Shamusodoofus

Hey guys,

I am just curious to know how the durability of the rotary engine is on the Rx-8. I have heard both good and bad things about it.

Many people say they havent seen a high mileage Rx8 (over 200k miles) because it never lasts that long. However, I have done some research and have come to find that many people also say that the rotary engine is MUCH more durable than the conventional piston operated engine (I also believe them because it does in fact have FAR less moving parts).

Lastly, the people who say that the rotary engine is extremely durable claim that the reason that the engines dont last that long is because people treat them as conventional engines.

So, what I would like to know is? Which is the truth?

Will the engine be able to go 200k miles+? Or will it die on my at like 120k miles even if I maintain it properly

Thanks in advance!!

Huey52

iTrader: (2)

You've hit many of the salient, true, points.

The rotary is inherently more reliable than a piston engine, thanks to more elegant design (many fewer moving parts and turbine rather than opposed combustion).

However, as you cite, it has to be treated and maintained as a rotary, e.g. watch the carbon buildup (hi rev/redlining often helps), and keep the oil regularly changed and topped off (it consumes oil to lubricate the rotor apex seals and thereby hold compression).

And if the worst were to happen and you lost oil, it could not seize thanks to the differing rotor and chamber materials, and thereby thermal expansion rates (steel and aluminum respectively).

Properly used and maintained it should easily outlast its piston powered counterparts.

Keep in mind that a rotary engine is so reliable (and high 'thrust to weight ratio') it's preferred in aviation applications.

tubingchamp

iTrader: (3)

Little bit of both.

It should last a very long time if maintained properly, giving it oil, redlining it regularly, not pushing it until it's warm, revving before shutting it down, etc etc.

As with every car, there are those that don't last long because of minor flaws, or random issues that are not all too common, even if properly maintained. We have several 120k+mile owners here on their first engine.

The car just isn't too old, so within 5 years 200K miles is a large amount, not many people have been able to physically drive that much on 5 years that I know of... Maybe look around and we'll see what kind of other answers we get

04RX8man

well I know of one 170,000+ milegeage 8 on these boards! and many over 100k miles....yes they require a small amount of care compared to civics and the norm however with propermaintenance I don't see y it can't go well over 200k miles

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

i seriously doubt your going to see many series I engines make it past 100k with any kind of performance due to the seal wear unless the owner has used premix for the engines life

Shamusodoofus

Wow, thanks alot for the quick answers. To be honest I was a bit scared that you guys might have thought I was a troll.

Umm, with this next question I really dont mean to bash the RX8.

I am considering purchasing an RX8, however, I have to wonder, why is a new RX8 so expensive? There are other cars (such as the 370z) at a similar price with greater performance (speed for sure, not sure about handling (my friend says its close)).

I asked my friend this question and he told me that you are able to get much more incentives and discounts with the RX8 then other cars. If this is true, what kind of discounts are you guys getting?

**I was first going to purchase an 06+ used Rx8 (cause of Renesis 2) when I heard that the 09 is getting a significant upgrade**

thanks

ken-x8

Your user ID, together with asking the second most common already-answered question, could give that impression.

Ken

warwickben

from what i read about the 09 is its mainly body changes ect. nothing really big changes in the motor. if you ask a rx8 guy why its more money then a 370z ect they will tell you it will handle better less common and tons of othere reason.

i got my used 05 gt a few months ago fully loaded. the windo stickker was still in the glove box and with all the options it was sold for over 32k$. not bad cause i paid less then 15k for a 3 year old car with 40k on it.

CTrx8

iTrader: (2)

you may want to look into that. there are some modifications under the hood of the '09s.

https://www.rx8club.com/purchasing-financing-insurance-56/official-2009-rx8-info-info-sheet-order-form-spec-deck-colors-inside-140437/

rglbegl

My last 13b made it over 225,000 before I sold it.
And it was my track car, so I drove the **** out of it

bose

iTrader: (5)

New 370Z's are going for about 40,000. USD at stealerships around here. The R3 RX8 was at 34ish so the 370 is a bit more expensive.

04RX8man

yeah the 09's got prob one of the best "engine" upgrades possible they added 3rd injector...so they know that there are some problems with wear on the center of the Apex seal however premixing on the earlier models will greatly reduce wear!

Renesis07

iTrader: (1)

my first renesis is over 70K now.

I do not premix, I use 5w20, and I top off once between oil changes. I change my oil every 3-5,000 miles.

No engine issues.

And I am extremely hard on this car.

PotatoSoup

Wow, pretty impressive. On an '04 no less!

ShottsCruisers

When the deal's done, these two models should sell for about the same price though you have to watch the upgrades on the Z or the price goes higher.

The Z is faster just like a POC Mustang. Other than that, it gives things away to the Rx8:

*Rx8 is a true 4-seater
*You imagine where you want the Rx8 to go and it does it on it's own
*The 370 is very hard to drive fast on city streets. I don't street race but I can tell you that suspension-wise and power delivery....that rear can fling you out of control. The Rx8 soaks the bumps in the turns and it's smooth delivery and tight LSD give it the advantage on the turn and safety wise.
*You want to burn rubber and race on the straights...the 370 will kill the 8.

