Newbie vs Experience
 

I have not been posting in the general forums in a while and I am ashamed to say that when I peruse the new threads now, it seems that what was once a very informative and helpful brotherly like atmosphere has now become a battle ground for those that are new to the car/forum and those that have been around for a while or at least think they are knowledgeable. I'd like to see this forum get back to a more helpful atmosphere like I remember everyone being when I first joined. Everyone was really great and made me feel welcome. Now, it seems that if you are a newbie and ask a simple question there are some that think it funny to blast the new guy just because he/she is not knowledgeable and has not done a search.

It's not everyone and in a lot of cases, it's not those that have been around for a long time. Seems like a lot of recently joined members that want to be in the experienced category and look big. Most of the older members I think know where I'm coming from.

I'm not sure what it would take to rectify this but I know if I was a new member and got the responses I see, I'd leave and would not check back. This forum was one of the main reasons I purchased my 8 and have kept it. I do search and I am careful where and what I say but I do speak from the heart and with thought to what my comments are actually saying and what impact they may have on someone, especially a newbie.

My skin is pretty thick and I really don't take any crap from anyone anymore. Some of you just ignore my comments and that's fine. A new person may not have developed the skills needed to weather such comments. They may be new to posting in threads period and that's just not a good way to help people.

I'd like to think this is a positive atmosphere where we guide people to the right places and help them get comfortable with the community. I have a lot of friends on the GA forum that don't come here anymore because of this type of attitude. Anyway, those are just some of my thoughts as to the atmosphere here. Let's help not hurt.

I do agree that this forum has changed for the worse. That's why I have been stuck at under 8000 posts for so long. lol......... A lot of these new threads make me wish I hadn't clicked on the link. About 80% of the threads seem to have new members thinking they're all big and start thread jacking.

you should check out NASIOC if you think the n00b bashing here is bad, lol

Wrong section. I kind of see what you mean, but it seems like some people dont even want to try... to them this forum is a place where they can have everything handed to them and then never contribute anything to the forum themselves. This is honestly the first forum I joined and actively monitored and posted in. I have asked some questions that have already been addressed but I have found most of my answers through searching... most searches are quick but, believe it or not, I've actually read through some of those 100+ page threads to find my answers. When I post for someone to search or something, it's because they ask a question that could be answered quicker if they actually tried than the time it takes to start the new thread and then check back later. I'm not trying to be mean when I respond in a manner like that... but we dont need the forum bogged down with 3000 threads saying "what exhausts are there for the rx-8?". Now if they narrow it down to 2, explain some certain qualifications etc, it then becomes a more specific question with a more specific answer that is actually worth answering.

btw, this topic has been discussed many times before, it results in the 2 sides supporting their position and then nothing actually changes. This type of thread pops up just as often as those "my rx-8 is not broken, is something wrong?" threads. The truth is, if these guys want their answers, they almost have to stay around. I'm guessing if they want it that bad, they'll take that "search noob" advice.

I agree Silver. It's always easy to yell at the n00bs and tell them to SEARCH, but we were all new at one time, we need to remember that.

I'll continue to try and help out the newer members whenever I can.

I know when I joined the forum, I read for two full weeks, and that was after having worked at Mazda Dealerships for several years, having read the vast majority of articles abotu the car in the last 5 years, and being in general fairly knowledgeable about cars. I learned how to search before I posted, and furthermore made my VERY FIRST post a gift to the forum, a roughly 1000 word "essay" looking into the anatomy of a car deal. I had received some advice reading, and tha led me to my first couple of "mods", so I made a gift back.

I, personally, think that it is IMPERATIVE that a new user read first, search second, and post THIRD, when they are unable to find the answer. I'm not sure if the board allows such programing, btu a good idea would be to have a "start new thread" button show up ONLY after 100 thread views or something to that nature.

^ yep you got it right.
Read the stickies, do a couple of searches and then you will know what to ask for.

By the way shud I buy an RX 8 or Civic?

I will admit myself that I read the forum for months before I joined. I was pretty sure that after all the bashing on the noobs I was ready to jump in. I feel I did pretty well myself. I still have slip ups from time to time, but I truely believe that the months I wasn't a member and just brushing up on the site really helped. It also helped me learn different personalities of some of the members.

You also have to remember that when a lot of you joined a lot of the information was new and there were always new and interesting posts being made. There isn't much new to discover.

