driven!the GM Hywire
04-04-2003, 01:01 AM
#2
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makes you wonder what kind of cars will be on the road 30, 40, 50 years from now. How do you soup up a car with no engine? What will happen to are rotary? What will happen to the piston engine? Boggles the mind.
04-07-2003, 10:41 PM
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04-08-2003, 12:14 AM
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Originally posted by 13bpower
] How do you soup up a car with no engine? What will happen to are rotary? What will happen to the piston engine?
] How do you soup up a car with no engine? What will happen to are rotary? What will happen to the piston engine?
hey, some electricity-smart guys, tell me, would very low ampherage with very high voltage be better than high amps and low volts, as far as running an electric motor goes??
IC engines, if fuel cells take over (which they won't: constantly cost prohibitive), then they'll simply become antiquated dreams of "cheap performance" enthusiasts, just like leaded gasoline.
Last edited by wakeech; 04-08-2003 at 12:18 AM.
04-08-2003, 12:23 AM
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Originally posted by chenpin
here is a nice article:
http://www.inter.net.il/~m-design/green/mazda.html
here is a nice article:
http://www.inter.net.il/~m-design/green/mazda.html
but, i'm still wondering if water injection into the combustion chamber would help boost thermal efficiency (and thus torque) in a hydrogen engine where the water droplets shouldn't interfere much with the combustion...??
04-08-2003, 01:30 AM
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http://www.inter.net.il/~m-design/green/mazda.html
good article, but it was referring to testing back in 1991, so what about recently? is the hydrogen rotary still in any sort of R&D?
hmmm....hydrogen pwred rx-8...or even rx-7...
Last edited by rotorex; 04-08-2003 at 01:38 AM.
04-08-2003, 04:00 PM
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Originally posted by wakeech
hey, some electricity-smart guys, tell me, would very low ampherage with very high voltage be better than high amps and low volts, as far as running an electric motor goes??
hey, some electricity-smart guys, tell me, would very low ampherage with very high voltage be better than high amps and low volts, as far as running an electric motor goes??
From gut feeling I would say more current => stronger B field => stronger Fb (force due to B).
04-08-2003, 06:24 PM
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Originally posted by zoom44
i asked the most electrically smart guy in oregon and he said high volts and low amps is the way to go.
i asked the most electrically smart guy in oregon and he said high volts and low amps is the way to go.
04-08-2003, 07:25 PM
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you're talking about current proportional to propagation? I guess that explains IIR.
EDIT: Also I just thought of something. Running at higher voltage will increase efficiency (by less wire heating, dunno if that offsets core losses), but at a cost. A high voltage motor is larger, heavier, cost more to buy, cost more to rewind and takes longer to rewind. So there are economic constraints to High V Low I, but in general V>I is better than I>V
Also you will not really be getting more performance. For example,
100HP 1800RPM 230/460Volts 228/114Amps 405T Frame 1277Lbs. Cost $2800
Repair/Rewind $1399 3days
100HP 1800RPM 2300/4160Volts 30/17Amps 447/9T Frame 2800Lbs. Cost $15,100
Rewind $7550 7days
Power needed to run both engines are roughly the same @230V vs. 2300V. @4160V vs. 460V the High V actually uses more power.
EDIT: Also I just thought of something. Running at higher voltage will increase efficiency (by less wire heating, dunno if that offsets core losses), but at a cost. A high voltage motor is larger, heavier, cost more to buy, cost more to rewind and takes longer to rewind. So there are economic constraints to High V Low I, but in general V>I is better than I>V
Also you will not really be getting more performance. For example,
100HP 1800RPM 230/460Volts 228/114Amps 405T Frame 1277Lbs. Cost $2800
Repair/Rewind $1399 3days
100HP 1800RPM 2300/4160Volts 30/17Amps 447/9T Frame 2800Lbs. Cost $15,100
Rewind $7550 7days
Power needed to run both engines are roughly the same @230V vs. 2300V. @4160V vs. 460V the High V actually uses more power.
Last edited by chenpin; 04-08-2003 at 07:44 PM.
04-09-2003, 10:15 PM
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The saddest part about going from IC engines to fuel cells and electric motors is that electrical engineers will be designing the drive train, instead of mechanical engineers, like me! :D
But seriously, fuel cells are the future. The biggest problem is makeing them cheap enough for the average consumer. Also, producing H2 requires enormous amounts of energy and/or pollution. You end up spending ten times more energy on producing hydrogen than the amount of energy you get from the hydrogen. We need to figure out a way to produce hydrogen much more efficiently.
As for us mechanical engineers, we can still design the chassis, suspension and fuel containment systems :D
But seriously, fuel cells are the future. The biggest problem is makeing them cheap enough for the average consumer. Also, producing H2 requires enormous amounts of energy and/or pollution. You end up spending ten times more energy on producing hydrogen than the amount of energy you get from the hydrogen. We need to figure out a way to produce hydrogen much more efficiently.
As for us mechanical engineers, we can still design the chassis, suspension and fuel containment systems :D
04-10-2003, 01:03 PM
#15
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Originally posted by Schneegz
Also, producing H2 requires enormous amounts of energy and/or pollution. You end up spending ten times more energy on producing hydrogen than the amount of energy you get from the hydrogen. We need to figure out a way to produce hydrogen much more efficiently.
Also, producing H2 requires enormous amounts of energy and/or pollution. You end up spending ten times more energy on producing hydrogen than the amount of energy you get from the hydrogen. We need to figure out a way to produce hydrogen much more efficiently.
04-10-2003, 01:07 PM
#16
The problem remains that these fuel cells cost upwards of 90 thousand dollars to make.
The reason is because they use sensitive and expensive materials like.... PLATINUM!
The fuel cells are also more prone to weathery conditions, specially cold and also extreme hot.
This is why I'd still say that a hydrogen COMBUSTION engine (even with the combustion power loss that's signifigant) is the way of the future; fuel cell technology is nice but not very applicable nor will it become affordable due to the expensive materials that are used to make up the fuel cells.
The reason is because they use sensitive and expensive materials like.... PLATINUM!
The fuel cells are also more prone to weathery conditions, specially cold and also extreme hot.
This is why I'd still say that a hydrogen COMBUSTION engine (even with the combustion power loss that's signifigant) is the way of the future; fuel cell technology is nice but not very applicable nor will it become affordable due to the expensive materials that are used to make up the fuel cells.
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