relocate the a/c condensor
01-08-2012, 09:25 AM
#1
relocate the a/c condensor
Why not? Anything that can increase direct air exposure to the radiator front will help with cooling.
Couldnt the a/c condenser be moved to another area and maybe even a small spal fan added to it to supply the air flow it needs ( which is not much).
Ideas?
Couldnt the a/c condenser be moved to another area and maybe even a small spal fan added to it to supply the air flow it needs ( which is not much).
Ideas?
01-08-2012, 09:51 AM
#2
Registered
Maybe you could mount it on the roof. You'd need to get longer hoses to connect it to the compressor, though, and also figure out the best place to drill holes to route those hoses. Don't forget to use grommets in the holes so the hoses don't get abraded.
Ken
Ken
01-08-2012, 12:49 PM
#3
instead of putting the cart before the horse, it may be a more wise idea to see how the AC condenser is actually impeding air flow, and the change in airflow with the condenser removed. For all we know that condenser could be unintentionally directing airflow to somewhere that is actually beneficial.
01-08-2012, 07:18 PM
#6
The air conditioning in the 8 is mediocre at best in extremely hot weather. A smaller condenser will not likely help this problem if anything it needs are larger more efficient condenser.
In the interest and spirit of the thread however, I suppose he could relocate it to the trunk area, but he would need some fab work to move the hot air outside the vehicle. May as well get a bigger condenser while your at it. Not to mention a serious fan(s) to get sufficient airflow across the condenser to remove the necessary heat to facilitate the cooling process. I don't think putting it on the bottom of the vehicle is a good idea just because of ground clearance. I mention that only because that is where we put them when we build Limo's.
01-09-2012, 10:07 AM
#7
true---but some of the Pettit guys have been running a/w intercoolers mounted in the pan with no problems?
It could work---but it may be too much trouble?
I was thinking that if you could just flip it downward --then maybe new lines etc may not be needed?
It could work---but it may be too much trouble?
I was thinking that if you could just flip it downward --then maybe new lines etc may not be needed?
01-09-2012, 12:34 PM
#10
Here's a way ...
http://corvaircenter.com/phorum/read...,387284,387306
Seriously? Where in the world would one find space for a sufficiently-sized condenser on an RX-8 other than where it's located now?
Running AC "on" with ambient 90 F will kick up the temp of water coming from the radiator by 10-20 deg F. Removing the condenser altogether will have a relatively minor effect by comparison.
http://corvaircenter.com/phorum/read...,387284,387306
Seriously? Where in the world would one find space for a sufficiently-sized condenser on an RX-8 other than where it's located now?
Running AC "on" with ambient 90 F will kick up the temp of water coming from the radiator by 10-20 deg F. Removing the condenser altogether will have a relatively minor effect by comparison.
01-09-2012, 01:05 PM
#12
Add some ducting.
Relocating the condenser would make it useless, and a plumbing nightmare. If you really have to fiddle with it, take the whole AC system away.
2 52mm holes with a holesaw on lower opening and 2 ducts will do the trick.
Relocating the condenser would make it useless, and a plumbing nightmare. If you really have to fiddle with it, take the whole AC system away.
2 52mm holes with a holesaw on lower opening and 2 ducts will do the trick.
01-09-2012, 01:34 PM
#13
Don't you think Mazda engineers considered all this when they placed it where they placed it? That's what engineers do. Particularly the engineers who manage to get hired over all the other engineers who applied for the same position and didn't. And particularly at a company known for its out-of-the-box engineering. After x years of production, the condensor would have been relocated if that would have improved the car. Not saying it's impossible to find a better location, just highly unlikely.
Last edited by New Yorker; 01-10-2012 at 01:11 PM.
01-09-2012, 01:46 PM
#14
Registered
i still think relocating it to the roof is the best solution. Avoids the problem of it being taken out by rocks, so you don't need the screen any more. That's a $100 saving right off the bat.
If it's mounted vertically, and tipped back a little, it would also serve as an air deflector for when you tow a trailer taller than the car.
Ken
If it's mounted vertically, and tipped back a little, it would also serve as an air deflector for when you tow a trailer taller than the car.