Now being years since the 8 first came out, finding older ones cheap is getting easier and easier. This means that younger and younger can now afford. The younger you get the less you want to wait and the more you want to be spoon fed. We live in a society that we basically have all kinds of information at our finger tips. We're just getting more greedy as time goes on.

Anyways I could rant on forever about this and I'm sure you don't care to read any more, but I do tend to agree with what is being said. Most of the good topics were all started years ago.

If the kind of nonsense going on today, was the same kind of nonsense going on in Nov 2004 when you joined, the responses in 2004 would have been the same.

"This has been discussed many times:

-link, link, link, link, link"

The truth is, people who tell people to search, or link to previous exact same topics, are preserving the value of 4 years worth of discussion.

If you really expected us to write up the full deal every time someone asks a question, then there'd be no use for a search feature or archive at all. Why save any discussion topics that are older than 12 hours?

Sometimes the politeness runs out and somebody is just going to get mowed down like the grass.

This has been and always will be the greatest 8 club on the internet. The fact that people, including myself, need to get hit hard in order to learn lessons and develop further is nothing new. You are probably more of a "mentorship" role model, but there are other applicable models of leadership that are equally valid.

i have to say, i have been on forums for about 6-8 years now...wow!!! and each one is new and the counter starts off at...0...its like with every new place you go, you dont know where to look and everything is different. I agree with the search first, but some people have searched, but not for the right word...but instead of blasting them to search, either dont leave a comment, or leave a link to goto...but if i say my car is making a weird noise, you may have already looked and could not find the same lil noise.....but also while typing you dont know that persons on the other side and know if they are joking, being serious or whatever....i guess just dont post crap if you dont have anything to say :)

I read about a month before purchasing my Rx-8. Even back in early 2004, there was a ton of information here, so much info that I didn't have to ask any noob questions. It was already here for the taking.

A lot of valid points on both sides. I understand the need to keep 4 years of information in tact and also the need for new members to use the search feature. I just think that the problem is an attitude issue. For example look at these two responses:

Search noob!

or

Welcome to the club and congratulations on your new RX-8! You may want to check out the thread (xxx) for the info you are requesting. Please make sure you read the stickie post as they are VERY important and that you do a search as most every question has already been answered.

I know this subject has been discussed before and I hate to bring it up again but this forum has been very important to me over the past 4 years and it makes me hurt when I see people having a door slammed in their face and treated like crap.

I read this forum for about 6 months and I finally joined because I wrecked my car. I got a LOT of support and I got some that said I got what was coming. It was those that cared that helped me through one of the worst times in my life. Mine was a lot more serious than oil viscosity but to some that are really excited and don't know where to go to share their excitement, this should be a welcoming experience.

EDIT:
I hope this thread will stay in the RX-8 Discussion forum and not be moved to the Lounge as it is intended for those posting in this forum to read.

IMHO, that's the best way to answer newbies. There are, of course, some first posters who have an obnoxious style and deserve a smack, but they're in the minority. And you'd think people here could tell the difference.

I've been active here for just a couple of years, and I think my post count greatly exceeds my significance here. I also subscribe to the general pricipal that forum members should not attempt to moderate other members - that's for the moderators.

But...just voicing my own tastes...I find the knee-jerk "Search, noob," or "Here's what you need" with a link to the search page, or repeated posting of the link to albino black sheep, to be more tiresome than most of the "What oil should I use" posts.

FWIW, I've found answers to almost all of my questions by browsing or searching. I think I've just started two posts asking for info. Got a great answer to the first. No answer to the second, which tells me it was unanswerable. Joined in a lot of great conversations. Hope the forum stays as friendly to all as it's been to me.

Ken

I can pretty much tell if the dude did his homework b4 posting.

then I will decide what to do, if "i think" he did not do his/her homework, the answer will be either "search, you n00b" or "not doing anything"

I might be a bit harsh(a lot of times), but seriously speaking, they gave people a chance to yell at them(by not doing their research, just want answers), dont ya think ?

Excellent point Silvereight. Nothing more annoying than an internet forum kid who thinks he is so awsome that they are rude to those that dont know. I guess it makes them feel good about them selves to blast noobs, but in the end it only makes them look pathetic, if you cant respond in a mature manner, then dont, nothing makes a forum look more lame then forum tough guys that bully around noobs.

One thing I learned both here on RX8 club and also within the rotary community locally to me is that those with experience all got it the same way. They aquired it on their own either by wrenching on their own vehicle or by reading the wealth of information that is offered here.

