sohcpunk

Hey guys, I recently bought a Mazda RX-8 and have been pretty satisfied with it for the last 2 months. But when I first got the car, the tire pressure monitor light keeps on blinking no matter how accurate I set my tire pressure. I bought it to the dealers and they said they'll have to put the correct psi into it and it should be fine. After getting my car back, I drove it for 15 mins and the darn light shows up again. So I bring it back to the dealers and they say, we'll have to reflash the tire pressure monitor unit. I was given a loaner car for a day. Okay, I got the car back again and drove for 15 mins and there it comes on again. I was getting tired of this and brought it back the next day. (They recognized me by now). They said that they'll have to order the whole pressure monitor unit because they dont know what else can be the problem. So I waited 3 weeks for the unit to be ordered and delivered to the dealers. I get a call from the dealer that the unit is in so i bring my car in and get a loaner car. They said it should be done in 1 day. After waiting till 4PM that day, they called me and said it would have to take another day for them to finish it up. Okay, by this time i was pretty pissed off. Here I am driving a crappy *** Ford Escort loaner car and I'll have to waste so much time driving back to the dealer the next day to pick up my car. The next day, I picked up the car and they said they replaced the whole unit and they test drove it and everything and it should be fine now. I drive it out for 15 mins again and it comes back on! Now I think that I've had a lot of patience but this is going over the line. Does anyone know if this is a lemon case because personally, I think they messed up all the wiring and stuff in my car to put that monitor unit in and still didnt get it working. Thank you for your input.

Racer X-8

Doggon it! Dealerships!

Can you go to another one? You don't have to stick with the one you purchased from, you know.

Scratch the lemon thing. The only lemon here is the dealership!

sohcpunk

For some reason, this dealer gives me a loaner car and the car rental company they send me to charges me an extra $10 because I'm under 21. Is this fair? I thought Mazda gives you free loaner cars when the car is in for warranty? Just because I'm 19 doesnt make me different from anyone else purchasing the car. They said Mazda will only cover up to $30 a day for a car rental. BTW, I think all dealers will replace the part, I just want to know if I can use this as a lemon case because I think they cut up all the wires in my car and I want a new one! They have tried to fix this problems over 3 times and its still broken!

calve

what does iit mean when somethign is called a lemon case?..

G8rboy

What makes you think they cut up all the wires to replace a module?

I certainly hope they tried the easier route of trying different TPM sensors (with a different set of wheels/tires). It seems to me that a flaky or intermittant RF transmitter in a sensor would be more likely to blame than the whole TPM computer module.

And while it sucks to get the shaft because of your age, enjoy all the fringe benefits while ya got em : )

-Sean

sohcpunk

I guessing they probably had to cut up the wires because they are replacing the whole tire pressure unit.

Gord96BRG

No, no components are permanently hard-wired. Everything on the wiring harness has connectors to easily remove and replace components.

What is the exact psi you are running in your tires? Have you installed any aftermarket electronics in your car? (Audio system, subwoofer, etc)

Regards,
Gordon

G8rboy

No worries there... everything should be modular with unpluggable wiring harnesses and cables.

I would take RacerX's advice and find a better service dept... I question their troubleshooting techniques.

-Sean

sohcpunk

I've been setting the tires at 32 psi in the morning when the tires are cold. I've tried this many times and I'm sure the dealer set it to standard psi before they test drove it after they installed the module. The car is stock. Nothing changed.

Haze

Ever since the advent of computers, lazy mechanics think that problems can be solved solely by computers. It doesn't work that way. (Of course this isn't all mechanics but an unfortunate some.)

Remember that this is the FIRST time this department has ever looked at a TPMS system. There are few guidelines, and they are guessing . . . stupidly.

I quote the above because it hits all the high points. 1) No wiring has been cut! They just unplugged one computer and plugged in another. Your car has not been permanently damaged. 2) In order to try different sensors they would have to replace all four wheels and then flash the wheels to the central computer because, according to the owner's manual, the sensors are exclusive to your car and will not "broadcast" to other TPMS sensors that you might be sitting next to in traffic. I doubt if your dealership did this. Next to doing this is to dismount each of your tires and hand test each unit to make sure that it is working properly. I doubt if they did this. There is more that they can do to test your problem. If they are dragging their feet, CALL MAZDA NORTH AMERICA! Their dealers have to fix these cars, and that's something MNAO should be interested in them doing. 3) I believe that the problem IS in your wheel senders since the flashing light goes on when the wheel is removed from the car so what the receiver computer senses is a "no signal" from a wheel, and that's the code that you are getting. 4) Make them pay the $10 extra that you were charged. That problem is between them and the car renter and you are quite right that Mazda has contracted with you for a loaner car during warranty repair. It is not a "fringe benefit". It was included in the purchase price of the car, and it is on the sales sheet and advertising, so make them give you your ten back. 5) Lemon law: It varies from state to state. In most states the law is tripped by these facts after taking the car in for three separate attempts to repair the car, which have failed. This means leaving it with them three separate times, having them return it with the SAME problem still apparent. This sounds like you. Most car companies are sensitive to this at this point and what they do is when you take it in and threaten lemon law after the third trip to the dealer, they keep the car for ages until it is repaired. Some car companies will fly a trouble shooting team in to fix the car. If you want to try this, which is never easy or fun, take it in; threaten lemon law suit; make them pay THE WHOLE RENTAL PRICE for a loaner; contact to MNAO by e-mail or phone and get an address to send a follow up letter advising of them of your intention to invoke lemon law and send that letter certified. That should get you car fixed even if it takes a while. If it doesn't then you are on your way to having the bum car replaced. Best of luck.

