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still no Diesel KF stateside but now talks of a hybrid Diesel. I"m thinking back to that product timeline Mazda released a while back (zoom, was it you that posted it somewhere) and wasn't there a mention of a Sky-Activ D II ? Maybe this is part of that?
This is because an electric motor excels at low-end torque, but starts to cripple as road speed(and RPM, since electric motors are usually just paired to a single-speed differential) increases and the torque starts to taper off.
Diesel is also optimized for low-end with usually 4~5k RPM redline, so you end up with a hybrid that won't have any top end power.
Gas hybrid works because gas engine and electric motor cancel each other's disadvantages. Electric motor efficiently takes care of the low-end, and gas engine kicks in to give you the punch when you need to high-end power.
Add the already long list of disadvantages diesels have, I doubt this is gonna happen.
Last edited by UnknownJinX; Sep 15, 2018 at 08:02 PM.
7 more years of sales.
4 whole cities? in the world?
yeah, I'm sure Mazda is really sweating that one...
Maybe this will become a trend.
Once more and more cities ban diesel in Europe, Australia and other continents, more and more automakers will stop making diesel passenger cars, since it doesn't really have a market in North America to start with.
Of course, I think diesel trucks and semis will still be around for a while, but I am not betting my money on diesel passenger cars.
Like mentioned, Toyota has already said "Screw it, we have made a proven, reliable hybrid system, ditch the diesel."
7 more years of sales.
4 whole cities? in the world?
yeah, I'm sure Mazda is really sweating that one...
You really need to read more, try 70 cities in Germany and FOUR Countries in less than 4 years.
Why is Nissan stop selling diesel in EU for ?.
As for US, hows it going for you, been 'coming' in US for the past 6 ******* years and Mazda cant get it together.
Sure VW did not help and basically VW screwed it..
Why the hell would ANYONE want a Diesel car, great torque, but clearly you have never looked into just what the cost of Service and Operations are.
2 to 3 times that of a Petrol sorry Gasoline Engine.
Skyactiv X is the best thing going for Mazda...but seriously I have never seen such a rudderless company in all my years.
2.5T is falling over, Diesel sales here and in Europe are so small electric will take over, sadly.
Mazda are only doing this (diesel) in US to try and recoup engine Skyactiv Diesel investment.
Japan is the Only country where Mazda diesels has been successful, even Mazda Japan did not think the demand in Japan would be good.
And I agree with our friend I cant see the point of a hybrid diesel, FFS how much will that cost, The most expensive cost to any car brand..
Just my opinion, but I just don't think Mazda knows what to do next, apart from Skyactiv X..
How about a decent powerful engine, ooh like every other car brand has, you can turbo all you want there is STILL No replacement for Displacement.
They need Toyota USA to make it for them in Alabama.
You really need to read more, try 70 cities in Germany and FOUR Countries in less than 4 years.
Why is Nissan stop selling diesel in EU for ?.
As for US, hows it going for you, been 'coming' in US for the past 6 ******* years and Mazda cant get it together.
Sure VW did not help and basically VW screwed it..
Why the hell would ANYONE want a Diesel car, great torque, but clearly you have never looked into just what the cost of Service and Operations are.
2 to 3 times that of a Petrol sorry Gasoline Engine.
Skyactiv X is the best thing going for Mazda...but seriously I have never seen such a rudderless company in all my years.
2.5T is falling over, Diesel sales here and in Europe are so small electric will take over, sadly.
Mazda are only doing this (diesel) in US to try and recoup engine Skyactiv Diesel investment.
Japan is the Only country where Mazda diesels has been successful, even Mazda Japan did not think the demand in Japan would be good.
And I agree with our friend I cant see the point of a hybrid diesel, FFS how much will that cost, The most expensive cost to any car brand..
Just my opinion, but I just don't think Mazda knows what to do next, apart from Skyactiv X..
How about a decent powerful engine, ooh like every other car brand has, you can turbo all you want there is STILL No replacement for Displacement.
They need Toyota USA to make it for them in Alabama.
Rant over/...
i basically agree BUT:
Nissan currently sell SMALL diesel engines basically from 1.6 (mostly) to 2.0 liters ,so many other manufacturers. BMW , MB and Audi have no plans to cut totally the diesel engines in big cars. i mean 6 cylinder engines. Yes the future is electric, but i think there is almost a decade for diesel in big/premium car market.
