Rhawb

Yeah, like I said, you very well may love the thing, lots of people are very happy with it. I'd suspect my feelings for this car put me well within the minority of the MS3 community.

VikingDJ

Nice to see some honesty from someone who has owned both cars., and can constructively criticize their own vehicle. I took a LOT of flack for my criticisms on the RX8 when I owned it. I don't recommend speaking your mind on the MS3 forum though like I did on here. HEHE

I test drove a Speed 3, and thought about trading in my Speed 6 for it, but I can't take anymore financial hits like I've taken by swapping cars like i have the past 4+ years. I actually like the Speed 6 more as well, as it feels more expensive and refined, and is the perfect daily winter car to compliment my S2K (RX8 replacement)

I can see why you'd miss the RX8, as you didn't jump into another pure purpose built machine like I did with the S2000. I gained EVERYTHING sports car, and made up for the lack of comfort by having a Speed 6 to use as my daily. If you can eventually make the Speed 3 your daily beater car, and get yourself a sports car, you won't be as critical of it, so my advice is do what I did.

The Speed 3 is a fine machine, and most owners are really happy with it. Not fair IMO to compare it to the flagship RX8. It's not supposed to be as good of handling, nor have the feel, because the reality is, it's a hopped up 3 hatchback when all is said and done.

Rhawb

I'm already working to establish myself as an MS3 realist. Nobody's gotten too upset about it just yet, but I know it's coming, haha.

Your suggestion is rather amusing - I've been telling my girlfriend non-stop how I really want to pick up an S2k after this car. I miss my RWD, I miss the high revving, and I miss the handling most of all. The Speed's just not quite the car for me - it's a blast, but I know when I start nitpicking a car to death, it's just not the one.

Oh and comparisons to the 8 come because that's where my experience lies, and lots of people are making the exact same switch. I usually try and give them my best advice and my best comparison of the two.

Big_Mike_4488

Well said Viking. I totally agree with what you said about Rhawb's review. Was great to finally hear a valid review from someone who has owned both cars.

I'm leaning towards the MS3 because I really only need a daily driver in the next few years. Just coming out of school. Need something with a warranty a little better gas mileage. More room for the new dog. I was actually looking at the regular Mazda 3 for that but when I test drove the MS3 I was blown away in comparison. Figured I could have the best of both worlds. My fiance really really likes it too. Hell, in a year I might be giving my future wife the MS3 and I'll be switching to a RWD sports car again. I almost feel like I'm wasting the handling capabilities of such a great car like the 8 because I can't afford to ever take it to a track. Maybe in a few years I'll have the funds to take a car to the track. I was thinking, I would love to put an MS3 engine and turbo in an MX-5 Miata. I don't even know if it's possible but that would be one hell of a track car. Ha, the things that go through my head.

Rhawb since you miss the RX8... you interested in working out some sort of trade? My '04 Grand Touring is at 61K miles in great shape and I've got it listed at $14,900. ($400 below KBB) I was looking for a sun. silver MS3 but a well kept Red is still pretty. Let me know.

VikingDJ

I can totally relate. There's really two ways to nitpick. If lets say the Speed 6 was my both combination fun car/ daily driver, I'd be ripping into it right now harder then you ever possibly could your Speed 3, and I'd be INCREDIBLY dissappointed in it. It's HEAVY, handling is very good for it's class, but nothing even remotely like a sports car, or even a Speed 3. In all honesty though, I personally can't even call it much of an enthusiast car, because it's TOTALLY not me. The STI I had before it was more me, but I needed a friendlier, under the radar, smoother daily driver, and I couldn't pass up the INSANE deal I was offered.

If you were able to buy an S2000, or an RX8, while keeping your Speed 3, I'd be wlling to bet your entire attitude would change, but as a sports car enthusiast, I can fully understand your criticism. However, the Speed 3 is a great all around car to fix all needs, performance wise and utility wise, so it's no wonder it's so loved and popular.

