eTiMaGo

OK, here's the story... Got myself a nice lil' RX-8, and offer one of my best friends (who has quite a bit of racing experience) to have a drive in it. His impressions:

Not enough power: Being an automatic (bad choice in retrospect I agree), it lacks the kick to quickly overtake on the highway. Even if I modify the engine there's only so much the tranny can handle, plus mods would be expensive.

Can't rely on engine braking: For a quick deceleration, if you're going too fast, the gearbox will not let you downshift in semiautomatic mode, so you need to rely solely on brakes, which would mean eventual quick fading and wear, and does not slow down quite as fast.

Not that much fun to drive: Sure, it's really well balanced and sharp handling, but you could have very similar handling, as well as bags of power from a WRX or similar, not to mention at a much lower price (at least over here, a WRX is almost 25% cheaper than the RX-8)

So of course I tell him that power isn't everything, his answer is that for the kind of speedy driving we'd do here, which is basically limited to the highways, sharp handling doesn't mean much. I tell him the car looks 100x better than an Evo or WRX, he answers sure, but do you drive a car from outside looking at it? And, that I could have easily gone for a secondhand near-new Boxster for a very similar price, which would have power, looks and handling, not to mention much higher brand prestige.

His overall impression of the car is that it does not feel like a car that cost that much. I keep telling him it's not a race car, but a versatile sports car, and he replies that his car which costs half as much (he drives an Accord Sedan V6 3.0, not a bad car really, but FWD and sensibly heavier) would out accelerate and out-run mine, and be a lot more comfortable in the process.

I know you guys all love your 8's, and I sure adore mine, but I now have the seeds of doubt planted in my head. I enjoy the rush of acceleration as much as the next guy, sure, but I've also always had a thing for lightweight, nimble cars (heck my previous dream car was the classic Mini Cooper...)

So, any suggestions on how to shut him up? I'd think a challenge on a technical track would be best, but I lack the racing skills (Gran Turismo certainly is a good teacher but no replacement for experience)

Man, this sucks, but I am sure many of you have experience similar criticism, and would realy like to hear your thoughts.

cstokes24

You have to buy the car YOU want and enjoy to drive. You can't worry about what others think and say. For all your friends racing knowledge and criticism, he drives the ultimate sports car.....a Honda Accord

Forget about what other people think........

hemanrulez

So lemme get this straight. This "guru" friend drives an Accord and is pissing all over you??

Yeah I'd definately listen to him.

hemanrulez

haha cstrokes you beat me by 1 sec.

eTiMaGo

Hahahah I know you guys would comment on that, but he's basically outgrown sports cars now, used to have a R34 skyline, raced NSX's. And, the Accord is locally considered a somewhat powerful, relatively fancy car out of most peoples' financial reach.

hemanrulez

in that case shouldn't the RX-8 be locally considered WAY outta reach.

If he's outgrown the Accord you can tell your friends you are cooler than the guys who need to prove their dicks bigger by driving a slightly faster car.

And BTW dude why do you need us to make up excuses for you. Dont sit at home, go out and drive this beaut of a car and you'll realise why you bought it.

cas2themoe

So you have the auto? I'll be the first to admit, I was just plain stupid for buying the Automatic RX8 at first. I had the auto for a couple months, went back in to test drive the manual and I was sold. I have never looked back. Straight line performance is much better in the 6 Speed RX8.

cleoent

If you really want to keep everything but get more speed, go get the 6 spd. If not, just enjoy the car. Once you take it on a track all those seeds of doubt will be gone, trust me.

I took my 1st gen rx7 auto to the track and fell in love all over again. Of course, the track was even more fun with my 1st gen rx7 5spd, but both were awesome.

Sephiroth

The V6 Accord will be faster than an auto RX-8, but it won't handle for ****. The body roll makes me puke; On the bright side at least it's not as bad as the camry .

The WRX is a completely different machine, completely different approach to handling. Not necessarily superior at all. Stock vs Stock with equally good drivers, the RX-8 will outhandle the WRX. Once you start talking about modified, there really is no use to arguing.

Seriously, if you care about straight-line performance then an auto is certainly not for you, and in fact the RX-8 is not for you either. The 6-speed RX-8's potential is just starting to be realized, it will take more time for power to be available in that car.

therm8

Straight line performance isn't everything. But it is nice. The tranny can handle plenty, don't worry about it. This one can handle whatever a stock FD AT can. Talking up WRX's and Sti/Evos for straightline performance only is silly. If I wanted pure straightline performance with decent handling, I'd buy an $8K Fbody. Drive what you like, and get a supercharger when they come out (*hurry up Hymee ). Then you'll have a better all around package.

As far as your friend, don't let his comments get to you, and he'll forget about it eventually. Take a road trip to some mountains, and bring him along.

spieder

That's like my friend who owns a 1998 Honda Civic 4door with 122hp auto. He would always bag on my Mazda3 auto with 144 hp. He drove it briefly a couple of times and he'd tell everybody how slow it was. Then his Honda broke and I let him drive the Mazda3 for 3 weeks. Now he loves the car.

There are design characterisitcs that it takes awhile to appreciate about a car. You can't get it in a 5 min drive. Sure my 3 wasn't that fast (still faster than his civic) but it did wheigh 500 pounds more than his car did. It took him a while to appreciate that the weight went into a stiffer chassis, more comfortable ride, more interior room, better handling, quiter ride etc.

Drive his accord and you'll notice a huge difference in vibration, floating, torque steer, seating position etc.