Mazda is looking into that market.Not the market of Nissan.
I think that the first diesel that will be phased out in few years in Mazda will be the new 1.8 (1.5 is already over, as you can see) ,followed by the 2.2, the newest (the supposed 3.0 L6) will be the last that will remain in lineup for a decade.
after 2030 no more diesel engine into Mazda lineup , this prophecy is credible (based on the information that have today)
Not really. Just because their 2.5T is having some glitches, doesn't mean it's fundamentally flawed.
Again, it's cheaper to redesign and fix the 2.5T than making a V6 from literal scratch, unless Mazda has the right to use the Ford V6 blueprints or something(probably not).
And it's not like V6s are completely bulletproof. Look up "Honda V6 oil consumption", and that's from a manufacturer who has a lot of experience making V6s at this point.
Lots of V6s are being replaced by I4T. Honda Accord's J35 is being replaced by K20C, and Ford has dropped the V6 option altogether with the Mustang because they just don't sell(doesn't help that people laugh at you for having a V6 muscle/pony car over here). The Ecoboost Mustang(2.3T) is doing very well over here. Sell like hot cakes.
Another thing to consider is the higher engine option for cars usually just don't have a very high take rate. For most people, a 2.4/1.5T Accord, 2.5 Camry and 2.5 Mazda 6 is all they need. The V6 Accord's take rate is about 20% while the V6 Camry's take rate is lower than 10%.
Now don't get me wrong, I like a good V6 myself, really liked my V6 Accord Coupe, but it's starting to run into the dilemma of having advantages not a lot of people give a sh*t about(better sound, more predictability in corners) while the disadvantages are more apparent(more cost to manufacture, fuel economy not as good in EPA tests).
If Mazda is really going through the whole going up brand thing, I could see the use of a V6, but until then, I say just stick to the 2.5T.
2018 CX-5 (USA) Showing EPC and Gas or Diesel Engines.
2019 CX-5 (USA) Showing EPC Crankshaft and Engine Blocks, no mention of ANY Diesel, what is NEW that the 2018 did not have is the 2.5 TURBO from CX-9 and Mazda 6.
So you heard it here folks the CX-5 2.5 Turbo Gasoline is coming to the USA as a 2019 Model Year and the DIESELS are FINISHED for USA as they Never started.
Sure hope Mazda gets that 2.5T Exhaust GATE Fixed..
If I were to purchase another SUV (currently have a CRV) I'd want the extra torque and be able to use a larger Class III hitch on the same CX-5 like size/platform. Not having a V6 or larger Diesel (preference) would be a deal breaker.
I am still interested in the Chevy Cruze Hatchback Diesel (MT) with a new potential job that will have me commuting 52 mi round-trip/day in Boston traffic.
You know, a CX-5 2.5T sounds like it could be a good vehicle. Even if they de-tuned it (210 hp/290+ tq) to give more separation from the CX-9, it would still be an improvement over the 185/185 from the 2.5 motor.
Originally Posted by wannawankel
If I were to purchase another SUV (currently have a CRV) I'd want the extra torque and be able to use a larger Class III hitch on the same CX-5 like size/platform. Not having a V6 or larger Diesel (preference) would be a deal breaker.
A FWD (or F-biased AWD), 3500lb, unibody car with rear IRS and a 6000lb towing capacity?
Towing 3000lb of combined LeMons Del Slow race car and trailer behind my buddy's 4.7L V8 Cherokee (double axle with trailer brakes) wasn't the best experience I've ever had as a passenger.
Seems like overkill. Maybe Class II.
Last edited by NotAPreppie; Sep 20, 2018 at 09:29 AM.
If I were to purchase another SUV (currently have a CRV) I'd want the extra torque and be able to use a larger Class III hitch on the same CX-5 like size/platform. Not having a V6 or larger Diesel (preference) would be a deal breaker.
Then I think a truck is more for you.
You can get a diesel V6 with a Dodge RAM 1500.
An I4T is the same as a V6 as far as most people are concerned.
Originally Posted by wannawankel
I am still interested in the Chevy Cruze Hatchback Diesel (MT) with a new potential job that will have me commuting 52 mi round-trip/day in Boston traffic.
Why though?
Just buy a hybrid or EV then.
ICE sucks in terms of efficiency when you are dealing with low speed crawling. Let the electric motor take care of it.
"A hybrid/EV is boring to drive though!" Well you still have your RX-8, and driving in Boston is probably one of the least exciting things you can do anyway.