I wouldn't be surprised to see everyone contributing and helping each other back in 2004. Everyone was still learning the quirks of the engine and the car in general. We've now had 4 years of information built up in this website so nearly every novice question has been answered several times.

Doing research into topics and upgrades shows dedication and seriousness. Doing your homework shows others you're really interested in learning and understanding the car which is the key to success with the RX8 in my opinion.

When someone comes online asking "so, how much boost can the rotary handle?" or "is it safe to redline this car?" I know right away they have been here 5 minutes and gave up on reading.

I spent the better part of a year lurking around this website for everything I could get my hands on. Turbos, Nitrous, porting, the long threads about testing and teardowns. I had maybe 200 posts when 2008 came around and I've owned by car since December of 05.

People help those who help themselves. If you can't demonstrate at least that much then SEARCH NOOB!

Give it a rest.. these aren't the Civic forums.

No, that's true. Compared to many other forums people are given easy treatment here.

no offense but people who said "those elites suppose to help the n00bs" are the ones that never actually helped anybody, at least not much.

On our local forum we have a policy of making sure every new member is treated like they just walked into our house and we greet them like a friend. No matter what the question and how little searching they did. You get the same questions a lot of times but we have found that most new members (that bother to post) do want to communicate intelligently, they just need to get acclimated, learn the personalities of the people they are communicating with and then they settle in and are great active members that come to events or just have fun online.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying be nice to everyone no matter what they say. I have on occasion been very vocal about something someone has said on this forum. I have a couple classics (in my on mind :) ) that I'm very proud of. As some of you have said, you can tell if someone has done their homework. You also can make the choice of responding with a nudge or a hammer. If nudging doesn't do the trick then I'm all for the hammer. I guess I'd just like to see the subtle approach at first then turn the dobermans loose if you smell blood. :)

https://www.rx8club.com/attachment.p...1&d=1215349311

that dog looks mean .... puppy puppy puppy :P

Both side s are correct in the issue. For the four years that Ive been a member (you can see that my count is only mid 200s extremely low) I ve used this forum as a tool to diagnose and understand what exactly is going on with my car. I would have no problem thinking about exactly what I wanted to know and search for it. I aggree with that now I have flamed a couple of newbs only recently, but this was out of frustration and a prescence of laziness on the newbs behalf. There are plenty of newbs that construct well thought out concerns or questions as well and the dont get bashed. This pattern of posting generalized questions(some of which you can even do a two second google search for) has flooded the forum with to much useless garbage to the point at which when I go to search for something I have to filter thru 90% complete crap to find what I wanted to know. And to the newbs credit this maybe what they have to deal with as well, so it seems to be a spiraling problem... not quit sure what to do about it, but personally I will try control myself when over generalized and repetitive questions are asked as new post....

Yea, I think someone mentioned that the cars are cheeper now and that brings in a new crop of drivers that before couldn't afford them. Our car was at one time a selective group of enthusiast. Now it's appealing to those that are comparing prices of used cars. I was told yesterday that you can get a NEW 2008 for $20K as advertised in the newspaper. I've not seen that myself but that is unbelievable. With the cost of the used 8's getting down so low now, this forum is going to keep getting new members with the same questions.

I wonder if maybe there should be a New Member forum? Maybe a section for newcomers that are required to spend a given amount of time in that section before moving on? They could post all they wanted in that forum. They could read all the forums but just not post outside of the New Member one. I don't have an answer, just trying to see if there is a possibility of something that might start them off gradually? A moderator could be the one to guide them and give them a pass to the next level of posting?

There's a sticky FAQ somewhere around here. Any noob questions should be going there and people just link to that.

Speaking as one of the newbies..............

I can say that I have always been treated respectfully and cordially by the more experienced veterans of this fourm, and that goes for the "new, yet think they are experienced" crowd as well.

And believe me, I have had a billion questions, and probably each and every one was a no brainer, softball pitch type question they have heard again and again. And I have never been treated rudely.

Why even yesterday, I had a question about oil and after perusing all the stickies and searching I did not find a related topic, so I started a thread. Apparently, it was a repeat of a couple day old thread that I missed and I was politely informed where I could go to find that answer.

Personally, I consider it very discourteous to expect you guys to do my research for me. I consider it discouteous to expect you guys to regurgitate the same information over and over when somewhere on a sticky, the same question has been asked and has been answered in-depth. And often it has been answered by folks experienced with RX8's, rotary engines, specific components, etc. In the case of newbies, it is to their advantage to go to a thread chock full 'o' information on the topic they are seeking, rather than to get a limited and cursory overview in some new thread that they start.

