RX8 beats S2000 & 350Z in March 04 Motortrend!
 

I just picked up the new March 2004 Motortrend and the RX-8 was placed 1st overall over the S2000 and 350Z. I hope next year or the following year the relase a Mazdaspeed turbocharged RX8 it will look great in my garage next to my FD:D

Where did u get March '04 motortrend

Borders Bookstore here in New York.

Shit! It ain't even Feburary yet! WTF?

Managed to skim through the mag in the bookstore today. All three cars match fairly closely performance wise, toss up really, they gave it to the RX-8. Depends what you really like and need out of your car, that is the right choice..

"In some regards, the RX-8 is a small exoticar with marvelous engineering innovations. "

Rotary Nut, dude, that was kinda funny (lol)

agreed
 

At least we agree on this!!!!

Yeah i read that article... GOD made RX-8 ...it is the best sports car out right now... even though its slower.. it still wins.. i drove one man i didn't want the test drive to end.

Imagine how better it would be with 50 more horses... man it would give corvette and 911's a run for its money...

RX-8 isn't faster... buts its a better sports car of the 3. PERIOD.

Also in the article ...
They compare top of the line 350Z... TRACK MODEL
Top of the line S2000
BASE RX-8 with no sport suspension and it STILL won.. "our tester wasn't even the sport suspension equipped version."

1.) RX-8 - $26,680
2.) 350Z - $34,180
3.) S2000- $32,800

The interior in the rx-8 was base-trim... and it was better then 350Z well-equipped..

"Magical Mazda".. haha hell YEAH

"sport suspension"? if it's the 6MT model the "sport" suspension is standard. they did test the manual right?

Sport Suspension?? hmmm... RX-8 only come with one kind of suspension doesn't it? S2000 too, only one suspension... 350Z in the other hand got track package and all ...

IMO, performance wise, rx8 really can't compete with S2000... but the extra two seat, suicide door, great interior, exterior design, unique rotary engine is probably what won RX-8 first place.

If it was BEST Performance Sport car... i think (IN MY OPINION) S2000 deserve that spot. but if it was BEST overall Sport Car, then RX-8 deserve the spot.

.....and if it was UGLIEST interior... 350Z definitely holds a strong first place, in that case! =)

Yeah, if the 8 is a 6sp, then it's a "standard suspension," but compared to the auto I guess it is sort of a "sport" suspension.

Yeah, I also think the 8 is slightly out of place there with 2-seaters. Kind of odd. Especially the S2k, as that is about as pure a sports car as you can get.

Either way 13-B... I'd have to agree with you on all accounts. :)

Every one is going to treat this differently. I am sure the guys on my350z are screaming bloody murder because the Z beat the 8 on the performance tests. There are so many variable, it all depends on which is more important, and everyone is different.

BTW, aren't all 6MT equipped with the "Sport Suspension" and all AT not?

I thought only the Sport and Gt models have sport suspension

The Z guys are crying but I think they should be used to it by now.

Rx-8 vs 350Z vs Monaro (Gto)

http://www.drive.com.au/news/article...XB1MMNXHD.html

a few highlights:


Fuel economy still appears to be something of a rotary bugbear, though. Our RX-8 drank 14.1 litres of premium per 100km, which was bad enough to put it behind the significantly heavier and more powerful Monaro. Not quite enough, though, to put the kiss of death on the most exhilarating and enjoyable engine here.

Sealing it for the Mazda is ride quality, which quietly soaks up most surface uglies without drawing them to the attention of the occupants, making it a good option for long journeys. It does this while maintaining a strict sense of handling discipline and control, which makes it the top choice for drivers who want the best of both worlds.

Sealing the win for the Mazda is its classy, non-conformist design, good ergonomics, impressive build quality and unmatched sense of occasion Our choice is the RX-8 because it caters to both requirements without compromise. It performs strongly and handles better than the Monaro and is more practical and comfortable to live with than the Zed, thanks to its adventurous door system.


from edmunds.com 350Z vs rx-8

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/compa...9/page003.html

Although most editors agreed that the RX-8 would be just as good with two less doors and a more traditional shape, no one was complaining after experiencing the car from the driver seat. With its lightweight feel, incredibly smooth power delivery and stylish cabin, the RX-8 offers a combination of performance and comfort that few sports cars can match. Its personality doesn't overwhelm you at first, but spend any amount of time behind the wheel and the value of proper balance, minimal weight and a precisely tuned suspension become immediately obvious. If the RX-8 represents the future of the sports car, we can't wait to see what's next. The Z may be faster, but the Rx-8 is the better sportscar

top gear on the 350z:

part of the reason nissans Z cars came so fat and so heavy is cause they were designed for the american market and the american car is as you know an enormous sofa. this one wasn't just designed for the americans, it was designed by the americans. to be honest it looks a bit of a mess. but it would cause its a jap car designed in america and the head of a project was an indian and the engine is french. we have had fusion food before, but its the first fusion car. Think of it as being a raw hamburger curry served in a disinterested way in a bed of garlic ajuis. If your the sort of person that likes to cruise the stsreet annoying everyone with the stereo this car is for you.

