Automatic RX8 a FIZZER .
01-21-2004, 03:50 AM
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Automatic RX8 a FIZZER .
Well its nice to know i am not alone in criticising the decision by MAZDA to bring out the automatic RX8.
These are the comments made by the jounalists from Wheels magazine Feb 04, pgs. 61, 110, 111 in relation to the automatic RX8:
"Mazda meanwhile got busted over its reluctance to hand out automatic RX8's to the press. They were firmly told that there could be no COTY (Car Of The Year award) consideration without it. Magically, they found one, and suspicions were confirmed when the four-speed, low-revving rotary drove like a DRUGGED DACHSHUND (breed of small dog). It became known as the six-cylinder P76.
(Hymee as an ex-P76 owner - are you reading this?)
The RX8 automatic, on the other hand, is not so satisfying. Mazda's decision to team the rotary with a four-speed automatic is hard to understand. Torque converters can't cope with high revs. Consequently, the auto RX8 redline is 7500 rpm, largely accounting for the loss of 36kW compared with the unrestricted engine of the manual.
The automatic's top gear is much taller than the manual's and with fewer gears to fill a wider spread, the gaps between ratios are huge. Compounding the problem further is the auto's electronic control software. To avoid shift shock and to ensure transmission durability, it will not allow selection of first gear from second at more than 45 km/h.
This equates to an engine speed of only 4600 rpm. The driver is denied access to the top half of the engine's operating range, where the rotary is at its best.
While the automatic RX8 performs reasonably well in undemanding situations, such as city or freeway driving, it cannot be recommended to an enthusiastic driver. Mazda should have given the RX8 the automatic it deserves - either a sequential, one of the double-clutch sequentials, or even a toroidal CVT; all would have been good choices. All of these technologies avoid the rev restrictions of a torque converter auto. Even a five-speed conventional auto would have been better."
** The words in brackets are mine
The good news is that even with the lame duck/dachshund of a dog automatic RX8 we still managed to win the coveted Australian Car Of The Year (COTY) award.
For all the automatic drivers - learn to drive manual so that in the future you can truly enjoy what a sports car is all about.
Michael
These are the comments made by the jounalists from Wheels magazine Feb 04, pgs. 61, 110, 111 in relation to the automatic RX8:
"Mazda meanwhile got busted over its reluctance to hand out automatic RX8's to the press. They were firmly told that there could be no COTY (Car Of The Year award) consideration without it. Magically, they found one, and suspicions were confirmed when the four-speed, low-revving rotary drove like a DRUGGED DACHSHUND (breed of small dog). It became known as the six-cylinder P76.
(Hymee as an ex-P76 owner - are you reading this?)
The RX8 automatic, on the other hand, is not so satisfying. Mazda's decision to team the rotary with a four-speed automatic is hard to understand. Torque converters can't cope with high revs. Consequently, the auto RX8 redline is 7500 rpm, largely accounting for the loss of 36kW compared with the unrestricted engine of the manual.
The automatic's top gear is much taller than the manual's and with fewer gears to fill a wider spread, the gaps between ratios are huge. Compounding the problem further is the auto's electronic control software. To avoid shift shock and to ensure transmission durability, it will not allow selection of first gear from second at more than 45 km/h.
This equates to an engine speed of only 4600 rpm. The driver is denied access to the top half of the engine's operating range, where the rotary is at its best.
While the automatic RX8 performs reasonably well in undemanding situations, such as city or freeway driving, it cannot be recommended to an enthusiastic driver. Mazda should have given the RX8 the automatic it deserves - either a sequential, one of the double-clutch sequentials, or even a toroidal CVT; all would have been good choices. All of these technologies avoid the rev restrictions of a torque converter auto. Even a five-speed conventional auto would have been better."
** The words in brackets are mine
The good news is that even with the lame duck/dachshund of a dog automatic RX8 we still managed to win the coveted Australian Car Of The Year (COTY) award.
For all the automatic drivers - learn to drive manual so that in the future you can truly enjoy what a sports car is all about.
Michael
01-21-2004, 05:28 AM
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I'm disturbed by this, I have my reason's why I got the auto.
1. Northern Va, traffic is hell I drive 100-110 a day. If theres a wreck 2hrs easy one way, stop go stop go.
2. I have a 3 yr old in the back seat which needs things all the time.
3. I don't give a dam about what vehicles can out run me! Hell 85-90% of the vehicles can do that.
4. Bought for looks , rotary fan, and back seat. Because I do things with my family.
5. I had a Supra that was a stick and drove it in the same traffic. Life sucked, leg cramps that took alot of time to recoup afterwards.
People are different and they have different needs. So don't ever say "For all the automatic drivers - learn to drive manual so that in the future you can truly enjoy what a sports car is all about."
For my needs the Auto is great.
I posted a 132mph on a road course here. OH my god I'm in an Auto. I guess I don't know what a Sports car feels like.
Look at my tag it says it all.
1. Northern Va, traffic is hell I drive 100-110 a day. If theres a wreck 2hrs easy one way, stop go stop go.
2. I have a 3 yr old in the back seat which needs things all the time.
3. I don't give a dam about what vehicles can out run me! Hell 85-90% of the vehicles can do that.
4. Bought for looks , rotary fan, and back seat. Because I do things with my family.
5. I had a Supra that was a stick and drove it in the same traffic. Life sucked, leg cramps that took alot of time to recoup afterwards.
People are different and they have different needs. So don't ever say "For all the automatic drivers - learn to drive manual so that in the future you can truly enjoy what a sports car is all about."
For my needs the Auto is great.
I posted a 132mph on a road course here. OH my god I'm in an Auto. I guess I don't know what a Sports car feels like.
