Ajax

My car is in the shop for a second transmission rebuild that is being covered under warranty. I'm at just over 60k miles, though I started having problems at 58k this time (the last time at just over 30k). The issue I'm experiencing is that second gear would grind going into gear at high RPM. Previously, the same thing was happening with fourth.

My dealer just called me today saying that while they're still going to cover it under warranty, the technician believes that the AFE shifter is to blame. What he said was that the shifter is not traveling far enough when going into 2nd and 4th and the hubs are wearing out.

I do not want to create a panic or unnecessary fear/uncertainty/doubt, but this is happening and it MAY be related to the AFE shifter. I happen to have one of the very first runs of the AFE shifter and I know that changes were made to it. I don't know if any of these changes were made to address this, but, if you have one, and you have transmission problems, be sure to pull it out before you take in your car and if you're experiencing what I am, you may want to seriously consider removing it.

I know that when my car gets done this week, I will be pulling out the short throw and most likely replacing it with the mazdaspeed part or even the dreaded stock part.

I'll keep you all informed if anything else comes up.

Again, don't freak out. This is just what the dealer told me and they don't always get it right.

Ajax

Cattywampus

I have the AFE STS and it seemed to fix the reverse problem I had. No problems with gear shifts yet. I'll keep that in mind if I have those issues.

Ajax

Moved to correct forum...
Jeez I suck.

staticlag

I'm freaking out Ajax!

imput1234

iTrader: (6)

good thing I don't have one
yet

Ajax

I knew someone would..

I really enjoyed the short throw while it was in there. The shifts were super smooth.
Now I need to figure out what I did with my stock shifter and go back to that sloppy nonsense.

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

Never fear, Jedi is here!

I had my transmission replaced last year but I don't think it's related to the AFE SS. The grinding happened with the stock shifter, it just was more pronounced with the SS. (as one would expect with bad synchros)

I've seen a lot of transmissions replaced and YES, MANY of them had a SS but that's probably because this is one of THE most popular mods for M/T owners.

I slapped my SS in my new transmission a week after it was installed and I have been fine ever since!

turborx8

iTrader: (1)

The 2nd gear grind is not caused my the AFE SS.

I have the EXACT same problem and I have a stock tranny. The problem is Mazda decided to put the miata tranny in the RX8.

staticlag

Yeah but if they rebuilt it the first time then it might have been a rebuild error they are just noticing now.

RP's stuff is pretty high quality, I'm sure that something like this wouldn't be overlooked by him

staticlag

It really does irritate me that I've already had the tranny rebuilt once for 5th gear grinding. And its noisy as all heck now. I assume from the noisiness of my tranny (and my 300rwhp) that its days are numbered

mysql

how many of you with the shifting problems ran a GL5 fluid in the transmission, like maxgear?

Ajax

Well, the first time this happened to me, the tranny had just seen its 30k service and they put the wrong gear oil in my tranny as well as another member's. We both had rebuilds done at about the same time. I have no idea what they replaced beyond my 4th gear synchros that time.

Now they're wearing again. I had the short throw in there back then but only for about 6k miles. Now it has been in there for 36k and I'm having the same issues again.

If it really isn't because of the short throw, then what is really causing it?
The shop guys tell me that the transmission actually is very similar(but not the same) as the old miata transmission. They said they even refer to the miata rebuild documentation as well as the RX-8's when they do the RX-8 tranny because it has more real pictures (not just drawings).

I'm not knocking RP's shifter at all btw. It's a great piece and I've loved it since day 1. I'm just concerned and I wanted to make people aware of what is being said.
That said, I will most likely pull it out once I get the car back.

Ajax

I had problems after they did my 30k because of the wrong gear oil and now again just before 60k. I did just have the transmission fluid swapped and I had royal purple put in there.

turborx8

iTrader: (1)

I use RP maxgear 75w90. Are you suggesting that is what caused my grinding issue?

Max-Gear is recommended for use in truck, motor home / RV, and automotive front or rear differentials, manual transmissions, and lower gear units of marine engines that specify use of an API GL-5 or GL-4 fluid.

http://www.royalpurple.com/gear-oil.html

staticlag

I've used Redline since I've had maybe 6K on the odometer, it was one of my first mods. Changed it twice in 30K. then after my rebuild, I gave it a breaking in period of about 3K and I changed it to maxgear since thats the only thing I could find on short notice.

Ajax

oh, and i've only had maxgear in the transmission for 4000 miles. I got it done at 56.6k. I had issues with second at 58k, and they're telling me 4th is having the same kind of issues.

