tokenbrit

Sorry to start a new thread on this guys, but I, (like most other owners I guess) would initially like to free up the extra horses that are tied up in my ECU (emissions control etc..). Is there any way I can just get my unit reflashed to max hp (maxdaspeed ECU? - not necessarily from my country). This would mean utilising a friendly dealer/garage I guess (or somebody that has access to the appropriate kit and/or downloads). I would willingly pay, and travel within the U.K. Unfortunately I have a U.K. spec. 6sp and the ECU is pretty much tamper proof. Any ideas anybody?? There must be a way to free the horses that the car was initially designed for...

dcfc3s

Look for the thread on the Greddy E-manage fuel computer - you can use that to tune your factory ECU to your heart's content.

Matter of fact -
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...threadid=17055

Dale

robertdot

Or Canzoomer.

"Tamper proof" is relative to how much work you want to do. If you can't even get to the ECU, you can't install any aftermarket ECU fixes. I've never seen the UK Spec cars, let alone what protection they put on the ECU. First, I'd spend some time trying to figure out how to un-do the "tamper proofing." There has to be a way to get in, because Mazda still needs to get in if it breaks.

There was a thread on this somewhere. They might have figured it out. You might want to run a search to find it.

tokenbrit

Cheers guys. I am aware of Greddy & Canzoomer. I am a little reluctant to add a 'piggy-back' controller (at this stage anyway). I was trying to work out if it was possible to upload a different mazda engine management map to my factory ECU tho. After all; you don't need access to the actual ECU to change it's code if you have the right kit do you? The mazdaspeed version would be good (if anybody can get hold of it), ot at-least closer to the 250hp the engine was originally designed for (currently 230). Surely the upload process into the factory ECU isn't that hard...

robertdot

The ECU is upgraded through the CAN / ODBII port that is located under the dash where the steeringwheel meets the dash. If you look under there you can see it. It's a big long plug... at least that is where the US one is.

The reason I suggested a piggyback unit is because 1) You need the Mazda program to flash the ECU and 2) You need the Mazdaspeed / JSpec flash.

I've not done any research, but I imagine these aren't easy to come by. If they are, I'd LOVE to find out where to get them. At any rate, unless you have a really really friendly service department at your Mazda dealer, you are probably SOL on that front.

But, if you can get the parts, I hear it only takes about 10 minutes to do the work. After getting the M flash, I can confirm that it is a quick process.

Canzoomer's mission statement with the CZ1 was to make an easy to add / remove solution that cost roughly the same amount as the US HP loss refund ($500 USD) and give back the missing ~30 HP.

Given the two choices, I think I'd rather have a piggy back unit than a flash that isn't supported by local dealers. Mainly because, if you flash the ECU yourself, you probably will void your warranty. The piggyback unit will also void your warrenty, but you can pull it off fairly easily without any traces. I guess you could re-flash your ECU back to whatever it was before, but if you don't actually have the hardware, you won't be able to.

Just my thoughts. The ECU flash would be cool, but the piggy back kit is a reasonable option.

But if you are really "locked out" of your ECU "compartment", then the ECU flash might be better for you. So... whatever floats your boat.

dcfc3s

I imagine at some point tuners will be offering ECU reflashes, but as of now there aren't any. It'll take time for people to learn the ECU's software and learn how to write code for it and tune it. That's a serious undertaking!

Dale

tokenbrit

This is what I was looking for guys.

http://www.accessecu.com/products/accessport.html

Now I only have to wait until it's ready....

Japan8

The J-spec flash is reported to put out no more power than the US flash. Dynos very various tuners have produced similar results to those of US tuners.

Actually flashing the ECU is probably the best solution, and is the one that most if not all tuners in Japan are using. THe problem is... where do you get this tool from and how much does it cost??

monzter

I had something similar to what you posted above with my last vehicle a Harley F-150. It was called the Predator and it was made by DiabloSport. It came preprogrammed with a couple of tunes that you could "re-flash" your ECU with. It plugged right into the OBDII port. You can then either get it custom tuned at the dyno, or a vendor could e-mail you a tune that you downloaded to the tuner and uploaded onto your ECU. Pretty neat unit. Best part was that if you were going in for service, all you did was re-flash your ECU with the stock tune. If they come out with something like this for the 8 I would definitely be interested.

RobDickinson

Your looking at 20bhp maximum from messing around with stock ECU maps (228bhp to japans 250ps).

For that you need to decrypt the ECU , modify etc al, and hide this from mazda to keep the warrenty. Oh and do it all again every time mazda come out with a new flash which fixes something else.

Whilst nothing like this is impossible its still fairly hard work, and you dont know if mazda have actualy put decent encryption onto the thing.

I'm sure the UK cars can be piggybacked, but it may require more work and/or different solution to other cars. Piggyback or replacement ECU is a prefered choice for tuning IMO.