My money isn't on the 0-60. It's on the handling, safety, foregivefullness if you make a mistake, the ability to take 2 more people aboard, and the ROTARY motor.
Once you own this engine and experience it's smoothness. you'll not like a piston motor unless you have a certain need where you have to have it (more speed, towing, etc). I can't tell you how many times I'm driving with the cruise on at 6000 RPM and forgot to shift up because I couldn't feel or hear the high revs.

THOSE ARE THE THINGS THAT I'LL PAY FOR.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

One story I heard a bit back comes to mind, regarding Grand Am (i believe) racing. The cars with piston engines were shut off immediately after the races, having had so much power run through them that everything was warped and bent. Just prior to shut-off, they sounded awful.

The guys driving the rotories would step out of their cars and give interviews and chat, leaving the engine running and it would sound exactly the same as when it started the race. Piston engines were rebuilt after every race, it was common for the rotory to run many races between rebuilds.

Granted, this isn't the track, but for power-to-durability, you simple can't beat this engine. Also, if the worst does happen, and you need a rebuilt out of warranty, the simplicity of the engine is in your favor for rebuild costs, and I believe they are significantly cheaper than even 4-banger piston engines. Read up on rebuild posts and threads by RotoryResurrection and Sleepy-Z on here. It gave me a ton of confidence about my engine, as well as useful information from someone that regularly rebuilds.

04RX8man

^except i believe that labor costs are higher for rotary engine(at least so i have heard) because of rareity of ppl that know how on these motors....

REsuperD

+1

i have heard many many times how reliable rotary racers are. many people are surprised how short (piston) engines last and how often they need to be rebuilt in race cars. i've heard F1 engines last only 1 race? in racing, rotary engines often last much longer

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

True, higher labor costs. But look up RotoryResurrection's rebuild cost ranges. I am not going to quote them, and it is a "per job" cost depending on the extent of the rebuild, but even the high end was cheaper than the rebuild of a Toyota 4-cyl I went through.

kvndoom

Rx8 isn't expensive. Hell, I got over 4000 off MSRP when I got mine, and the economy hadn't even tanked yet. They are pretty easy cars to negotiate down.

MSRP is "expensive" only if you are looking at dollars per horsepower, which many people do. Yeah you can get faster for less, but the 8 has many intangibles.

DubbsLuvs8s

iTrader: (1)

I just ordered an '09 R3 for the S-Plan of 30,106. On top of that I'll get money off for whatever incentives are in play when I pick it up. I don't think you can beat a car like this for under 30k.

Also, this may be too late, but the Ford X-Plan used to qualify you for the Mazda S-Plan also, but I think when Ford bought out of Mazda they ended it. You may not be too late if you have a hookup at Ford to generate a pin and get it for S-Plan.

Raptor75

This is a tough one.

The Rotary can stand a great deal of abuse from hard driving. You can hammer it all day long it it will respond better then if you babied it. As the Rotary ages it stays strong right up until the end. Pistons die a slow power losing death. Rotary will rarely have a cataclysmic failure. The main components are just to strong as a function of the engine for that to happen. Pistons engine can throw rods, snap values etc... causing a near explosion in the engine bay. Race rotaries can run a whole season with out a rebuild something pistons just can't do.

On the negative side rotaries has a complex system of compression seals that are more prone to failure that a pistons seals. When these go it is a loss of power that kills the rotary. For reasons not fully know a relatively large number of RX-8 engines have failed because of poor compression sealing. Some blame the oil weight, the oil metering, maintenance of the car, the way it is driven etc... No one knows for sure. Mazda has performed a number of engine reflashs to help prevent this and offered to decarbon engines which are showing lose of power. Is this a fix, we don't know only time will tell.

So in summary you have basically a very strong engine which had a problem which was causing some engines to fail prematurely. Has this be resolved? Only time will tell for sure but Mazda has upped the engine warranty to 8 years and 100K miles so you do have a little time to find out.

PotatoSoup

What the hell?

The RX-8 is one of the greatest automotive bargains ever. Where else can you get:

-quality/Made in Japan
-RWD
-beautiful chassis (big brakes, LSD)
-safe (side airbags and stability control)
-decent practicality
-stylish
-HIDs/LED tails
-Nice luxury touches (autodimming review mirror and Homelink)

all for well under $30K new?!?

Only from Mazda, that's where. I mean I can't believe it when I spec out some cars, like BMWs. You have to pay for $3700 package if you want options like autodimming review mirror and Homelink, which would only cost about $300 and aren't available separately!

Ryan2008

Get it because it's so damn fun and there's nothing else like it God dammit I love my RX8

cajunrx8

Coming from a long time rotary owner I can only tell you that you need to stop listening to others and go drive an RX8.
Don't dwell on the raw power or lack of, but how the car drives, how it rides and handles your steering inputs. feel how the brakes haul the car down from speed with ease.

Then go drive the other cars you are considering and see if they can match the 8's almost telepathic driveing style.