The stickies, and some older threads, contain the accumulated wisdom and knowledge of RX8 and rotary-heads........I see no problem with referring new members to these threads.

Can the new members be asked to search for stickies and the subject they are interested in before asking questions, in a nicer manner? I guess so, in some instances, maybe.

But in the same sense, some members, when asked nicely to do a simple search, react as if they have been insulted and smeared and as if their dog was kicked. They take offense to being asked to do a search.

But bottom line, my point is I have asked a thousand questions and have never been treated unfairly or rudely.

And respectfully, as a newbie I have not observed any sort of negative atmosphere. I still see the veteran RX8 owners and veteran rx8club.com members going out of their way to help new guys like me, and for that I am appreciative.

^^^ well put to be named,,,I ve found your questions well constructed so you usually get specific guidance and advice,,, I am not nearly as knowledgable as I would like to be nor as the senior memebers either but Ive been around for a while and like to think that I can find what I want when I want,,, It just seems to be the case that there are clear distinctions between people whom really are really seeking knowledge and those whom want to be spoon fed,,,

That's one of the problems. The elites are not *supposed* to help. They do because they *choose* to, which is excellent. But when they start feeling like they have to, then their patience with newbies can run thin. Very understandable, but it wears them out. I'd rather see the experts kick back and relax. At least enough to not get frazzled. There are enough of us with modest knowledge to share the load on the simpler stuff. Everyone except the forum owner (whose unceasing and backbreaking work is deeply appreciated) should aim at enjoying the site.

Ken

I made a list of names who "bash" me for telling n00bs to search, no elites on the list of course

and guess what, the funny thing is, those people hardly ever helped anyone else, even when it comes simple stuff like oil changes and weight. what makes them have the right to bash me in the first place ?

I think this is a problem.

I believe that newb bashing is healthy for a forum. Other than getting the entertainment value out of watching a few clueless newbs being decimated by the witty folks here on RX8club, I think newb bashing serves a higher purpose as a deterrent to starting worthless threads and posting disinformation. Becoming a member of RX8club should be a rite of passage. Every now and then, you’ll step on a land mine and get crushed by a more experienced and knowledgeable member, but you get back up, dust yourself off, and keep posting while you learn. This sort of dynamic raises the bar of the entire forum, and promotes engaging and productive discussion across all levels of members.

Pander to the newbs, and you destroy the catalyst that forces them to get up to speed and become contributors instead of leeching parasites.

As a newb, I've tried to search before posting and when I do post I've been getting respectful answers. However, I've been browsing the forums a while and I see both sides of the coin.

I think my biggest gripe agains the "search noob" response is that it is a minimalist approach to helping. These forums making conveying ideas quite a bit more difficult than speaking in person (even with all these emoticons :)), so it lowers the value of a minimalist approach even further.

What I'd like to see, and try to do, is to at least provide links to existing discussions. If the thread is dozens or hundreds of pages long, maybe an approx page number to start looking. It really doesn't take that much effort. Or if there are tons of threads on this topic already, suggest a few search words that would be most effective. A lot of times I'm sitting here thinking about something that might be discussed to death and have no idea what to search for.

And really, if you don't feel like making any helpful suggestions, there's really no reason to reply at all... "SEARCH NOOB!" might cute or funny to you, but really if the user on the other side just got here and hasn't had a clue on where to search or what to search for, and this is their first response to a question they're seriously concerned about, they'd feel like crap. If these guys actually do stick around, they will be the ones to relay this message to the next group that joins, and the chain continues. I hope we can stay away from that.

Am I on your list? :eyetwitch
:Eyecrazy: What happens to those on the list when you scratch them off? :)

They have no right. But they will. It becomes a problem if you let it.

Speaking as a long time veteran of usenet (which makes this place look like a lady's tea party) personal attacks and defenses tend to be pointless. Forum members figure who to respect and who to not respect from the original posts, not who gets in the last word.

FWIW, as I mentioned earlier, I do find most of the "Search, noob" posts to be tiresome. Not a criticism of anyone; just a personal artistic judgement. I did find Mugato's version entertaining, partly because of his avatar and partly because of his impassioned "For love of God!"

Ken

I agree with what you stated here.

The range of experience one finds on this site is pretty wide; widest I've seen in fact. Getting "newbs" up to speed who'll put out the effort should be one of its goals.