With the UK's extra security modifying this may invalidate your warranty and seriously affect your insurance in the event of a theft - so idealy whatever mod needs to be invisible or removable. I know CZ's mod is meant to fit into the ECU housing, same/similar mod but fitted externaly may be worth a look.

IMo a lot of work/expence for 20bhp isnt worth it, I'd only bother if I wher aiming a bit higher. 40-50 should give the car a bit extra push.

tokenbrit

The way I see it is that you need access to the ECU to get any significant gains at-all. Just by changing the ECU, you should free up 20+ hp. If you change the Air Intake/Exhaust or add some kind OF F.I. you could add a LOT more. The trouble is, I don't feel that doing mechanical mods will be worth it unless you can tweak the ECU too to make the most of them. I am sure I could get a 'piggy back' unit to work, but I would kind-of like to use the original ECU. You can always change it back to stock for servicing etc.. if you want to with the AccessECU. Thats why I like the idea of it so much...

Japan8

The Japanese tune of 250ps is just like the US 247hp then 238hp... not true. The flash is at least named different from the US... but power output has been repeatedly dynoed as the same as everyone has been getting in the US.

Blitz (who is developing a S/C kit) reports a dyno of about 180ps.

Trust/GReddy reports an increase of 60-70ps for 268ps with their turbo kit underdvelopment. That makes the base in the 198ps - 208ps range.

Don't ask me how, because I have no idea, but it seems that just about ALL Japanese tuners do reflashes only, not piggybacks. So they have somehow managed to "decrypt" the ECU. I do agree that getting your tune reflashed by mazda when you take your car in is a pain, but it can be worked around with a little creativity.

Getting caught with an ECU mod vs getting caught with a t/c or s/c under the hood... which one has a higher chance of happening? IF you want to keep your warranty, you are limited in what you can do for 4 years. 20hp increase is the greatest of all mods currently available and is enough to be noticable. Combine it with a mid-pipe and some kind of intake improvement (VFAD and free flow box filter or the short arm with cone fliter) will make the increase just that much more.

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

I think anyone who is concerned with warranty issues ought to just give up on the idea of messing with anything that is not of a bolt-on variety. Hence, the Canzoomer ECU is probably the best bet. In the meantime, I would like that product which gives me the performance that I am seeking. Here's a thought; how about being open and honest, along with reasonable, with your service advisor and see if they respect you for that by rewarding you with coverage even though mods were performed? I know my advisor takes care of me and appreciates the fact that I keep him posted on the latest news thanks to the information I receive from this very website.

Charles

Japan8

And what if they refuse Charles? What do you do then? Try another dealer? And if the 3 Mazda's in your town all refuse, then what? From the sounds of things... people's experiences, this looks like a very real possiblity.

If people knew that being honest and upfront with them would (not could) workout, then I think everyone would do it.

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

My only response is that direct honesty has always worked for me. My guess is that maybe it happens so infrequent that when a person in a position of decision-making authority is confronted with forthrightness they feel compelled to respect it and respond in kind. The day I took delivery of my 8 I told my salesperson that I intended on modifying the car. He was aghast that I would drive it home and begin the upgrades. My seeming lack of concern regarding warranty issues probably changed the personal dynamics. When I rolled the car in for some recall work two of the four service advisors, and a handful of mechanics, came out to see what the cool rumbling sound was. When I began talking about what I had done, and what I plan to do, they were all intersted in talking about the RX. Many of the people who work at the dealership cannot afford the car or the mods so they get to live vicariously through our experiences. Don't play them for fools, rather, develop a friendship with them and maybe buy a pizza once in a while and see how they have a hard time saying "No" to you. I recall reading a post where someone brought in a handful of tee-shirts to give away and the crew were ecstatic. Anyway, that's how I do things. To each their own.

Charles

Japan8

What you described is the way I like to do things. It's the way my father does them as well. But as his project is long long out of warranty, that part isn't an issue. However, his experience with the dealers... sucks. He takes his car to a Mustang Perfomance shop to have all work done. Sometimes they give him install freebies and my father buys the guys beer. My aunt does the same with her BMW... particularly because the dealer is trying to rape people on both parts and labor. Anyway, the point is that I do understand where you are coming from... it just seems like it is difficult or rare to have that relationship with a dealer vs speciality shop.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Canzoomer piggy-back cant be used easily on EU cars because of the tamper-proofed ECU box.

RobDickinson

But I'm sure it and other systems can be modified to fit somwhere, its just CZ's mod has been designed to live inside the ecu housing.

I brought this up on this forum just as a heads up - unaware buyers would spend a lot of cash on something they would struggle to fit, and couldnt return easily.

If you kow what your getting into and are prepaired I'm sure you could do something.

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

Well, J8, in the future I shall consider myself lucky for having a decent dealer team who treat me well.

Charles