When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
This is just a rant and take it as you will. But the next person that brings me a turbo RX-8 trying to make power with BHR crap coils on it is going to receive an earful. These coils suck to make any real power as they come from BHR. Please stop using cheap truck coils in turbo applications! It wastes my time and your money. Even in stock n/a form, the OEM coils (healthy) perform better then the BHR coils with the stock tune. You lose almost 10 rwhp with BHR coils stock (untuned)! End rant...
Well whatever works makes sense, we all can only speak from personal experience but I myself have driven and known quite a few boosted RX-8's with BHR coils and homemade D585 kits. Some of those cars have been boosted for many years.
whoa whoa... this is gonna get heated, time to get the popcorn.. a lot of OTHER people have the BHR coils believing they are god compared to oem coils....
hehehehehe.... I'm on the OEM coils side of things....
MMmmmmm well I believe this is rather more important than popcorn eating gifs and stuff.
@footman and @sonicsdaman
I respect Scott, Ray, Kane, Jeff, Brett, Mark etc
It sucks that it's a BHR product. But I stand by my experience ... seriously I'm out now not another post in this thread. I will not entertain the popcorn eaters
Meh, there really is no debate, it's really just personal opinion. Plenty of platforms use these coils without issue. I am not saying they are the best setup anyone could ever make, there are a couple of viable coil options but these work fine for the majority of customers and i would say they are well proven. and plenty of people have been fine with stock coils. But I went thru three sets of stock coils and never ran anything other than OEM Mazda coils when I was NA. And the S2's seem to go thru coils fairly often still so I am not sure that the revised OEM coils are any better.
MMmmmmm well I believe this is rather more important than popcorn eating gifs and stuff.
@footman and @sonicsdaman
I respect Scott, Ray, Kane, Jeff, Brett, Mark etc
It sucks that it's a BHR product. But I stand by my experience ... seriously I'm out now not another post in this thread. I will not entertain the popcorn eaters
Yeah I mean if you had issues you had issues, you can only base your opinions on that and if I experienced the same thing I would probably feel the same way. I understand it is not a knock on BHR.
I figured the fanboys would magically appear into the Canadian section. The problem with people is they base their opinions on the fact that it seems to work for them. If your not pushing a minimum of 14 PSI, I really don't care about your boosted opinion. Noticeable misfires only seem to start to happen around 10-12 PSI if your paying attention.
I didn't just create this thread based on a bad experience with BHR coils with one car. This last car that just took me over the edge. I can't stand behind an overpriced bracket and adapter harness using the wrong coils. Maxing out the dwell helps, rewiring the harness to get direct power helps, but the end of the day its still barely adequate for low boost applications, just people assume because it works, "ITS FINE" while in reality their losing potential HP. At high boost, it really shows how useless they are, misfires like a pig. As far as I'm concerned BHR coils are only useful for n/a (with tune to modify dwell) or your low HP Greddy kits running 6-10 psi...
I did this comparison on a 2009 R3 with 50,000 KM (healthy engine) last year just so I could show people the HP you lose with BHR coils + stock tune. You lose about 8-9 rwhp with BHR coils on a stock tune/car vs OEM healthy coils...
And no need to get pissy, I just disagree with you. I have seen plenty of RX-8 dyno days, and a lot of cars with the BHR kit on the dyno, your HP loss claim is BS IMO. And I'm not a fan boy, my kit has worked fine since 2009 and there are many others who would say the same as well. My buddy Shadycrew31 made 218WHP NA (MM tune) with his his homemade D585 kit using a BHR harness and when he was turbo (Greddy) he made 275WHP with a tune that wasn't even finished.
But yeah the stock tune surely isn't ideal. What is your solution for a better kit.
A Greddy turbo doesn't make enough power to push the coils over to the point of noticeable misfire with the correct dwell.
My HP claim is BS? I tested it back to back. I drove the car onto the dyno and did 2 pulls with the original tired ignition system, it made around 156 rwhp if memory serves. I installed (still on the dyno) the complete BHR setup (coils, wires, plugs) and did 2 pulls, it did the 170 rwhp listed above. I tuned the dwell to take advantage of BHR coils and did 2 pulls, it made 178 or 179 rwhp. I then actually tuned the ECU and got the 183 rwhp shown above in the comparison. Have you ever tried such a comparison to have actual data or are you just throwing comments out your ***?
A Greddy turbo doesn't make enough power to push the coils over to the point of noticeable misfire.
My HP claim is BS? I tested it back to back. I drove the car onto the dyno and did 2 pulls with the original tired ignition system, it made around 156 rwhp if memory serves. I installed (still on the dyno) the complete BHR setup (coils, wires, plugs) and did 2 pulls, it did the 170 rwhp listed above. I tuned the dwell to take advantage of BHR coils and did 2 pulls, it made 178 or 179 rwhp. I then actually tuned the ECU and got the 183 rwhp shown above in the comparison. Have you ever tried such a comparison to have actual data or are you just throwing comments out your ***?
thewird
Serious question: Any idea what the compression was like on that engine? Quantitatively?
