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bse50 11-14-2010 06:12 PM


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3783651)
OK, but he was what 5th on the start grid.., considering he has been on 1 or number 2 or 3 in most if not all other races (from memory), 5th is way off.;)

I agree but the pack was pretty tight and you never know how they were dealing with the last engines they had etc. It is also true that Red Bull always favored Vettel so go figure :)
I don't want to offend you but i think that Webber, out of the champions, was the one who deserved it the least.
In the end all he is is a 34yo driver who never won anything during his career and he finally got the right car with an amazing team. Just like Button. Great driver but definitely not a true champion. Add Massa and Rosberg to that mix.

The 3 champions (Vettel, Hamilton and Alonshole) all have that something more that makes them stand out one way or another. Vettel is FAST, Hamilton is Aggressive, Nando is well... nando :) Kubica is right up there as well, too bad that he is racing with an electric car against dragsters!

ASH8 11-14-2010 06:31 PM

Webber has been in F1 for 9 years..I guess he has No experience.

Remember he drove VERY unreliable cars for Minardi, Jaguar, Williams....for years.

HE WORKED HARD to get where he is, Mummy or Daddy did not PAY to have their boy in a top F1 Team unlike most of the others..

To suggest Webber is not a great driver or "deserved it the least" is just absolute Bullshit.

Who won the most F1 races this year??

And I am not offended, I thought you were more reasonable with your thinking G.;)

WHAT pissing me off are the FIA and rule makers, year after year they keep moving the Goal Posts because "they" do not like the results..

Ferrari who blatantly CHEAT and get a little $$ fine...BS

ASH8 11-14-2010 06:54 PM

Words from MW..

Car 6 MARK WEBBER, Finish Position: 8th, Start Position: 5th

“It was a big day and we had the chance to do something incredibly unique, but in the end it didn’t turn out for us. Earlier in the race we knew we had to roll the dice and go for it with the strategy, but it left us exposed and Fernando (Alonso) covered us. I tried my absolute hardest and we did everything we could, but in the end it wasn’t enough. You’ve got to take your hat off to Sebastian, he's done a great job all year and to lead the Championship at the last race, he’s got the timing right and I fully congratulate him on the World Championship.

I was in with a chance of winning the Championship until the last race, so I must have been doing something right and in the end there are a lot of positives. I feel I have driven very well for most of the season and that's the most important thing to me. This weekend didn't turn out and it's a shame, but it’s a good time to reflect in the next few weeks and look back at the highs and the lows but that's the way the sport is sometimes. There have been quite a few emotions over the last couple of weeks; when you come so close to the top and just miss out, it's a shame, but I tried my absolute hardest and I have great guys around me.

I think two championships for the team is not bad and I’ll be fighting again next season.”

MW about the race..

A dramatic season finale in Abu Dhabi ended in disappointment for Mark. He came home in eighth place, behind Fernando Alonso, and ended the 2010 World Championship in third place with a total of 242 points.

“When you aim high and you miss the target,” says Mark, “the arrow’s got to go a long way down. I’m very disappointed by what happened on Sunday evening; I aimed for the biggest target in motorsport, the Formula One World Championship, and it didn’t work out.

“But there are still lots of positives to take out of the 2010 season. I’ve taken five pole positions, four victories and I’m even proud of some of my second places because they were well-executed race weekends. In due course, I’ll probably look back and think this season wasn’t a bad effort.”

Mark’s eighth place in the race was his worst result since the Chinese Grand Prix in April and it came about largely through a poor grid position. He lined up fifth, the lowest of the four championship contenders, and he never recovered from that handicap during the 55-lap race.

“It was my worst qualifying since the season-opener in Bahrain,” says Mark. “I struggled with a lack of grip in qualifying and then had the same problem at the start of the race. That’s why I pitted relatively early, on lap 11: I wanted to get some different rubber on the car to see if it would give me more speed.

