R8-ted-X

Hi,
Posting to the US forum to see if any US owners have any thoughts.

I have a 2010 RX-8 in Australia.

1st, the diff was dragging at low speeds - changing lane or stopped and turning left or right. Diff was replaced under warranty.

When the dealer changed the diff they did not line things up quite right and I had trouble getting into some gears and it jumped out of others. Iit felt like the rubber boot around the shifter was jammed not alloiwng full movement of the shifter. The dealer said they'd not lined it up right and fixed it.

But I still have an issue with shifting into 2nd gear 1st thing in the morning. I start the car, put laptop etc in the boot, jump in, reverse out of drive way, shift into 1st, take off gently 9as the engine's still cold), try to shift into 2nd and it just won't go. I have to ease off and try several times before actually getting into 2nd gear.

Once i've driven about a mile (1.5 KM) it's all good. But, every morning's the same.
The dealership has put in synthetic gear oil - feels great once it's warmed up.
Last week Mazda approved a new tranny - which has been done.
I've been driving it for a week and have the same problem.

If i have the same issue on 2 transmissions, it cannot be the transmission - so, what can it be.

I'd appreciate any thoughts that might isolate the probelm and help the dealer fix it.

Thanks

Razz1

The fluid or alignment of the PPF or both.

ASH8

Considering you are in the middle of winter it is because your Transmission is COLD...Simple.

I can't believe the idiots changed the tranny...how many k's have you done??

If you want a tip, give your transmission some time, they do wear in and get better shifting wise and ALWAYS put your foot flat to the floor Before you change.

At around 3000 KMS replace your Trans and Diff Fluid, I use Red-line.(synthetic), MT90 trans and 75W90 Diff.

My new MX-5 has the same design Tranny and 1 to 2 is also stiff and sometimes won't go...am I worried...NO....becasue I know it will get better with use age...and when I change fluid.

It really is a matter of changing your driving style to match the tranny, not the other way around.

And PLEASE don't come back and say your other car (brand) did not do it..or

R8-ted-X

Yes, it's the middle of winter in Australia - that means the temperature this morning was 11 deg C (that's 52 deg F) and hardly cold. Just try telling Canadian owners that +11 deg C is cold (I've seen -52 C in Key Lake, Saskatchewan)
Mazda, like most car manufacturers, design and test their cars in extreme conditions - cold and hot. If a car won't go into gear there's a problem.

Before I start driving I can shift between any gears nice and easy - so it's not the 'cold' weather. BTW, I always fully depress the clutch - so that's not it either.
I've also asked a lot of RX-8 owners - and it's not a probelm for them. If it was 'normal' they'd have the same experience.
As for your '5 - well, if it's not going into gear - I'd suggest seeing if other owners have the same thing and, if they don't, perhaps seeing your dealer.

but hey, thanks for the reply.

R8-ted-X

Thanks Razz,

You could be onto something.
The dealer had the tranny out when they changed the diff. and did not get it lined up at all right when they put it back in. Perhaps they've not got it in a bit better but not fully lined up.

I've known mechanics not to use alignment pins when they've replace auto boxes (for a variety of excuses). Do you know if there's a workshop instruction on the correct procedure to R&R the power plant frame ?

Appreciate the help.

nick99davis

you could possibly have a problem with your synchronizers in your tranny! i would go get it serviced ASAP at a mazda dealership!

ASH8

Jeez man...

If you don't want to take advice from forum members who perhaps have seen a little more than your goodself...that is you...

You have asked, and I have given you what it is...

Goes to show how some Mazda Dealers don't know, I would have never replaced your tranny with a new one...goes to show it is not a "flaw"..as it is doing the same thing.

Perhaps you can also show "some" details about your car (mileage)???
Although in this case it won't change my opinion.

Putting your car IN GEARS when it is not moving means absolutely nothing as none of your Gears and Synchro rings are not having to mesh any gears without movement or pre-load...are they??

As I said to you..(and others)...give your car some miles to loosen up and for all your gears and rings to bed in..

I suggest "Searching" in this forum as there is a lot of good information here.

