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Been going thru the exact same thing , checked all the same items, including the EPS module. I haven't changed out the intermediate harness but did swap out the steering rack as the torque sensor was the identified and most likely item based on process of elimination. Sorry to say that fix was also temporary. I installed a known good used rack this came with its own short harness from the steering rack so even that's a different one
Honestly, even a temporary fix would be an improvement at this point. I just read through this whole thread again and not really finding a lot of cases that are similar to mine, mostly cases that are intermittent. Mine was a total random failure - worked for two weeks, sat the car for a couple days, and it was broken. Hasn't even slightly returned since. No shaky steering, no different effort left to right, just completely out.
I had another mechanic friend suggest battery/alternator based on an Identifix case:
I don't know if I see this being the problem though. Battery is 12.2v with the engine off and charging system is 14.3-14.4 at idle with the engine running.
Honestly, even a temporary fix would be an improvement at this point. I just read through this whole thread again and not really finding a lot of cases that are similar to mine, mostly cases that are intermittent. Mine was a total random failure - worked for two weeks, sat the car for a couple days, and it was broken. Hasn't even slightly returned since. No shaky steering, no different effort left to right, just completely out.
I had another mechanic friend suggest battery/alternator based on an Identifix case:
I don't know if I see this being the problem though. Battery is 12.2v with the engine off and charging system is 14.3-14.4 at idle with the engine running.
I gave you the short version. All the validation , symptoms you identified I experienced including the working fine until you move the steering wheel. Mine has been intermittent for over a year until it got to the point of being off more than on. Driving for a month at a time without power steering. Every time I would try something it was good for a day, an hour, a week or not at all, then fail (including the changing the whole steering rack). Resetting the code would work briefly until it didn't anymore.
My theory as to starting the car for a few minute then moving the steering wheel and failing, is there is a steering wheel angle sensor that sees the steering wheel position and expects to see a cosponsoring reading from the torque sensor if it doesn't it will fail.
I'm testing mine at the moment with a simple twist to the contact pins in the connector to ensure contact. If that fails I will replace both sides of the connector. I'll update when I'm convinced is works or if it fails and I have to try something else. Just a heads up don't bet the farm on replacing the torque sensor/rack as the answer. By the way the torque sensor is not a part you can buy as a separate part, it comes with the whole steering rack.
Just a heads up don't bet the farm on replacing the torque sensor/rack as the answer. By the way the torque sensor is not a part you can buy as a separate part, it comes with the whole steering rack.
I'm definitely not convinced that the rack swap will fix the problem, but the diagnostics for troubleshooting this system are so vague and ambiguous that the best I can do is eliminate it as a variable. It doesn't seem like the torque sensor or EPS motor on the rack actually fail that often (it typically seems to be the wiring), so a low mileage used rack with a return policy seems like a comfortable investment at this point.
Or at least that's the plan. Buy a rack, tear into the car again, go through FSM procedure again, and if it's still not something glaringly obvious, then replace the rack and retest. At least then, the only thing I think that would even still be a problem is the battery harness/upper harness.
It would make more sense to first replace the upper intermediate harness (that connects to the PS control module, above the radiator), and lower harness. Bunch of people on here have bought a rack and control module, only to find out the same PS issues occur.
Yup
Power steering solutions on this car are unpredictable to say the least. Things will fail intermittently, I've even had my PS come back on spontaneously. My current thought is the connectors will fail before the wire itself. I'm not even convinced its not in an unrelated area. Don't even get me started on on computer related failures.
It would make more sense to first replace the upper intermediate harness (that connects to the PS control module, above the radiator), and lower harness. Bunch of people on here have bought a rack and control module, only to find out the same PS issues occur.
I don't think there's going to be much replacing of that after looking at a wiring diagram (main harness). But could possibly repair the connector/wires coming off of it. Sleeping on it and looking at the car again, as well as doing more reading on electrical, I'm finding that the continuity tests in the FSM really don't mean anything if the wires are damaged/corroded. Seeing a lot of coolant splatter, I think the next step will actually be to do some resistance/voltage drop tests.
Quick update.
So far after a week its still hanging in. This is with tweaking the three wire connector under the Air-box.
I'll start to truly believe it in a month or so.
Looks like I was able to fix my issue. I can't believe this crap worked but here's the story. It ended up being a bad ground.