I don't honestly think 4000 miles is going to cause that much wear on a gear, but who knows.

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

***RAISES hand***

Won't be making that mistake again. Using Redline now

Ajax

So why is it a mistake?
What's the story?

staticlag

API Category GL-1 (inactive*) designates the type of service characteristic of manual transmissions operating under such mild conditions of low unit pressures and minimum sliding velocities, that untreated oil may be used satisfactorily. Oxidation and rust inhibitors, defoamers and pour depressants may be used to improve the characteristics of lubricants intended for this service. Friction modifiers and extreme pressure additives shall not be used.
API Category GL-2 (inactive*) designates the type of service characteristic of automotive type worm-gear axles operating under such conditions of load, temperature and sliding velocities, that lubricants satisfactory for API GL-1 service will not suffice.
API Category GL-3 (inactive*) designates the type of service characteristic of manual transmissions and spiral-bevel axles operating under mild to moderate to severe conditions of speed and load. These service conditions require a lubricant having load-carrying capacities greater than those that will satisfy APL GL-1 service, but below the requirements of lubricants satisfying the API GL-4 service.
API Category GL-4 designates the type of service characteristic of spiral-bevel and hypoid gears in automotive axles operated under moderate speeds and loads. These oils may be used in selected manual transmission and transaxle applications.
API Category GL-5 designates the type of service characteristic of gears, particularly hypoids in automotive axles under high-speed and/or low-speed, high-torque conditions. Lubricants qualified under U.S. Military specification MIL-L-2105D (formerly MIL-L-2015C), MIL-PRF-2105E and SAE J2360 satisfy the requirements of the API GL-5 service designation.
API Category GL-6 (inactive*) designates the type of service characteristic of gears designed with a very high pinion offset. Such designs typically require (gear) score protection in excess of that provided by API GL-5 gear oils. The original API GL-6 test equipment is obsolete.
API Category MT-1 designates lubricants intended for non-synchronized manual transmissions used in buses and heavy-duty trucks. Lubricants meeting API MT-1 provide protection against the combination of thermal degradation, component wear, and oil seal deterioration which is not provided by lubricants meeting only the requirements of API GL-4 and API GL-5.
MIL-PRF-2105E this specification released in 1995 combines the performance requirements of its predecessor (MIL-L-2105D) and API MT-1. MIL-PRF-2105E maintains all existing chemical/physical requirements, stationary axle test requirements, field test requirements and data review by the Lubricants Review Institute that were required under MIL-L-2105D. It also adds the stringent oil seal compatibility and thermal durability test requirements under API MT-1. MIL-PRF-2105E has been re-written as SAE Standard J2360.
SAE J2360 standard is a new global quality standard that defines a level of performance equivalent to that defined by MIL-PRF-2105E, a U.S. military standard for approval that was not available to oil blenders in all parts of the world. It includes all of the most recent axle and transmission testing requirements identified in API GL-5, API MT-1, and MIL-PRF-2105E including the need to demonstrate proof-of-performance through rigorous field testing.

Razz1

If you search you will find threads that say the viscocity of some tranny fluids don't work because they are too slippery.

In other words the oil does not stick enough to the gears. It falls off so fast thats why metal to metal wear occurs causing a breakdown in the syncro's.

turborx8

iTrader: (1)

Would switching my oil to redline improve it or is it too late?

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

RP is a great company but some people's transmission simply didn't care for it. Would the failure have ocurred with a different oil? Maybe... no one will ever know.

If you look at an 04 / 05 owner's manual, mazda recommends GL-4 or GL-5.
New owner's manuals only list GL-4. hmmm...

(according to what mazda showed me when a friend had issues with his transmission)

Ajax

Interesting.
And this could happen in only a short period of time?
This makes me wish I did the fluid swap myself rather than letting my oil change place do it. They recommended RP after I requested it for the engine oil.
Bah..

Oh well..
Dealer is fixing it now. If this really is the issue, why would the dealer say that the shifter isn't allowing the hubs to engage far enough?

turborx8

iTrader: (1)

The only reason I use RP is because there is a huge thread on here that is full of people that love it and have tried redline but prefer RP.

****!

Ajax

If you're really having problems with a gear, call Paul at mazmart or just PM mazmart here and ask him to try and get you a used, low mileage tranny and do a swap. That's what I was doing originally until the dealer told me they'd do it under warranty.

Paul had me quoted 900 for a 20k mile transmission and another 400 for a swap from rotary performance. Paul sold that transmission though and he didn't have any in stock last I checked.

1300 is a lot better than 2800 for parts and labor.