it doesnt take very long to work out that this car has many weak links and the weakest link of all is the engine. first there is the noise and its just a noise and annoying drone and it gets on yoru nerves. Then there is the perfomance. they say it will do 0 to 60 in six seconds ...but it never feels that fast. when you look at the 350Z you expect it to be light, sporty and agile, but its not. I was expecting it to be like a mx-5 fun...but its not. not even a little.

What it is is a ton and a half of iron mongry. its just a muscle car and muscle cars should be fun but its not. The noise is driving me mad. The hard ride and the effort it takes to drive this car makes it one of the most exhausting cars I have ever come across. The look of the interior is fine, but what is not so good is this (showing the flimpsy build quality) I've seen better build quality in an allotment share. There no practicality. The 350 is a 3 out of 10, it could do better.


top gear on the rx-8
while its not the torquiest engine in the world, nor is it the most economical, but God its smooth. Because it doesn't feel like its running on anything as crude as petrol, it seems more like double cream. This is one of the easiest cars to drive fast that I have ever come across. Its just so forgiving. Its like a punching bag. You can give it absolute hell and it just never fights back. Of all the cars I've driven this year, Im fairly certain this is the best one

Gosh, C & D did a comparison and the rx-8 won too. I'm seeing a trend here.

Hardly...but you can continue to think so if it makes you feel better. when you have to put other cars down to make you or your car feel better, what do you think that means?

Why all the hate against the Z?.....I love it. I just love the rotary more. Both are great. We are all lucky that we have these choices. RWD sports cars at decent prices....it's great!

I'm not saying that anybody has in this thread really bashed the Z. But I feel it coming......I've seen how it starts in all the other threads....

Now, what I will never accept is calling a FWD car a sports car...no matter what numbers it puts up......it just ain't right.

I don't know about all this other stuff cause I like my 8 too much to worry about anything else.

BUT RX_999 THAT'S SOME FUNNY SH!T...

After whipping out my RX8 brochure thats by my bed, I found the sport suspension and large brakes are standard on all 6 speeds.

:)

They should be used to it by now, or at least GET used to it. Now that the Z isn't the newest toy on the block and its true colors are showing, no one is gushing over it anymore. Personally I can't see why anyone EVER gushed over it, but that's just me.

If they judged cars on interior ugliness only, Nissans would ALWAYS come in first place.

That seems to be your personal perception, however, the Z has been out for over a year and a half, and it's still talked about frequently, in magazines, amongst peers, and forums (especially on this board). On the other hand, the RX-8 IS the newest toy on the block, and it seems like its publicity is slightly diminishing already. However, like your quote, this is merely my perception. The difference between our perceptions, is that I still consider the other car (in this case the 8) one of the best cars on the market in its class and can admit it. I would own an 8 and Z if i could. However, these cars are so unique and each has its own strongpoints that there is no way for me to declare an all-out winner.

I'm not putting the Z down. Its good for what it is. I read all the threads over there and it does appear they are crying.

Didn't mean to offend you. The 350Z is a fantastic car.

Ok?

The fact is, the only all-out winner is the car that YOU choose based on YOUR needs.

If performance is paramount and by performance, I mean power... then there are cars for you there. If it's handling, then there are cars for you there too. If it's the best of all worlds, the RX-8 has fit the bill for many of us and will continue to.

No awards or comparo tests will change that fact.

Nice as the RX8 is, I must say that the Motor Trend article would have been more legitimate were it comparing the RX8 with cars which are more like it in performace and concept, like the Infiniti G35 and the Lexus IS300. The Z is a 2 seat, 2 door hatchback and the S2000 is an all out sports car with barely enough room for two people.

According to the article, the Rx8 won not because it outperformed the other two car in ANY measure of performance but because it was "competetive" and was a good "compromise". It was quieter, had more room and was less expensive. Clearly the S2000 engineers had none of those things as their priorities when they were building the surgical scalpel that we call the S2k. Can you tell that I own the S?;)

But I love sports cars in general and have great admiration for Mazda and its cars. I would love the RX8 to succeed and then I would love for Mazda to produce the next generation RX7 so that I could buy that road rocket as well. I love my Miata.....it tells me what Mazda is all about.:)

And congrats to all you RX8 owners, you have a handsome car with good performance and practicality to boot.