BTW someone will always have a faster car than you, a bigger house, a prettier wife, more money, a better job etc, more Christmas lights and etc. Get the idea.

amartin

You're quite right... one you start talking about modifications, there is no use arguing.. the WRX will simply OWN the RX-8, hands down.

In fact, stock vs. stock, the WRX handles better, and is quicker.

With little modification, the WRX surpases 280hp, and can easily achieve 300hp with a few more dollars.

The RX-8 is pretty much stuck at about 236hp (crank), and RWD. The WRX (and don't get me started about getting spanked by the STI) is also AWD, so I don't see HOW you seem to think in stock form the RX-8 is going to out handle the WRX.

BlueEyes

Since you apparently didn't read it spieder

Deslock

Wow eTiMaGo, the prices over here sure are different... with a street price of $24k USD, the RX8 6-speed isn't much more than a WRX and it's certainly not double the price of a V6 Accord.

Don't worry about what others say... unless they tell you to trade in for a 6-speed, in which case you should listen to them. I'm kidding! But really, get a 6-speed.

Just drive it and enjoy!

I had a 2002 WRX. Its boost rush was always smile-inducing and tearing up dirt roads and snowy parking lots was a blast. But compared to the RX-8 it suffered from significant understeer, mediocre steering and handling, horrible brakes, a loose shifter, and poor throttle response. The WRX wasn't nearly as responsive, balanced, and tossable. Subaru did tighten up the steering a bit on newer models and I'm not trying to diss the WRX... it's slightly faster than the RX-8, is fun to drive despite some deficiencies, and many of its weaknesses can be addressed through mods. But you're full of crap.

mikeb

you could buy a faster car if you want

Synergy RX-8

BTW, a guy down in PR put a 650 hp, Rotor, 20b engine in his car, used the stock tranny with some reinforment that he did himself, and it takes it fine, the tranny is pretty solid, but if you really want speed you bought the wrong car. Otherwise, if you like me and you just love driving this car, because you like it, then you like don't let you honda accord friend tell you what to like.

Mugatu

iTrader: (1)

who cares

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

the OE RX-8 tranny is anything but solid, it can't take 270hp long term, let alone 650hp

Ike

Stock for stock an RX-8 will outhandle a WRX. Put some new tires and wheels and a rear sway on the WRX and it would be pretty close. But stock for stock no way with the lousy all seasons the WRX comes with.

That being said I agree with a lot of what the friend of the original poster said. Especially the fact that in day to day driving having extra power is more fun and more useful that having the best handling car. I don't think I've ever taken my WRX to its limit on the streets nor would I take the RX-8 to its limits. I do however go wot several times a day, sometimes it's to merge sometimes it's just for kicks.

m477

Sorry, but even with new tires a WRX won't handle anywhere near as well as an RX-8. Look at autox results at the national level. You know, the ones that show the RX-8 cleaning up in B-stock. The fastest WRX isn't even remotely close to the fastest RX-8.

As for which is "better", it depends on where you are driving. Living in a place where there are curvy roads on the mountains and hills, I prefer a light car with sharp handling like the RX-8. However, in BFE middle of nowhere midwest, with nothing but long stretches of straight flat roads, something with a little more acceleration might be appropriate. However, in that case I would choose a V-8 over the lagmaster WRX, but that's just my personal prefrence.

Ike

Autox doesn't mean a whole lot to me. On a real track a WRX with a few minor upgrades could probably keep up pretty well. The best motoring video is a good example that I'm not off with my thinking, that was a regular old JDM WRX in those videos. Like I've said before, when I drive to work on an autox track never leaving second gear I'll care.

Also calling the RX-8 light is a bit silly considering the '05 or earlier WRX and the RX-8 with a few options weigh about the same. It's also silly calling the WRX a lagmaster considering how gutless the RX-8 is in low RPMs, drive the WRX in its powerband and lag isn't noticeable just like the RX-8. The WRX also had a wider more useful powerband.

toca

rx8 is light pu tmy on my racing scales it cam e in with a 1/2 tank at 2977 my homies wrx came in a 3190 with 1/2 ytank and then we put a eclipse gsx it was crazy it cam ein at 3200

guy321

Ike compliments the 8 over the WRX, and it isn't even April Fools Day!!


He IS unbiased!

m477

Autocross is an officially sactioned competive sport. Best motoring is *entertainment*. Big difference. Trying to "prove" something with a BM video is silly.

Anyway, my claim was that the RX-8 *HANDLES* much better than a WRX. What does what gear you're in have to do with how well a car handles? AutoX is about as pure of a test of a car's handling that you can get. And since the RX-8 is much, much faster than the WRX at autox, I think it's pretty safe to say that it handles better.

Track performance is a whole other thing entirely. A track tests a car's handling AND acceleration AND braking. We could get into a discussion of RX-8 vs WRX on the track (ie not just handling), but now we're getting off the current topic of handling...

The WRX does have significant turbo lag. Nothing about the RX-8 will change that fact. Besides, if you actually read my post I was comparing it to V-8's in straight-line driving.

sti_eric

Sorry, m477, I've driven both my STi and my wife's RX-8 in an autocross. The biggest advantage that the RX-8 has is not its handling, but the fact that you run the whole race between 6000-8500 rpms (its power band) in 1st gear. It is very difficult to keep a turbo'd 4 banger in its power band with the turbo spooled while continually having to shift between 1st and 2nd. Plus, if you take a look at nationals, you will see WRXs winning STX and STU classes with better lap times than the best RX-8 in B-stock. You won't see any modified RX-8s leaving B-stock, because they just won't be competitive. Autocross results do nothing to determine which car handles better.