DARKMAZ8

search MS6 aswell!!!!

Thetitanium8

I hope the 6 is a big hit. :D

JeRKy 8 Owner

I was hoping that the Mazdaspeed 6 would run the 1/4 mile in the low 14s and reach 60 in less than 5.5 seconds. That way it could compete with WRX and STI...at least somewhat.

But if its only making 60 in 6.2 seconds then it's more in line with a G35 Sedan..

Disappointing...I wanted it to be faster than the RX-8

Tirminyl

Neer was ment to compete with the wrx, sti, or evo. Think more of Legacy GT and the likes.

Sigma

Dream on. Maybe if a retarded guy launched it. A stock Mazda6s will pull a 14.8 with a competent driver.

Faluzure

Wurm, I think you are overreacting here. I thought the same thing about the 350Z vs the Altima SE-R & Maxima. As you know, Nissan recycles a bunch of their engines in different lineups. The same engine in the 350Z is found in those 2 sedans. Regardless though, those cars are still not a 350Z.

The same applies to the RX-8, despite the fact that the performance of the Mazdaspeed versions of other cars may approach the same power as the RX-8, they are in fact... still not an RX-8. You still have the amazing RX-8 handling, as well as looks and finally... the awesome rotary engine.

zoom44

what sad is that people get hooked on 2 numbers- hp and T- but dont bother to figure the weight into that. whats sad is you think that somehow this version of the 6 "outclasses" the 8. whats sad is you didnt bother to read the post before yours or any onther herfe or on the 6 forums that shows the 8 will still be faster and handle better.

zoom44

because the 6 was out first so it gets the MS treatment first. how is that hard to comprehend?

mikeb

zoom makes a good point

hopefully it does well so we can get some more ms goodies coming from mazda

khtm

Hey Faluzure...do you have a link to pics of your car? It sounds awesome (from your sig)...I'd love to see pics

snizzle

not to mention it's obvious the 4 banger is easier to tweak to get out the door first

I seriously considered the 6 when I was looking for cars, it's a great all around sedan but it's still not an 8. I think the MS6 is a great thing for Mazda (and indirectly the 8). Calm down people.

snap-on

I don't know how many of these threads we have seen but it is getting a little old.

The MS6 will probably only be a one year run as rumors are abound of a major upsizing for 07. The new car will be longer/taller and wider than the present day Altima. Mazda also has 3 new vehicles hitting the streets in the next year with the new Miata, The Mz5 and the MXcrossport will be ordered in Oct for Dec/Jan delivery

The Rotary has always been a niche vehicle and the 929/Millenia where the "flagships"

Mz3 (2 bodystyles)
Mz5
Mz6 (3 bodystyles)
Mxcrossport
Rx8
tribute
B-series

The point of the line-up is to have a car for every type of car buyer.

doubleohsmurf

I see no problem with what Mazda is doing. They offer a cars in each class that can be had with a huge range of options from cheap base model with great economy to very luxuriosly loaded and strengthened versions of the same car. Take the 3, you have the base 140hp "i" and the 160hp "s" 4/5door avail with HID, NAV, leather, stereo, wheels, sunroof, etc...and soon a turboed MS with even more options. And the 6 is the same, base "i", then "s", the MS. Also the 6 is older and needed a midlife freshening to keep it overly competitive with newer cars being marketed. The 8 may not be Mazda's flagship, but its one of the nicest cars Mazda offers, even in base form. It too will be upgraded at its midlife, and/or a new RX7 will be introed. Its too soon to upgrade a car (the 8) when you can still milk the market with its current setup. Mazda is simply securing it financial future in its lineup and on the international racing scene, so we dont see a repeat of the mid 1990s.

Sigma

I assume by "outclassed" you mean "faster", because that's the only category that the MazdaSpeed6 is going to beat an RX-8 in. So, on that note....