I used about 12ft of wire to make a big patch harness for the power steering, for the torque sensor and power to plug into a friend's RX8 with working steering. We parked my friend's RX8 next to mine, took his apart, and plugged his rack into one end of the harness. Then my car's power and module plugged into the other end. Basically, my car's module and power should - in theory - power his rack, so he would have power steering, even with his car not running. This would at least tell us if the wiring was good or not.
Turns out this didn't work the first time. No power steering in either car. So we swapped - my rack patched into his car. Worked like a charm - I had working PS patched into my car and a confirmation that my rack was good. We checked the connections and did the whole test again to try to find the discrepancy, which turned out to be that no power was getting past the radiator connector on my car, and therefore not getting to the rack.
I pulled up the wiring diagram and tried working my way back to that connector from the battery. This is where I found the issue - at terminal 1B, there was inconsistent continuity and the connection to ground was 4 or 5 ohms. Traced this to the white connector on the battery case and cleaned it out 3 times with Deoxit. This fixed the continuity and resistance to ground. Plugged everything back in, fired the car up, had PS again.
I'm befuddled a little because I cleaned this particular connector the first time the issue popped up and it didn't change anything, so I never went back to it. I did use a different cleaner this time (which was much more harsh than the no-name contact cleaner I had) so that seemed to have done the trick.
I love the extra long test wires and getting the two cars together to troubleshoot. Genius and a great way to get together as a community of finicky car owners. Well done!
So i'm the guy who replaced nearly everything (except the upper harness) and my power steering still didn't come back until a magical humid day. Well, I had it for 9 months and today, it's been raining and it went out again...after NINE MONTHS of it working kinda unexplained. I'll get in there and dry things out and see what happens next.
So i'm the guy who replaced nearly everything (except the upper harness) and my power steering still didn't come back until a magical humid day. Well, I had it for 9 months and today, it's been raining and it went out again...after NINE MONTHS of it working kinda unexplained. I'll get in there and dry things out and see what happens next.
My recommendation based on what I've learned from this is put a voltmeter on *everything* and check for continuity and resistance as much as you can. The good news is that the power steering electronics really aren't that complicated and easy to get to, but what sucks is that it's so sensitive to minor voltage drops, it doesn't take much for the entire system to fail. I hate electronic faults like this - if it's mechanical, the problem is usually obvious; if there's a hole in the block, I know what happened. Whereas with this, it will look totally fine and not work. Furthermore, you will run into so many contradicting readings as you test that you will scratch your head trying to determine where the real problem is.
Unfortunately, you won't be able to replace your upper harness easily (since that's actually the body harness, you'd have to rewire the whole car), but it's doubtful that's your problem. At worst, it could be the connectors from the upper harness to the lower harness and you have developed corrosion over time there. You might have to cut those and hardwire the lower harness to that connection, but DON'T do that until you put a voltmeter on both sides and determine that you have continuity and no resistance through those wires. If both of those check out, those wires aren't your problem.
Also be sure to check all the grounds, and clean them as much as possible. I ended up going back and recleaning mine and grinding the paint off the body grounds just to ensure no problems going forward on any of the grounds. Again, a voltmeter is your friend here.
You may also have the same problem I did in that I cleaned the connectors the first time around using the DIY on this site, but that didn't fix my problem and sent me on a tailspin of changing parts - only to find out it was a connector the whole time. I just didn't do a good enough job actually making sure those things were clean enough, or using the right tools for the job.
This is a very good contact cleaner, which is actually used in the trade and recommended by Mazda to it's Dealers...
Obviously there are other brands/types available..
This is a very good contact cleaner, which is actually used in the trade and recommended by Mazda to it's Dealers...
Obviously there are other brands/types available..
Quick update for anyone following - I've had no issues at all since digging into the system and cleaning that white ground on the battery. Three months in (along with a lot of autocrossing and a leaking radiator...) and still holding strong.
Hey guys! I've been having the steering issue off and on myself. It started when it was raining. My roommate was driving it at the time, so I'm not sure what all happened to it.... either way, here is what's going on.
I had cleaned the connectors under the airbox, and put a bit of dielectric grease in there. It was fixed for a few weeks, then started up again. It's gotten progressively worse, but is still intermittent. If the light is on, it's really hard to steer. Like its fighting against you. It takes maybe 40 lbs of force to break the wheel free if you ease the pressure on. If you shake it over a little, it isn't as bad. When the light is off, it varies in ridiculousness. Sometimes it isn't too hard to steer. Other times it's worse than with the light on.
If I keep pressure on the wheel, after a minute or so the traction control light will blink, or sometimes stay on.
