http://www.worldcarfans.com/9080627.013/corvette-zr1-laps-nurburgring-in-7-min-26

I like this bit....

So do Vette fanatics finally have something to boast about when comparing size with Ferrari, Porsche, BMW, Nissan and Honda fans?

You mean who has the biggest woody!:bowdown:

Whoa !!!!!

think you meant GTR in title ......

I want to see the vids.

nice! glad to see its this fast already. the ZR1 is more of a competitor for the GT-R spec V though, which already timed 7:25 during testing. I think its going to be hard to tell which car will get the faster lap time when alls said and done

meh, it's plenty fast enough XD...

Car nerds and computer nerds aren't that much different. This is like 3DMark on wheels. :D:

A Corvette that not only smacks competition around with power, but also out-handles the best of them?

No need to pose a question. The way I read that article, it's telling the world "all the critics of the ZR1 can now shut the hell up."

No need to pose a question. The way I read that article, it's telling the world "all the critics of the ZR1 can now shut the hell up."

Well they kind of CAN, that's the thing. The precision engineered, exact GT-R made in the most advanced country in the world matched by what's supposed to be a clunky, clumsy muscle car and wait...

oh no...

It's American. Awww shyyyyt. That means it has to have a 10L, 100hp engine, a live rear axle, and a private tanker that comes free with purchase.

So yes, they can shut the hell up now.

Does anyone know if the Bugatti Veyron went around Nurburgring, and if so what time did it do....

Yes, the Bugatti went around Nurburgring... not sure the exact time, but it wasn't as good as many would've thought it would be.

An amazing car, but with an interior that GM just can't get right.

I swear that the Malibu interior looks better.

If Bob Lutz, an admirer of VW interiors, can't see the problem here, who will?

Im confused what's supposed to be impressive about this...a $30000 more expensive car that is just 3 seconds faster (and there's a thread about dealer price gouging sending the ZR1 cost up to $413000). $10000 a second isn't worth it...

i dont see why people underestimated it. it was a beast from the start

If I remember correctly, the GT-R's time was set on a wet track.

If I remember correctly, the GT-R's time was set on a wet track.

that was the old 7:38s, the new record of 7:29 was on good conditions
the ZR-1 is still roughly 1 second behind the GT-R spec V
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordschleife_lap_times

Im confused what's supposed to be impressive about this...a $30000 more expensive car that is just 3 seconds faster (and there's a thread about dealer price gouging sending the ZR1 cost up to $413000). $10000 a second isn't worth it...

It is more than worth $30,000 to 1. Dive a car that doesn't look like a total POS and 2. Drive a car that gives a higher sense of involvement than a Playstation game...

that was the old 7:38s, the new record of 7:29 was on good conditions
the ZR-1 is still roughly 1 second behind the GT-R spec V
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordschleife_lap_times

Ah. The article says that the GT-R spec V run was "Unofficial time measured by bystanders at the track"

The ZR-1's description was "Strong headwind on main straight. electronically timed and confirmed with two hand-held stopwatches." I bet there's at least a few more tenths to be shaved off the 7:26.4 time in better conditions.

The fact is that the "standard" GT-R got it's ass kicked by 2.63 seconds, and the Spec V time is unofficial.

Vette = Self indulgent wiener

Ferrari, GTR, Porsche, Maserati, Aston, = Connoisseur

I wouldn't drive a Vette if it was free. Every time I see one I think douchebag.

i sense a little bias...

and btw did anyone see the LF-A unofficial lap time?

Vette = Self indulgent wiener

Ferrari, GTR, Porsche, Maserati, Aston, = Connoisseur

I wouldn't drive a Vette if it was free. Every time I see one I think douchebag.

I'd drive the vette before the GT-R.

Cars I drive have to at least look better than a Aztek.

It is more than worth $30,000 to 1. Dive a car that doesn't look like a total POS and 2. Drive a car that gives a higher sense of involvement than a Playstation game...

amen. no dissing the Japanese-esque styling of the GTR, but to me and me others its damn ugly! At least the corvette looks sweet, oh and wait ITS AMERICAN! Finally, a car worth praising about. We invented motor sports and its about time. Although, i doubt as a daily driver the corvette is nice. I am sure it makes a horrible noise while driving on the highway like its predecessors. And can it turn?....in corners?....AWD?...NO. Forgive me, GTR still wins.:confused:

The Vette must have taken a short cut...
http://www.forum-auto.com/uploads/200312/veedub_1070446424_slingray7.jpg

ahahahaha. short in the front, party in the back.

Car nerds and computer nerds aren't that much different. This is like 3DMark on wheels. :D:

well said,

I got 11,213... you? lol

Honestly considering the ZR-1 weighs 486.2lbs lighter and has 158 more horses than the GT-R its pretty sad that it only beat the GT-R by 2.63 seconds. You'd think with a HUGE power to weight ratio advantage over the GT-R the ZR-1 would do much better. This only shows the beauty of Japanese engineering. Not to mention, the GT-R will cost about 30,000 LESS than the ZR-1 and will be more streetable due to it's AWD with snow,race, etc. modes AND capability to drive around more than one passenger!!!!!!!!

I'd like to see the ZR-1 against the V-Spec GT-R with 70 MORE horses and 331 LESS pounds....now THAT would be a bit more even...

Honestly considering the ZR-1 weighs 486.2lbs lighter and has 158 more horses than the GT-R its pretty sad that it only beat the GT-R by 2.63 seconds. You'd think with a HUGE power to weight ratio advantage over the GT-R the ZR-1 would do much better. This only shows the beauty of Japanese engineering. Not to mention, the GT-R will cost about 30,000 LESS than the ZR-1 and will be more streetable due to it's AWD with snow,race, etc. modes AND capability to drive around more than one passenger!!!!!!!!

You also have to factor in drag, the GTR may have less drag then the ZR-1 wich will give it an advantage. Not to mention the AWD. I would be more then happy to drive either one :)

I'd like to see the japanese develop a modern rear wheel drive sportscar that can claim that time, either that or take away the awd from the gtr and see what it will do. I'd also be curious as to how much something like that would cost given what killed their RWD cars previously. Until that day, comparing an AWD supercar to a RWD "muscle/sports car" seems kinda' pointless. (even if the less sophisticated and traction impaired vette is still faster anyway) This comparo reminds me of the billsions of people who try to compare EVo/STi to the 8 all the time. :lol:

The Vette has its shorcomings. But you need to drive one before damning them as redneck trash. My boss has a Cayman S. Very nice. And much more refined. But if I was in the market it would be a tough choice between this and a new C6. Corvettes have always had the one mark of a great performance machine. The faster and harder you push one the better it feels. And being domestic means you get the advantage of affordability and, more importantly, you get a car that is very receptive to modifications.

Not a Vette fanboii but you need to experience one yourself instead of buying into negative hype from some magazine article. You might like it, you might not.

Corvettes are not for eveyone, neither is the RX8.

Vette = Self indulgent wiener

Ferrari, GTR, Porsche, Maserati, Aston, = Connoisseur

I wouldn't drive a Vette if it was free. Every time I see one I think douchebag.

Nah you were thinking of the camaro not the vette. (I know the new camaro is sweet)

Honestly considering the ZR-1 weighs 486.2lbs lighter and has 158 more horses than the GT-R its pretty sad that it only beat the GT-R by 2.63 seconds. You'd think with a HUGE power to weight ratio advantage over the GT-R the ZR-1 would do much better. This only shows the beauty of Japanese engineering. Not to mention, the GT-R will cost about 30,000 LESS than the ZR-1 and will be more streetable due to it's AWD with snow,race, etc. modes AND capability to drive around more than one passenger!!!!!!!!

Why the hell would one want to buy a GTR when a Honda Civic (which looks better and gets better gas mileage) is much cheaper to buy? Unless your daily commute involves the Ring, there's no point in buying the GTR over a regular old Civic.

Do you see what I'm getting at?

^^you can replace the word GTR with "RX8" or any other car and have the same implications.