Didnt the S2k and Z run high 13s and RX8 run mid 14s?

I think were all in agreement here that all the cars in the comparison are great cars...i wouldn't be on this forum if the rx8 wasn't a great car. no need to try and name an all out winner when there obviously is none.

Yeah, it's like each car is a steak... some people prefer a different cut and level to which it's cooked.

Are any of them wrong? No.

All up to the individual. Enjoy the steak the way "you" like it and move on... and be happy that the others at your table got one they liked too.

*group hug*

I love rotaries and always did since i was 11... im 16 now.... but i always shows repect for Z .. supra .. Skyline.. all those cars are fantasic... everycar is good for something... something specific... thats what its made...

350Z or RX-8 both are bad ass rollers... to roll out in...

Yeah, and the Z is completely overdone/overcooked.

Cmon.... we all know which is the "best sports car" among the three cars; it aint the 8, and it aint the Z.

I love Mazda because of this principle: They believe in lightweight, great handling, uncompromising cars.

The 8 is a compromise car. If I needed to calculate back steats into my buying decision I'd buy one... it becomes the obvious (hell, the ONLY) choice.

If you read through the article, it's clear that the 8 wins between the three cars because of its practical nature. There are people who want a car that puts perforamance and the driving experience above anything else... these people usualy look for things called "sports cars", because, well, sports cars are just that... cars that don't compromise the experience for practical limits. I think it's a little foolish for the 8 to win in this comparo... because it clearly doesnt do anything as well as the S (from a performance aspect) save braking... which is close.

The S sticks better.

The S accelarates quicker.

The S is lighter.

The S has tighter steering.

The S is better balanced and transitions better. ( A true 50/50 weight distrubution Vs. a 48/52).

IMO The article shouldnt have taken practicality into consideration when juding sports cars.

The S should have won, and the Z should have come in last. =D

I can respect your OPINION that the S2000 should have won, but I have a few issues with that.

first, the rx-8's steering is far better than the s2000. Actually I should not say far better, but its definately more precise and has a better feel. I have driven both, I know.

The S2000 is not better balanced than the rx-8. I dont know the weight distribution, but the rx-8 is 50/50 weight and everything about the car was designed for balance in mind. Rx-8 is definately better balanced (not the the s2000 isn't amazing in that catagory).

Transitions better? the car feels like a miata or a civic until 6000 RPM then it goes nuts. Thats alot of fun, I agree..but its not "better".

As far as the S "sticking" better, I have seen .88 to .92 on various tests for skid pad on both cars. In this test the s2000 had better grip, so if thats your point, ok.

The Rx-8 also has better brakes. the best tested was 60-0 in 111 feet, the s2000 cant offer that.

the S2000 is a great choice, I dont have an issue with anything thinking the S should have won, but I still prefer the 8.

What I mean by better is how tight the steering is. The steering ratio on the S is much tighter then on the 8; it might not be "better feeling" to some people (that is highly subjective) but it most deffinetly is better for performance purposes.... it simply is tighter... and that is a fact.

Actually, no... it is not 50/50 balanced; it's ALMOST 50/50 balanced... but it is 48/52; there was a whole schpeel on how Mazda wanted to design it this way so that the driver would offset the weight (I'm not going to go into what I think of that, kind of like how Nissan WANTED to design the Z so it was 46/54 so that the weight would shift forward and be 50/50 through a turn). The S2000 is a true 50/50.

You don't atuoX do you? I don't mean hit vtec by transition better. It's clear you've never driven an S2000 either; I'm starting to wonder if you actually own an 8.

They brake very similarly. Kutos to Mazda.

The S is a better sports/performance car period. The 8 is a better compromise car period... which is apparently what MT was looking for.

Now if Mazda released a 2600lb two door with a rotary.... we can all dream I guess.

who the hell are you to tell me I never drove an S2000? And who the hell are you to tell me I dont have an rx-8? I have an rx-8 and an rx-7. I dont need lectured by you. You are entitled to your opinion, but you cross the line when you accuse me of lying.

I dont agree with your analysis, btw.

First off here is my link where I posted my review of the s2000 on 11/25/2002

http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.ph...ighlight=s2000

here is the original post
my friend and me drove each others Rx7 and S2000
I have wanted to drive a s2000 for what seems like forever. My friend Kevin and me decided to trade cars and have some fun on the street....Anyway after driving the two cars I can put things in perspective. Looks are subjective and in my opinion both cars are stunning. The S2000 had more of a refind modern feel while driving, while my car had more of a brutal raw feel to it. I was really impressed with the power the S2000 has, but I think the fun with the s2000 is the revving of the engine and how happy the car seems to want to climb to 9000 rpm. I shift at 8100 in mine, although my car loves to rev, it seems the S2000 climbs revs even faster than My car does. It was funny, I forget how loud my car is with my MP. Sitting in the car I never notice it. When I was in his S2000 and he flew by me in my RX7 I can hear the exhaust on the RX7 and its LOUD. LOL.

