SpeedForceRacing-326WHP with dyno chart
 

We just finished our Black project car and we managed to get 326 at the wheels on a Dyno Dynamics.And 240 ft/lbs of torque to boot.Seehow flat the torque curve is :ylsuper: Here is the dyno chart.http://www.speedforceracing.com/imag...it/rx8_1_6.jpg

WOW, IT SEEMS TO BE ...... PRetty IMPRESSIVE !

but , may I ask what kind of equipment u guys have ?

looking good.

Nice. Also isn't the dyno dynamics usually register even lower hp then even Mustang dynoes.

Just visited your homepage 7500 for the kit :Eyecrazy:

The car is equipped with the SFR turbo system(non ball-bearing).SFR testpipe and a Borla 3" cat-back. Thats it. Nothing else. Running at 9 psi of boost.

Torque Monster for sure

but as I can see in the picture, gotta relocate some of the stuff (battery, for example)

Hmm .... pretty costly, but ahh if it adds like more than 100 hp/tq .... I guess .. hmmm

The battery relocation kit comes with the system.We make a super nice aluminum battery box that mounts in the trunk and then we supply you with new ground and power cables.The test car dynoed at 175hp and 125 ft/lbs at the wheels so we added 151 horsepower and 115 ft/lbs of torque at the wheels.We also have an even bigger intercooler and turbo option that we havent tested as of yet :Eyecrazy:

Nice numbers man. I bet it's a quick SOB :).

headsnapper for sure...nice...just for kicks...why a non-ball bearing..i'm guessing a T04b?..those like lower oil pressures and less oiling...that the main reason?...or just it's overall scalability? I mean don't get me wrong..i think it's great i'm just wondering your reasons behind putting one in...

$7500 seems like a lot to put out all at once, and no way I could have saved up enough to drop that kind of dough, but really I think its fairly reasonable. Assuming they're using a standalone EMS. If they're still using the emanage, then it is a bit expensive.

Over time I've spent over that on mods for my 8 and still don't have that kinda hp. If you look at turbo kits for other cars its really an average price for a good kit. The price of the Greddy turbo has just spoiled us. But I don't think the Greddy kit is as good quality as this kit, and definitely won't make this kinda power. Its my experience that if you want that kind of power, you're going to have to spend that kind of money (except maybe if you go the NOS route). Unless you own a Mustang and can get 20hp from a set of headers. But it all depends on what you want.

My only complaint is that its not a ball bearing turbo.

SFR could we get some more details about the turbo your using? What kind is it and what's the trim? Also, what kind of engine management are you using?

doesn't the car rev to 9k+ rpm? You seem to be missing ~1150 RPM

Detonation or just lifted early?

EDIT: Just realized this was a :repost: with a picture and that the question was answered already.

It is a Turbonetics turbo. TO4E with a 57 trim. The hotside specs is our little secret :yesnod: The engine management is from Injection Perfection and it is basically a TSI unit.The same thing Ric Shaw uses.It controls timing,fuel,boost,it can control NOS,etc....It controls the injectors and ignition timing directly without using the Mass-air sensor to do your fueling corrections.It has a 22 psi MAP sensor in it for accurate pressure measurements.Very nice system and it is as close to stand alone as you can get without having to build a harness,rewire the car,etc.......

Because it does so much , it costs alot which is why the price ofthe turbo kit is up there.But hey if you want to run your own EMS system and figure out your fueling requirements, then you can save alot of money and buy a tuner kit.
:shocking:

What is the price for the tuner kit?

It's on the website

Dang nice gains. Do you planning to take that 8 to a track...it wold be cool for the customer to not only see a dyno but the real world application on a track. Just...so we could hear and see what those numbers could do.

By the way, anyone know what type of whp Adrian-1 is hitting? He just got a 13.1 in the 1/4 mile and we could use his greddy turbo to estimate/guestimate what the SFR Turbo could do.

There are so many different variables involved... i would think its just better to wait till an SFR turbo kit owner shows 1/4 mile times.

