TALAN7

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=122361

Shame, Mazda's entry level car gets this type of attention while their flagship gets anniversary badging to celebrate a 40 year milestone.

sad

mysql101

what attention? it's the standard exhaust, suspension, etc. stuff we have had for a long time on the rx-8.

Renesis_8

wow nice....
________
Pipe Shop

TALAN7

Yeah, but it actually makes more power.

Mugatu

iTrader: (1)

not much more - $5k more got them .1 second quicker in the quarter mile and .2 seconds faster to 60. i would have done computer upgrades that offer way more bang for the buck.

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

hehe, Mazdaspeed squared..

Spinning Sushi

iTrader: (21)

"Suspension doesn't like choppy surfaces; small performance gains; torque steer."

(laughs at suspension and torque steer)

Small performance gains.... it's like our 8's. Every after market part barely have any performance gains.... the only big gain is a frick'in turbo.

tajabaho1

5k would get me a turbo for the 8, thats really all this car needs, so yup, doable

mysql101

I love answers like this.

So you'd rather mazda do a shitty job at tweaking the RX-8, so that it makes 25 less whp, so that you'd need an aftermarket catback and intake to get it back?

Hornet

I really don't think that is what he meant! I think he meant that from the very start that the Mazdaspeed 3 got the power advantage and very shortly after it's release it got another power tweak. People can say that the 8 has the Mazdaspeed exhaust, intake, etc. but the problem lies in that there is a totally tuned 3 from Mazdaspeed and now they are tuning the tuned model. The 8 does not have a Mazdaspeed version available in the US so we are still behind the progress of the 3. Just think of it in terms of the 3 has stage 1 and 2 and we have a stage 1 but even from it's stock form to stage 1 the 3 destroys what the 8 is getting from Mazda's tuning division in the power adder department. This is just my take on what he is getting at!


p.s. You never see GM giving anything more power than it's halo car so why would Mazda or any other car company for that matter do it...even if there is a car in GM's lineup that matches the base Vette on power there is nothing that matches the Z06!

Willicuddy

This is a lost cause

ASH8

When will you guys get it..

The RX-8 Just does not have the development potential for MORE HP, etc, etc.
And gains you see in banger engine design..
Mazda have spent 40 years getting the engine where it is today..at it's limits.
Any add ons like turbo, supercharging, or whatever compromises emissions, reliability,economy, and last PRICE.

IMO this is it, the end of the road for the 8 in a few more years (2012)..
Unfortunately..

I have heard from too many sources that it is the end of the line..
I will repeat if all those who say 'Mazda are committed to the rotary'... well of course they are while they are still making/selling them!

In 2011 the car will fall of the radar.

You can kick my *** if I am wrong

Floyd

NS! Props to Mazda for actualy trying to get the most out of their cars on the first go around

mac11

iTrader: (1)

please explain to me then, how it is economically feasible for Mazda to be spending money to continue to engineer future rotary motors? Is it all just a smoke a mirrors tactic to sell a couple thousand more RX-8's over the next 3 -5 years?

Yes, that must be it. I can see how spending MILLIONS on an engineering team to get zero return on their time for the sole purpose of selling a couple more cars in the next 3 years would make perfet business sense.

Renesis_8

^ Its a good thing that Mazda isn't all about making money, its a balance of zoom zoom and that. Rotary is a part of Mazda heritage, they're not the same without it.
________
Kiaritta

ASH8

Look, I am as enthusiastic as most when it comes to ANYTHING Mazda!.

For ANY of their cars to be viable they must sell a min of 15,000 units a Year.
The RX-8 is now a long way off that, I have watched the development of the Rotary for 35 years..and seen most of the success, but, I am only repeating what I have already said, to vastly improve sales they would have to have major improvements in engine for the HP gains that many keep asking for..
Yes, Mazda have the Hydro Rotary with adaptation ideal for hydrogen, BUT, can you honestly see in the next 5 years, Hydro filling stations?..NO.
The hydro 8 Rotary at the moment has about 50% less power and torque and has a tank range of also half...just not viable for the masses.
Apart from adding rotors, making a larger rotor size engine (cc capacity) has many operating issues that IMO would be unsuccessful..let alone an increase in gas consumption when the world wants more economical cars.

8 Maniac

iTrader: (1)

I thought mazda promised a new rotary in 2010... Also, I might be remembering wrong, but didnt the team that worked on the renesis work on their own or something like that? Not on mazda's pay roll? (I seem to remember something like thatt but I could very well be wrong). But assuming I'm correct, then I can only hope that with the incentive of pay and with more resources available they could develop a better engine. From what most of the more reliable sources on this site have said, there seems to be plenty of hope for a future rotary.

But, on the original topic, I must say it's kinda ridiculous. I understand how we might not be high on the list for being an MS car, but I never expected to be so low that other cars would get MS treatment twice before us.

WoodsOfGreenRx8

Those MazdaSpeed 3's are little rockets.. I test drove one yesterday..

TALAN7

Finally, one who understands. Personally I think Mazda needs to get out of the rotary business unless they can make one that's reliable enough to really tune. Next comes the Mazdaspeed MX-5. If they make a Mazdaspeed CX-7 with a blown engine then I'm done.

mysql101

First off, I'm glad your opinion doesn't count.

What mazda does with their hatchback in no way effects my ownership of the RX-8.

The new mazdaspeed upgrades on the mazdaspeed 3 have the same gains in power as a fuel management system on the RX-8. BFD.

So while you're moaning about the MS3 getting shocks, intake, and an exhaust, I'm enjoying 330 hp in my RX-8.


Secondly, you can tune the RX-8 all you want. There aren't reliability issues unless you tune it improperly. Perhaps you should research the topic before pretending you know what you're talking about and stating opinions on the subject.

Mugatu

iTrader: (1)

while i mostly agree with you, i am having a hard time thinking of one car company whose featured sports car is actually slower than 2-3 of its other family cars.

mysql101

Yeah, no doubt - we'd all love to see this coming out from the factory with 300 whp, but fuel economy would hurt, and it's no longer just one car that suffers, but the entire company since economy is averaged across the entire fleet. If they're willing to push 5w20 just for tiny percentages in fuel gain, how painful do you think it'll be for them to produce a car that gets 14 mpg?

People who want power, always end up aftermarket anyway. So while it's not perfect, it's nothing to make a big deal over. Ultimately, the issue with rotary engines isn't the willingness for Mazda to give us more power, but the issue with economy when it's pushing the power levels people want. Even with our "230" hp, our forum is filled with people complaining about economy.

Razz1

Nice article. Thanks for sharing.

mac11

iTrader: (1)

you have to remember...Mazda sells cars in other places besides just the US. Everyone - including Mazda - knows that sports cars sales taper off as the years pass without a refresh. So I am sure they took that into account when they were selling 50K/year worldwide and planned accordingly.


apparently you are asking the wrong people. There are members around here that are very well connected and have a proven track record that have given (Or was it the CEO??) of MAzda Japan came out and said in an official Mazda statement there would be a new rotary. I bet they were just lying at seven stock last year when a top execc (can't remember who off the top of my head) announced to the crowd "You will be proud of the next rotary!"

So you are saying Mazda engineers CAN'T produce a viable, more powerful rotary?

TALAN7

Your 330 hp aint warranted by Mazda, is it? The 8 has reliability issues without tuning, what the heck are you talking about?