My car is not stock and I forgot what a stock rx7 feels like so I cant compare power. I can tell you that the S2000 has a much softer ride, bumps are not as brutal. The shifting is perfect and the steering is exact. The Rx7's shifter is ok. My chasis has 152,000 miles, I have alot of play in my steering and I have worn bushings. His car had better steering response as a result of that.

He was really, really, really, really impressed with the torque of my car. He was really having alot of fun driving it.

So in the end my opinion is the S2000 is far more civilized and refined than the RX7. In the RX7 you can feel the engine and the road more and in the S2000 you feel the car more. You can have the top down in the s2000 and not mess your hair up, LOL.

I would Love to have an S2000.

are you still calling me a liar? you still dont think I own an rx-8?

according to hondacars.com

http://www.hondacars.com/models/spec...odelName=S2000

the weight distribution is 49/51

according to mazdausa

Don't be fooled by its power: the RENESIS engine is uncommonly compact. (In fact, it's about the same height as the transmission). This facilitates an advanced front-midship layout, which provides an ideal mounting position for the entire powertrain - low and behind the front axle. That positioning is a key factor in the Mazda RX-8's approximate 50-50 weight distribution, which helps to provide exceptional stability and handling.

My garage 2...(from 1st post)

I actually just read the article, and think it is a waste of ink. There is pretty much the same heated discussion at the S2ki board as well. I don't think it is a fair comparo, and certainly proves nothing.

I think we are VICTIMS of clever manipulation by Motor Trend's attempt to sell more magazines. Surely they KNEW a comparo like this would set off a ruckus, and people (I am guilty) would go out and actually buy their rag.

If you want pure muscle sport car performance - get the Z
If you want pure balanced sport car performance - get theS2K
If you want balanced performance with two extra seats get the 8

The key word is approximate. The rx-8 is 48/52, the 2000-2003 S2000 is 50/50*.

Anybody can write testimony about a car on a message board; it doesnt mean that they are telling the truth, or know what they're talking about. I've based my position on your experiences by your comments, specificly:

Which is just an uneducated sort of position. If you compare the dynos for an 8 and an S, you'd see that both cars have a similar power delivery, until 6K, where the F20C walks completely away from the renesis.

The only thing I currently like about the renesis is its potential; in my mind it clearly has more room to grow then the F20C (or the F22C for that matter). Time will tell.

*I'll be upfront and say I don't know much about the '04 models save the fact that the F20C has been replaced with the F22C and it weighs more.

the honda web site said 49/51 who cares.

Oh ok, I must have lied. I guess I gave a flattering review of the S2000 on the rx-7 board for the fun of it.

oh ok, i'm so glad. You are entitled to your opinion, but you cant respect someone elses without calling them a liar. You are a punk.

The dyno comments are facts, not opinions. You come out and comment about the S being equal to a civic or a miata and you're calling me the punk? LOL

R & T did a test shifing at 6000 RPM in the s2000 and 0-60 was 11 seconds. UNDER 6000 RPM yes, it accelates similar to a miata or civic. its a fact.

I never said the s2000 doesn't have a better power to weight, but as you probably know the rx8 cant be dynoed without going into limp mode. those 170 RWHP figures you have seen are not accurate.

lets put it this way, car +driver=3200 lbs. trap speed=95. No way in hell it only has 170 rwhp.

I'm not so sure this is true. My co-worker has an s2k with a Vortech Supercharger, and it lays down 298 - 302 hp at the rear wheels. A well tuned F20C with stock internals can bump that up to almost 350hp. I doubt the Renesis will approach 350 rwhp any time soon, but as you stay, only time will tell.

I'll call BS on that; how about substantiating it?

you can call BS on it, i'm not about to scour the net for some test that I am sure was done.

You called BS on the fact that I own an Rx-8, you called BS on the fact that I drove a S2000. So it doesn't suprise me.

How bout I get you a nice tall glass of STFU?

I'm personaly thinking of going with a comptech supercharger. I've heard the comptechs are more reliable and if you get it installed at a dealership it won't void the factory warranty.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...20/index1.html

Well, considering a well tuned RX-7 can hit 350 without THAT much work (certainly much less work than adding a supercharger since it's already turbo'ed, but I digress), once boosted work gets done on the 8's they will be well within the area. Of course, boosting the 8 is looking to be more of a challenge, but it's certainly do-able.

Man that was cool. thanks!!!