RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

What is your opinion on how far away the Korean automakers are from Japanese levels of trim, fit & finish, materials, quality, durability and technology?

dshiznit1489

Hyundai is making quite a name for themselves lately. The new Genesis looks AMAZING. I thought it was a Mercedes when I drove past it.

HeavyMetal699

I think they are doing well to imitate the best out there and selling it for much cheaper.

Hyundai especially makes cars that have good value for the dollar. I think in the future they are going to shake the "cheap" and "inferior" image as time goes on.

Kind of like the Japanese car makers did in the 80's.

BTW I do not subscribe to the thought Japanese cars > all

RXei8ht

Very comparable, and even better in some cases. If you look at last years JD power and Associates Vehicle Dependability Study both Hyundai and Kia were ahead of Mazda in overall dependability.

http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/new...spx?ID=2007130

Renesis_8

They spend a lot of $$on R&D! If the new Hyundais prove to be reliable, then it gets the green light for me.

Interior and exterior quality can always be improved with $$, but not mechanical, takes time.
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RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

The one thing I wonder most about is durability.

It's one thing to hit initial quality targets and a whole other enchilada to see how the mechanicals are doing at 50k, 100k and beyond...

kersh4w

iTrader: (3)

its a good thing hyundais come with a 10 year/100k warranty then.. right?

JRichter

Last 4 years (after 2004) of dependability studies show Hyundai to be about mid-pack as far as reliability is concerned. Kia usually near bottom. Note Hyundai above Infinity and Mercedes in 2008.

playdoh43

their drive train engineering still lag behind japan and germany, but they are catching up fast

delhi

Buick, Cadilac and Oldsmobile are good buys then.

Lithium Lotus

I got to ride in a Genesis sedan when my friend test drove it. I sat in the back, and those were the most comfortable back seats I've ever been in.

TALAN7

It's funny how perception is everything. Hyundai has improved a lot but look at the 08 list. 4 of the top ten are American but all you hear here and on any other boards is that American is crap. Sure Hyundai is improving but I believe that American cars improved more in the same timeframe. My 2000 Buick Regal was wayyyy more reliable than my RX8. It rattled when I turned it in after the lease and it looked cheap inside but it never gave me any problems.

Loks like people are giving Hyundai and even Kia (which is still way down on the 08 list) the benefit of the doubt but won't budge when it comes to their perception of American cars. Just my 2 cents

Marklar

Part of the problem is that the American cars are overpriced by comparison, and tend to have crappy interiors and fittings. Reliable or not, the build quality isn't impressive at a glance.

The Korean cars have made amazing strides recently, but they aren't the equal of the Japanese yet. But they are less expensive, and offer a really good value.

JRichter

Yeah, the lines between build quality (how things are put together and materials used) and reliability (dependability) is always blurred. This is two different things. Then you also have the actual design (styling-wise) inside and out to look at. The charts above only represent reliability (to an extent). Where most of the American manufactures fail IMO is build quality and design - not necessarily reliability, but the general public seems to think so. To build a desirable product you want a decent blend of all three. Hyundai kind of falls in the same boat though I think their actual build quality is probably higher than a lot of the American cars and their design (styling) is still not to my liking but getting much better.

dynamho

There was a comedy movie called "Crazy People" in the 90's starring Dudley Moore who plays an ad exec that landed in an institution. He then employs them to create in-your-face ad campaigns.

I recall a section where they get a Japanese manufacturer's account and create this advertisement showing how average American physiology (tall and with big fingers) is a significant disadvantage for build quality.

Anyway, there were some good ones, like:
"Come... in the Bahamas." (travel)
"It won't just scare you, it will f*ck you up for life!" (movie)
"Jaguar. If you wanna get a bj from someone you don't know." (car)

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

I think the Koreans lag in suspension designs - even the new, acclaimed Genesis is starting to reveal some seriously unhappy early adoptors now that they've discovered the same type of suspension issues that have plagued Hyundai and Kia products of the past.

I do agree that assembly quality is leaps and bounds ahead of their last gen products, but I think there's almost a disconnect in the way the Korean cars drive and 'behave.'

I rented an Azera a while back on a 5 day trip - well, it was given to me. Anyways, the fit an finish was very good, the interior was very quiet, the fuel economy on the highway was surprising on the highway, but the damn car should have come with an anchor. I can't remember a worse ride in terms of undulating and bounding and even lateral swaying, ever. My s/o joked that she was 'sea sick' at times, and it wasn't that much of a stretch.

Many Sonata and Optima owners are bloody mad about the noises their front and rear suspensions make over busy roads.

Having said all that, I welcome the progression of Hyundai and Kia as low cost, viable competitors to the automotive scene, as they'll help keep others honest and drive down prices for the consumer.

JRichter

Lol, forgot about that movie. I will have to see that again as it's been so long I don't remember much about it. I think Daryl Hannah was in it.

I've never driven one but seems like I have heard/read similar things. Will be interesting to see how the new full spec RWD Genesis Coupe will handle (performance-wise) when given a proper full track test.

dynamho

Yes. Korean chassis dynamics and suspension engineering is their weakness. They've only recently started taking this seriously.

Arguably, handling is the least marketable and one the least important factors for mainstream American consumption. You can't really put a hard metric on handling.

They were smart to emphasize interior and cupholders before handling. Now that they have the money, they have the R&D budget to focus in addressing this deficiency. I assure you, they will be formidable in a short span of time.

ASH8

Agree totally, my sister has a KIA Cerato ( a year old), I was really surprised at the improvements and functions of the interior..

They have some ways to go, but are fast catching up to the Japanese standard.

What I notice are the interior plastics looks cheap and some items are and feel cheap. Carpets are poor quality. Their metal/panel work appears to be stronger/heavier.

But the main area in which they are light years behind are in chassis dynamics, handling, at a guess still in the mid 1990's. Brakes could be a little better too.

dynamho

Good call on the brakes.

Only performance-oriented manufacturers take brakes seriously, Mazda being one of them.

Again, braking is not as sexy as 0-60 from a marketing standpoint.

Many domestic and Korean cars are deficient on braking.

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

Not only brakes, but ESC and ABS.

I am amazed that Kia and Hyundai, yearning to be taken seriously (and they are serious) in the mass volume market, have yet to include ESC & ABS as standard features in their family-oriented sedan offerings.