I'd like to see the japanese develop a modern rear wheel drive sportscar that can claim that time, either that or take away the awd from the gtr and see what it will do. I'd also be curious as to how much something like that would cost given what killed their RWD cars previously. Until that day, comparing an AWD supercar to a RWD "muscle/sports car" seems kinda' pointless. (even if the less sophisticated and traction impaired vette is still faster anyway) This comparo reminds me of the billsions of people who try to compare EVo/STi to the 8 all the time. :lol:

That proves my point exactly...theres really not too much modern about the ZR-1...its a car with a big-ass motor with a supercharger slapped on it. Typical american muscle.

The beauty of the Japanese cars are that they make performance vehicles using technology and engineering...NOT a big-ass motor.

Yes, the GT-R is a supercar....so what exactly do you call the ZR-1? At a base price of just over $100,000 its no common street car.

You compare my comparison to the comparison of the evo/sti to the rx-8....don't forget the evo and sti have about 70 more horses and way more torque than the rx-8...not to mention they cost almost the same price with the rx-8. The ZR-1 however, has the tremendous power AND weight advantage.

Like German automobiles, Japanese automobiles are more BRAINS while domestic muscle is more BRAUN.

Nah you were thinking of the camaro not the vette. (I know the new camaro is sweet)

:rant: I recent that comment :) My first true love was a 95 Z28 :tear: Went like hell in a straight line but handled like a boat. I think the C6 gives you the best of both worlds. Great handling car and fast as hell. Same goes for the GTR

I'd like to see the japanese develop a modern rear wheel drive sportscar that can claim that time, either that or take away the awd from the gtr and see what it will do. I'd also be curious as to how much something like that would cost given what killed their RWD cars previously. Until that day, comparing an AWD supercar to a RWD "muscle/sports car" seems kinda' pointless. (even if the less sophisticated and traction impaired vette is still faster anyway) This comparo reminds me of the billsions of people who try to compare EVo/STi to the 8 all the time. :lol:

Yea, Honda should develop a new NSX and test it at the ring!

oh wait....

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/GeneralFuture/articleId=127446?tid=edmunds.il.futurelanding.late stnews..5.*

Like German automobiles, Japanese automobiles are more BRAINS while domestic muscle is more BRAUN.

I would have to disagree and say that German automobiles are the perfect combination of the two...

Ive been following the ZR1 VS GTR debat for awhile on other boards now and a couple things worth mentioning are:

A. The GTR's "official" time was done using R compound tires and had the boost cranked up beyond stock levels along with suspension tuning, although stock parts were used it was not "stock"

B. The ZR1 turned in that time being completly showroom stock with the ADDITION of communication and saftey equipment, a strong head wind on the main straight, stock Michelin Pilot tires and one of the engineers as the driver! Not a pro like was piloting the GTR. With a pro behind the wheel I would expect to see at least a 7:20 out of the ZR1.

I expect GM is waiting for the Spec V to turn in its offical time befor they unleash the ZR1 with a pro behind the wheel to really slap Nissan in the face.

So for those of you who are comparing hp I would guess the GTR that Nissan took to the ring to be closer to the 550 mark.

Ive been following the ZR1 VS GTR debat for awhile on other boards now and a couple things worth mentioning are:

A. The GTR's "official" time was done using R compound tires and had the boost cranked up beyond stock levels along with suspension tuning, although stock parts were used it was not "stock"

B. The ZR1 turned in that time being completly showroom stock with the ADDITION of communication and saftey equipment, a strong head wind on the main straight, stock Michelin Pilot tires and one of the engineers as the driver! Not a pro like was piloting the GTR. With a pro behind the wheel I would expect to see at least a 7:20 out of the ZR1.

I expect GM is waiting for the Spec V to turn in its offical time befor they unleash the ZR1 with a pro behind the wheel to really slap Nissan in the face.

So for those of you who are comparing hp I would guess the GTR that Nissan took to the ring to be closer to the 550 mark.
Yea I heard the ZR1 also was only running on 87 octane fuel, and had to dodge a motorcycle crash ahead of it... oh and it was getting shot at by a few attack helicopters in a james bond-esque style as well.

Can you bring up any more 'things worth mentioning'? :lol:

Yea I heard the ZR1 also was only running on 87 octane fuel, and had to dodge a motorcycle crash ahead of it... oh and it was getting shot at by a few attack helicopters in a james bond-esque style as well.

Can you bring up any more 'things worth mentioning'? :lol:

Hahaha.

Either way, the ZR1 beat the GTR. Period.

Not to mention, yes the GTR has all this cool tech... but isn't that just more to break? More tech means it's harder to mod as well.

Hahaha.

Either way, the ZR1 beat the GTR. Period.

Not to mention, yes the GTR has all this cool tech... but isn't that just more to break? More tech means it's harder to mod as well.


Exactly. Im thinking smaller pully and some fuel injectors.

well said,

I got 11,213... you? lol

13,670 - sadly crysis still sucks on it though :(

I really don't see what the big deal is. So the ZR1 beat the GT-R. So what? There's always going to be a faster car. It is also a mistake to call the ZR1 "low-tech" because the Americans are using all the same engineering tools as the Japanese. They simply took a different approach to achieve their objectives. This being said, the GT-R is probably still the easier car to drive because of the systems it includes and the nature of its layout. Also, the GT-R is not ugly. You should see it in person.

This may be a "dumb" question....someone may know..

How can the Corvette (ZR1) pass pedestrian safety standards in Europe and I guess the US, it does have a low sharp front, rather than the thick, high, blunt noses on cars like the RX-8.



Ash

Ive been following the ZR1 VS GTR debat for awhile on other boards now and a couple things worth mentioning are:

A. The GTR's "official" time was done using R compound tires and had the boost cranked up beyond stock levels along with suspension tuning, although stock parts were used it was not "stock"

B. The ZR1 turned in that time being completly showroom stock with the ADDITION of communication and saftey equipment, a strong head wind on the main straight, stock Michelin Pilot tires and one of the engineers as the driver! Not a pro like was piloting the GTR. With a pro behind the wheel I would expect to see at least a 7:20 out of the ZR1.

I expect GM is waiting for the Spec V to turn in its offical time befor they unleash the ZR1 with a pro behind the wheel to really slap Nissan in the face.

So for those of you who are comparing hp I would guess the GTR that Nissan took to the ring to be closer to the 550 mark.

All very true. Let's also not forget that the ZR-1's stock tires are garbage. GM's solution to not including a spare in Corvettes is having runflat tires. Putting on a set of real tires should yield big improvements in handling.

Yea, Honda should develop a new NSX and test it at the ring!

oh wait....

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/GeneralFuture/articleId=127446?tid=edmunds.il.futurelanding.late stnews..5.*

damn ure so smart :rolleyes:

I already knew about that, I've been following the NSX for a while, might even end up buying a used one as my next car as I've been in love with them forever. However, the last gen NSX had an msrp of 90,000 dollars for a US model, and it wasn't anywhere near the ZR-1's lap time, and the "new one" is not out so it's irrelevant anyway. I'm still waiting for the modern RWD Japanese sportscar that's supposed to get similar times to the ZR-1 on the ring, so where is it? :D:

Good god. You guys are acting like little kids, comparing each other's wieners in the locker room.

C'mon, the GT-R is a great car, but a bit heavy. The ZR-1 is a little more primitive, but damned is it fast!

Every car has their ups and downs. This time, Nissan lost, with a "budget" $30,000 LESS than GM. So what? Don't act like a whiney kid. Lose like a man.

That proves my point exactly...theres really not too much modern about the ZR-1...its a car with a big-ass motor with a supercharger slapped on it. Typical american muscle.

The beauty of the Japanese cars are that they make performance vehicles using technology and engineering...NOT a big-ass motor.

Yes, the GT-R is a supercar....so what exactly do you call the ZR-1? At a base price of just over $100,000 its no common street car.

You compare my comparison to the comparison of the evo/sti to the rx-8....don't forget the evo and sti have about 70 more horses and way more torque than the rx-8...not to mention they cost almost the same price with the rx-8. The ZR-1 however, has the tremendous power AND weight advantage.

Like German automobiles, Japanese automobiles are more BRAINS while domestic muscle is more BRAUN.

Tell us if you will, exactly what engineering and technology are you talking about? This should be interesting, I look forward to your reply. And before you tell me high technology engine configurations we'll begin by introducing you to this 1933 DOHC engine:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1933_Bugatti_Type_59_Grand_Prix_engine.jpg

Good god. You guys are acting like little kids, comparing each other's wieners in the locker room.