The site appears to have about 15-20 very serious enthusiasts and 4-5 people who do or could earn a living working on these cars.

It appears to have have countless people who'd have trouble changing their oil.

I think you need both and all that is in between to have a successful site.

To better facilitate this wide range, the site's organization could be modifed so that very basic questions are better separated from the more in depth discussions where you'll find the very serious to pros participating.

It's not that it's bad, it could be better.

Actually, I think it is set up that way. If you look at the index:

RX-8Discussion
This tends to be the catch all

Tech & Performance
Brakes down the different areas of interest

One would think so, but then you'll find too many "Help!!!! My A/C knob is broken" in the Tech and Performance section.

Haven't thought about how to organize it differently where such posts would be limited. Note I said limit, not prevent.

Not my original idea, but I'll suggest creating a Tech Lounge section for beginner mod and tech questions. Sticky the heck out of it with all the oil, mpg, etc. threads.

Have the description say "hey you stupid newbs! get your dumb asses in here!"

This worked well on another forum...

I agree, this site is very well broken out more so than many other car forums ive been on...Its quit clear that the pros tend to stick around in the tech and performance sections and their debates are outstanding when it comes to the depth of knowledge, these people get right down to the nitty gritty... I dont think ive ever even commented in a thread that was set up by RotaryGod or Mazmart, these guys knowlegde are well over my head, but the threads that seem to minor issues,, ie the ac knob example keeps getting repeated over and over,,, and most of the time when noobs are told to search politly they pull an attitude and snap back,,,I did serach thanks for the advice a-hole(apparently not enough).... and thats what ususally leads me to be more aggressive with the next person....

I love the idea of nycgps sig,, has intant info in his sig....

Fwiw the forum needs an upgrade. Every year there are more 8s produced and more aftermarket parts on the market. Yet the stickies that vets refer to are rarely maintained or upgraded. Most of a first page of a sticky is pretty worthless and searching gets harder and harder as the sheer volume of info - good and bad - makes finding answers to specific questions difficult.

Wiki posts maintained and updated by experienced members would go a long way to curtailing the repeat questions that make people who've answered them a 100 times ignore them on the 101st.

For the most part tho my experience has been a good one and if I'm looking for info about my car I can almost certainly find it somewhere on here. If I'm looking for people who are gonna be a little more tolerant of noobish questions I go to my regional thread and ask there. They know I'll return. The favor by buying a beer or two.

I don't think we should assume that because cheap 8's are everywhere that we should expect the quality of the discussion to go down...I was a bigger gearhead at 18 than I am now at 40. I remember the dumbest threads from years back, actually.

8's were 40+ grand (Canadian) when I bought in, the fact that kids can easily partake now means only that there's never been a better time to be a car enthusiast. Take it from me, I turned 16 and got my licence in '84...nothing but garbage available back then.

Although I have only been around since April 2008, I think part of what you are seeing has to do with the fact that back in 2004 everyone was in the "Honeymoon phase" with both their new RX8 and this messageboard. Everything was new to the members of this board and everything about the RX8 was new to the members.

For example (ficticious):

Someone might ask "Hey.....what is this button for?!?" and 732 rx8club.com members would ask "Yeah......what the hell is that button for, anyway?"

Eventually, someone would point out "Hey....that is the DSC button!" and 732 rx8club.com members would say "oh.....cool!" and the community would discuss this feature and learn as a whole.

Meanwhile, potential RX8 buyers ready to purchase a new RX8 would chime in asking "Do I need to get DSC or can I get by without it?" followed by discussion (and learning)

Eventually, someone would state "Hey.....DSC is fine on the public roads, but I wish we could disable it for track, that would be good, surely!" And within time someone would respond "You turn it off by pressing the button for 7 seconds......and please don't call me Shirley" and everyone on the board learned.

It is stuff like this that was part of the "Honeymoon phase" and that lent towards that "brotherly" atmosphere.

Now multiply that times every other feature and every inch of the car that was part of the initial learning curve. Another example would be someone saying "Hey.....this sure doesn't feel like the car has 250 hp as advertised!" and I think you will know what I am getting at.

I may be just a newbie, but I think it is fair to say that that honeymoon phase has passed, and people are now familiar with this board and their RX8's, and the "brotherly" feeling from learning about an introduction year car has passed.

But that does not mean that there is no brotherly or sisterly atmosphere here today, evidenced by the fact that the old vets, and even the newer vets, without fail, everyday it seems, are always willing to welcome new or potential RX8 owners, and have the patience to answer the same questions they were asking back in 2003.

