What fuel is best for an RX8?
 

I was curious what octane I should be sticking in a rotary, obviously for turbocharged the highest possible octane but with the Renesis I wasn't sure.

BTW I do not own one but I was just curious.
Yet...

The manual says 91 octane

Here downunder, most owners use 98 octane in the 8.

Hate to say do a search, but this topic has been discussed in much detail. If you are looking for max performance go with 93/91 octane at all times. It can use 87 or 89 but the ECU will retard timing and decrease your hp, especially under heavy throttle. I had included an article in the previous threads where they tested several cars, and the ones that recommended/required 91 lost 6% to 10% of their performance when a lower grade of gasoline was used.

Man, you guys are up late. Makes you do crazy things like bring up over-discussed topics.

Processed petrol from your local gasoline station is the best fuel for your RX-8.

ROFL! :D

93 octane

I just added up the number of tankfuls of 87 octane in my gas mileage spreadsheet and I counted 65. (I counted 16 tanks of 93). The difference in performance was negligible - if anything it was better with 87 than with 93. There are technical arguments as to why this might be true due to the shape of the rotary's combustion chamber that I don't completely understand. All I know is that 87 works best for me.

I experimented with 87 once. I also learned my lesson by experiencing engine knock at high rpm/WOT! Bad sound, that. It also didn't feel as snappy on the 87, probably due to the retarded spark. I also have an '83 RX-7 that is the opposite - dyno proven to make more power (4hp) on 87 vs 93. No knock ever on the 12A, even when spark was accidentally 10 degrees advanced.

I use 89/91 (whatever the mid grade is) at the more expensive stations, but if I have to go to a cheaper one I get the high grade, haven't noticed a difference between them

I experienced the exact same problems, and they were all due to using low-grade fuel. I took it to the dealer, they told me to switch back to 91+ octane fuel, and the problems, for the most part, have since been resolved. I'll never go back to 87 again and would dissuade anyone from putting it in their 8's.

Some in outback Oz use koala oil and refined kangaroo poo, some of us even use 98 Premium unleaded and there is a marked difference in performance from the normal 95 octane fuel..
My Mazda3 Sp23 also runs 98 premium fuel and there is a significant increase in power in this OZ spec vehicle.9100RPM

95 is normal in Australia?? Geeze, I bet that's really expensive. 93 is the highest we hit here in the US (I think).

And refined kangapoo? I bet the exhaust wreaks!

93 Always! Be good to your car!

LOL! 87 octane from 2nd tank on, 15k miles and no problems related to fuel or engine.

If I lived in the red line zone, I don't think I'd use 87 octane though (from what I've read on the forum) - but for my driving style it works just fine. I'll take the $$$ in fuel saving over a few HP, thanks.

Anyone here using 87 octane and living in the red line zone with no issues?

I strongly agree.

If the manual says that low octane will work find then guess what. Low octane will work fine. No suprises here.

As for the guy who says he had engine knocking and went to 93 and "for the most part the problem went away". You've got big problems in there. Good luck..

93 for my baby!! Specifically...Shell V-Power. :D

- Irish :cool:

I've used 87 and did not notice much difference in power, but my mileage dropped significantly... I only managed 147miles to 14.8 gallons. My fuel light had been on for a little while, and I could not believe when I filled up that I was that close to empty and had only 147 on the trip meter. Thats right....9.8mpg.

95/98 octane is about $1.10 per litre here in Sydney Australia.

"You've got big problems in there"???? What the hell is that suppose to mean? I surely hope you did not mean that derogatorily. After having read feedback from numerous respected individuals on this forum, the service manager of my dealership, and other Mazda mechanics since, as well as my own personal observations of my engine's performance using various octane fuels, I don't believe my comments on 87 vs. 93 are baseless. Considering I'm not alone in my position, you're otherwise also calling several other 8 owners crazy.

Mark D

Feel free to read your post again, then mine. Not sure how you can get offended over this, but knock yourself out. (Actually kinda funny to me -- like Captain Furious in the movie Mystery Men.)

You said you engine was knocking at High RPM's with low octane fuel. You went to the higher octane and it "for the most part, has been resolved." If your engine is knocking at any RPM "Bad Sound" then you have a problem.
And if using better gas helped but didn't fix the problem, it soulds like a band-aid on a problem that will get worse.