Renewing the transmission will do nothing to change the 1-2 change is is a characteristic of this Transmission not a defect or fault.

In your own words it "is all good" after a few kilometres once the oil has moved around Gears and Bearing and Synchro.

I never knew Mazda did cold weather testing before...wow.

Yes, there have been MX-5 owners in US, Canada and UK complaining of 1-2 shift, and have learnt to live with it...as I said give you car and tranny some miles on it then see...you have a 3 year warranty.

If you are not prepared to take advice from experienced owners here then so be it.

There is NOTHING wrong with these transmissions, all that is wrong are drivers and owners...

ASH8

Here you go, I did some searching for you...

this is a Mazda Service Tip for Owners Complaining of "Hard Shifing"..this is for Series 1 RX-8's (different Transmission Assembly), however same Clutch, PP and TB.

2004 RX-8 (with M/T)
Hard/No Shift
Some customers may complain of hard shifting, or they are unable to move the shifter into any gear range while the engine is running. Also, the clutch may engage/disengage near the floor. The concern may be caused by loose clutch cover (pressure plate) bolts. Follow the repair
procedure below:
1. Confirm customer concern.
2. Remove starter according to WSM (Section 01-19-02).
3. Check clutch cover bolts are torqued to 16.3 - 24.4 ft. lbf.
Note: Bolts may be difficult to access using standard wrenches & sockets. Aftermarket distributor wrenches (14 mm or 9/16) may be used..

I somehow doubt this is your issue...

ASH8

Transmission Removal Note
WARNING:

Remove the transmission carefully, holding it steady. If the transmission falls it could be damaged or cause injury.

CAUTION:

To prevent part interference in the engine compartment, position the installation part of the exhaust manifold stay of the front pipe on the transverse member to control the inclination of the transmission under its own weight.

1. Support the transmission securely using a transmission jack.
2. Remove the transmission installation bolt.
3. Remove the transmission.

Transmission Installation Note
1. Shift to any gear position.
2. Install the SST to the main shaft.


WARNING:

Remove the transmission carefully, holding it steady. If the transmission falls it could be damaged or cause injury.

3. Place the transmission on the transmission jack and raise it.


NOTE:

Slowly rotate the SST to engage the clutch with the main drive gear spline, and install the transmission.

4. Install the transmission.
5. Tighten the transmission installation bolt.

Bolt length
A: 55 mm {2.1 in}

B: 90 mm {3.5 in}

Tightening torque
37—52 N·m {3.8—5.3 kgf·m, 28—38 ft·lbf}

Power Plant Frame Installation Note

1. Support the transmission using a transmission jack.
2. Install the power plant frame.
3. Install the plate.
4. Temporarily tighten the nuts in the order shown in the figure.
5. Tighten nut 1 until the power plant frame is seated in the rear differential.
6. Install the heat insulator, exhaust manifold stay, catalytic converter, middle pipe, main silencer and front tunnel member.
7. Raise the power plant frame front end (transmission side) or transmission using a transmission jack so that dimension A (between power plant frame lower surface and front tunnel member lower surface) shown in the figure is within the adjustment value.

NOTE:

When raising the power plant frame without a transmission jack, use bolts (M12x1.25) with a thread length of 55 mm {2.17 in} or more. Tighten the bolts from the underside of the front tunnel member as shown in the figure and raise the power plant frame.

When using bolts, the underside of the power plant frame could be damaged. Affix tape to the underside of the frame to prevent damage.

If there is the possibility of age-related bending/deterioration of the mount, adjust dimension A to approx. 15 mm {0.59 in} higher than the adjustment value to facilitate obtaining the specification.

Adjustment dimension A
55—57 mm {2.17—2.24 in}

8. Tighten the nuts and bolts on the rear differential side in the order shown in the figure.

Bolt, nut number
Tightening torque

N·m {kgf·m, ft·lbf}

1, 2
126—154

{13—15, 93—113}

3
75—93

{7.6—9.5, 55—68}



9. Tighten the nuts on the rear differential side in the order shown in the figure.

Tightening torque
126—154 N·m {13—15 kgf·m, 93—113 ft·lbf}

10. Verify that dimension A is within the specification with the transmission jack and the adjustment bolt removed.
If it is not within the specification, adjust dimension A again.