OR... just for kicks, you could use this
http://www.rx7.com/accel_calculator.html

-hS

Cool...that looks pretty fun, now is that whp or flywheel?

...and what do they mean shifts vs gear?

Like...how many shifts to 60mph and what gear....I don't understand that part??

Yeah, why not rev it all the way up?

Just to piggy back on this, with such a big difference in power, I'm sure the car would be at least from 0.4-0.7 sec faster, but traction would be the biggest problem. Traction for a tuned GReddy turbo'd car is bad enough, I can't imagine what it would be like with this sucker.

Ya, but there's things that can be done to help with that. Stickier tires would be the biggest. Vivid also makes some traction bars, but I don't know how well they work.

Yes, I am a novice in rotary engine technology...
I don't understand why the HP/Torque peaks at 7200 and then peters out...
So really, from 7200 to 9500 is pretty much useless.... is this correct?
They've turned our rotary into "acting like" a piston engine,
except there's no appreciable grunt off the line...

I don't get it (stupid is as stupid does)?!

"peters out"???

WTF. Its still putting down 320HP when the dyno chart ends. I wish I "petered out" above 300whp.

haha, Dont we all!

Whao, and this is actually for sale. Interesting.

I imagine its gotta be difficult to size a turbo to work at maximum efficiency throughout such a wide rev range. On any engine, if you want it to spool fast and give lots of low end torque, you usually have to sacrafice some up top. If you want lots up top, then you have to sacrifice spool time and low end torque. With modern turbo's this effect can be greatly mitigated, but it will be somewhat magnified in a rotary since it has such a large cfm range.

So if you want it to hold power till 9krpms stick a bigger turbo on there, but realize your not going to spool up to full boost until 4,5,6... k rpms.

I think I soiled myself

If you got this kit with the Inter-X you still would save $500...so why are we getting your EMS again?

No offense, thank you for working on this and making a product for the RX8!!!!

Also...did I miss it or did you explain why you messured this at 7.2K? I would think you could make more power at a higher RPM or is there a huge drop off or something?

Please explain...us newbs need to know.

If you got this kit with the Inter-X you still would save $500...so why are we getting your EMS again?


For starters.......you could have already had this kit a year ago if you bought a tuner kit.The big problem is everybody and there brother said this kit doesnt make power,we are lying about our claims,we dont know what we are doing,we are idiots,Greddy is the best,etc...........So now we make the power and all of a sudden,hey you can buy this kit and use interceptor X.Why didnt anybody do it sooner? Actually there were quite a few guys that did because they realized the potential of this system right away.Unfortunately, the majority of the masses thought it was impossible to do what we did and provide a real dyno chart.One of our customers seen similiar results with an Emanage but his Emanage is not working right so he is not gettng the smooth idle and drivability that we have.

If you do the math you wont be saving $500 because you still need to get injectors with the interceptor X because we dont provide injectors with the tuner kit.Then add in a boost control solenoid and I dont think you will save anything.On top of that the EMS we supply you is tuned for this application.Sure you might need a little fine tuning for your particular mods but you dont have to tune from scratch so you will save money on dyno time too.



No offense, thank you for working on this and making a product for the RX8!!!!

Also...did I miss it or did you explain why you messured this at 7.2K? I would think you could make more power at a higher RPM or is there a huge drop off or something?



Well you can see that the power starts to drop off at 7850.If I remember correctly at 8500 rpm it is below 290WHP so there is really no use revving it any higher because you are out of the powerband.It is not uncommon for most cars to make peak power before redline and this car is no different.I think some of it has to do with the butterfly system and the fact that this rotary is not as efficient at 9000 rpms.To summarize........if we are making really good power without revving the crap out of the motor, then it means there will be more reliability to the end user.The stress on the motor at 9000 and 10,000 rpms is much greater then at 8000 rpms. :angel: :angel:

and less stress on the tranny :)

I see...my mistake, thanks.

SFR...OK, I understand now...thanks. (about the 7.2K thing).

Thanks for the hard work...at 9psi that's pretty dang impressive.