C'mon, the GT-R is a great car, but a bit heavy. The ZR-1 is a little more primitive, but damned is it fast!

Every car has their ups and downs. This time, Nissan lost, with a "budget" $30,000 LESS than GM. So what? Don't act like a whiney kid. Lose like a man.

ummmmm...I'm telling on you! :lol:

The ZR-1 is fully capable of cracking 7:25. On a track the size of the 'ring? A combination of a few slow shifts and a few not-perfect corners could easily account for two seconds. Than there's the headwind.

There is no replacement for displacement.

Although I would never spend my own money on one, I think you still have to give the vette the respect it deserves.

But I don't think comparing the GT-R to it is really apples to apples, since the GT-R is a 4-seater with more practicality, and the Vette is a 2-seater with much less storage space.... It's kind of like comparing an Exige S to an M3.

Although I would never spend my own money on one, I think you still have to give the vette the respect it deserves.

But I don't think comparing the GT-R to it is really apples to apples, since the GT-R is a 4-seater with more practicality, and the Vette is a 2-seater with much less storage space.... It's kind of like comparing an Exige S to an M3.

...or a 350z to a RX8?

I wish Ferrari weren't above crushing Nissan and GM.... Both Nissan and GM have sent their fastest most powerful production cars ever to the ring backed by pro drivers.

If Ferrari did the same it would look something like this car and this guy driving:
http://www.3autos.com/upload/3autos.com/200512/world_debut_of_ferrari_fxx.jpg

And then no one would care about ZR1 and GTR times anymore...

damn ure so smart :rolleyes:

I already knew about that, I've been following the NSX for a while, might even end up buying a used one as my next car as I've been in love with them forever. However, the last gen NSX had an msrp of 90,000 dollars for a US model, and it wasn't anywhere near the ZR-1's lap time, and the "new one" is not out so it's irrelevant anyway. I'm still waiting for the modern RWD Japanese sportscar that's supposed to get similar times to the ZR-1 on the ring, so where is it? :D:

Well then keep in mind that it was the very first time they'd taken the actual chassis out. There were probably tons of suspension changes being made. And if you judge by all the lame excuses the ZR1 fans are giving why the time was so "slow" then I'm sure the body camoflauge sacrificed aerodynamics and it would have been at 5 seconds faster with a smooth surface. I'm pretty sure Honda's goal will be to beat the GTR on the ring, at least if they want to sell any in Japan. :)

I am not getting into this pissing contest. But here are the official lap times for the RING.... very interesting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordschleife_fastest_lap_times#Production_car_lap_ times

For those of you that are lazy....

[edit] Production car lap times
Length Best Lap Times Make Model Power/Weight Driver Date Source Notes
6:53 Ariel Atom 500 500 PS/500 kg
6:55 Radical SR8 360 PS/650 kg Michael Vergers 2005-09-28 Video
7:18 Donkervoort D8 RS 370 PS/670 kg Michael Düchting Sport Auto 12/04
7:24 Lexus LF-A ~552 PS/~1360 kg 2007-12-28 Auto Express
Winding Road
Unofficial time measured by bystanders at the track
7:25 Nissan GT-R V-Spec ~551 PS/~1590 kg 2008-04-08 Car Magazine autoblog.com Unofficial time measured by bystanders at the track
7:26.4 Chevrolet Corvette C6 ZR1 638 HP/1519 kg Jim Mero 2008-06-27 *manufacturer claim. Strong headwind on main straight. electronically timed and confirmed with two hand-held stopwatches.
7:27.82 Pagani Zonda F Clubsport 650 PS/1230 kg 2007-09 video Semi-wet conditions.
7:29.03 Nissan GT-R 480 hp/1740 kg Toshio Suzuki 2008-04-16 Best Motoring 07/08 video NISSAN Press release Standard run-flat tires. Dry Track.
7:32.02 Porsche 911 GT2 2008 530 PS/1440 kg Walter Röhrl 2007 *manufacturer claim.Motor Authority,
video
Semi-slicks tires.
7:32.44 Porsche Carrera GT 612 PS/1380 kg Horst Von Saurma Sport Auto
7:34 Koenigsegg CCR 817 PS/1180 kg Horst von Saurma 2005-10-17 Sport Auto Cold conditions
7:35 RUF RT12 659 hp/1573 kg Sport Auto
7:40 Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren 626 PS /1768 kg Klaus Ludwig AutoBild
7:42 Ford GT 550 PS/1521 kg Octane Magazine
7:42 Porsche 911 GT3 415 PS/1440 kg Walter Röhrl Automobil 05/06 sport auto 05/06
7:42.9 Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06 505 hp / 1450 kg Jan Magnussen 2005 Motor Trend[8] Muggy conditions
7:43 Porsche 996 GT3 RS 381 hp/1360 kg "Motor" magazine
7:44 Pagani Zonda S 550 PS/1280 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 02/05
7:46 Porsche 911 GT2 462 PS/1450 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 06/01
7:47 Porsche 911 GT3 RS 381 PS/1321 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 08/04
7:47 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano 620 PS/1690 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto
7:47 Lamborghini Murcielago LP640 E-gear 640 PS/n/a Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 01/07 Sport tyres
7:49 Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z06 512 ps / 1440 kg Horst von Saurma 2007-06-22 Sport Auto
7:50 BMW M3 CSL 360 PS/1421 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 08/03
7:50 BMW X5 E53 LM Hans-Joachim Stuck 2000 EVO magazine 08/2005 BMW M70 S70B56 engine from a V12 LMR producing 750 bhp
7:54 Mercedes CLK DTM AMG 582 PS/1678 kg Sport Auto 03/05
7:55 Caterham R500 Superlight 233 PS/460 kg Robert Nearn EVO magazine 07/2000
7:55 Ferrari F430 F1 490 PS/1493 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 01/06
7:56 Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06 405 PS/1409.1 KG (3100 lb) Dave Hill [1]
7:56 Honda NSX-R (NA2) 280 PS/1270 kg Motoharu Kurosawa Best MOTORing 08/02 Omit the safe equipment model No Airbags No ESC No Spare tire
7:56 Porsche 911 Turbo 420 PS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 06/00
7:56 Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale f1 Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 02/04 Sport tyres
7:59* Chevrolet Corvette C6 Z51 405 PS/1481 kg driver Dave Hill *manufacturer claim.
7:59 Cadillac CTS-V (2nd Generation) ~550 HP/ ~4200 John Heinricy 2008-05-09 manufacturer claim[2]
7:59 Porsche 911 Carrera S Walter Röhrl WHEELS 06/04 PASM setting “Performance”
7:59 Nissan Skyline GT-R R33 Dirk Schoysmans Autocar magazine 1997 Without speed limiter
7:59 Dodge Viper SRT-10 2005-11 Motor Trend