“Unfortunately, I got stuck behind the Toro Rosso of Jaime Alguersuari as I exited the pits and the time I lost dropped me behind Fernando Alonso when he pitted four laps later. But that became academic because I was still behind Vitaly Petrov and Nico Rosberg, who‘d pitted while the Safety Car was out at the start of the race, and it’s very difficult to overtake at Yas Marina.”

The driver with no traffic problems was Sebastian Vettel. He won the race from pole position to claim the world championship by four points from Alonso.

“I’ve got to take my hat off to Sebastian because he’s done a good job this year,” says Mark. “We’ve had our ups and downs, but we’ve pushed each other and it’s always rewarding to get out of bed to do that. It’s amazing to think that the only time he led the championship was after the last race, but that’s the only time it matters. Well done to him.”

Mark heads to Austria this week for a press conference at Red Bull HQ with Vettel, Christian Horner and Adrian Newey, before taking a well earned rest.

“I’m reminded of that great adage,” he says. “What doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. Well, I’m still alive and I’m sure I’ll bounce back from this season a better driver. Right now, though, I need a good break. The gas has been wide open since the third week in January and it’s been a long season. There’s been a lot of travel, a lot of emotion and a lot of effort. It’s time for some time out.”

ASH8 11-14-2010 06:58 PM

Car 5 SEBASTIAN VETTEL, Finish Position: WINNER, Start Position: 1st

I’m speechless. I don’t know what you are supposed to say in these moments, it has been an incredibly tough season for myself and all of us, physically and mentally. We always kept believing in ourselves – no matter what people said – in the team and in our car. I kept believing in myself and today was a special day all round. I got up this morning and tried not to think about anything; I tried to avoid contact with people and just tried to do my own thing. I knew all I could try to do was win this race and do my best. We only led this Championship once this season, but it was when it mattered.

The car was phenomenal today; the start was very tight with Lewis (Hamilton), and I had some graining in the first stint, but then the car stabilised and was a dream. To be honest, I didn’t know anything until I passed the chequered flag. I was wondering, because my race engineer Rocky was trying to give me advice every lap to help me carry the car home and I was thinking ‘Why’s this guy so nervous, we must be in a bloody good position!’ Then crossing the line he came on the radio and very silently said ‘it’s looking good, we have to wait until all the cars finish’.

I was thinking ‘what does he mean,’ as I hadn’t seen the screens - I just wanted to make sure I didn’t get any distractions during the race and focused on myself. Then Christian came on the radio and screamed at me that we had won the World Championship –

I have to say thanks to so many people. To start with, the team: that’s all the people here at the track and all the people in Milton Keynes – they are pushing like hell and I think they will be enjoying this moment as much as last week. Also everyone back in Austria, who has supported me from the beginning – it’s been an incredible journey with Red Bull and, after all the ups and downs this season, to come here now and win the Championship is unbelievable. Thanks to everyone I have known from the early days in karting and those in my home town of Heppenheim to now, thank you so much.”

RWatters 11-14-2010 08:07 PM


Originally Posted by mike1324a (Post 3783646)
Congats to Seb Vet! Great driver and overall great person. This is especially true compared to a certain Spaniard who, while having an attitude, has also been involved in a lot of team scandals in recent years. Holding up Hamilton in the pits in Hungary in 07 with Mclaren, Piquet crashing so Alonso could win with Renault in Singapore in 08, and team orders this year with Ferrari. Coincidence? There is a common theme here and he stinks like a cheating Spaniard.

Ah, again with the team orders stuff. Let me guess, you think it only exists at Ferrari right?