Nice results.

What is the larger turbo you guys are going with? I'm assuming that would be to continue climbing with power towards redline?

Does you EMS function like the Interceptor? Or does it manipulate the code like the Emanage? If it functions like the Interceptor, I'm curious how it doesn't trip the "too rich" CEL.

I'm pretty sure that is Wheel Horse Power.

Shifts (i believe) is referring to the number of shits in your 1/4 mile - essentially this reflects gear ratios. I am pretty sure on our car it should be around 4 shifts

Gear is referring to weather or not its a 5 or 6 or 7 speed transmission.

If you want a definete answer, you can just call Rotary Performance and ask them for yourself. Their phone number should be up on the website.
-hS

Unless you do like Porsche in the new 911 Turbo and use variable turbine geometry system to improve flexibility... http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=3253

Thanks rkostolni for your helpful explaination, now I don't feel like such a
"rotary retard" :Eyecrazy:
Al

very interesting. good job SFR.

dd sends...

Thanks! I re-did it and that calculator looks pretty dang accurate.

It "looks like" your setup on an 8 would get us into the mid 12's which is just amazing. I know I know, there are alot of factors (driver, grip, reaction time, weather , modded 8 weight, etc etc) but my goal of 300whp for the RX8 would honestly be more than enough for me.

Gearing - I don't think they are talking about how many your vehicle has - a 4 spd can have the same gear ratios as a 5spd or 6 spd...they are more likely referring to your final drive gear ratio...the RX-8 is 4.44.

Unfortunately, there's a lot of history with SFR and the forum. Most of it is water under the bridge now. But, you're right. There are a lot of doubters here.

Low 13's is pretty easily attainable nowadays. While I haven't gotten a time slip yet, I'd be willing to bet I'm almost there. STi's are supposed to run mid to low 13's and I'm beating them - even though they are really tough to beat off the line with that AWD.

AMEN Charles, I agree 100%!

It's so cool how people doubted the RX8 and now it's making huge power gains and it's also lovely to see the aftermarket for the RX8 blossom into what we have today. No...not perfect and honestly still pricy for me but once my 8 is paid off I'm glad there will be several options to make the 8 faster and better overall.

I think there has been a turning point on this fourm. Ever since the interceptor has produced power gains it seemed to open the flood gates in the minds of the people on this forum. Power is possible and we now know that 300+ whp is much more attainable then we believed 6 months ago. Now the next obsicle is to make the general tuner population to realize what we are slowly realizing, meaning that the 8 is a fast car. I like the idea that we wont have to stay in the twisties to win anything. We now can have some grunt and as of this moment this is the most powerful kit we can buy.

How big is the piping on this kit?

That won't be for a while for some of us. (Dang trade-in roll over)!!!

Congrats SFR. Now go to the track and scare people.

I second that!!!:rock:

To further hijack...Charles, how much does the OEM PPF weigh?

Charles...keep up the good work.

....and NOW...back...to yada yada yada

Charles, do you have access to finite element analysis software, or would that even help? We have AlGor at work, and things are fairly slow for the moment.

Thanks Charles for your support.I feel your pain since we have been through it on these boards just like you.The piping for the RX-8 turbo system is 3" intake. 2" turbo to intercooler and 2.5" to 3" intercooler to throttlebody.

Lemme guess, the "Machinery's Handbook"? ;)

Yeah, it's probably the additional cost of aluminum, the additional cost of welding (or is there any welding, I don't know), etc. Mazda designs cars with a price point in mind just like everyone else, and if you've gotta carry more weight to save money, the bottom center of the car is probably the best place to do it.

If you have an autocad model of your 3 proposed designs, I could analyze them and you could see the weak spots like this, then change materials or design until you reduce the stress to an acceptable level.

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/349/socketl6ow.gif

We use algor for huge ball valves, but we've also done steel brackets. The president of the company has waterfront property and needed some special kind of brackets for his bulkhead. :P

Of course, if your designs need to remain classified, that's cool too. :)