Oil...!
Thread Starter
rock-->o<--hard place
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,242
Likes: 0
From: Canberra, AUSTRALIA
Oil...!
(I can't believe I just started an oil thread)
It appears Mazda has raised the RRP of its 5W30 rotary oil from c$55 to over $70 for 5L
which suggest it might be timely to re-appraise alternatives and their costs.
Both my dealer, and the rotary specialist who does my interim changes have always offered me options. The dealer offers Mobil1 as well as the Mazda oil, and Reliance Rotary offers a Valvoline oil as an option (think it is XLD Lo-Vis). Both the alternatives used to be around $35-40/5L but that is a while ago.
What do you think?
It appears Mazda has raised the RRP of its 5W30 rotary oil from c$55 to over $70 for 5L
which suggest it might be timely to re-appraise alternatives and their costs.Both my dealer, and the rotary specialist who does my interim changes have always offered me options. The dealer offers Mobil1 as well as the Mazda oil, and Reliance Rotary offers a Valvoline oil as an option (think it is XLD Lo-Vis). Both the alternatives used to be around $35-40/5L but that is a while ago.
What do you think?
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 88
Likes: 0
From: Australia
Just put in castrol edge 5w-30 synthetic during my last service.. Cost $ 45 from supercheap.
Also changed gearbox oil to motul gear 300 fully synthetic. Great gear oil, definitely improved gear feel and reduced notchiness 1st to 2nd.
regards
Rexi
Also changed gearbox oil to motul gear 300 fully synthetic. Great gear oil, definitely improved gear feel and reduced notchiness 1st to 2nd.
regards
Rexi
Shifty Bastard.
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 0
From: Melbourne, Australia.
Hang on...I cocked that up. Mobil 1 is rotary poison, apparently.
Originally Posted by rotarygod
Ok here's the official scoop on the oil issue. As I said earlier, I asked the highest people on the planet when it comes to rotaries. First I'll start with Rick Engman's position as he built all of the engine's for Downing. I looked at Rick and just quite simply said, "synthetic oils". His response was, "I wouldn't use anything but synthetic oil in a rotary". Thankyou Mr. Engman! All of Downing's race cars use Valvoline synthetic. He said it doesn't matter if it is a race engine or not. I also told Mr. Engman that many people say you only use synthetics in a rotary because it gets rebult all the time and that it doesn't matter what happens to these engines. I can't post what his opinion are of these people! He did say their engines get 100 RACE hours of use between rebuilds. The Courage is using experimental engine parts that were last used in the 80's and 90's! They care more about the longevity of the engine on a race car than a street car so some people's logic is VERY flawwed.
Now onto Mazda's position on synthetics since I know that the opinion of the smartest rotary person in the U.S. isn't good enough for some people. As I stated earlier, I asked the head of rotary engine development for the past 30 years at Mazda. He designed and built the 787B engine too. In very broken english he told me that not all synthetics are created equal. some are better than others when it comes to mixing with fuel in the oil metering system. The oil metering system is the key. It is NOT with swelling seals. He said that because some oils work very well and others not as well, it is far easier to just officially say not to use them than to say which ones to use and not to. This has actually been speculated for a long time and now we know it's true. I asked which synthetic oils he does not like. the answer is very surprising. The worst synthetic oil for the rotary according to the smartest rotary engine person in the world is Mobil 1. At least Valvoline and Royal Purple are fine. Didn't get any others listed. Rick Engman did say that decades ago there was an issue with some swelling of seals with old synthetic formulations but these have long since been resolved.
To all the people who keep getting on my case and others for using Royal Purple, WE'VE BEEN THE CORRECT ONE'S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D
Now onto Mazda's position on synthetics since I know that the opinion of the smartest rotary person in the U.S. isn't good enough for some people. As I stated earlier, I asked the head of rotary engine development for the past 30 years at Mazda. He designed and built the 787B engine too. In very broken english he told me that not all synthetics are created equal. some are better than others when it comes to mixing with fuel in the oil metering system. The oil metering system is the key. It is NOT with swelling seals. He said that because some oils work very well and others not as well, it is far easier to just officially say not to use them than to say which ones to use and not to. This has actually been speculated for a long time and now we know it's true. I asked which synthetic oils he does not like. the answer is very surprising. The worst synthetic oil for the rotary according to the smartest rotary engine person in the world is Mobil 1. At least Valvoline and Royal Purple are fine. Didn't get any others listed. Rick Engman did say that decades ago there was an issue with some swelling of seals with old synthetic formulations but these have long since been resolved.
To all the people who keep getting on my case and others for using Royal Purple, WE'VE BEEN THE CORRECT ONE'S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D
:
Thread Starter
rock-->o<--hard place
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,242
Likes: 0
From: Canberra, AUSTRALIA
Yeah, I'm a Castrol fan from way back (which means it is now sentimental, and has no basis in either fact or logic) especially if it is readily available. But I will check what the dealer is going to use
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Likes: 0
From: Melbourne, Australia
I stockpiled 10 X 5 litres of Castrol's Formula R 5W30 for $29.99 each during the Supercheap's introduction of Castrol's Edge 5W30. Oil filter from Mazda only cost 9 bucks with the drain plug washer. I change oil every 4000km. I hope it's ok to use Castrol's synthetic oil.
Shootin' from the hip
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,584
Likes: 0
From: Sydney, Australia
Originally Posted by timbo
It appears Mazda has raised the RRP of its 5W30 rotary oil from c$55 to over $70 for 5L
Why do questions like oil need to be this hard?
Shootin' from the hip
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,584
Likes: 0
From: Sydney, Australia
Originally Posted by timbo
Care to start a thread on your favourite tipple? 
Besides, why would anyone want to discuss Cascade Premium in an RX8 forum...
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 745
Likes: 0
From: Canberra
Did you guys not read what Gomez posted?
"He said that because some oils work very well and others not as well............."
Is it worth the risk to save a few $? I'll be sticking with the Mazda oil.
"He said that because some oils work very well and others not as well............."
Is it worth the risk to save a few $? I'll be sticking with the Mazda oil.
Last edited by Tim Tam; Mar 5, 2006 at 02:48 AM.
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 778
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane Australia
On the subject of synthetics, I have been very impressed by the low amount of soot that I see in my oil. Grand Prix Mazda service my car with a full synthetic, and I've been topping up with a full synthetic too. I'm getting close to my 50k service, and the colour is very pale. I have read the arguments about synthetics and seals, and when I was researching elastomers (polymers which behave like rubber) for a project at work, I happened across an article by DuPont on their Viton fluorocarbon elastomer which is extensively used in automotive seals. They say that the trend towards synthetic oils has driven them to produce new formulations which can stand up to the synthetics. This accords with what Mazda have been saying about the Renesis motor; i.e., it is OK to use synthetics. It is likely that the RX-7 motor uses seals which can't hack the ester-based oils.
Edit/Delete Message
Edit/Delete Message
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane, Australia
Just a quick question - is that Grand Prix's standard procedure, or have you specifically asked them to use a synthetic?
I'm getting my car from there, just want to know what to expect when I take it in for a service
I'm getting my car from there, just want to know what to expect when I take it in for a service
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 778
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane Australia
Originally Posted by gibbon
Just a quick question - is that Grand Prix's standard procedure, or have you specifically asked them to use a synthetic?
I'm getting my car from there, just want to know what to expect when I take it in for a service
I'm getting my car from there, just want to know what to expect when I take it in for a service