Look at my tag it says it all.
01-21-2004, 05:37 AM
#3
The auto is for those who want an auto, so Mazda is meeting a segment of the Market they were not willing to miss out on.
Although I personally wouldn't have bought one, I can't critisize anyone who has. We are all entitled to our own opinions, just as much as we are entitled to express them.
Cheers,
Hymee.
It has been a long day...
Although I personally wouldn't have bought one, I can't critisize anyone who has. We are all entitled to our own opinions, just as much as we are entitled to express them.
Cheers,
Hymee.
It has been a long day...
01-21-2004, 06:26 AM
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mmmdowning
If you were disturbed by my post you always have the option of not reading it.
Some people just cant handle the reality of being told the TRUTH.
Yeah in my opinion you dont know what a real manual RX8 sports car feels like.
In my expressed opinion the rotary engine is not suited to an automatic tranmission , especially to the type used by mazda in the current auto RX8.
Michael
If you were disturbed by my post you always have the option of not reading it.
Some people just cant handle the reality of being told the TRUTH.
Yeah in my opinion you dont know what a real manual RX8 sports car feels like.
In my expressed opinion the rotary engine is not suited to an automatic tranmission , especially to the type used by mazda in the current auto RX8.
Michael
01-21-2004, 11:01 AM
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Lock and load
Like i said I have my reasons for getting the auto. My other car is a 73 Corvette that I setup for road racing. It has 700hp, it pulls 1.1 g's in turns and it is a manual. That is my sports car. This car I trailer to the track, not for every day driving.
Yes I agree Mazdas choice on the auto could have been better but they didn't and I'm not concerned with it.
I test drove the the manual and its great but guess what it could have been better. And as I posted before it didn't fit my needs and it doesn't mean I should get the manual in order to know what a sports car is or feels like.
Like i said I have my reasons for getting the auto. My other car is a 73 Corvette that I setup for road racing. It has 700hp, it pulls 1.1 g's in turns and it is a manual. That is my sports car. This car I trailer to the track, not for every day driving.
Yes I agree Mazdas choice on the auto could have been better but they didn't and I'm not concerned with it.
I test drove the the manual and its great but guess what it could have been better. And as I posted before it didn't fit my needs and it doesn't mean I should get the manual in order to know what a sports car is or feels like.
01-21-2004, 12:26 PM
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RX-8: Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....
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Remember one thing guys: award or no awards, Fun to drive or boring as hell, the most important thing for company is do is to MAKE MONEY. Everything all comes down to revenue and profits at the end. Mazda knows that. The automatic are simply there for people who wanted an automatic and nothing else. I bet most of the people here who got an automatic wouldn't even consider getting an 8 if the 4-AT is offer as one of the trim.
01-21-2004, 04:31 PM
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The Wheels article made it clear it was the TYPE of automatic that was chosen. If Mazda spent a little bit more technical effort, they could have chosen a different sort of Auto and not suffered the power loss. Even if they used an Toyota MR2 style device it would have been better.
01-21-2004, 05:34 PM
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The unfortunate part is that the resale value of the early RX8 automatics will suffer badly when the better automatics are released by mazda .
Apparently they are working on a five speed Automatic and a S.M.G. STYLE OF BOX .
My wife initially thought it would be nice to have an Automatic so she could drive it now and then , but i wouldnt have a bar of it .
Now she is glad that we have the Manual Version and she is planning to learn to drive manual someday.
By nature she tends to procastinate so that day may never come.ha ha ha
michael
Apparently they are working on a five speed Automatic and a S.M.G. STYLE OF BOX .
My wife initially thought it would be nice to have an Automatic so she could drive it now and then , but i wouldnt have a bar of it .
Now she is glad that we have the Manual Version and she is planning to learn to drive manual someday.
By nature she tends to procastinate so that day may never come.ha ha ha
michael
01-21-2004, 06:04 PM
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2010 Prius - Miss the 8
Michael,
Lucky for some of us then that when and if the 'better' AT comes out I'll just buy that one too. It's all the same to me. I never thought of RX-8 as a true sports car anyhows... like the previous poster stated, it works fine the way it is. I'm not going to be racing anyone in this car... if I did, my 350Z or 98 Supra Turbo could go much faster for me. If I trully wanted a true Sports rotary I would just have bought the RX-7.
Lucky for some of us then that when and if the 'better' AT comes out I'll just buy that one too. It's all the same to me. I never thought of RX-8 as a true sports car anyhows... like the previous poster stated, it works fine the way it is. I'm not going to be racing anyone in this car... if I did, my 350Z or 98 Supra Turbo could go much faster for me. If I trully wanted a true Sports rotary I would just have bought the RX-7.
01-21-2004, 07:41 PM
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I would contend that the RX8 is a sports car and the 350Z and Supra are not. Even Project Gotham Racing 2 places the two latter cars into the "Pacific Muscle" category, not the sports category.
Sports cars are nimble, quick, provide good feel for the car and good tactile feedback.
From all accounts the 350Z is a point and shoot car. You muscle it through corners and it goes. No real feedback. Whip me beat me master, I'll do it.
Your 350Z would get easily beaten by the Bently GT Continental or the Jaguar S Type R. Does that make them sports cars?
Ooops. I may have just started a religous war.
Sports cars are nimble, quick, provide good feel for the car and good tactile feedback.
From all accounts the 350Z is a point and shoot car. You muscle it through corners and it goes. No real feedback. Whip me beat me master, I'll do it.
Your 350Z would get easily beaten by the Bently GT Continental or the Jaguar S Type R. Does that make them sports cars?
Ooops. I may have just started a religous war.
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