You always have to compromise something, but I'm fortunate enough to be able to afford two cars. I am most certainly NOT a Speed 6 enthusiast, but thinking like a general comsumer , as a daily friendly car that can get me through bad weather and in comfort, I'm totally in love with it.

If I were to sell my Honda, I'd really start to not like my Speed 6, but as it sits, which is a daily winter car and work commuter, it's absolutely a fabulous machine. I'm happy because I have two great combination cars. The Speed 3 would definitely fit me better as a commuter car, but it's too late for that.

Rhawb

I wouldn't count on the MS3 to fix any gas mileage issues. I mix my aggressive city driving with LOTS of pretty tame highway driving, and I'm only averaging about 23. I've almost hit 25, but it was all highway. My 8 was getting 20-21 mpg.

Anyway, as much as I bitch about the thing, I'm not disappointed, so I'm going to hang on to it for a bit. I want to get some modding out of my system, and really wring it out on a track day before I get rid of it. Sorry man! ^_^

Big_Mike_4488

23 MPG mixed?!?!? Hell I get 19 MPG out of my 8 and that's 75% highway. MPG will definately be an improvement but its def. not my selling point. Just a plus. Actually there is no ONE selling point for me on this car. Just a lot of perks that all add up.

bascho

Another MS3 owner here. I had a 2005 RX8 Shinka (still the best looking RX8 made IMO) and sold that to get a 2006 Mustang GT. I only got rid of the Mustang because I needed usable rear seats. The MS3 is a great allrounder. Is it my favorite car.......definitely not. However, for a car that costs less than $25K and has 4 real doors and hauls this much ***........I don't think anyone can find anything better. As soon as my kids legs are long enough to actually bend down into the rear seat footwell, I'll be going back to a stang. But as long as the child carseats are needed, the MS3 allows me 90% of the performance with exceptional fuel economy. In the RX8 I got 18mpg in mixed driving. Same commute in the Mustang I got 19.5mpg. Same commute in the MS3 I get 25mpg.

MS3 best performance = no
MS3 best handling = no
MS3 most convenient for 4 passengers = no
MS3 best at all aspects combined = for the price, I say yes.

JRichter

Being in Detroit, How was the MS3 in the snow/ice?

bascho

On the stock rubber.......one of the worst cars I've ever owned. Summer only tires and a light powerful car do not mix. After changing to 16" wheels with snow tires it's been a very good car in the winter. If you own an MS3 in a snow state, then a winter wheel/tire package is a must.

Rhawb

Bascho: I agree with your assessment - Well, aside from liking the Mustang.

bascho

I know liking the stang is not popular around here.......but I can't help it. I've owned 6 in my lifetime and I'm addicted. And since I work for Ford I've seen the 2010 and I'm in love. As soon as the kids ditch the car seats, I'll be ditching the rear doors

Hey, at least when I'm not driving a stang I choose to drive Mazda's.

Rhawb

hehe, just giving you crap about it.

Big_Mike_4488

Test drove this car again. Damn. This thing is fast. The salesman I went on the test drive with was a bad ***. He was like, "ok downshift before this turn... now punch it.... hug that line hug that line!" It was a blast. I punched 3rd gear and then 4th getting onto the interstate. I started getting a little scared which I thought was weird. Then I looked down at the speedo to see that I was pushing 125. WOOT!! That was probably about the same timeline it takes me to get to 85 or 90 in the 8. No wonder I was gettin a little scared.

Anyway now the plot thickens. Its funny you mentioned the Mustang. Just found out TODAY that my family gets a big discount on Ford cars due to my dad working at Michelin. I can get a 2008 GT Premium Coupe for around $23,500. Roughly the same price as the MS3. I'm still leaning towards the MS3 because the rest the car caters to my needs better than the Stang, but I'm never going to say never. The $23K range is a pretty good buy for a brand new GT.

EDIT: Rechecked the Stang GT price. Its $22,700 before TT&T.