sohcpunk

I pretty don't know who to blame for the $10 extra fee. Basically the company that rents out cars to this dealership charges $30 a day to rent out a car. Okay, that is what Mazda is covering. The rep told me Mazda will only pay up to $30 a day for a car rental. So by me being under 21, they have to charge the extra $10. Who is at fault? I have no idea. Mazda? or the dealer? Should I report this to Mazda?

meeh

Why don't mazda give rentals that matches the type of car you bought from them. I'm not saying to give another rx-8 but atleast at the same caliber. I was also told that they would only give a rental if the car has to stay overnight? That's pretty inconvinient. I remember with my old car they would try to give me the same type or car that they had in the dealership (sometimes i get lucky and even get an upgrade) or if they don't have any I'd get a loaner from like a car rental place but it would either an SUV or a decent car... not a ford escort.

Haze

I think that your position is this. You entered into a contract with Mazda to buy a car, the RX 8. Mazda advertised a "free loaner program for warranty repairs" not one with a few exceptions or additional fees. The dealer was required to implement this policy by establishing an account with a local car renter. They did that using mazda's fleet power to negotiate a flat rental fee of $30 a day, which let me tell you ain't that cheap anyway, but that's what they negotiated. The car renter is trying to double dip by getting you to pay for what either were unable to negotiate into the contract or for what is actually already included in the $30 flat fee. When the renter negotiated the price it was certainly a possibility that some of those cutomers would be under 21 and that event should have been inlcuded in the fee and most likely it already is. They are try ing to double dip the fee, and they succeeded.

Technically you should have just refused to pay the extra ten bucks, called the dealer had them explain it to the renter. However, your problem is with mazda. They failed to provide the "free loaner car". It wasn't free. It should have been free. That's the argument. I can't tell you if it'll work easily or even at all, but that's what I would do. That car should have been free and, and it doesn't matter if you are 19.

As for supplying a car that is comparable to the RX 8, well, there just isn't anything comparable, but the deal does not say anything about a car that is comparable. It just says a car, and I would be perfectly happy as long as it ran. In the end all a car has to do is get me from A to B so the escort does that.

MuzzleFlash

I agree that the problem appears to be in the sender and not the receiver unit. It could be a low signal strength fault or a true low tire pressure indication due to a TPS malfunction. It may only show up at high wheel RPMs and/or with road surface conditions (as opposed to a shop dyno).

The dealer should have high tech diagnostic systems that point them in the correct direction. Maybe that's expecting too much.

You got some good advice here. Now go raise some hell and don't take no for an answer. It's a lesson you will learn time and time again in your adult years. People will take advantage of you if you're timid. That doesn't mean that you should be an a$$hole. Just be assertive, and willing to escallate and don't take an inferior offer.

Unless they can show you in writing that Mazda's loaner cars are limited to 21 and over, they are stuck with the contract. Make them honor it.

The dealer really gets shafted when the lemon law is invoked. They eat the sales commissions and lose the program incentives. They have a lot of reasons to get the car working right.

Rx-Appreci-8

Apparently they aren't troubleshooting -- they're just shot-gunning one item per trip. First they though it was incorrect pressure. Then they reflashed. Then they replaced the main unit. Fortunately the system isn't too complex (conceptually, at least) and you are left with the 4 rim sensors/transmitters, possible bad electrical connectors, a CAN bus related problem or defect in the dash idiot light circuit. I'll bet they get it when they replace the 4 wheel rim units. You might want to insist they replace all 4 together. The Tech CD (see other threads) has a video demonstrating a summary of the TPMS troubleshooting procedure.

Hopefully that won't take 4 more trips.

sohcpunk

I called the dealer today and told them that it might be the sensors located in the 4 wheels. He tells me that the technician has already checked and diagnose the sensors on the wheels. He ask me to come by again so they can pull up the error code to report to Mazda. Thank you for your inputs so far. If they can't fix it this time. Do you think I should report it as a lemon?

Haze

It isn't a matter of "reporting it". Lemon law is a civil law concept that gives you a statutory right to have the car taken back if a court determines that the company has sold you a car which trips the requisites of the statute. Only way you are going to do that is to hire an attorney and sue.

What I would do is politely mention to the service department that if they are unable to repair your TPMS system on this trip to the service department, then you and your parents (might make them think you are more serious since you are 19) are intending to hire an attorney and pursue a lemon law remedy since the car appears to be irreparable. I would also mention that you would feel that MNAO should be made aware of the problem and if they didn't do it, you would.

As for your ability to use lemon law in reality, it is impossible to say since you would need to hire a lawyer to tell you whether your situation meets the standard for lemon law in your state. I have no idea if there are any laws that could actually protect you.

Best of luck and again I have no idea if the above would work. It's just something to try to put some pressure on the dealer.

Killed4an8

If you go to the package (you know the one with the owner's manual, warranty information, and other fun stuff) that they gave you when you bought your car, there's a booklet that's call "Owner's rights under state consumer protection laws" and in there there is a requirement for each state in order to invoke the lemon law. Just look up ur and follow the direction on it. Careful though you might still get jerk around cause nothing comes easy especially getting them to replace ur car. Good Luck!!!