It's not even about me defending Ferrari because it's not even necessary. All the major teams do it. Period. There is no discussion or debate necessary. They all do it. Ferrari was just retarded enough to get caught. Was it Alonso's fault when Rubens was screwed last season so that Button could win races? Was it Alonso's fault in Turkey when Button was told to "conserve fuel" as he was trying to pass Hamilton? Was it Alonso's fault Ferrari was doing it years ago? Was it Alonso's fault when McLaren favored Hamilton over Heiki and would give him the preferred race strategy? Was it Alonso's fault when Kimi was told to support Massa while he was at Ferrari? It's like some of you guys started watching Formula 1 two seasons ago or something. lol

BTW, Mark's handling this all extremely well. Huge props to him!

mike1324a 11-15-2010 12:11 AM

Oh I totally understand how it happens all the time and not to mention my favorite driver is the reason the rule was written. That being said, Ferrari were brazen with it and then tried to treat everyone like we were stupid and it never happened. While Kimi was with Ferrari, he and Massa were equal up until the very end when one was mathematically eliminated, as should have happened. Its just interesting just how quickly Massa got the back seat to Alonso.

I do totally agree with you about Mark.

PerSmitt 11-15-2010 12:40 AM


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3783688)
Webber has been in F1 for 9 years..I guess he has No experience.

Remember he drove VERY unreliable cars for Minardi, Jaguar, Williams....for years.

HE WORKED HARD to get where he is, Mummy or Daddy did not PAY to have their boy in a top F1 Team unlike most of the others..

I doubt any parent can afford to have a pay-seat at Ferrari or McLaren. Secondly, the big teams pay their drivers, not the other way around because they want the most talented drivers. If Webber was as talented and experienced as you say he would be driving for a bigger team.


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3783688)
To suggest Webber is not a great driver or "deserved it the least" is just absolute Bullshit.

No, not really. He had an extreme package, and decent driving skill but that was about it. Not very deserving in my opinion either. I always want the best driver to win though, so i guess we will never agree there ;)


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3783688)
Who won the most F1 races this year??

Vettel did together with Alonso. And then Webber on third place. Webber who inherited a victory from Vettel due to SC fuckup where Vettel got a drive through. So purely driving wise you can subtract one victory there, it was just luck for Webber there.


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3783688)
And I am not offended, I thought you were more reasonable with your thinking G.;)

WHAT pissing me off are the FIA and rule makers, year after year they keep moving the Goal Posts because "they" do not like the results..

Could you try to explain that. I cannot even remotely guess on what you are referring to. Is it the added amount of races or is it the changed point system?


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3783688)
Ferrari who blatantly CHEAT and get a little $$ fine...BS

Agreed, that one was ugly. Big props to Red Bull for playing it fair the entire way!

PerSmitt 11-15-2010 12:43 AM


Originally Posted by RWatters (Post 3783716)
BTW, Mark's handling this all extremely well. Huge props to him!

Totally agreed. Mark is probably the most mature driver on the grid and is a great sport and has great personality. And my girlfriend keeps saying he is cute too ;)

So yeah he handles it really well, and I actually expected him to. He seems to be a really great guy. In case people thought I did not like Webber, I really do. I just don't agree with him being as great as other here wants to put it. ;)

bse50 11-15-2010 12:55 AM

Ash,
I'm not saying that Webber isn't a good driver, i'm just saying that he needed a career to get to a point where others got with their pure talent alone.
Schumacher was winning with any car, at any time and any place instead. Massa had 1 extraordinary season because he clearly had a great car but what after it? :)
Same applies to Webber in my opinion, he is not a true champion but somebody smart and mature enough to capitalize on his experience. Modern champions are, on the other hand, stupid enough not to capitalize on their own talent and often end up kissing the walls lol :)

Pololo_RX8 11-15-2010 07:52 AM

What can I say?... What can I say?...

If you think about it, Alonso lost the championship to the "marque" that gave him the initial 2 championships -> Renault!!

Renault powered RB and even the 2 Renaults of Kubica and Petrov were much better than the Ferrari package this weekend.

On top of this, the stupid suicidal decision that Domenicali made caused Alonso the championship. I feel bad for Alonso as he gave everything he has to this team on his first season at Ferrari. It's even worse when literally this has been a ONE DRIVER team as Massa has done close to nothing all season long... Bring Kubica to Ferrari...

It was the worst weekend for Ferrari this season and they could not have picked the worst time to do this.