Ken
01-09-2012, 02:11 PM
#15
Don't you think Mazda engineers considered all this when they placed it where they placed it? That's what engineers do. Particularly the engineers who manage to get hired over all the other engineers who applied for the same position and didn't. And particularly at a company known for its out-of-the-box engineering. After x years of production, the condensor would have relocated if that would have improved the car. Not saying it's impossible to find a better location, just highly unlikely.
If you don't have anything smart to say, don't say anything at all
01-09-2012, 02:59 PM
#16
Registered
That lets me out, I guess. 
The reason Mazda puts the condensor in front of the radiator is because that's where everyone puts it. Not clever engineering...just the customary in-the-box configuration.
It takes a while for someone to think of something else, if at all. Thinking of open wheel race cars - how many years did they have the engine in the rear before it dawned on them (McLaren first, I think) that the radiator no longer had to be all the way in the nose?
Ken
The reason Mazda puts the condensor in front of the radiator is because that's where everyone puts it. Not clever engineering...just the customary in-the-box configuration.
It takes a while for someone to think of something else, if at all. Thinking of open wheel race cars - how many years did they have the engine in the rear before it dawned on them (McLaren first, I think) that the radiator no longer had to be all the way in the nose?
Ken
01-09-2012, 07:18 PM
#17
i agree with that.
No I dont have any heating problems at all. Mine is very stable and just where I want them. I just like to think. My wife rolls her eyes all the time.
If moving the a/c condensor has such a little affect--then why bother with the stuff behind the radiator? Seems to me the stuff in front of the radiator would have a bigger affect than what is behind it. Within reason of course.
No I dont have any heating problems at all. Mine is very stable and just where I want them. I just like to think. My wife rolls her eyes all the time.
If moving the a/c condensor has such a little affect--then why bother with the stuff behind the radiator? Seems to me the stuff in front of the radiator would have a bigger affect than what is behind it. Within reason of course.
01-09-2012, 08:29 PM
#18
Super Moderator
Don't you think Mazda engineers considered all this when they placed it where they placed it? That's what engineers do. Particularly the engineers who manage to get hired over all the other engineers who applied for the same position and didn't. And particularly at a company known for its out-of-the-box engineering. After x years of production, the condensor would have relocated if that would have improved the car. Not saying it's impossible to find a better location, just highly unlikely.
Could not agree with you more NY!
I constantly get astounded by those who believe they know more or best, most car companies have been doing it this way for decades.
IMO any relocation would be a nightmare logistically and then plumbing wise, remember high/low pressure pipes/hoses still have to get to under the dash to evaporator....then what about compressor efficiency if condenser was re-located say in the trunk?
I think the next best thing in car AC's will be electric compressors, smaller condensers and evaporators with greater effecency...where did I read about this...I think Toyota.
Electric Brakes are next.
Denny my mate...you have too much time on your hands...lol
01-09-2012, 08:33 PM
#19
Super Moderator
01-10-2012, 05:54 AM
#20
Ta da!...
Could not agree with you more NY!
I constantly get astounded by those who believe they know more or best, most car companies have been doing it this way for decades.
IMO any relocation would be a nightmare logistically and then plumbing wise, remember high/low pressure pipes/hoses still have to get to under the dash to evaporator....then what about compressor efficiency if condenser was re-located say in the trunk?
Could not agree with you more NY!
I constantly get astounded by those who believe they know more or best, most car companies have been doing it this way for decades.
IMO any relocation would be a nightmare logistically and then plumbing wise, remember high/low pressure pipes/hoses still have to get to under the dash to evaporator....then what about compressor efficiency if condenser was re-located say in the trunk?
The s1 engine has its quirks, the oil recommendations in the US are plain wrong, the oil pressure is too low, the water pump cavitates, the transmission doesn't last and I could go on.
The daily driving and track driving approaches to a car are also way different. I could understand somebody positioning the condenser flat with a naca duct on the underbelly to free some flow to the radiator, for track use in hot weather for instance.
Engineering is a trade off, just like everything in life.
So, in short... Mazda isn't the god some of the users think it to be and no, mazda doesn't know it all and doesn't always get it right.