8:01 Nissan Skyline GT-R R33 280 PS/1540 kg Motoharu Kurosawa Best Motoring - Video Special DVD Series Prototype (weight/horsepower different from production car)
8:02 Mercedes CLK 63 AMG - Black Series 507 PS/ 1790 kg Autobild 07/07
8:03 Aston Martin V8 Vantage (2005) 380 bhp/1570 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 10/05
8:03 Porsche 911 GT3 360 PS/1391 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 08/99
8:03 Honda NSX-R (NA1) 280 PS/1230 kg Motoharu Kurosawa Best MOTORing 02/06 Omit the safe equipment model No Airbags No ESC No Spare tire
8:04 Audi R8 420 PS/1595 kg Sport Auto 07/07
8:05 BMW M3 E92 420 PS/1608 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 12/07
8:06 Subaru WRX STi Spec-C 280 PS/1370 kg Motoharu Kurosawa Best Motoring Video "NISMO Beast Unleashed"
8:07 BMW Z8 E52 400 PS/1615 kg autobild.de 06/01
8:09 Audi RS4 420 PS sport auto 06/2006
8:09 BMW M6 E63 507 PS/n/a Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 12/05 Sport tyres, limited to 259 km/h
8:09 Honda NSX-R 320 PS/1467 kg Sport Auto 08/02 Sport tires, suspension modification
8:10 Chrysler Viper GTS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 10/97
8:13 BMW M5 E60 507 PS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 12/04
8:13 Ferrari 355 GTB Sport Auto 10/1994
8:22* Chevrolet Cobalt SS 2008 2.0 Turbo *manufacturer claim.
8:22 Nissan Skyline GT-R R32 280 PS/1430 kg Motoharu Kurosawa Best Motoring Video Special DVD
8:22 BMW M3 E46 343 PS/1584 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 12/00
8:22 BMW M Coupe E36/7 321 PS/1445 kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 10/98
8:24 Audi S5 354 PS/1718 kg * Sport Auto 01/08
8:24 Subaru Impreza Sport Auto 05/04 Sport tires
8:25 Lotus Exige S 243 PS/xxx kg Horst von Saurma Sport Auto
8:25 Jaguar XKR Horst von Saurma Sport Auto
8:25 Porsche Cayman S Horst von Saurma Sport Auto
8:24 Mitsubishi Charisma GT Evo VI Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 11/99 Sport tires
8:25 Mitsubishi Charisma GT Evo VII Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 11/02 Sport tires
8:26 BMW 335i E92 Coupe 306 PS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 306 hp
8:26 Nissan 350Z 290 PS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 10/03
8:28 Porsche 911 Carrera (993) 272 PS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 07/97
8:32 Porsche Boxster S 252 PS Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 12/99
8:38 Honda NSX Sport Auto, 08/97
8:39 Honda S2000 Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 01/00
8:39 Mazdaspeed3(MPS) 260 PS/1403 kg Mark Ticehurst 2007 Mazda News 06/07[9] Driver inexperienced on track.
8:40 Chevrolet Corvette C5 automatic 344 PS/1505 kg Sport Auto 07/97 Crash involving civilian later in the lap
8:42 Lotus Exige Mk1 179PS/796KG Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 11/00 Sport tires
8:47 Honda Civic Type-R 200PS/1204KG Horst von Saurma Sport Auto 11/01
8:49 Volkswagen Golf R32 250PS/1591KG Sport Auto 09/06
8:51 Ford Focus ST 225PS/1330KG Sport Auto 09/05
8:53 Volkswagen Golf GTi DSG Mk5 200PS/1421KG Sport Auto 11/05
8:54 Vauxhall Corsa VXR 192PS/1262KG Sport Auto 04/08
9:05 Ford Focus RS 215PS/1355KG Sport Auto 09/05
9:12 Jaguar S-Type Diesel 208PS/1722kg Sabine Schmitz Top Gear episode of Top Gear, (Series 5, Episode 5 Bridge to Gantry)[3]
9:59 Jaguar S-Type Diesel 208PS/1722kg Jeremy Clarkson Top Gear episode of Top Gear, (Series 5, Episode 5 Bridge to Gantry)[3]
10:08 Ford Transit (van) Sabine Schmitz Top Gear episode of Top Gear, (Series 6, episode 7; Bridge to Gantry)


[edit] Official Lap Times in Competitions
General Note: International motorsport sanctioning bodies used the 20.832 km Nordschleife variant in 1983 only.


[edit] Qualifying Times
Length Time Make Model Class Driver Date Source Notes
20832 m 6:11.13 Porsche 956 Gr. C Stefan Bellof 28 May 1983 n/a 2nd qualifier (and winner) in same event (199.005 km/h)

22835 m 6:58.6 Ferrari 312B3 F1 Niki Lauda 2 August 1975 [4] [5] pole-position for 1975 German Grand Prix
22835 m 7:06.5 McLaren M23-Ford F1 James Hunt 31 July 1976 [6] pole-position for 1976 German Grand Prix
22835 m 7:08.59 Ford Capri Zakspeed Turbo Gr. 5 Klaus Niedzwiedz 4 July 1982 [7] Pole-pos Großer Preis der Tourenwagen
22835 m 7:30.52 Ford Capri Zakspeed Turbo Gr. 5 Klaus Ludwig 30 March 1980 [8] pole-position for 1980 DRM race
22835 m 7:31.7 Porsche 935 K3 Gr. 5 Klaus Ludwig 29 April 1979 [9] pole-position for 1979 Eifelrennen, DRM race
22835 m 7:44.4 Ford Capri Zakspeed Turbo Gr. 5 Hans Heyer 29 April 1979 [9] Fastest Category II car of 1979 Eifelrennen, DRM race
22835 m 7:45.44 BMW 320 Turbo Gr. 5 Hans-Joachim Stuck 30 March 1980 [8] Fastest Category II car of 1980 Eifelrennen, DRM race

22835 m 7:42.1 Brabham BT26A-Ford F1 Jacky Ickx 3 August 1969 [10] pole 1969 German GP, fastest on original bumpy track
22810 m 9:43.1 Mercedes-Benz W154 GP Hermann Lang 24 July 1938 n/a pole-position for 1939 German Grand Prix
22810 m 9:48.4 Mercedes-Benz W154 GP Manfred von Brauchitsch 23 July 1939 n/a pole-position for 1938 German Grand Prix


[edit] Official Lap times in Races
Length Time Make Model Class Driver Date Source Notes
20832 m 6:25.91 Porsche 956 Gr. C Stefan Bellof 29 May 1983 [11] 1983 1000 km Nürburgring
20832 m 6:28.03 March-BMW 832 F2 Christian Danner 24 April 1983 [12] 1983 Eifelrennen (193.272 km/h)
20832 m 7:04 Porsche 996 Turbo Gr. A/GT Uwe Alzen/Arno Klasen 29 May 2003 [13] Castrol-Haugg-Cup 2003 Foto Klasen/Alzen (bettered by 15-25 s during videotaped VLN races on 24.4 km track)

24433 m 8:09.949 Porsche 996 Turbo Gr. A/GT Uwe Alzen/Jürgen Alzen 24 September 2005 [14] VLN 2005 videotaped. Turbo engined discontinued due to rule changes. (179.526 km/h)
25378 m 8:43.367 Porsche 996 GT3-MR Gr. A/GT Lucas Luhr/Timo Bernhard/Mike Rockenfeller/ Marcel Tiemann 18 June 2006 [15] 24 Hours Nürburgring 2006, team set a new overall distance record with 151 laps
25947 m 9:02.206 Dodge Viper GTS-R GT2/24h Peter Zakowski/Pedro Lamy/Robert Lechner 1 June 2003 [16] Fastest lap on longest possible track layout in 24 Hours Nürburgring. Team DQ'd for fuel tank size

22835 m 7:06.4 Ferrari 312B3 F1 Clay Regazzoni 3 August 1975 [17] [18] 1975 German Grand Prix
22835 m 7:06.51 Maurer MM82-BMW F2 Stefan Bellof 25 April 1982 [19] F2 lap record in 1982 Eifelrennen
22835 m 7:10.8 Tyrrell P34-Ford F1 Jody Scheckter 1 August 1976 [20] 1976 German Grand Prix
22835 m 7:37.3 Porsche 935 K3 Gr. 5 Klaus Ludwig 29 April 1979 [9] 1979 Eifelrennen, DRM race (179,760 km/h)
22835 m 7:46.3 Zakspeed Capri Turbo Gr. 5 Hans Heyer 29 April 1979 [9] 1979 Eifelrennen, DRM race (176,290 km/h)
22835 m 7:56.21 Zakspeed Capri Turbo Gr. 5 Harald Ertl 30 March 1980 [8] 1980 DRM race (172,630 km/h)

22835 m 7:43.8 Brabham BT26A-Ford F1 Jacky Ickx 3 August 1969 [21] 1969 German GP, lap record of original bumpy track
22810 m 10:09.1 Mercedes-Benz W154 GP Richard Seaman 24 July 1938 n/a 1938 German Grand Prix
22810 m 10:24.2 Mercedes-Benz W154 GP Rudolf Caracciola 23 July 1939 n/a 1939 German Grand Prix