On the other hand, although I completely dislike Vettel, not only because he is german, but because he was the favorite on a team full of hipocrisy (we do not give team orders... yeah right) I feel he DESERVED to clinch the title. He had the faster car, he had the most poles and he was unlucky this season.

Whoever thinks that RB don't give "Team Orders" should have their head examined. :) :)

Congrats Vettel... Although I am a Ferrari fan to the bone, I acknowledge when somebody is better and this time, you were. Congrats.

Carlos

alnielsen 11-15-2010 08:59 AM

Williams announces Hulkenberg leaving, Barrichello staying

Williams on Monday announced that Nico Hulkenberg is leaving the British team.

The Oxfordshire based team said Brazilian driver Rubens Barrichello's 2011 teammate "will be confirmed before the end of the year".

The news follows comments in Abu Dhabi by Hulkenberg's manager Willi Weber, who said he believes the team has already signed Pastor Maldonado.

Williams said in a media statement that German Hulkenberg, 23, has put in "convincing performances" in his rookie season and has "an undoubtedly bright future in the sport".

"We are convinced that Nico will go on to great things. We wish him well and hope that our paths will cross again in the future," said team boss Sir Frank Williams.
http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=394705:F1

Alternate Title: One Pole on a drying race track doesn't buy you much these days or Hurray for the Old Guys.

[c]K 11-15-2010 09:17 AM


Originally Posted by Pololo_RX8 (Post 3783938)
On top of this, the stupid suicidal decision that Domenicali made caused Alonso the championship.

I hardly believe Domenicali took that decision, I would blame the race engineer :suspect:

alnielsen 11-15-2010 09:29 AM

In the quotes that I have read, the only reference to Alonso's strategy was it was a team decision. There was no mention on whether it came from the team principal or the race engineer.

mike1324a 11-15-2010 10:36 AM

.1 of 1.....F1 rivals were quick to congratulate Sebastian Vettel on becoming F1's youngest Champion on Sunday, and there was also praise in his home country.

Red Bull team-mate Mark Webber, who was one four drivers going into the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix with a chance of winning the title, said: "Congratulations to Seb and to the team, two World Championships, that's not a bad season. There's quite a few emotions when you just miss out. It's a shame."

Ferrari's Fernando Alonso, who finished the race seventh and ended the season second behind Vettel and ahead of Webber and McLaren's Lewis Hamilton, congratulated Vettel and tried to shrug off his frustration.

"This is sport - sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Congratulations to Red Bull and Sebastian but next year we will try again," said the Spaniard.

"It was very good, for me especially after two years of some difficulties, coming back to winning races, fighting for the Championship. I'm sure with this team it is very possible to fight for Championships in the future, so I am happy."

Hamilton, who finished the race second ahead of team-mate and outgoing World Champion Jenson Button, said: "It's not been the most spectacular season for us, but huge congratulations to Red Bull and Sebastian. He really did a fantastic job throughout the year and fair dos to him."

Button added: "We've all had our ups and downs, including the new World Champion Sebastian. But he's a very talented driver and he thoroughly deserves his success."

Former World Champion Michael Schumacher offered "big congratulations" to the man who has now given Germany only its second F1 Champion and the first since Schumacher won the last of his seven titles in 2004.

"That was extremely well done after his season was so mixed but he was able to come back strongly in the last few races," he said.



Vettel said he was touched by Hamilton's reaction at the finish line.

"He gave me his thumbs up. I felt he really appreciated (what I did). I felt a lot of respect. I have known him for a long time, we have been through a lot in Formula 3," Vettel said.

dezau 11-15-2010 11:21 AM

wow... podiums on abu dahbi are champions of 10, 08 and 09!

alfy28 11-15-2010 11:32 AM

Wow what an exciting year it was. we got to see teams flip flop like fishes in the sea, Ferrari fans donating all their hard earned cash to the tissue companies found around the world.
Grat’s to vet, even though he wasn’t the one I cared for , I will admit he worked hard for it. Just glad that RB didn’t fall into the team order stuff at brazil, and let their drivers work hard for the win. While all the critics were calling RB stupid for not allowing webber win in brazil, they didn’t allow the media get to them. So I guess RB in the end got the last laugh.