Standard dimension A
48.4—56.4 mm {1.91—2.22 in}

ASH8

Power Plant Frame Removal Note
1. Support the transmission using a jack.
2. Support the rear differential using a jack.
3. Remove the power plant frame.

Rear Differential Removal Note
WARNING:

If the rear differential falls off, it can cause serious injuries or death, and damage to the vehicle. When removing the rear differential, verify that it is supported securely with a jack.

1. Support the rear differential using a jack.
2. Remove the differential mounting installation bolts.
3. Lower the jack slowly and remove the rear differential.

Rear Differential, Power Plant Frame Installation Note

WARNING:

If the rear differential falls off, it can cause serious injuries or death, and damage to the vehicle. When installing the rear differential, verify that it is supported securely with a jack.

CAUTION:

Tighten the differential mounting installation bolts completely only after performing the power plant frame installation and adjustment. If the differential mounting bracket is installed at an incorrect angle, the differential mounting bracket bushings will twist and cause an abnormal noise while the vehicle is moving.

1. Support the rear differential using a jack.
2. Temporarily tighten the differential mounting installation bolts.
3. Install the power plant frame.
4. Install the plate.
5. Temporarily tighten the bolts and nuts as shown in the figure.
6. Tighten the nut B until the power plant frame is seated in the rear differential.
7. Install the heat insulator, TWC, middle pipe, main silencer and front tunnel member.
8. Raise the power plant frame front end (transmission side) or transmission using a jack so that dimension A (between power plant frame lower surface and front tunnel member lower surface) shown in the figure is within the adjustment value.

Adjustment dimension A
55—57 mm {2.17—2.24 in}

NOTE:

When raising the power plant frame without a transmission jack, use bolts (M12x1.25) with a thread length of 55 mm {2.17 in} or more. Tighten the bolts from the underside of the front tunnel member as shown in the figure and raise the power plant frame.

When using bolts, the underside of the power plant frame could be damaged. Affix tape to the underside of the frame to prevent damage.

If there is the possibility of age-related bending/deterioration of the mount, adjust dimension A to approx. 15 mm {0.59 in} higher than the adjustment value to facilitate obtaining the specification.

9. Tighten the bolts and nuts on the rear differential side in the order shown in the figure.

Step
Bolt, nut
Tightening torque

(N·m {kgf·m, ft·lbf}

1
A
126.0—154.0 {12.9—15.7, 93.0—113.5}

2
B
126.0—154.0 {12.9—15.7, 93.0—113.5}

3
C
126.0—154.0 {12.9—15.7, 93.0—113.5}

4
F
74.5—93.2 {7.60—9.50, 55.0—68.7}



10. Tighten the bolts and nuts on the transmission side as shown in the figure.

Tightening torque
126.0—154.0 N·m {12.9—15.7 kgf·m, 93.0—113.5 ft·lbf}

11. Verify that dimension A is within the specification with the transmission jack and the adjustment bolt removed.
If not within the specification, adjust dimension A again.

Standard dimension A
48.4—56.4 mm {1.91—2.22 in}

12. Temporarily loosen the differential mount installation bolts, straighten the differential mounting bracket bushings, and then tighten the differential mounting installation bolts again to the specified torque.

CAUTION:
Never support the rear differential using a jack when tightening the differential mounting installation bolts. Otherwise, the differential mounting bracket bushings will twist and cause an abnormal noise while the vehicle is moving.

Tightening torque
74.5—105.0 N·m {7.60—10.70 kgf·m, 55.0—77.44 ft·lbf}

R8-ted-X

Many thanks for Factory Manual 2010 data

ASH8

This is all Manual stuff that is relevant...

Please don't get me wrong PPF alignment is obviously important, however, with minor changes done in Series 2's, alignment of PPF, etc is relatively easy with very little room for error, WHY you Dealer had issue I will never know (although I have an idea).