[edit] Motorcycles, Official Lap Records
Length Time Make Model Rider Date Source Notes
20832 m 7:49.71 Honda RC30 Helmut Dähne 23 May 1993 [22] [23] [24] As motorcycle contests were discontinued after 1994, this remains the fastest officially timed motorcycle lap ever on the 20832 m variant (159.7 km/h). Done in a single lap time trial run during Zuverlässigkeitsfahrt series on road legal VFR750R RC30 and Metzeler ME Z1 tyres.
22835 m 8:22.2 Suzuki 500 Marco Lucchinelli 24 Aug 1980 [25] [26] [27] 1980 German motorcycle Grand Prix (163.6 km/h), fastest motorcycle lap even on 22835 m variant, last Moto-GP held there


[edit] Motorcycles, unofficial times, public sessions
In public sessions, it is not possible to do full laps as it is required to pass the ticket gates. Enthusiasts time themselves from the first Bridge to the last Gantry. These are about 1720 m apart on the main straight, and depending on top speed of the vehicle, this Gantry-to-Bridge section could be covered in under 30 seconds. See also Bridge To Gantry website

Time Make Model Rider Date Source Notes
7:21.8 MV Agusta F4 312R Andy "AndyPath" Carlile 15 Oct 2008 Performance Bikes Magazine January 2008
7:28.8 Yamaha YZF-R1 "The Baron" n/a Performance Bikes Magazine October 2007 n/a
7:32.1 Yamaha YZF-R1 Brendan Keirle n/a Sliders Guest House video lap Aug 2006 Video Here n/a
7:32.6 Aprilia RSV1000R Factory "The Baron" n/a reported in PB Magazine August 2007 n/a
7:35.7 Suzuki GSX-R1000K7 Dale Lomas (Ex-Roadtest Editor of Performance Bikes Magazine) n/a On-board video at BridgeToGantry.com n/a
7:50 Suzuki GSX-R1000 vs Aprilia RSV 1000 Fausto "Faustone" Severi & Helmut Dähne 2002 SuperWheels during a SuperWheels's Pattuglia Acrobatica test
Length Time Make Model Rider Date Source Notes
20832 m 8:12.62 Honda CBR 1000 RR Helmut Dähne Sep 2007 autobild early morning full lap comparison with Walter Röhrl in a Porsche 997 GT2 (7:32)


[edit] Unofficial F1 Lap Record
On 28 April 2007, Nick Heidfeld drove a BMW Sauber F1.06 Formula One car around the Nordschleife, on a BMW publicity day in combination with a VLN 4h endurance race[10]. For safety reasons, BMW announced that the car was slowed with hard demonstration tyres, maximum ride height, and 275 km/h top speed limited by the transmission. Heidfeld drove three laps on the combined Nordschleife and short GP-track, as used in VLN races, with a track length of 24.433 km (so comparison with older records is difficult). The official lap time released by BMW Sauber was declared to be 8:34 (thus ca. 30 secs slower than the fastest Porsche 996 turbo in VLN). The German press duly reported this lap time, yet criticized BMW. In each lap, Heidfeld slowed down once to pose for a slow video truck, at Schwedenkreuz on the first lap 1, Kesselchen in lap 2, and Döttinger Höhe in the last lap. The two time spans in between the three passes of Heidfeld were clocked by some fans around the track, first Wehrseifen to Wehrseifen in about 7:28, then 7:22 from Klostertal to Klostertal, which is over 50 secs quicker than the fastest current Porsche 997 GT3 RSR in VLN. This translates to an average of about 200 km/h, similar to Bellof's record, but considering the slow GP section, Heidfeld probably was faster on the Nordschleife, close to 6 minutes. Fans who respect the official record of the late Stefan Bellof settle for an "estimated 6:12".

Road & Track magazine reported Heidfeld's lap was a 5:57 or 5:58 (for the Nordschleife only), breaking the track's six-minute barrier for the first time in history.[28] However, their times were done by measuring the speed in some corners, and then calculating a laptime, and not timing a full lap. A BMW video montage [11] with onboard, track side and helicopter camera views gives a better estimate of 6 minutes 40 seconds to the last corner.

Heidfeld has since expressed his desire to repeat the experience with less restriction.

According to F1 Racing magazine of June 2006, BMW engineers had estimated that a BMW-Sauber F1.06 could lap in under 5:15.8[29] which equals to an average of 237 km/h.


[edit] Notes and references
^ Ask Dave Hill, December Edition. crossedflags.com. Retrieved on 2008-01-04.
^ Cadillac Drivers' Log - 2009 CTS- V Blisters Nurburgring
^ a b Jaguar S-type diesel at the ring. bbc.co.uk/topgear. Retrieved on 2007-12-30.
^ Lauda had set 7:00.6 the day before, and with 6:58.6 broke the magic barrier of 7 minutes. Carlos Pace was 1,4 sec slower with his Brabham, qualifying second. (translated from German) p.102, Jörg-Thomas Födisch, Robert Ostrovsky: Grüne Hölle Nürburgring, 1995, ISBN 3-922300-53-7
^ Lang, Mike (1983). Grand Prix! Vol 3. Haynes Publishing Group, p91. ISBN 0-85429-380-9.
^ Lang, Mike (1983). Grand Prix! Vol 3. Haynes Publishing Group, p135. ISBN 0-85429-380-9.
^ 20832.com - Nürburgring & Nordschleife Fanprojekt [rekorde]
^ a b c World Sports Racing Prototypes - DRM 1980
^ a b c d World Sports Racing Prototypes - DRM 1979
^ 20832.com - Nürburgring & Nordschleife Fanprojekt [rekorde]
^ 20832.com - Nürburgring & Nordschleife Fanprojekt [rekorde]
^ 20832.com - Nürburgring & Nordschleife Fanprojekt [rekorde]
^ Statistik: CHC Rundenrekorde Nordschleife 1990 - 2007 [1]
^ Sieg und neuer Rundenrekord für Alzen Motorsport [2]
^ 34. ADAC Zurich 24h-Rennen Nürburgring [3]
^ Corrected Results [4]
^ Regazzoni, starting from third row (with 7:01,6), in lap 7, while on position 2, set a new lap record with (192.79 km/h) 7:06.4. This record will stand forever. (translated from German) p.102, Jörg-Thomas Födisch, Robert Ostrovsky: Grüne Hölle Nürburgring, 1995, ISBN 3-922300-53-7
^ Lang, Mike (1983). Grand Prix! Vol 3. Haynes Publishing Group, p93. ISBN 0-85429-380-9.
^ 20832.com - Nürburgring & Nordschleife Fanprojekt [rekorde]
^ Lang, Mike (1983). Grand Prix! Vol 3. Haynes Publishing Group, p138. ISBN 0-85429-380-9.
^ 20832.com - Nürburgring & Nordschleife Fanprojekt [rekorde]
^ Foreword by Helmut Dähne, to Ulrich Thomson: Das Nürburgring Fahrer-Handbuch, 1997, ISBN 3-89365-533-6
^ 7:49,71 - Der Ring. Der Dauerbrenner von Futura. Erleben Sie Helmut Dähne mit der Honda RC 30 auf seiner Rekordrunde auf der Nürburgring-Nordschleife. 7.49.71 die Rekordzeit, die bis zum heutigen Tage von keinem Motorradfahrer gebrochen wurde. Onboard-Video by Futura Video, reenacting the record setting ride [5]
^ Dähne in his red-white leathers, doing a wheelie [6]
^ p.108, Jörg-Thomas Födisch, Robert Ostrovsky: Grüne Hölle Nürburgring, 1995, ISBN 3-922300-53-7
^ Nürburgring - Rekorde
^ Nürburgring - Rekorde
^ Road & Track, Hidden Glory at the Green Hell, May 2007
^ The layout includes 73 corners, and a simulation by BMW has today's BMW-Sauber F1.06 cutting the timing beam in 5m15.80s. - "Jacques at the Nürburgring", F1 Racing magazine, June 2006, p.83 [7]

[edit] External links
Road legal sports car lap times and comparison
Database with lap times of racing events and magazine tests
Castrol-Haugg-Cup lap records of various classes recorded on Nordschleife 1990 - 2006
One of the oldest/largest lists of Nordschleife lap times, with track length and average lap speed
Laptimes achieved in public sessions
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordschleife_lap_times"
Categories: Motorsport in Germany

The manual gearbox of the ZR-1 is bound to lose time at each turn, isn't it?. On a long track like the 'Ring, it could probably add to 2-3 seconds, if not more.