And I think that when there is the occasional gruff "search, noob!" comment, just wait............it is usually followed by another poster explaining why they should search in a "nicer" tone, explaining how to search, why to search, even to the point that they provide a specific link to an existing thread, and sometimes just flat out answering the question.

Kumbaya.

I agree with alot of what To be named later said.
Forum is going thru a transition period where a big influx of 2nd hand buyers are coming in. And as new mixes with experience, there has been a little bit of surly-ness. Probably part of the natural evolution.

Personally, I think it is a waste of time and effort to even post "Search Noob", just as I think it was a waste of time a while back when people would put random one word posts out just to boost post count. But as was earlier said - if someone is randomly posting previously answered stuff all over, he deserves a little lesson here and there. It is part of learning to exist in the forum world.
Maybe I have thick skin (or a thick skull) but when someone told me to search, at least I knew the info was out there - and generally I got pointed to it soon enough.
I prefer that to just getting 0 replies.

I prefer the local sections and the local forum because you aren't as anonymous and words have reprecussions on your reputation. Too many people hide behind the inanets.

*edit* - Can we fix the Lounge next. Jeez, hasn't any one had an original idea lately.

it is somewhere in the middle right now.. as a troll hunter. not to be confused with a newb killer. i will say this..

i spent 6 months here before i got the car.. back then we all learned together..

not so much now..

i do sometimes post the how to search thread!! and this great link..

https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...25&postcount=4

wow, it is out there..

and another..

https://www.rx8club.com/new-member-forum-197/rx8-faq-new-owners-116484/

and i got to tell you if you ask a question that is in the owners manual. sorry. cant help you..

here is a good last post that if they were not lazy, or really wanted to learn. duh!

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-exterior-appearance-body-kits-27/whats-part-called-where-can-i-get-149920/

food for thought..

beers :beer:

I keep thinking this forum is getting increasingly worse, but then I head over to other boards. This is still one of the nicer communities around, really. Sure we have our bad eggs, and not everyone is as nice as they should be, but by and large, there's much less to complain about around here then you'll see at other boards.

Swoope, I like this one of yours better..

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/posting

i dont try to bash, i try n guide if i dont know...

I agree with To be named later: it's only polite to try to search for answers before making a post. I'm definitely a newb, both to this forum and to the RX-8, but I did a lot of reading here before buying my car and have done even more reading in the 2 months since then. Which, I think, is why the three question threads that I've started didn't get flamed.

That said, I learned my etiquette from years of being on other forums. The average 18-year-old might not have the same experience. So this is where they learn, and in that regard I think a certain degree of newb-bashing is only right.

Well, I guess it's time to toss out my .02. I am a loooooonnngggg time lurker. I've been reading the forum since 2005. Since I didn't own an RX8, I didn't feel I should have a username. I fell in love with the RX8 in 2004 and when I first found this forum I spent weeks just trying to absorb everything I could. I have yet to own the 8, however now that I have ordered it I'm sure I will be a lot more vocal. I have seen the "expierenced" and the "noobs". I've even seen some of the "noobs" take their smacks and learn enough to become "expierenced". While yes, there are some that are just @sses to be an @ss, the majority of the active community are always willing to help each other out and help someone who actually wants to LEARN about the rotary. Most of the "noobs" I've seen get smacked around are people who have their username for 5 minutes and begin with a series of questions even the Mazda sales guy can answer. "What kind of oil should I put in", "Why do I have to check the oil", "Why can't I outrun a mustang in a 1/4 mile", "How come my car just flooded I only had it on for like a min", etc. Yes, as the price drops more people will buy it and have stupid questions. Typically it is the same people that will have the same stupid questions a month from now. Some people just don't WANT to learn and I think it's ok if they get their hand smacked. RX8Club is a wealth of knowledge as many people have commented on, why have that wealth trashed by 1,000 threads of stupid questions making it difficult or impossible to find the knowledge of people like RotaryGod, Hymee, Jedi, and so many more available here?

If someone really wanted to learn, then they would do their research first. Whatever they can't find or are unclear about, then they should ask questions (even if it has been asked before). But some people ask questions that could be easily found on the Mazda website, for example. That just shows they're expecting to be spoonfed. Learning requires effort.

DIE ! :shocking: :shocking: :shocking:

j/k

nah, u're not. but if u want me to "add" you, let me know, alright ? hahahaha :wiggle: