red_rx8_red_int

Exactly my plan.

red_rx8_red_int

I think the RX8 is fine for a corporate exec. I work in a very upscale environment with many folks making a lot more than me and I think I have the best daily driver there. The people with porsches don't daily drive them.

GiN

Look what you've started!!! :p

VikingDJ

Interesting reading on this thread. I have to agree with ike here. The sti should be in no way compared to the origin impreza. People tend to look at the appearance and just decide to mock it for not being an original body design like rx8. The fact is that everything around the car is nothing like a regular impreza. If you want to mock the looks of the sti, that's fine. If you don't like feeling every bump on road like a true performance sports car performs that's fine too. Those are subjective views, but purely opinion based on one's particular needs. Someone can come along and do the same thing to the rx8 in the reverse order. I thought I would enjoy the high revving rx8 more then my previous ownership of high torque power. Having to drive the rx8 at high rpm speeds to get it to go anywhere at the moment just doesn't fall into my needs for a sports car. I admit I am so caputred by the appearance of rx8, I do realize that making a trade in like this, I am ultimately sacrificing looks and refinement for power and performance, therefore I need time to think this through.

I do realize that this may be totally out of my hands, because I can almost here the dealership talking to me right now. I predict something along the lines of " WELL THE RX8 DOES NOT HAVE A HIGH DEMAND, AND WE CAN"T GIVE YOU NEAR TRADE IN VALUE BECAUSE WE SIMPLY COULD NOT SELL CAR. " The fact is that the car is selling brand new for same as the private party value KBB suggests. This is where these super below invoice deals can kill you. If placed at a dealership, it would probably only sell for 28k, which is what it's trade in value is. I ultimately think when the subaru dealer gets back to me, they will offer thousands less then trade in value, and that alone will kill any hopes of a trade in. Currently they said they need to look further into it before they can give me any numbers. This probably means they don't want the rx8, but want to make a sale, so they are stalling because they know I am a long shot buyer. Even though the msrp of my rx8 when new is considerably more then a brand new sti, it may do me little good. The car only has 3100 miles on it, has every single option plus nearly $1k worth of dealer installs it will not mean anything. I am sure the market value has dropped considersably, and the dealer will want my car plus about 6-7k, if not more. I wanted to try it anyway, but likely I am stuck with rx8 (not a bad car to be stuck with). We'll see what the dealer has to say. This appears to be a buy it and marry it car, like many cars are. I had hoped that the 3500 I got off msrp would help me in trading it in, but it appears the price I paid from a trade in standpoint, is actually the msrp of the car. It's out of my hands, so if the price is right, I'll be at dealership this weekend to test drive. Very unlikely, but I'll wait and see what they decide. Thanks for reading!!

Fanman

No way would I say the RX8 has more potential. I would say maybe the RX7 might have a case, but not the RX8.

Ike

I'll agree with you there, the FD has it's quirks but it certainly has a ton of potential if you want to deal with those quirks.

Kain

Do you ever think about how much time you devote (waste) to every STI or WRX thread on this board>? It used to upset me how aggressively you would attack these comments, and in the tone that you did it in, ultimately alienating new 8 owners on an 8 board from their lovely new investments. I now see it as cute and almost funny when I picture you scouring through old articles to get your quotes and typing away feverishly just to make a point on a board you just happen to frequent, for a car (the 8) you would never own in the first place. I as well test drove an STI before I made my purchase, I however could not get over the pure ugliness of the car. If your stuck on a desert island with a super ugly girl, THAT is a situation where you would have to "let her grow on you" for me a car is not. especially a daily driver. Thus, we all have our own opinions, and if you owned an 8 I am sure yours would differ. maybe you could try a different method next time and pride yourself in the knowledge that others are ignorant- don't hang their underwear from the flagpole!!! now back to the festivities!!!! <ewoks bang your drums!!!>

shelleys_man_06

How do you people know whether the RX-8 has any tuning potential or not? Am I subject to blind faith? Of course not. This car hasn't even been out for a year, and yet people are now complaining about the limited tuning options available. I can't believe the impatience. If you want instant gratification, by all means get an STi, EVO VIII, or even an FD3S. Cars like that have already established themselves as tuner cars. The RX-8's tuning potential hasn't even been tapped yet, and its already getting bashed. Engines such as the EJ20 (I know it's not the USDM-spec STi engine), the 4G63, 13B-REW all have its vast share of aftermarket goodies, mostly because it comes turbocharged. Strap on an intake and an exhaust, and you will soon see serious results on the dyno. Small displacement N/A engines will always have a hard time making insane amounts of power. The main issue is displacement. Also, I believe converting N/A motors to FI is not easy. Why do people assume a turbo kit will be churned out within months of a car's release? Ever heard of R&D? If you can design a turbo kit, nitrous setup, etc. in two weeks, give HKS a call. They would love to hire you .

VikingDJ

Of course the car has tuning potential. Any one can make a car fast. However, if you add up the time, money, and reliability to taking a regular rx8 and modifying it, it's just not the car you buy for pure performance no matter what it's tuning potential is. 300hp worth of potential on the stock engine safely? I don't see it. It can be done, but not without huge consuqences and shortened engine life. The STI is instant potential, with a beefed up forged piston boxer engine that is meant to handle mods and lots of POWER. The renesis engine I do not believe can handle 300hp and last a long time. I may be wrong, but I just cannot see you easily being able to make this a 300hp beast, yet still be a daily driver that will last a very long time. Ultimately Mazda needs to be the one to create this.l Putting your own kit on this is not a good idea for a daily driver that you plan on putting a lot of miles on, and driving for a long time. If it's meant for pure track, then by all means, knock yourself out.

Wow, that was bold of you Kain, yet so so very true. I do not know if I will be able to get over the ugliness of the sti. it doesn't look that great to me in pictures, but I'm heading to dealer to look and possible and test drive, and we'll see how I feel. They never let me test drive it in February because the dealership only had one. This time they only have 2, so we'll see. Maybe I could have persuaded them by acting like I was definitely gonna buy one, but I didn't.
Of course the second I showed up at mazda dealership, the guy was already getting the rx8 out of the lot.

shelleys_man_06

Who says you cannot have a reliable turbo kit?

RX8-TX

I know its juts a matter of preference...but if you finally go for the STi, make sure you don't get the rear wing. I don't really know how old you are, but I could live without it. And I think I could probably be happy...obviously, sitting alongside my 8.

Lawerence

He is talking about turboing an N/A car.

Which IMO (and most other people SHOULD agree) has more risk/time/effort associated with it than modding an already turbo car. (of course this is a different given point on any engine).
Sock turbo>aftermarket turbo (not in all cases)


Well i agree that it wont be done easily (at least not in the near future).
But i think it can be done. As far as reliability we will have to wait and see.
I personally want to see how long the STOCK motors are going to last.

Lawerence

Oh and DJ i was in a situation similar to yours.

I owned a brand new cadillac Catera. Never gave me any problems had every option...then i decided i wanted something sporty. So I had to take a nice big hit on the catera (shouldnt be as bad with an RX8) after only 8 months and about 7000 miles.

The car I get consequently ended up being a POS. And i got another car shortly after.
And TWO new car purchases after that one. Then I vowed nover to buy new again unless...
a) I can pay with cash (no finance)
b) Its a new RX7 (then i'll suffer the 7%)

Ike

I fully intended to ignore this post since it's just the same crap that's been gone over before. However I was PMed and asked to post some thoughts, so I did so.


P.S. It took me 5 seconds to find that quote because it was in the last thread about the STi...

VikingDJ

Well said Lawrence. My concern is not with the inability to make the rx8 a true performance car. It's what you said "risk/time/effort" being the key factor/ along with the big bucks that will come along with it. For a daily driver every day car a custom modded 04 rx8 is not the best idea. The risk is too great. As of now, there is no risk because it's not really possible. Reliability by adding a turbo to rx8 is hit or miss, but you can't agrue that the risk is not greater then buying a brand new sti. Plus, there goes your warranty. Ultimately I am looking at the sti being a good car for three years, and if and when mazda makes a car with similiar power, I will then trade it back and get what I really want. No one really knows how the renesis motor would handle having 300hp, but odds are it won't be as good as a forged piston beefed up boxer engine like the sti has. There are only three things I see as making this a bad idea. #1 is the financial hit I would take. #2, losing amenities. I can deal with no leather. I really don't use the navigation, but could always go aftermarket if I end up missing it. The bose system in rx8 is decent, but not enough to factor in. Then you have other things like the hid lights, heated seats and power driver's seat, the homelink system. I would miss the sunroof, but I'd get over it fast. Whatever I missed feature wise doesn't factor in. #3 is the looks. I admit I am downgrading with an sti, and that is holding me back. There are some plus sides of course to getting th sti. The pure power and performance, and the awd, which by putting a set of all season radials on would make the car drivable in winter. I'm not sure how the car as it sells would be in snow, but it would def be better then the rx8. I'm currently playing email tag with dealer, cutting through all the BS so they will finally give me a number. I want to make my decision by end of week, so hopefully they will get back to me. I am impressed with this dealership, because even in this long shot sale, they are still taking the time to meet my request, and come up with their best possible deal they can give me. I can't ask for any better. I can't even make a decision until I have my total loss, so for now this is still just an inquiry. Needless to say if I did by some chance end up with the sti, it will be utterly bittersweet. There's a part of me that hopes the dealer will give me an out of reach quote, so I can just accept the rx8 and it's flaws, and wait patiently for a better rx8.

As for IKE. I asked him to post on this thread, because in beginning there was nothing but bashing going on about the sti, which is not fair. He may be opinionated and naturally bias when it somes to the wrx and sti, and can be overcritical about rx8 to obvious sensitive and defensive owners, but he doesn't rip the rx8, and he understands and respects the car for all it's attributes even though he'd probably never buy one. This site needs people like him to neutralize the bias owners, and offer information, so people who come here thinking about rx8 can here more then just GET IT MAN GET IT. He's not any more bias about the wrx then most people here are about the rx8, so keep that in mind. I guess the fact that he does it on an rx8 forum is what gets to people. It shouldn't because there are just as many non owning rx8 people on here as there are owners. I am middle road, and I see the flaws in cars I own as well as cars I don't own. I wouldn't encourage/discourage anyone from buying an sti instead of an rx8, or the reverse for that matter. Thanks for posting IKE. You may **** off some rx8 owners here with your tell it like it is attitude, but in my book you give people ability to look at both sides of stories.

Ike

As is the STi will be scary in the snow, the tires that come with it are close to being an R compound. So certainly plan on getting some either snow tires or all seasons should you decide to go with the STi. I went through one winter with ultra high performance all seasons and I wouldn't suggest it I couldn't believe how safe it felt regardless. I procrastinated and then drove them through the first early snow and just decided to go with it unless it started to feel unsafe and it never did. However, getting some good snow tires makes the car a blast to drive in the winter, if it snowed it was time to go find a parking lot or some back roads to go out and play on. Lakes can be pretty fun as well depending on how well the lake freezes and how insane you are

Honestly I'm pretty unbiased when it comes to the STi and WRX, I love my car but I know it's shortcomings as well as the STi's. Though if the EVO didn't exist I wouldn't have much bad to say about the STi, with the EVO considered it falls short in a few areas. Mainly the STi's steering isn't as good as the EVO, the EVO is about as good as it gets for a non supercar on the track, it's so fast and responsive and has an amazing feel. However I can see how that would be a bit scary at times in day to day driving. The seats in the EVO get the nod over the STi's as well, unless you're a bit of a widebody :p You want ultimate performance in the 30k range you buy the EVO. You want something really damn close to the EVO with more low end grunt and a bit faster stock for stock that's better for daily driving then the STi is your choice. Potential wise the EVO gets the nod as well, but that's more to do with how old the powerplant is and the amount of tuning knowledge. Give it some time and the USDM STi should be able to show more potential based on the extra displacement. But that's really only something to worry about if you have to have a car that you can make run 10s now (because 11s just won't do) rather than in a year or two.

playdoh43

ohh yeah, if u buy a STI, which is a nice car. make sure you know and research about the detonation problem at a sti forum. detonating makes your engine go bye bye , its a lot worse than flooding your rx8

Ike

Many of the people having problems are from Cali where 91 octane is the best they can get. The STi does NOT like lower octane fuels, but in Pa. that shouldn't be a problem.

playdoh43

its true, but ive also heard of it detonating on 93 octane. I too dont think its that big of a threat since chance of it happening isn't really that high... I just know there is such a problem. But i dont really know too much about it, so its best you read up on their forums and get a feel for your self. its your money :p

playdoh43

Besides, WRX and Evo are like the step child AWD performance cars in Japan, if you want the big boy, you gotta go with the Skyline GT-R. And the next GT-R is coming to US in 07 (will cost more than an a STI though). Trading in a relatively new car is a huge hit on the pocketbook!

VikingDJ

I am not trading in rx8 for sti afterall. I thought it over, and I can't lose that kind of money just to have a better performance car. The numbers subaru gave me were pretty good, but only on the 04 model they have leftover. The 05 was just too big of a hit. So, now comes plan B. I have a 95 golf I use as my work car. It's old and only worth like $1k on trade in. I'm laying an offer on table for the 04 sti they have. $3k down, plus the golf trade in instead of rx8, and I am gonna finance. The rx8 is paid off so no worries there. I may bail becuase I'm not sure if I want a 5 year loan or not, but I'm gonna see what the dealer can come up with interest rate wise. I figured this will solve my problem all together because I love both the sti and rx8 so much. I'm gonna go to dealer tomorrow and negotiate. I may or may not walk out with sti, but I'm gonna see what they can do. They'll need to give me a low interest rate, and $500 a month is absolute most I will pay monthly. It's still a long shot, but man, slapping a set of all season radials on sti and having and for winter, and rx8 for summer. CAN IT GET ANY BETTER THEN THAT?

GiN

Having both is better than having to choose. :-D Get an EVO and a 350Z while you're at it! :-D