Four-Door Sedans Faster than the RX-8: (only those remotely close in price I can think of off top of my head)

Nissan Altima 3.5 SE
Nissan Altima SE-R
Nissan Maxima
BMW 330i
Honda Accord (it would if they put the manual on the sedan rather than only on coupe)
Subaru Legacy GT
Subaru WRX
Subaru WRX STi
Mitsubishi Evo
Dodge Neon SRT-4
Dodge 300C
Dodge Magnum R/T
Dodge Charger


And I'm sure there's lots more I'm not thinking of right at the moment. Hell, even a Mazda's own Mazda6s would give an RX-8 a run for its' money in the 1/4-mile.

VikingDJ

Right on. The MS6 will be a direct competitor with the Legacy GT. It's heavier, yet packs more hp and torque then the Legacy, so it should be an interesting competition. The Legacy GT Pulls out 0 to 60 in mid 5s and low/mid 14s in 1/4. Not sure what the MS6 will do, but if their specs are right, it should be a nice competition for Subaru, Then again, who's to say they aren't overrating the numbers. Speculation of it being faster or slower then the RX8 means nothing at this point. We do not know. IMO, it will be faster then the current RX8.I test drove a Legacy GT for about 15 minutes (almost traded in my STi for one). Sorry guys, but the 250hp- 250 torque Legacy GT will take out the RX8 off the line, and form a roll without much trouble. What will 250+ extra lbs compared to the Legacy, but also 24 more horses and 30 more feet of torque do for the MS6? That remains to be seen. No doubt the MS will have some serious power, and be a much easier car to go fast in. It certainly will not handle as well though. On the highway, it will likely have little trouble making mince meat out of the RX8, as the Legacy GT does, but personally I don't really care. This shouldn't even concern us, and should only be used for fun discussion, not crying about not being the fastest Mazda.
We'll just have to see, but I think Mazda is making a smart move by building this car. In time, there will be a high performance RX8, or an RX7. The current competition for Mazda is in the sedan market, so financially this is a great move, and the car should have great success. Hopefully, the RX8 will be the next in line to have the MS tag on her.

doubleohsmurf

Agreed. And from my knowledge, the only reason the MS6 is so heavy is because of its complicated new electronic/independent driven 4WD system. with a standard 4WD setup it might very well womp on the Legacy GT and give more luxury minded cars a run for their money, as well as compete w/ the smaller sport compact Evo and STi (but i wouldnt say these two are the main target group). When Mazda wants to compete with these faster cars they will release a MS3 with the same/similar engine.

Wurmfist

No I haven't, but I'm glad you make sure to post in every one even if you don't like it. I think if there was an award you would get "Forum Troll" . I do know how to use the search function. I'm not going to comment at the bottom of a thread that has 24 bizzilion posts and try to read through everything. That's why this is a FORUM. Not a hard concept to comprehend.

I guess I may have gotten a little too excited about the MS 6 but when you look at the hard numbers, horsepower and torque. Using the excuse that a 4 banger is easier to tune may be true but Mazdas been dealing with rotaries forever and the renesis is rumored to be the "simple" engine in that there isn't a whole lot going on in there. So mazda could easily make a MS 8 with Turbo. I've read in other threads that the renesis was made for FI. I think it's more a lack of sales than anything. I know it's true too, because I can goto the dealers and still get brand new 2004's on the lot. And they are marking them down by more than 5500 dollars. I should of held out. lol!

Sigma

Lack of sales isn't really it. In fact, lack of sales is one reason why Mazda produces a MazdaSpeed in the first place. There are still '04 Mazda6s on some lots too, but they're making a MazdaSpeed6.

Historically, Mazda has produced a MazdaSpeed vehicle right when a redesign is about to come out. The MazdaSpeed Protege -- right before its' replacement the Mazda3 came out and Mazda needed a sales boost to get the Proteges still in people's minds and help clear the lots (The Protege5 was used to help too). The MazdaSpeed Miata - right before the MX-5 gets redesigned. The MazdaSpeed6 -- right as the Mazda6 gets slightly re-worked for '06 and a predicted refresh for MY '07 (might be pushed to '08 since this '06 refresh sprung up). The MazdaSpeed3 will be showing up right before the Mazda3 is due for a refresh as well.