Great time, I'm surprised that the driver was an engineer not a professional driver. I think they're holding back alittle bit by what they said on edmunds.com. Congrats to GM!

I wish Ferrari weren't above crushing Nissan and GM.... Both Nissan and GM have sent their fastest most powerful production cars ever to the ring backed by pro drivers.

If Ferrari did the same it would look something like this car and this guy driving:
http://www.3autos.com/upload/3autos.com/200512/world_debut_of_ferrari_fxx.jpg

And then no one would care about ZR1 and GTR times anymore...

I would be more concerned if this man was the driver..

http://www.evo.co.uk/images/front_picture_library_UK/dir_449/car_photo_224695_7.jpg

I would be more concerned if this man was the driver..

http://www.evo.co.uk/images/front_picture_library_UK/dir_449/car_photo_224695_7.jpg

Yea, Rohl might have a heart attack trying to keep up with Schumacher... I'm concerned too :lol:

I wish Ferrari weren't above crushing Nissan and GM.... Both Nissan and GM have sent their fastest most powerful production cars ever to the ring backed by pro drivers.

If Ferrari did the same it would look something like this car and this guy driving:
http://www.3autos.com/upload/3autos.com/200512/world_debut_of_ferrari_fxx.jpg

And then no one would care about ZR1 and GTR times anymore...

The Ferrari FXX isn't a production automobile. DUH!!!

Here's more about the ZR1 that I'm sure you don't know... from Road & Track
An interesting tidbit: The front rotors are the same as those on a Ferrari FXX and the rears are off the front of an Enzo! The rotors are nearly identical to those on a Bugatti Veyron and optional on a Ferrari 599.
:D:

The Ferrari FXX isn't a production automobile. DUH!!!

Here's more about the ZR1 that I'm sure you don't know... from Road & Track

:D:

DUH!! :lol:

I knew someone would start throwing out excuses why the FXX couldn't be compared. Not like Schumacher in the Maserati MC12 wouldn't beat the ZR1, or even Schumacher in the F430 Scuderia could probably crank a better time than the ZR1. But since the ZR1 is GM's best, I thought Ferrari would be able to use their best too... And though it seems like you were just being sarcastic, I did know about the brakes on the ZR1. :)

Im happy with GT-R Spec V WHILE having the extra 200 something grand to mess around

400K for a Muscle car? no thx.

400K for a Muscle car? no thx.

Incorrect.

The Corvette is not and never has been a "muscle car". It is and always has been a purpose built "sports car". I understand your mistake, because several muscle cars have borrowed engines and components from the Corvette, but the Corvette itself is not a muscle car.

anyone who thinks the corvette is a muscle car just because it has lots of power is ignorant.

The leaf spring comments are valid, though

*ducks*

The vette when compared to the best the world has to offer is no where near the top when it comes to overall handling. If the Vette is an elite handling car, even the Z06 would have easily beaten the GT-R with its huge advantage in power to weight ratio. Just because its not at that elite level does not mean its not a sports car, it still handles better than 90% of the cars you see on the road including many sports cars.

The vette when compared to the best the world has to offer is no where near the top when it comes to overall handling. If the Vette is an elite handling car, even the Z06 would have easily beaten the GT-R with its huge advantage in power to weight ratio. Just because its not at that elite level does not mean its not a sports car, it still handles better than 90% of the cars you see on the road including many sports cars.

Tell that to the boys who drive the Compuware twin Z-06 in the ALMS. I am sure they would laugh in your face for that statement you made! :lol:

Did you not look at the "Ring" list i posted ? The Z-06 beat a Ferrari, several Porsches,a Aston Martin, NSX R , Viper, Catterham, BMW M3/M5 ,Skylines,Mercedes CLK Black Series which is a street usable racecar,Audi R8, and not to mention a full blown out racer car called the Mercedes CLK DTM AMG , yes the one that races in the German Touring car championship! Pretty top of the food chain to me , plus a full blown race car added to that list that a street usable Z-06 dominated. I say the handeling is equal to if not above and beyond to keep the elite at bay.

The Z-06 is a helluva car , have you ever driven one? I have , look for my review on my buddies Z-06 that i drove , the review is on this board. The Z-06 is a serious contender without all the computer aided crap that the GT-R has on it. The reason why the GT_R car gets such a good time on the ring is because of that computer aided guideance. Look at the list and tell me is there any Skyline GT-R that even remotely comes close to the C6 Z-06 time? There isn't because those Skylines GT-R's didn't have all that computer aided assistance to help them out. A good or pro driver drove them the best they could and got the time they got.

The Z-06 is a elite performer, now , then and for the future. The Z-06/ ZR-1 can hold its own against 95% of cars on this planet. Numbers don't lie....

Tell that to the boys who drive the Compuware twin Z-06 in the ALMS. I am sure they would laugh in your face for that statement you made! :lol:

Did you not look at the "Ring" list i posted ? The Z-06 beat a Ferrari, several Porsches,a Aston Martin, NSX R , Viper, Catterham, BMW M3/M5 ,Skylines,Mercedes CLK Black Series which a street usable racecar,Audi R8, and not to mention a full blown out racer car called the Mercedes CLK DTM AMG , yes the one that races in the German Touring car championship! Pretty top of the food chain to me , plus a full blown race car added to that list that a street usable Z-06 dominated. I say the handeling is equal to if not above and beyond to keep the elite at bay.

The Z-06 is a helluva car , have you ever driven one? I have , look for my review on my buddies Z-06 that i drove , the review is on this board. The Z-06 is a serious contender without all the computer aided crap that the GT-R has on it. The reason why the GT_R car gets such a good time on the ring is because of that computer aided guideance. Look at the list and tell me is there any Skyline GT-R that even remotely comes close to the C6 Z-06 time? There isn't because those Skylines GT-R's didn't have all that computer aided assistance to help them out. A good or pro driver drove them the best they could and got the time they got.

The Z-06 is a elite performer, now , then and for the future. The Z-06/ ZR-1 can hold its own against 95% of cars on this planet. Numbers don't lie....

Quite frankly, any one of these masters of shit talk could've be amongst the plentiful supply of dumb-punkass kids who'll challenge a vette to a street race in their v-tec civics equipped with those hideous garbage can sized mufflers.

While it's a noble effort to try to inform some of these types who've moved on to the "prestige" of owning an RX8, I'm afraid it's an exercise in futility.

Let alone the obvious, they are of limited capacity to grasp numbers.

In short, and stated kindly, you're wasting your time.

The leaf spring comments are valid, though

*ducks*

First, let's start with the obvious.

First, tell us how the differential equations that descibe the behavior of a mass spring system vary between leaf springs and coil springs.

After you're done scratching your head on that one, tell us when did the horse and buggy equipped with leaf springs begin using advanced composite materials in them?

Now, ask yourself another question, why would GM engineers use leaf springs made of such materials when a steel coil spring is far less costly?

Now, that your head is on top your shoulders, why in the hell do you all think coil spings are of some great advantage? Friggen vegas had coil springs, and pintos too (not on the rears).

We'll move on from that if you can come up with just one good answer to the above.

As not always being one who follows his own advice, I'm guessing this too is a waste of time.

You know, the horse and buggy used wheels. The RX8 uses wheels. Using your logic, the RX8 and the horse drawn buggy have a lot in common.

Tell that to the boys who drive the Compuware twin Z-06 in the ALMS. I am sure they would laugh in your face for that statement you made! :lol:

Did you not look at the "Ring" list i posted ? The Z-06 beat a Ferrari, several Porsches,a Aston Martin, NSX R , Viper, Catterham, BMW M3/M5 ,Skylines,Mercedes CLK Black Series which is a street usable racecar,Audi R8, and not to mention a full blown out racer car called the Mercedes CLK DTM AMG , yes the one that races in the German Touring car championship! Pretty top of the food chain to me , plus a full blown race car added to that list that a street usable Z-06 dominated. I say the handeling is equal to if not above and beyond to keep the elite at bay.