I would also not spend too much angst on the 1-2 change, the same issue was there in the original tranny before the PPF and Diff was touched, with the new Tranny making no difference.

Having said all this are you sure the Tranny was really replaced with a new one??

I still stand by my original advice and give your Tranny some more miles, mine has just clicked over 40,000KMS and is terrific, yes a little tight 1-2 when stone cold, but so what!

My body is a little tight when stone cold also

R8-ted-X

Hi,

Warranty repair invoice that I was given when I pick up my car said "replace transmission' and that's what they told me. Now, they might have charged mazda for the part and kept it for someone/something else - guess I'll never know.

I don't mind a 'tight when cold' trany - I'd just like it to actually go into gear.

It's not that it's tight - it physically will not go into 2nd gear so I have to drive using 1 & 3 for a bit.

ASH8

Tip, What I find, When you take off on stone cold Tranny just change from 1st to 2nd at very low RPM-Speed 5-10 KMH (approx, 2500 RPM approx), light on throttle...give that a go until a few Kilometres and some heat gets into the box..

Believe me it will get better with some miles and age.

And Definitely, get the Oil changed at around 2-3000 KMS, and yes, I know the Owners Manual says much longer (40-60,000 from memory) which is way too long.

Even though there are magnetic Drain Plugs to pick up bits of metal which wears of gears, etc, it is much better to also renew oil and clean off swarf from Drain plugs.

Your car and Tranny, Diff will like you for it.

If your Mazda Dealer "invoiced" that the Tranny was renewed then it would have been, ALL warranty claims are audited by Mazda Australia before disposal, a Dealer will not risk doing a shonky when it is in writing-data.

R8-ted-X

Little update (thanks to Zoom on the Aussie forum).

This morning, after reversing out of the driveway, rather than selecting 1st gear, I selected second - it went in nice and easy. I drove off (downhill & gently) changed to 3rd etc. C0ming to the first intersection, I slowed, shifted down to 3rd then to 2nd - it would not go into 2nd. I stopped at the intersection for traffic and, as I was still pointing downhill (a little) I selected 2nd (when stopped). Again, it went in nice and easy.

Not a clue if this means anythign or not.

jasonrxeight

only 2nd gear wont go in?
try to gently push towards 2nd gear position when clutch out (syncro touching).
sometimes stuff can get between the syncros causing them to not work.

ASH8

Yeah Jason...

I also find ones "technique" has a lot to do with good shift changes, ones gotta get a "feel" for the tranny, if you know what I mean..??

R8-ted-X

Blipping the throttle mid way through shifting seems to help - perhaps the synchros will wear in over time.

CRO8TIA

Im sure this is what ASH said in his 1st post.

R8-ted-X

Could be but there are other comments/opinions. Best to consider what each have to say rather than miss amgem.

PeteInLongBeach

This is virtually a new car. No special technique should be needed to get it into any gear, hot or cold. I'm sure it didn't do this when it was delivered brand new and it shouldn't do this now.

It's under warranty. Have the dealer make it right

jasonrxeight

mines been as reliable as a rock.
slightly notchy in 3rd when cold 0-7F.

R8-ted-X

Thanks to all replies.

The car did not do this when it was delivered as new but that was in summer.
Right now is the middle of winter in Melbourne, Australia - that meant is was 65 deg F (18 dec C) in Melbourne and it still did it. That's hardly very cold.

The throttle bliping seems to help and therefore gives a strong suggestion that the problem is with the synchro. I have been in touch with the dealer and waiting to hear what they plan to do next.

I'll keep you all posted.

Thanks

viprez586

iTrader: (5)

This is the first and foremost thing you should have done.
The dealer did the work, and now it's not correct.

Complain until it is corrected, it's their problem. Not yours.

R8-ted-X

Hey,

I.m still chasing the dealer and have a Mazda Field Tech. booked to look at the car on 15th/16th.
Posting is for feedback/info from those more experienced than I and for future reference to others that might chose to use the search function.