I have been using 87 octane pretty much since I got the car. I live in the red-line zone and have not had any issues, although if I put 93 octane in...it just gets there smoother and what seems like faster (have not clocked this). I get about the same number of miles on the tank (220-260) no matter what I use with the exception of last week and the freezing weather which dropped me down to 160 miles on the tank...this I still don't completely understand.

Damn...that works out to 4.26 a gallon

Point taken, 8 is enuf. Although your open-ended sentence did leave me confused about its meaning, I apologize.

I think the thing that confuses me the most about the RX-8 is the inconsistency in performance. Some people get good gas mileage; some people get poor gas mileage. And, as here, a lot of people do not experience problems with low-octane fuel use; others, like myself, are utterly confused b/c the loud knocking and the drag in acceleration are markedly noticeable. For me, I wish I was making up the symptoms under 87-octane fuel. I would love to save money anywhere I can. Having read other threads, and I myself not being an expert in engines, I defer to earlier posts(i.e., posts #9 and 10 in this thread) that provide a more sound explanation than I could ever provide.

I would love to swap cars for about 100 miles with someone who is getting really bad mileage just to see if the poor results follow the car or the driver.

That's probably one of the lowest mpg numbers I've seen. 147 miles at 14.8 gallons in? You must have been damn near running on fumes. I always fill up around 13.3 gallons. How is it with 89 or higher? Maybe try mpg at a different gas station at 1/4 tank around 10.5 gallons and see if you get the same results. MPG Doesn't really change for me at 87 89 or 91.

True. Some are legitimate claims. Others just mash the pedal or can't accurately calculate mpg and it's hard to tell who's who.

Wow! It can be done then (okay, in your car anyway, since all these cars seem to vary so much :) ), red line with 87 octane and no pinging that is.

You experiencing slightly more performance with 93 octane seems on par with the owner's manual suggesting that lower than 91 octane may result in lower performance.

I use Shell gas, what brand(s) do you use most often?

Me three :D, but I'd like to drive it for one tankful.

Honestly...whatever is closest when the gas light comes on...or cheapest (note: I won't use HEB, Walmart, or no name brands). I will agree with you that Shell is the best that I have used...I am just not that picky since the 8 is greatly increasing the cash flow OUT of my pockets. I have been wondering about the "pinging" that people describe. Maybe I just got a really good 8 or maybe it really does take about 15,000 - 20,000 miles to completely break in the engine.

I use Premium and well known brand. Such as shell, chevron etc

Just an observation that I noticed on my car. I may get flamed, but I thought that it would be interesting. My car has 16.4K and I have been getting 19 to 19.6 MPG. Usually I fill up my tank with 91 octane after 240 miles; about a notch or so lower of 1/4 tank mark in the gauge. I do about 80% freeway @ 70 mph and half of the distance with traffic ~30 mph with stop and go in some areas.
Now here is the interesting thing. I normally use 76 gas station and it gives me the mentioned fuel economy. One time I decided to go to Costco and fil up with 91 because I was running low; and besides I was already there anyways to do some shopping. I noticed that my MPG went up to 20.7 MPG. That is strange, so I decided to try it out a few more tanks (5 - 7 ) and indeed my MPG is about that. One time I got close to 22 MPG, and my driving habits has not change nor my route or the traffic. I simply use my car to go to work and back home with a few miles in between for small errants. When I switch back to known brand gas, regardless if is 76, mobil, chevron, etc. My MPG goes back to 19 to 19.6. By the way I keep a close log book about my fuel economy since I got my car. I know that costco gas is not the greatest thing but so far I haven't experience any engine pinging when I do a WOT.
Anyone have experienced the same?

I spoke to a Mazda Engineer today....I will make a new post with what was said, but part of it fits in this post...

It has been mentioned before, but the engineer confirmed it for me...using full with as little ethanol or any "nol" for that matter will make a measurable difference. I am not sure of the contents or additives used in different areas of the US or world for that matter...but for my area (Michigan) he recommended Sunoco Ultra 94. Typical premium octane is 92 in Michigan.

If you want to know more about what I found out...check my post in the RX-8 Discussions area.

