blu3dragon

iTrader: (1)

I was at Thunderhill with PCA-GGR last weekend and had a ton of fun. This was my 2nd time on track in the RX-8 and my first time driving it at Thunderhill. It was also the first time I have driven at this track and not experienced any brake fade, what a revelation that is compared to my car last year.

I did a couple of 2:21.8 laps on the Saturday. Here is one of them:


Things started out wet on the Sunday, and I found out I need more practice at throttle control in a rear wheel drive car...

yomomspimp06

what are you using to show telemetry?

j9fd3s

scary place to spin! thunderhill is fun, though, and in the rain you should have learned a lot about car control/being smooth.

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

I am not a fan of having the camara outside the car. I like to hear the motor and tires instead of the wind.

Here is my T-Hill. T-15 spin in the rain, second lap on video.
With minimal mods and nto1's you should be able to get under 2:12. Looks like your over slowing the car and turning in a little too much too early which is hurting your ability to go full throttle as early.

Good pads and fluid should yield no brake fade when driven correctly.

blu3dragon

iTrader: (1)

An Aim Solo DL to get the data, and Race Render to overlay it on the video.
https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-racing-...alysis-244151/

Yes indeed, fortunatly I avoided the wall and the following car avoided me. I had thoughts of both as I spun around and took a few breaths in the pits to clear my head before heading back out.

I agree, I apologize for the awful noise and I like to see what my hands are doing as well. I have not figured out a good way to mount it inside yet.

Interesting, It's good to have a time to aim for and thanks for the tips. I know I have more work to do on the driver. I'll have suspension next time I am out and will be very happy if I can get close to 2:12 with that and some driver improvements.

blu3dragon

iTrader: (1)

Wow, that was a lot closer than I got. Looks like you did touch the tires. Very tricky turn in the wet as all that paint makes it much narrower than in the dry.

kster

Glad you spun before the start of the pit wall. At that corner, if ever go two wheels off on exit, just keep driving straight (into the dirt). Some 8-10 years ago at a Speedventures event, I remember a new E46 M3 went two wheels off on the exit of T15 and ended up hitting the pit wall nose first, totaling the car.

A 2:12 on R-compounds (with the cyclone) is a good goal. Getting into the 2:09s is much tougher though.

j9fd3s

we put it in the upper right corner, with a wide angle lens.


or you can go two cameras...

there is tons of room for improvement in the lap times. i'd pick a couple of safe corners, like turn 2 and try to just increase your speed.

i saw that with a new mustang, the mustang ended up about a 4'x4'x8' cube!

blu3dragon

iTrader: (1)

Watching that first video you posted, I need more practice for sure. Right now if I even make half the correction in a single turn that he does on every corner I'm backing off and looking for a clean pair of pants after the session.

j9fd3s

actually Mario is driving in the first vid, and Tommy is driving in the second. Mario is all elbows, and Tommy looks like he's going to the grocery store, or to sleep...

which one is faster?

Tommy.

smooth = fast.

additionally the car actually reacts to steering inputs, Mario complains about it being twitchy, but you can kind of see (its really apparent at sears in turn 1, if you watch a couple other videos) that his "twitchy" is the car actually reacting to his input.

etzilon

Let's not forget!

kbrewmr2

not alot of people driving a rain line... is the pavement that new that it hasn't developed yet?

blu3dragon

iTrader: (1)

To be honest, I am not at the level of being able to experiment with very different lines in the wet, nor did I have the time to do so. I was avoiding the kerbs, and by doing so, the outside tires are off the normal line at the apex and exit. Highway8 is even further away from the kerbs in his video.

Actually, with street tires, I am not sure you want to be too far off line or that there is the space to do so in a car. I do have different experience with karting, where the wet line is basically to avoid the dry line as much as possible during braking and cornering.

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

A fairly good artical on driving in the rain.

For me the main objective is to be smooth, find grip and finish the turn asap so i can get back on the gas.

Racing In The Rain - Art Of Racing In The Rain - Modified Magazine

bse50

Come on, most people never get to drive around a track in the rain... it takes a fair amount of experience and patience to master some wet skills

A simple trick to learn how to properly set up a turn in the wet is to imagine a different shape for said turn in your head.
You want to be slow in, fast out. Especially if it's a tight corner. By fast out I don't mean immediately after the turn. I mean at the end of the straight AFTER the turn!

If you turn later and close the turn earlier you'll have a longer straight ahead of you. With limited traction that's an advantage. The lines in Highway8's link are what i'm referring to

I made my mistakes during this video but after 3:42 you can really see some rain falling:

blu3dragon

iTrader: (1)

Interesting, thanks for the tips. I was sort of doing some of it, but now I have a clearer picture in my mind of what I should be doing next time... More focus on learning to drive in the wet is the main thing. I only had 1 wet session this last weekend and really just went out there to have some fun and learn some car control without thinking too much about my line. I'll be more focused next time, although that probably won't happen until next winter now.

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

A few tips on car seat up in the rain. If your on stock suspension, you dont really need to do anything except. Maybe drop your tire pressure. Dont go overboard, remember the are not getting as hot and therefore the hot pressures will already be much lower with the same cold pressure.

If you have a stiff suspension, its best to disconnect the sway bars. If you have a lot of negative camber, you should take a little out and increase your tires contact patch.

TANKERG

I have to disagree with lowering tire pressure. You should be at least the minimum 32, unless you meant lower than a dry track day. If you are below minimum the water will not track out of the treads the way they are designed to.

bse50

You actually raise your tyre pressure in the rain.

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

Lower hot pressure is what i mean. Advantage is more give, or effectivly lowering the spring rate which makes the car more forgiving in the rain.

bse50

If you want the car to be more forgiving in the rain you unbolt the sway bars!
Tyres have to work as tyres, not as springs. A lower inflation temperature means less ability to drain water because of closer treads.

I made your same mistake at a couple of events because some racer noticed me and corrected the issue. My mechanic also confirmed this and called me a dumbass after I called him for confirmation.

kbrewmr2

yep - soften the suspension other ways, you want the tire firmed up as much as possible

MadCat360

The only rule for driving in the wet is to drive on the parts that are least wet.

Sometimes that means slingshotting around the outside, sometimes that means driving a normal dry line.

That said, the places that are not rubbered in are usually the places with the least standing water and subsequently the most grip. Water pools on flat surfaces, and rubbered in track is pretty flat.

The best thing to do is go walk a track when it's raining. You'll find out how slippery the rubber line is when you walk on it, and immediately slip and fall over.

TANKERG

Also, a higher gear than in the dry can help too. Not as fast, but that's what you're going for

kbrewmr2

and that effect is more pronounced on older pavement

last two places I've driven in the wet were COTA about a month ago, and MSR-Cresson about a year ago. Cresson - highly HIGHLY pronouced rain line, old medium quality pavement with lots of use - best grip & times (Traqmate for real-time feedback) if you ran about 1.0-1.5 car widths off the dry line. COTA - no rain line, brand new top notch pavement and it's barely been used thus far - drive the dry line on wet tires and hang on.