Edit: you'd think the diesel has an advantage on highways...
Nope.
Last edited by UnknownJinX; Sep 20, 2018 at 11:59 AM.
Ford's V6 is derived from Mazda's early V6's; just as Ford's Ecoboost 4cyl is derived from the MZR VDT. It'd be easy for Mazda to bring their design current with Sky-G tech if they wanted a V6, but their goal was to simplify with a single plane engine design that focused on efficiency.
Mazda needs to look at Subaru a little bit, not what they are now, but what they were a few years ago that got them to the forefront of America's interest. They offered practical space inside, a practical AWD drivetrain, with a dash of fun through turbocharged and manual options. Mazda already has a fantastic design language, their interiors and exteriors are fantastic, the suspension and handling is above average, they just need to give people the security of an AWD option across the board, and the option of a decent engine that can go, versus having to explain itself and its underperformance away by saying 'I'm good on fuel though!'.
Originally Posted by UnknownJinX
Then I think a truck is more for you.
You can get a diesel V6 with a Dodge RAM 1500.
The V6 diesel in the RAM and Jeep vehicles are pretty good. I'm looking at a Chevy Colorado with the 2.8L diesel 4-cylinder but I prefer smaller footprint trucks when possible.
Nicely stated "Mazda needs to look at Subaru a little bit, not what they are now, but what they were a few years ago that got them to the forefront of America's interest. They offered practical space inside, a practical AWD drivetrain, with a dash of fun through turbocharged and manual options. Mazda already has a fantastic design language, their interiors and exteriors are fantastic, the suspension and handling is above average, they just need to give people the security of an AWD option across the board, and the option of a decent engine that can go,"
Nicely stated "Mazda needs to look at Subaru a little bit, not what they are now, but what they were a few years ago that got them to the forefront of America's interest. They offered practical space inside, a practical AWD drivetrain, with a dash of fun through turbocharged and manual options. Mazda already has a fantastic design language, their interiors and exteriors are fantastic, the suspension and handling is above average, they just need to give people the security of an AWD option across the board, and the option of a decent engine that can go,"
Subaru has a cult following of boring boxy wagons, which also happens to sell damn well being that it is the niche Subaru fills. Most late model Subarus on the road are Foresters, Crosstreks, etc with naturally aspirated boxer-4s with CVTs. Their target consumer is Regular Joe in his plaid shirt, beard oil, raw demin jeans, red-wing boots, Trule rack with a bicycle, and a Lodge cast iron pan he uses when he takes his Subaru camping. There will be even more cry babies about how boring Mazda has become if they copy and paste the same designs. It's not a niche for Mazda to fill.
Mazda is doing well compared to even a decade ago. They're selling exactly (or better) as forecasting in their long-term plan. They have departments worldwide with educated employees dedicated to their product development which is directly coordinated with their growth. That said, expect nothing but CUVs with powertrains suitable for your mature buyers looking for a comfortable, economical, handsome, and reliable Point A to B vehicle.
Last edited by SayNoToPistons; Sep 27, 2018 at 09:44 AM.
Probably start arriving in the Spring or Summer, just like any other time they have announced an updated product.
On the upside, we only have 2 people complaining that the 2.5 T is getting put in the CX-5.
1 person because it's not enough power for him to pull a 30k pound vessel up and over the Continental Divide at 85 mph, and the other because the engine has a design issue in its exhaust flapper.
Ford's V6 is derived from Mazda's early V6's; just as Ford's Ecoboost 4cyl is derived from the MZR VDT. It'd be easy for Mazda to bring their design current with Sky-G tech if they wanted a V6, but their goal was to simplify with a single plane engine design that focused on efficiency.
The Ford Duratec V6 family started off as a partnership with Porsche. Mazda used some of these engines (or parts of them) in some of their cars.
The Ford Vulcan V6 family was clean-sheet design. Mazda used this platform in the B3000
The Ford Cologne and Essex V6 motors were also ford designed.
The Ford Cyclone family (3.3L/3.5L/3.7L, also bearing the name Duratec but different from earlier Duratecs) and their ecoboost counterpats are clean-sheet designs. Mazda used these motors in the 6 and CX-9.
The Mazda K-series V6 motors were Mazda only except for one the Ford Testar Ghia and Probe.
The Duratec/Ecoboost 4-cyl motors are all nearly identical to the MZR/L-series motors.