01-10-2012, 01:07 PM
#22
Super Moderator
Not sure if you have , but go work in any new car franchise for a few years and you will see what some owners are really like....you see a glimmer here, but it is easy to talk..it is cheap...face to face, totally different....faults are always the car..never the owner.
My reference to "Condensers" was one of History....all (most) cars sold over the past 40 years have always had them in front of the radiator, apart from a rear engine car. I cant think of any car which has it different...but I am sure you will find one to continue the discussion.
I could understand somebody positioning the condenser flat with a naca duct on the underbelly to free some flow to the radiator, for track use in hot weather for instance.
Nothing in 'car air' has really changed, so why change it for so called better benefits....12+ car makers must all be wrong.
01-10-2012, 01:26 PM
#23
You are obviously referring to me, because you quoted me, I could also say there are just as many "who think" they also know. Mazda like all car companies design a car for all world markets. And yeah, no car is perfect, never has been, just like engineering nothing in cars is made to last forever...no owner is perfect either.
Not sure if you have , but go work in any new car franchise for a few years and you will see what some owners are really like....you see a glimmer here, but it is easy to talk..it is cheap...face to face, totally different....faults are always the car..never the owner.
My reference to "Condensers" was one of History....all (most) cars sold over the past 40 years have always had them in front of the radiator, apart from a rear engine car. I cant think of any car which has it different...but I am sure you will find one to continue the discussion.
..I really cant...not in a "normal RX-8"..it would be totally inefficient...more weight, more piping, more wiring.
Nothing in 'car air' has really changed, so why change it for so called better benefits....12+ car makers must all be wrong.
Not sure if you have , but go work in any new car franchise for a few years and you will see what some owners are really like....you see a glimmer here, but it is easy to talk..it is cheap...face to face, totally different....faults are always the car..never the owner.
My reference to "Condensers" was one of History....all (most) cars sold over the past 40 years have always had them in front of the radiator, apart from a rear engine car. I cant think of any car which has it different...but I am sure you will find one to continue the discussion.
..I really cant...not in a "normal RX-8"..it would be totally inefficient...more weight, more piping, more wiring.
Nothing in 'car air' has really changed, so why change it for so called better benefits....12+ car makers must all be wrong.
Denny is talking about his specific case. He's paranoid about radiator efficiency, not how cool his A\C will be after the mod.
I'm all for removing the A\C system completely. Easy weight reduction there... he's not set on that.
Cars have the A\C condenser there for packaging constraints and space limitation. We all agree that it is the most practical way to do so.
I use to blame the owner before the machine in general anyway... never had a problem doing so.
01-10-2012, 02:24 PM
#24
Super Moderator
I was really talking in general. I don't like the trend of "the manufacturer knows it all" sayers. Think about oil specs and the oil pressure on s1 engines.
Denny is talking about his specific case. He's paranoid about radiator efficiency, not how cool his A\C will be after the mod.
I'm all for removing the A\C system completely. Easy weight reduction there... he's not set on that.
Cars have the A\C condenser there for packaging constraints and space limitation. We all agree that it is the most practical way to do so.
I use to blame the owner before the machine in general anyway... never had a problem doing so.
Denny is talking about his specific case. He's paranoid about radiator efficiency, not how cool his A\C will be after the mod.
I'm all for removing the A\C system completely. Easy weight reduction there... he's not set on that.
Cars have the A\C condenser there for packaging constraints and space limitation. We all agree that it is the most practical way to do so.
I use to blame the owner before the machine in general anyway... never had a problem doing so.
'Packaging restraints'...jeez G everything is done because of restraints....or consumer reactions...or media reactions...how far do you want to philosophize.
01-10-2012, 02:29 PM
#25
I was just replying to your quote there. I don't want to philosophize but I, just like OD, use the car for another purpose, thus I taylor it to my needs.
Most good builders use tolerances different that what Mazda states to be optimal, use different procedures and parts etc.
Some even build PP engines with different port timing than what the Mazda SAE papers state! Again, we can accept a product "as is" and live with it or taylor it to our needs.
Most good builders use tolerances different that what Mazda states to be optimal, use different procedures and parts etc.
Some even build PP engines with different port timing than what the Mazda SAE papers state! Again, we can accept a product "as is" and live with it or taylor it to our needs.