I went from Hess (convenient) to Shell both mid grade and mpg jumped up over 1 mpg. For you looks like Costco jumped you up a little over 1 again. That Costco note was surprising and I'm tempted to try them out. But gas mileage aside, is their gas any better/worse for the car? It's definately cheaper but.. :confused:

I remember back in May-June timeframe that there was a discussion regarding the quality of gas from the known brand and the "generic" ones. Based on what I remember that all the gasoline in your area are made in the same local refinery if any nearby. The tankers trucks pulls out from the refinery with the same "basic" gasoline. then they go to their company's formulation station to add their "additives" I am not sure what additives have the gas from costco or other small gas stations. At least I know that they are using the right additives to make 87, 91, etc. octane. My guess that the generic gas does not contain not much detergents like the brand names. But, for me I usually commute 60 miles per day and normally I fill up on Thusday night If I start my commute on Monday with a full tank. With Costco gas I can push it to 280 miles with 1/8 tank left and no low fuel light. And about 13.4 gallons pumped. I am planning to alternate the fuel brands so at least my baby gets all the cleaning additives.

I read through a bunch of gas threads a while back, and several members swore by Shell V-Power. So that's what I always use.

In the US, 87, 89, 93 are the general three Octane levels available. I know in the UK, 95 is the lowest! So, my questions is, are the engines made different for the two countires.
I am from the UK but drive my 8 here in Alabama, US. I use 93 but have tried the 89 level a few times. I have noticed a reduction in performance, especially obove 6ooorpm. Due to this I have never even tried to use the 87 Octane. A reduction in performance I can handle at times, but engine damage, I cannot!

Doesn't the manual also say that using a lower octane fuel can result in a loss in performance? Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the loss in performance caused by the timing being retarded because the knock sensor has detected knock which in turn is a bad thing for the engine? (gasp for air)

I was skeptical about Shell, but tried it and my car seems to run smoother and with a bit more pep. Costco gas was hit and miss, sometimes my car ran smoothly on a tankful, other times I'd immediately feel a roughness.

Different engines are not required. In the US octane in computed using the (R+M)/2 method or (RON+MON)/2 in other countries such as the UK, they use compute using RON which calculates to a higher number for the same fuel.

For example, if you look in the owner's manual, they recommend fuel with octane 91 [ (R+M)/2 method] or above (96 RON or above) ..... so US 91 octane is UK 96 octane.

Thanks for tech info. Bottom line is I do not want to do damage and hear about "Knocking" sounds. It seems to me that if you get to the point where your engine is making these noises, damage may have already occurred. I drive about 4K miles per month and would love to reduce my costs by using lower priced fuel, but is it really worth it?

Trust me, I don't want engine damage either ...... I've never heard any knocking or had any engine problems in my 15k miles. Also, my understanding is that the ECU compensates for lower octane fuel by adjusting the timing to prevent the knocking.

If using 87 octane is guaranteed to cause engine damage, I hope to hell that Mazda would not have said it was okay to use in the owner's manual.

If you try 87 octane and hear knocking or experience any other problems, then switch back. If you're going to try it, I'd suggest starting with Shell. Let us know what happens if you do.

I'm sure somebody has said this before but I'll say it anyway. The purpose of designating different octane levels is a way of measuring HOW the fuel burns. The higher the octane the smoother and more controlled the burn. 87 tends to burn faster thus requiring more fuel and less timing. The PCM takes care of this for you learning between different fuels it can take several drive cycles for the PCM to learn though, so constantly switching is worse than sticking to one octane. For me personally running higher octane is better, there IS less risk of detonation and a performance difference. Probably not enough performance difference for the average person to notice on a close to stock car though.

Back West is a little different...

85, 87 and 91 are the available octane levels...so there are really 5 levels depending where you are in the US ;)

And that doesn't include any of the race gas available at some stations...

This happens because the colder the engine is the more fuel the ecu dumps in the engine to help it warm up

Well, that has to be a new record for necroposting. Twelve years! :Freak_ani

aggietiff28 sold his 8 five years ago.

.

...having never known why he got 160mi to a tank. Where were you when we needed you, Djbugz? WHERE, I ASK?!

non-ethanol (87) vs. ethanol (93)