And the MazdaSpeed RX-8, following the trend, will very likely show up a year before a refresh, redesign, or replacement. I wouldn't be surprised if it's a mid-model-year '06, just as the MazdaSpeed6 was (prior to the fire which pushed it to this Fall).

MazdaSpeeds have traditionally been used to boost ailing lines and/or clear lots in expectation of a model change, making the RX-8 a prime model to receive one; but only if Mazda even sees it as worth saving. And if April's sales figures stick around, I wouldn't be betting on it.

Steiner

MS6 > RX-8

deal with it ladies...

DARKMAZ8

It's slower and heavier so how do you figure the ms6 is better?

rx8club>steiner :p

bmcc49er

All I know is I would love to trade my wife's 6S in for the MS when it comes out, just have to talk her into it Would love to have my 8 and that to drive and I will owe so little on here 6 I could probably come out with a very nice deal after i spring the trade or sell it private party. Don't hate it, embrace it as another fine machine(fingers crossed).

PPen131

the ms6 will be faster than the rx8 regardless of its weight. i don't understand the obsession of using car magazines strictly as reference. remember, according to the mags numbers on the rx8 ranged anywhere from mid 14s to low 15s in the 1/4 mile.

Steiner

• better tuning platform
• quicker to 60mph
• quicker in the 1/4 mile
• better gas mileage
• better drivetrain
• more doors
• more headroom
• more storage space
• cheaper insurance

It doesn't surprise me that a few people in here are having trouble dealing with it. In fact the Nissan Spec V crowd had the same type of general denial when the specs for the 350Z came out. The RX-8 is no longer Mazda's flagship. Accept it folks. It doesn't mean the RX-8 isn't a great car, it just means the MS6 has it beat in terms of performance.

DreRX8

Honestly I'll wait until the cars hit the streets till I make my decision--I'll believe the actual numbers than whatever you are spouting off.

Sigma

More room for tuning? And Better Drivetrain?

The MazdaSpeed6 uses the same AWD system available on the Estate in Europe. This AWD system is weak and cannot be used for prolonged occassions even on the 166hp engine that it's used on there. It disengages over a certain speed.

For the MazdaSpeed6 this system was so weak that Mazda was forced to cobble together a means to water-cool the rear differential to keep it from exploding from the stresses. Even then the system is only good for momentary requirements of AWD, an even further reduction than what is on the European Estate. That AWD system has maxed out its' potential and then some.

Tuning Potential? Probably. They are upping the internals over the standard MZR, which is good. But you better be ready to sink a lot of money into getting that drivetrain upgraded. And for a car limited to only a few thousand units, and largely targetted not at enthusiasts, I wouldn't expect a huge market for MazdaSpeed6-specific parts. If anything that Duratec in the Mazda6s is a powerplant with far more proven tuning potential with minimal extensive engine work.

Cheaper insurance?

Insurance on an RX-8 is cheaper than insurance on a Mazda6 -- at least for me it is, and I'm still under the magical 25-year-old threshold as well where you'd think a sports coupe would be expensive to insure. I imagine it has to do with safety as well as the overall market of buyers tending to be a bit older, which is why an RX-8 costs a fraction of what a Mustang costs for me to insure though it costs 50% more and the parts are undoubtedly more expensive too.

More Storage Space?

Not a huge gain. Mazda removed the folding rear seat for the MazdaSpeed6 in an effort to stiffen the chassis. So you gain a moderate amount of trunk space, but I wouldn't call it a huge difference. The Mazda6 trunk is quite deep, giving it a huge volume, but one that is rarely used as we tend not to fill vertical space in a trunk. I suppose to some it's important, but I doubt it would be to someone cross-shopping the two, as if you're considering an RX-8 chances are trunk-space isn't a big deal. And if it is, the RX-8 has a very respectable trunk for its' class.

More headroom?

Marginal at best -- my head is virtually in exactly the same spot in both the Mazda6 and RX-8. With the moonroof I believe the Mazda6 actually loses to the RX-8 in this category because of its' in-roof design.

More Doors?

I suppose that depends on how you define doors. The rear doors on the Mazda6 are rather small and there's not a significant difference in ease of entry once you get over the initial awkwardness of the suicide doors.