The Z-06 is a helluva car , have you ever driven one? I have , look for my review on my buddies Z-06 that i drove , the review is on this board. The Z-06 is a serious contender without all the computer aided crap that the GT-R has on it. The reason why the GT_R car gets such a good time on the ring is because of that computer aided guideance. Look at the list and tell me is there any Skyline GT-R that even remotely comes close to the C6 Z-06 time? There isn't because those Skylines GT-R's didn't have all that computer aided assistance to help them out. A good or pro driver drove them the best they could and got the time they got.

The Z-06 is a elite performer, now , then and for the future. The Z-06/ ZR-1 can hold its own against 95% of cars on this planet. Numbers don't lie....

having computer aid "crap" on the GT-R dosnt take anything away from it, your so called "crap" brings results.
It beat the Z06 is all the comparos so far as well as on the track... that says something to me. A car with vastly superior hp to weight ratio should be a lot faster than it is, but its being beaten by heavier cars with less power including the 911 turbo. Comparing the new Z06 vs previous versions of other cars dosnt make much sense either. Bringing up racing versions of the vette dosnt exactly say much about the stock z06... I never said the Z06 is bad either, Its still an elite performer and Id love to own one if given the chance. You dont need to get mad just because there are people who thinks the z06 is not at the very top of the sports car world (but pretty close). remember, its just oppinion. Once again, the Z06 is a great car that will destroy 90% of the sports cars on the track :)

btw i dont think ferrari is that interested in the ring, they have their own killer test track. im sure all the crazy f1 technologies where they spend 400M a year developing can help them dominate the ring too if they are really up for it.

having computer aid "crap" on the GT-R dosnt take anything away from it, your so called "crap" brings results.
It beat the Z06 is all the comparos so far as well as on the track... that says something to me. A car with vastly superior hp to weight ratio should be a lot faster than it is, but its being beaten by heavier cars with less power including the 911 turbo. Comparing the new Z06 vs previous versions of other cars dosnt make much sense either. Bringing up racing versions of the vette dosnt exactly say much about the stock z06... I never said the Z06 is bad either, Its still an elite performer and Id love to own one if given the chance. You dont need to get all mad just because there are people who thinks the z06 is not at the top of the sports car world. Once again, the Z06 is a great car :)

btw i dont think ferrari is that interested in the ring, they have their own killer test track. im sure all the crazy f1 technologies where they spend 400M a year developing can help them dominate the ring too if they are really up for it.

I am not mad at all, I don't think the GT-R is at the top of the sports car food chain either. Only thing it can do good is handle, and accelerate .2 sec faster than a standard Z-06 to 60 after that its game over for it. A GT-R will not run the 1/4 mile faster ,(stock Z-06 broke in the high 10.97-99,GT-R still mid to high 11's. ) nor even comes close to the Z-06 top speed of 196 mph,183-186 for the GT-R depending on sources.

Ferrari must be interested in the ring as they ran there F430 F1 series car on it, the same F430 F1 that wears the Scudera badge on it. So much for investing on a better F430.


On a side not the GT-R did not best the Atom 500 or the Radical , those cars are way lighter than a Z-06 and a GT-R , not to mention both those cars have a higher Hp to weight figure on them too, yet the GT-R couldn't trump them. Without the computer aided training wheels the GT-R is not that special. Good sports car, yes, great sports car, no.

First, let's start with the obvious.

First, tell us how the differential equations that descibe the behavior of a mass spring system vary between leaf springs and coil springs.

After you're done scratching your head on that one, tell us when did the horse and buggy equipped with leaf springs begin using advanced composite materials in them?

Now, ask yourself another question, why would GM engineers use leaf springs made of such materials when a steel coil spring is far less costly?

Now, that your head is on top your shoulders, why in the hell do you all think coil spings are of some great advantage? Friggen vegas had coil springs, and pintos too (not on the rears).

We'll move on from that if you can come up with just one good answer to the above.

As not always being one who follows his own advice, I'm guessing this too is a waste of time.

You know, the horse and buggy used wheels. The RX8 uses wheels. Using your logic, the RX8 and the horse drawn buggy have a lot in common.

Wow, someone's upset...or just wanting a free course on suspension :)

Wow, someone's upset...or just wanting a free course on suspension :)

Waiting on free course....can we get it in a cognitive shade of blue or should we be thinking in blue while receiving it?

I am not mad at all, I don't think the GT-R is at the top of the sports car food chain either. Only thing it can do good is handle, and accelerate .2 sec faster than a standard Z-06 to 60 after that its game over for it. A GT-R will not run the 1/4 mile faster ,(stock Z-06 broke in the high 10.97-99,GT-R still mid to high 11's. ) nor even comes close to the Z-06 top speed of 196 mph,183-186 for the GT-R depending on sources.

Ferrari must be interested in the ring as they ran there F430 F1 series car on it, the same F430 F1 that wears the Scudera badge on it. So much for investing on a better F430.


On a side not the GT-R did not best the Atom 500 or the Radical , those cars are way lighter than a Z-06 and a GT-R , not to mention both those cars have a higher Hp to weight figure on them too, yet the GT-R couldn't trump them. Without the computer aided training wheels the GT-R is not that special. Good sports car, yes, great sports car, no.

Hey and I totally respect that,

your very accurate description of the acceleration advantage the z06 has over the GT-R serve to demonstrate to me even more that the Z06 should be faster than the GT-R around tracks but its not... The GT-R certainly did not beat the Z06 by out accelerating it in the straights

The GT-R is not the best sports car out there. The Gallardo has beaten the GT-R on BMI already at Tsukuba. It is however better than the Z06 in my mind and it seems to be the case in all the reviews and comparos so far too. Thats not even a knock against the Z06 because there are are always better and faster cars out there.

I wish Ferrari weren't above crushing Nissan and GM.... Both Nissan and GM have sent their fastest most powerful production cars ever to the ring backed by pro drivers.

If Ferrari did the same it would look something like this car and this guy driving:
http://www.3autos.com/upload/3autos.com/200512/world_debut_of_ferrari_fxx.jpg

And then no one would care about ZR1 and GTR times anymore...
this has to be a joke post uh? because this enzo looking ferrari, isnt even a producation car.

I think the ZR-1 and the GT-R Spec V are head to head competitors, they are both comfortably pulling similar track times right now, It will be interesting to see which one ends up being faster, and the one that is faster should get all the props it deserve.

The regular GT-R and Z06 are more or less direct competitors. the GT-R being faster than the z06 does not mean that the spec V will be faster than the ZR-1

First, let's start with the obvious.

First, tell us how the differential equations that descibe the behavior of a mass spring system vary between leaf springs and coil springs.

After you're done scratching your head on that one, tell us when did the horse and buggy equipped with leaf springs begin using advanced composite materials in them?

Now, ask yourself another question, why would GM engineers use leaf springs made of such materials when a steel coil spring is far less costly?

Now, that your head is on top your shoulders, why in the hell do you all think coil spings are of some great advantage? Friggen vegas had coil springs, and pintos too (not on the rears).

We'll move on from that if you can come up with just one good answer to the above.

As not always being one who follows his own advice, I'm guessing this too is a waste of time.

You know, the horse and buggy used wheels. The RX8 uses wheels. Using your logic, the RX8 and the horse drawn buggy have a lot in common.

:lol:

Sorry, I was joking. The *ducks* insinuates I'm just instigating. Don't worry, the vette is safe.

Waiting on free course....can we get it in a cognitive shade of blue or should we be thinking in blue while receiving it?

I was thinking more of a forest green... it is suspension after all :lol:

this has to be a joke post uh? because this enzo looking ferrari, isnt even a producation car.

and what number must be produced to be a "production" car? The ZR1 is only going to have 2000 made, under World Rally Car rules that wouldn't even qualify as a "production" car.

and what number must be produced to be a "production" car? The ZR1 is only going to have 2000 made, under World Rally Car rules that wouldn't even qualify as a "production" car.

the FXX isnt street legal, people who buy it are only allowed to drive it at Ferrari track events. the owners cant even drive it home

the FXX isnt street legal, people who buy it are only allowed to drive it at Ferrari track events. the owners cant even drive it home

Sure they can, if they live at a track. The Nurburgring isn't a public road anyways.

Unofficial times don't mean shit. I give respect to the ZR-1 because I know the official times with a pro driver will be lower.