Serious question: Any idea what the compression was like on that engine? Quantitatively?
Do you really think an S2 engine with 50k KM (30k miles) needs a compression test when they fixed the oiling in the S2's? I specifically waited for a car like this so the engine wouldn't be a question. This wasn't the only time I had seen that difference. Please don't assume I am basing any opinion stated here from one car. I only form an opinion after I've seen it on a couple of cars, otherwise its just a theory in my head until I see it again. I will gladly repeat the test on another car if a customer wishes, its not that hard to do at all.
Just a question. A specific reason behind it, but just a question. I'm not attacking you.
Even the OEM coil power you got it to is down considerably from other S2s dynoed that are bone stock untuned, so it's a valid question.
Well the stock power was from the original old components. The car needed new spark plugs but the owner decided to upgrade to BHR and tune instead of just changing the plugs. Which don't misunderstand me it is perfectly fine. I did the comparison to show people they need a tune when they get BHR coils, not that the BHR coils aren't good for that application. If they don't plan to get tuned, new OEM coils (not the ebay crap from alibaba) are the better option as it will make more power. That is all I am trying to say with that particular comparison. It is a separate argument from my turbo rant and I probably should have left it out of it so people wouldn't get confused lol.
Possibly. Still, there are stock S2s that have dynoed north of 200, no tuning, so a tuned OEM coil option not even getting to 190 makes me wonder.
Even if it is fuel wash clearing oil film from running on shot coils, cat clogging from the fuel, etc... A few explanations, was just curious at the disparity. In part because it has shown up elsewhere that a low compression engine can misfire with BHR coils where it won't on OEM coils. I don't know coil tech to know how that would happen, but I suspect that the accurate answer may be related to the original complaint you made in the thread.
Possibly. Still, there are stock S2s that have dynoed north of 200, no tuning, so a tuned OEM coil option not even getting to 190 makes me wonder.
Even if it is fuel wash clearing oil film from running on shot coils, cat clogging from the fuel, etc... A few explanations, was just curious at the disparity. In part because it has shown up elsewhere that a low compression engine can misfire with BHR coils where it won't on OEM coils. I don't know coil tech to know how that would happen, but I suspect that the accurate answer may be related to the original complaint you made in the thread.
That would be dyno discrepancies. All dyno's read different so you can't compare dyno sheets from different machines (even if its the same model but a different machine/day). That is why its important to use the same dyno and day when making comparisons ideally. My dyno numbers are consistent with other RX-8's I've done on this machine. That particular car was bone stock everything other then the BHR upgrade.
As for the current car I'm working on, its an 06 I believe with 56k KM. Again very little mileage, that a compression test would be a waste of time. The noticeable misfire only happens after it crossed over 12 PSI. It started having random hesitations over 10 PSI which some people link to the ports actuating or injectors staging (which is partially true) but on a strong ignition system you won't get that hesitation at all as the coils will burn through the fueling spikes/troughs. The current turbo is a GTX3076 FYI.
A Greddy turbo doesn't make enough power to push the coils over to the point of noticeable misfire with the correct dwell.
My HP claim is BS? I tested it back to back. I drove the car onto the dyno and did 2 pulls with the original tired ignition system, it made around 156 rwhp if memory serves. I installed (still on the dyno) the complete BHR setup (coils, wires, plugs) and did 2 pulls, it did the 170 rwhp listed above. I tuned the dwell to take advantage of BHR coils and did 2 pulls, it made 178 or 179 rwhp. I then actually tuned the ECU and got the 183 rwhp shown above in the comparison. Have you ever tried such a comparison to have actual data or are you just throwing comments out your ***?
thewird
I have never tried the comparison, I have just seen about 50 RX-8's on the Dyno over the years and I have seen plenty of BHR equipped cars make power, both turbo and non turbo, tuned and untuned. Your particular example is just one so it doesn't hold much value to me personally but you are entitled to believe what you want. I have also seen bone stock cars make more power than tuned ones with full bolt ons, lots of factors involved.
And how much power exactly do you think is too much for the stock coils? How much power is this particular turbo RX-8 you are tuning making?
I have never tried the comparison, I have just seen about 50 RX-8's on the Dyno over the years and I have seen plenty of BHR equipped cars make power, both turbo and non turbo, tuned and untuned. Your particular example is just one so it doesn't hold much value to me personally but you are entitled to believe what you want. I have also seen bone stock cars make more power than tuned ones with full bolt ons, lots of factors involved.
And how much power exactly do you think is too much for the stock coils? How much power is this particular turbo RX-8 you are tuning making?
I really don't care what you believe. I base my opinions on actual tests, not what I see or feel. I don't bias my opinions on products because I own or don't own them which is a big problem in the performance community.
There isn't a specific HP that a coil can or cannot due, that has to do with CCP and amount of fuel that needs to be ignited. A Greddy turbo will probably never push the BHR coils beyond their capacity with the correct dwell. A bigger turbo running high boost will, at low boost they will probably still manage but doesn't mean there isn't power left on the table due to weak ignition.
03-16-2015, 01:06 AM
