Superfan

Just noticed that mazda downrated performance by 3hp (210 -> 207 and 250 -> 247). Check the MazdaUSA site.

zoom44

the 247hp # has been floating around for awhile. even during the car and driver segment Csaba was saying 250 but they had 247 on the bottom of the screen. that is the first i have heard of a drop in the low power though.

tribal azn2

guess they didnt want another law suit

cueball

Could you elaborate?

tribal azn2

mazda got sued awhile back because they overrated the power on the miata

ibfubar2000

mazda had wrong info on the miata. aaid the horsepower was wrong. they ended up giving the customer 2 options. mazda would buy back the car or mazda would give the owner $500.00 plus free maintance for 3 years. it worked out great for the customers. some returned the car some kept the car with free maintanence! i dont think mazda will let it happen again. huge expence for mazda!!

brothervoodoo

So what was that weight to horsepower formula again? Maybe a couple of may need to get on that subway sandwich diet to recover those lost horses... :D

ChrisW

I don't think anything has changed. I think its always been 250 PS which translates to 247 hp. PS is the German measurement of horsepower (PS stands for pferdstarker, which is literally the German for horsepower). This is measured slightly differently to US horsepower, hence the slightly different figures.

Hercules

6 lbs = 1 horsepower

You'll have to lose a lot of weight

TybeeRX-8

ALL of the current RX-8 literature, including the new brochure I just received from the dealer states 250hp for the 6mt and 210hp for the at. I don't think they would have produced all of this if it wasn't correct. Even the Sales employees newsletter, Mazda Fuel for May/June (Vol. 2, Issue 3) says "Buyers have a choice of 250 horsepower...or 210 horsepower..." on page 12. Some of the older pre-production reports had estimated hp data. And none of the current info uses German data either.:o

zoom44

there is always that legalspeak on those brochures etc. that says "everything was true at the time of printing but things could change"

TybeeRX-8

I don't think that the Current sales info would state something "equivocal". There is no caveat in this literature.

The 250PS comes from the Intern'l Engine Award:
"The award ceremony will be held on June 4 in Stuttgart, Germany.

Outline of RENESIS engine (for Mazda RX-8 Type S/Japanese specifications) -Type:
-Total Displacement:
-Maximum Output (JIS net):
-Maximum Torque (JIS net):
Rotary engine, two-rotor, water-cooled
0.654L x 2
184kW (250PS)/8,500rpm
216N·m (22.0kg-m)/5,500rpm "

Note the data for "Mazda RX-8 Type S/
Japanese specifications

zoom44

i'll check my brochure when i get home i thought i saw the caveat on there somewhere.

TybeeRX-8

You may find it in one of the customer brochures, but what I referred to is Mazda Fuel , the publication for the sales staff.

zoom44

ok

3Rotor

This was discussed at length at SevenStock. At that time the "targeted" HP was 250 (and if you lookclosely at some of the literature it says that), but they were struggling to get the EPA /emmissions/power/performance equation solved. Even back then, they were talking 247 HP and the fact that they were "working diligently" on it to squeeze out the extra 3 HP. I wouldn't fret over 3 HP, there will be a couple of easy things you can do to gain back all of that ..and more. The first that comes to mind is a K&N air filter, exhaust mods next, etc. BTW, I know the guys at Corksport (www.corksport.com) and the owner has a car on order. The first thing they are doing is developing an exhaust system!

Gord96BRG

Nope - there was no law suits at any time over the 2001 Miata HP issue. Lots of publicity, quite a few unhappy owners, and a suitable resolution voluntarily provided by Mazda - owners could either return their Miatas for a prorated refund, or get $500 in accessories or free maintenance. The HP difference in that case was 12 HP, not 3, and resulted from a mix-up over test estimates and a decision after the engine tested at 155 to have all US Miata meet California emissions regs. It was the recalibrated engine that only made 142 crank HP.

Regards,
Gordon

Racer X-8

142 is 91% of 155...definite cause for concern.

247 is 99% of 250. You can loose that due to humidity! Not to mention the 1000 other variables at 8500 rpm. They all can work the other way as well. Unless you dyno-test your car, you don't really know what it's developing at any given time. And of course, don't forget the biggest factor - rpm...

MrWigggles

3000lb / 247 Horsepower = 12.1 lb / horsepower.

So increase the engine by 1 horsepower would be the same as decreasing the weight by about 12 lbs.

By the way, German horses are weaker than American horses so:

250 PS = 247 HP.

-Mr. Wigggles

P00Man

isnt the general "rule" 1hp for 10 pounds?
________
Zx14 vs hayabusa

neit_jnf

250 / 3029 = 12.12 lbs/hp

247 / 3029 = 12.26 lbs/hp


So it means an increase of .14 lbs/hp or 2.24 oz/hp, basically a negligible change.

I ran a simulation in Cartest2000 and the 0-60 time remained equal at 5.98 s but the only change was of only .01 s in the quarter mile, 14.46 vs 14.45

RX8Lover

oh my god - what are we all going to do??? 3 less horsepower? Forget it, I am cancelling my order. I don't want a car with 247HP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Racer X-8

So if I just finished eating a quarter-pounder, medium fries & medium coke, how much longer would it take me to drive to LA?

joema230

I know it was already posted, but 250 PS (aka DIN horsepower) is equal to 247 US/UK/SAE net horsepower. They are the same real power, just calculated differently.

You can do the conversion yourself using this tool: http://www.statman.info/conversions/power.html

It's widely known the German DIN horsepower rating is optimistic vs US SAE net horsepower. In fact some humerously refer to DIN as "Deutschland Invented Number"

Jerome81

I stopped by the dealership today, and picked up a brochure. In the brochure it says everywhere 250hp, with no disclaimer about it being provisional, unless I just missed it....

Sticker says 247hp.

Odd huh? I know 3hp is negligible, but 247 to me doesn't sound nearly as nice as 250 good even round number horsepower. I wish they could just make it 250....

BTW the car was stunning. Silver and Titanium with red leather (auto). However, the silver was 6sp parked outside, and they were giving test drives!! He said it already had 60 miles on it and offered to let me head out. However, couldn't find the keys (in another salesman's pocket) and after we were done browsing at Miatas the RX-8 was suddenly in the garage getting a cleaning. Bummer.... However I was promised I should come back. Maybe I'd better do that tomorrow before they sell that thing :D

If anyone is interested it was at Sterling Mazda in Sterling Heights on Van Dyke just south of 18 Mile. If you're thinking about buying the car, please wait until after the weekend so I have a chance to drive it first