I've checked the wire harness with a multimeter. The power lines were nice and solid. The torque sensor lines were hard to get continuity on at first, but once I got good contact with the leads it was solid.
What do you guys think the issue is? I've tried spraying both enda of the harness off with contact cleaner. The pins all feel solid in the connectors. But it's so intermittent. Is the sensor going out, which is why the traction control light comes on?
So last night I parked the car at a local bar. Went in for some food, a drink and some karaoke. By the time i came out around 1am the outside temps dropped to about 30 degrees from mid 50s. Started the car and BOOM no PS. Drove the car home since it was down the road.
Read through this thread and here is what my fix was.
Easiest thing was for me to test the harness (I checked the fuse first with a meter and it was fine) so i unplugged it at both ends (the power harness at the top of the rack is a PITA to get off) and noticed white residue at the top connectors that I assume was dried coolant from the purge port on the overflow tank.
I cleaned all the connectors with electric connector cleaner, made sure all the pins where straight and did a nice coating of DE grease. Made sure the grounds where clean and wired everything back up.
First I reset the sensor (on position on the key but not with the motor running), and then i reset the ECU (Pump the brakes a bunch of times untill the oil pressure needle sweeps) and then started it up.
POWER STEERING RESTORED!
Tonight should get cold at night again so I will update if anything changes but seemingly its a good fix.
^ Cleaning the connectors is a temp fix and won't last long. It's just a matter of days/weeks (or if your lucky, months) before the PS light comes back on lol.
happened to me the night before SevenStock
I had just finished reinstalling my bumper, polishing, and detailing the interior and when I went to back the car into the garage the light came on.
Obviously there was no time to acquire a new harness before the event (and 100+ mile round trip to SS) so I cleaned the hell out of the connections and hoped for the best.
Good news is the power steering has worked but I have no faith that this is a permanent solution.
My first Power Steering failure was back in like 07 or '08 and I ended up replacing the harness.
Looks like it's time to do it again.
I've long ago rerouted the overflow tank hose and the car never gets driven in rain or rough weather so it's tough to say what's causing this.
Over the past month I've heard a rumbling noise coming from my steering wheel every time I turned my car to the left (only the left.) This only occurs at slower speeds, usually when I'm turning from a complete stop. Also, I had the power steering fail light come on, turned off the car and turned it back on and it was fine.
I'm planning on cleaning the connecters and all that. In terms of the rumbling, is greasing the u-joint a fix to this? I've seen that it deals with "lumpiness" just didn't really read enough of the thread to determine if what I'm experiencing is the same thing.
The power steering in my 2004 with 71k miles either will work or not upon starting it up. It will either start up without the power steering light and the power steering will work normally, or the light will be on and the power steering will not work at all. It seems that temperature doesn't really have an effect, and it has not lost power steering while driving.
Well guys, add me to the list of RX-8 owners with power steering problems. I've had my 2004 RX-8 for just over 12 years, and just recently, at about 75k miles, my engine failed. I had the engine replaced with a Mazda reman, and two days after I got my car back, my power steering failed. It happened on startup, with the power steering malfunctioning from the very start. That is to say, it didn't fail while driving, or a few seconds after I started the car, but just from the very beginning.
Odd thing is, the first thing I checked was the EPS fuse. I popped it out, saw that it was fine, and then put it back in. I started up the car, and power steering was back. No erratic power steering at all, everything seemed to be working fine. But then, after a few hours, I tried to startup the car again, and again the power steering was malfunctioning. So I tried popping the fuse out and putting it back in again. Got the power steering working again.
I haven't tried all the connector cleaning solutions, or replacing the harness, but I'll give that all a shot. Something tells me that's not the issue, though. Something about disconnecting the power (popping out the fuse) and reconnecting it, resets the power steering electronics somehow, and when it resets it runs fine. But then, something happens to make it shut down again.
Not sure what that means, but I'm curious if anyone else has a similar experience.
The power steering in my 2004 with 71k miles either will work or not upon starting it up. It will either start up without the power steering light and the power steering will work normally, or the light will be on and the power steering will not work at all. It seems that temperature doesn't really have an effect, and it has not lost power steering while driving.
Hey I just posted on this. My 2004 with 75k miles has the same issue. I tried popping out the EPS fuse, then putting it back in, and that seemed to temporarily fix the issue. (I imagine this is the same as disconnecting the battery, and reconnecting it, except that it only affects power to the EPS system.) I'd be curious to hear if that works for you.
04-27-2015, 06:20 PM
Fantastic
cleaning connectors?