Sure they can, if they live at a track. The Nurburgring isn't a public road anyways. too bad you can only drive it at ferrari's tracks, and the ring isnt one of them.

too bad you can only drive it at ferrari's tracks, and the ring isnt one of them.
Ferrari doesn't own the Nurburgring.... the FXX has been to the Nurburgring before, just not on the Nordschleife. Though if it wasn't the FXX, the Enzo would do the same job and rape the ZR1 time if they sent out a pro driver (hopefully Michael Schumacher) and told him to set the fastest time possible. So I don't know why you're fighting the FXX so hard... if it wasn't that I could bring up dozens of other exotics that will smash the ZR1 time, like the Caparo T1.

Ferrari doesn't own the Nurburgring.... the FXX has been to the Nurburgring before, just not on the Nordschleife. Though if it wasn't the FXX, the Enzo would do the same job and rape the ZR1 time if they sent out a pro driver (hopefully Michael Schumacher) and told him to set the fastest time possible. So I don't know why you're fighting the FXX so hard... if it wasn't that I could bring up dozens of other exotics that will smash the ZR1 time, like the Caparo T1.

hahaha im not fighting hard about anything, im just pointing out that the other guy is correct in that the FXX is not a production car, its not even street legal and can only be driven at ferrari sponsored track events, you cant even drive them home. Then you came up with some stupid statement like

"Sure they can, if they live at a track. The Nurburgring isn't a public road anyways."

I thought you were cool and being funny, but it seems now that you are the one going to ridiculous length fighting so hard :) i never made any statement about whether the fxx or the enzo can beat the zr-1's track time, and I agree with you that they probably can. :)

Edit: N/m

BMonkey, take the stupid Ferrari badges off your car man, jeeze.


http://www.autoblog.com/photos/mazda-rrari-rx-8/854403/

BMonkey, take the stupid Ferrari badges off your car man, jeeze.


http://www.autoblog.com/photos/mazda-rrari-rx-8/854403/

OMG. That's BMonkey's car? Ferrari fanboi, sure, but...
how could you do that? Gaw. Jeez.

You see what happens when Mom tells him that he's outgrown this:

http://www.vipkids.co.uk/tgt_bw_sportscar_theme_bed-600.htm

Although an Austin friend of mine did see someone driving around in an RX-8 latenight wearing Michael Shumacher pj's.

Mom's not going to be happy if she following up on him reading these boards.

as much as the vette is sweet "sweet" and no matter how much i hate AWD drivers, id still rather drive the V-spec GTR.

ive been a fan of japanese cars since i was 7 years old. i wouldnt be caught dead in anythingelse.

OMG. That's BMonkey's car? Ferrari fanboi, sure, but...
how could you do that? Gaw. Jeez.

Hehehe, I do love the ferraris but that's just tacky. Almost as tacky as having a Pontiac as your avatar on a RX8 forum ;)

Ive been following the ZR1 VS GTR debat for awhile on other boards now and a couple things worth mentioning are:

A. The GTR's "official" time was done using R compound tires and had the boost cranked up beyond stock levels along with suspension tuning, although stock parts were used it was not "stock"

B. The ZR1 turned in that time being completly showroom stock with the ADDITION of communication and saftey equipment, a strong head wind on the main straight, stock Michelin Pilot tires and one of the engineers as the driver! Not a pro like was piloting the GTR. With a pro behind the wheel I would expect to see at least a 7:20 out of the ZR1.

I expect GM is waiting for the Spec V to turn in its offical time befor they unleash the ZR1 with a pro behind the wheel to really slap Nissan in the face.

So for those of you who are comparing hp I would guess the GTR that Nissan took to the ring to be closer to the 550 mark.

As much as I'm on the side of the corvette (as I think the GTR is overrated garbage) where did you get this information about the boost levels and tires on the GTR's run? According to the stuff I've found it only says it was run on "standard Japanese market tires" and nothing about boost.

As much as I'm on the side of the corvette (as I think the GTR is overrated garbage) where did you get this information about the boost levels and tires on the GTR's run? According to the stuff I've found it only says it was run on "standard Japanese market tires" and nothing about boost.

how is it a piece of overrated garbage when it smoke most supercars on earth ?

Hey and I totally respect that,

your very accurate description of the acceleration advantage the z06 has over the GT-R serve to demonstrate to me even more that the Z06 should be faster than the GT-R around tracks but its not... The GT-R certainly did not beat the Z06 by out accelerating it in the straights

The GT-R is not the best sports car out there. The Gallardo has beaten the GT-R on BMI already at Tsukuba. It is however better than the Z06 in my mind and it seems to be the case in all the reviews and comparos so far too. Thats not even a knock against the Z06 because there are are always better and faster cars out there.

Which BMI u talking about? I think the one I saw the GT-R took over at the last corner.

not to mention, GT-R cost how much again? and how much is the Gallardo ?

I think you are talking about this BMI video where the GT-R beat the Gallardo SL, and the Murcielago LP640... its Amazing..

The GT-R is clearly being walked on in the long straight by the Murcielago, but it clearly catches up in the corners with superior corner exit. The Exige is totally out classes here lol
http://youtube.com/watch?v=rBKLPIM7_k0

http://youtube.com/watch?v=cyesMboupuU
Car and Driver comparison of the Z06, vs Viper ACR, vs Porche GT2 vs GT-R

ZR-1 ring run released:

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/07/10/video-gm-releases-corvette-zr1s-7-26-4-ring-attack/

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii10/awedney/misc/zr1_ring_450op.jpg?t=1215726460

ZR-1 ring run released:

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/07/10/video-gm-releases-corvette-zr1s-7-26-4-ring-attack/

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii10/awedney/misc/zr1_ring_450op.jpg?t=1215726460

Totally faked and sped up video. That guy didn't take the sweeper on the back straightaway at over 175mph. It has leaf springs, for gods sake. That thing would have flipped and landed 10 football fields off the road.

Fake and impossible. Now, if it only had coil springs, different story.

okay, seriously...
THAT WAS AWESOME!!!!! OMG!!!!!!!! Sure the guy guy messed up in a bunch of places, but he gots some big ol' stones and drives 10 times better than I ever will.

DAMN THAT THING FAST!!!! I gotta see what the haters say....

^lol. Yep, I'm sure a few seconds could easily have been shaved off and perhaps he could have easily went another 10mph or more faster on the long straight - the car seemed to be fairly stable. An extremely hard track to nail all 170+ corners on a single lap. A wild ride none the less. I would kill to ride shotgun.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=k6mEirkQN8o&fmt=18

From the wheel movement and car movements the ZR1 looks to be far more stable and composed than both the Zonda and GTR (low and high speed). I guess thats proof that the much hyped about Magnaride suspension works. This video even looks to be in slow motion as compared to the GTR. Even with the headwind its also interesting to note that the 638hp ZR1 was only able to reach 179mph on the long straight, whereas the 480hp GTR reached 180mph.

At start of straightaway:
ZR1: 6.36
GTR: 6.48 Difference= 12 seconds

To the end of the straight where the bridge crosses
Times:
ZR1: 7.05
GTR: 7.18

Time to run back stretch:
ZR1: 29 seconds (ZR1 reaches near 180mph and holds back)
GTR: 30 seconds

I personally think it is LUDICROUS to think the ZR1 could only put 1 second on the GTR through this contest of flat out acceleration EVEN if the GTR had carried more speed into the straight. Hell, even a "measly" 505HP Z06 has been shown to put atleast that much distance on a GTR from 0-120mph.

It looks like the GTR was doctored with A LOT more boost even if the tires weren't doctored.


I would say that with a better driver *cough* C6R driver *cough* they would have a far better time, at times I feel that Jim Mero was taking some very conservative lines. It's also funny watching him throw his hands up in the air when he does something wrong like taking a very wide line or hitting the limiter.

After seeing that, I'm sure whoever gets a ZR1 will be the fastest man in their trailerpark :lol:

After seeing that, I'm sure whoever gets a ZR1 will be the fastest man in their trailerpark :lol:

LOL!
hang on... gotta sneeze... aaah AAH AHHHSSOHL!!!
:D:

LOL!
hang on... gotta sneeze... aaah AAH AHHHSSOHL!!!
:D:

:) I just couldn't resist.