(I can also get discounts on all Mazdas, but unfortounately the MS3 and MS6 are not included in the deal.)

Rhawb

My Speed3 still scares the crap out of me every once in a while. I have the MS intake and I'm convinced it turned my second gear into a psychotic, boost belching monster. I usually refrain from shifting hard because the car's fast enough as-is, but I tried it the other day - the thing broke traction for a good LONG time even with DSC on, and then proceeded to wander all over the road from torque steer until I decided to cool off in 3rd. This is definitely a "two hands on the wheel" car.

nt5k

^ Crazy.. I had a Acura CL-S a while back and it was the same way. The front wheels would literally hop. This was a heavy N/A car. I can only imagine how insane a lighter,turbo car is. I can see it getting old fast.

Big_Mike_4488

Even in my short time driving the MS3, I have noticed that there is a smoothness you have to develop in order to keep the power under control. Its almost another challenge, which I actually like. I think learning to drive this car fast and under control might make me a better driver. You definately don't feel as in control of the car as you would in the 8. Call me weird but it really doesnt bother me that much.

VikingDJ

Phew. I have no plans on trading my Speed 6 in for a Speed 3, but after reading this thread I'm surely tempted to put on an acting performance, and tease the dealership into thinking I plan to, so I can take one out for a drive. Part of me is afraid though I might get stupid and buy it, and then regret it because if I did that, after about 6 months my finances would force me to sell the S2000. Ain't gonna happen. hehe

I have not driven a Speed 3, but the MS3 and MS6 are virtually the same thing power wise, and I'm imagining my Speed 6 400lbs lighter, and I'm getting a grin, having some flashbacks of my STI, and the way that car was just EXPLOSIVE. Granted the Speed 3 isn't as fast as an STI, but not all that far behind. I gained a lot of luzury switching form my STI to the Speed 6, but I suffered pretty huge drop in power, especially from 0 to 80. Granted my Speed 6 is no slouch, but the extra weight really plays a roll, and it makes the car feel more muscular rather then explosive. However, once moving at higher speeds, the weight does play much less of a roll, and this car surely takes off once you're going.

The Speed 3 is surely a fabulous car for the money. The only reason I didn't get one is because I'm AWD partial, and also at the time, I'd have ended up paying more for a Speed 3 then a Speed 6 (just was coming out and no deals whatsoever), and I actually really enjoy the luxury I have now, and the S2K gives me my thrills. I couldn't pass up the INSANE deals on the Speed 6, and have no regrets, but I surely wouldn't mind having a Speed 3 as a third car.

I'd say GET THE CAR!!! It's a fabulous all around machine.

bascho

Of all the cars I've owned, the MS3 definitely takes the most driver skill. When you're getting on it, you definitely need two hands on the wheel. I often imagine what it would be like to put the engine in the rear of this thing running the rear wheels. It's too much motor for a FWD car which is why torque is limited in 1st and 2nd gears. Imagine this engine running full boost from jump going through the rear tires. Pure sex.

Ever Hernandez

^One of the reason I can't wait for Mazda to put it in a Mazdaspeed MX5-Lighter and RWD!

Big_Mike_4488

As far as deals, I don't know where you are at but I am getting my Speed 3 at invoice in South Carolina. I didn't think there was much point in looking elsewhere after that. I doubt many dealers will beat it since it is a limited production car. With the Sport model the invoice is like $21K or so after the destination fee. And from what I've heard the Grand Touring isn't much more except the Bose system and some leather trimmings.

Rhawb

I think the only things worth missing in the GT are the sunroof and maybe Nav if you REALLY want it badly.

Big_Mike_4488

Not even a sunroof. Isn't offered with the Speed 3 at all.

delhi

Because physics dictate that high power FWD car is bad design. Let's not get confused with driver's attention to ensure the car stays on the road with driving dynamics. This thread reminds me of the SRT-4 experiences.

dozer

iTrader: (3)

is this guy serious?