I hope Ferrari learned their lesson, but something tells me they will always be the douche as a team. But grats on making the car faster this year, alonso did an awesome job.

Grats to the underdog team.

alnielsen 11-15-2010 11:38 AM

I thought McLaren was the underdog team.

Pololo_RX8 11-15-2010 11:46 AM


Originally Posted by alnielsen (Post 3784245)
I thought McLaren was the underdog team.

I could not agree with you more Sir. :) :)

alfy28 11-15-2010 12:07 PM


Originally Posted by alnielsen (Post 3784245)
I thought McLaren was the underdog team.

Hmm who gave the impression they were? they need to be shot lol. but yah i woudl say years ago they were, but that was like pre senna days.

ASH8 11-15-2010 01:21 PM


Originally Posted by bse50 (Post 3783856)
Ash,
I'm not saying that Webber isn't a good driver, i'm just saying that he needed a career to get to a point where others got with their pure talent alone.
Schumacher was winning with any car, at any time and any place instead. Massa had 1 extraordinary season because he clearly had a great car but what after it? :)
Same applies to Webber in my opinion, he is not a true champion but somebody smart and mature enough to capitalize on his experience. Modern champions are, on the other hand, stupid enough not to capitalize on their own talent and often end up kissing the walls lol :)

Jeez, some of you guys have NO Idea???..lol

Do you remember ANYTHNG??..as I certainly do when it comes to Webber's career.

One cant WIN if their car keeps breaking..can they??

No DRIVER can make a Minari, Jaguar or Williams cars competitive when they have DNF at every race or every other race.

Reliability is an Engineering issue.

PerSmitt 11-15-2010 02:11 PM


Originally Posted by ASH8 (Post 3784387)
Jeez, some of you guys have NO Idea???..lol

Do you remember ANYTHNG??..as I certainly do when it comes to Webber's career.

One cant WIN if their car keeps breaking..can they??

No DRIVER can make a Minari, Jaguar or Williams cars competitive when they have DNF at every race or every other race.

Reliability is an Engineering issue.

Lets just agree to disagree shall we? Or we could pass a vote ;)

[c]K 11-15-2010 04:06 PM

Read an interesting theory on Alonso's dramatic strategy. Some says Red Bull sacrified Webber, making him pit early, Ferrari thinking he was the man to beat copied the strategy and made Alonso pit on the next lap. Also Rosberg changed his tires in lap one under the safety car, it seems Ferrari did not notice until after Alonso's pit stop (this would seem crazy, but that's what a reporter in the paddock said during the race).

[c]K 11-15-2010 04:30 PM

Is HRT dead? Toyota announced HRT failed to pay for their 2010 package. So HRT got no KERS, no 2011 car 4 months before the 2011 season and they made NO developement on the car during the year since it was garbage. No car + no money = no F1, uncle Bernie must be happy lol

alnielsen 11-15-2010 04:31 PM

Webber was not used to fool Alonso - Mateschitz


Dietrich Mateschitz has rejected suggestions Red Bull's race strategy for Mark Webber on Sunday was a plot to mislead Ferrari and favour Sebastian Vettel for the title.
more @ http://en.espnf1.com/abudhabi/motors...ory/34416.html

Pololo_RX8 11-15-2010 04:51 PM


Originally Posted by alnielsen (Post 3784665)
Webber was not used to fool Alonso - Mateschitz


more @ http://en.espnf1.com/abudhabi/motors...ory/34416.html

Suuuuuureeeeee... And Hamilton is God then... Damn... What more proof do people need to see that RB DID have a way to favor Vettel over Webber? Only a blind could not see this.... only a blind.

However, it's Ferrari's fault for taking this bait.


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