tglander99

Anyone heard of HHO Booster? A hydrogen injection system. If anyone knows anything, can you post a note about this? If it works with piston engines, wouldn't it work with rotary as well?

zoom44

oh HELL NO!!

dont get roped into this crap. i heard someone trying to convince someone at 7stcok this past weekend about this hocum/snake oil. i nearly screamed.

every single person who believes it works, when asked to reproduce the effects for study, have been unable to show any improvements. at the most what might be happening is that there is a cleansing effect on older engines, removing carbon etc, from some of the water from being injected. there is simply not enough hydrogen gas being created to do ANYTHING

http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars...ileage/4310717

but baahhhh you know what? don't listen to me , don't listen to the people who have spent thousands of dollars to try to prove it or not.

go buy a kit and stick it on and let us know how it goes.

tglander99

Nah, I won't do it, just wondering if anyone has done it is all. I'm sure if this actually worked, then it would be used by everyone. Which is the way things usually go--stuff that doesn't work is marketed on the web to unsuspecting trolls.

DocBeech

iTrader: (1)

water cooling works, im suprised no one has water cooled an rx 8

badinfluence

YES HHO does work, and it works well. Few understand that HHO is NOT Hydrogen. It is a mixture that has been used in Welding Applications before modern techniques were invented for welding torches.

H-H-0 is not H-O-H, the bonding is different. You are making a flammable gas, but it is not Hydrogen. The amount required for a larger than 2.0L engine EFI car will outweigh the power required to produce enough of the gas to be flammable.

Because H-H-O is NOT a clean mixture, the Stoich AFR ratio will vary based on the purity of systems used. Mosy systems to see on eBay & cheap websites, don't expect it to work. It is extremely LOW. 2:1 is what you can expect from a professional kit. 6:1 is the best you can ever expect as it is mostly hydrogen.

Just like a Engine that ONLY burns Ethanol the compression ratio MUST be VERY VERY high. Diesel engines will see an improvement, but a petrol will not be able to make much power with the gas unless the mixture is leaned and the compression ratio of the engine is very high.

A professional welding setup, is what I would try if I was trying this. I would try it on a very small EFI engine like a 1L engine

The issue you have is compression. When you compress this gas it does not act in the same why hydrogen, petrol, or LP does. It takes the place of oxygen, and if to little of the gas is used, it confuses your O2 sensor and it runs richer than it should. (Almost the same as before you added the system), so your wasting Alternator power on nothing. If your system is professional and can regulate the Hydrogen production properly as it bonds to the O molecule, it CAN work as a secondary fuel, but not a primary. Hydrogen works as a primary fuel because it is precompressed, and comes out in a rush because of the temp of the bottle.


Mythbusters made themselves look very stupid by trying to run a Carb engine. I consider them a credible resource for testing, but in this instance they did not adequately test the theory. In order to test this idea, a measuring system for hydrogen must be present to see the purity of the gas produced. A "bubbler" is NOT accurate at all, because even O2 floats if it produced as a side effect. The engine they used was a carb and a worn engine that more than likely had a very low compression ratio when it was made, let alone now after it is worn out.

If you want proof it works, Google the phrase "limelight" .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limelight
They were used before commercial lighting was possible in the fashion used today. Hydrogen wasn't available like today, so Oxyhydrogen was generated.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxyhydrogen
Information is available IF you understand the science behind the operation and can understand what 90% of the people doing the test are doing wrong.

elysium19

iTrader: (1)

I don't understand how the bonding is different"
As a scientist and someone who's taken his fair share of chemistry classes (a few yeas ago, I'll add), I do not believe there is any way to covalently bond an oxygen with two hydrogen molecules together in any formation other than water as we know it.

Also, as a regular guy who can tell when something is not quite right, this smells like crap.
Oxyhydrogen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The popular mechanics link above is well-written and should give you all the basics of why it's crap....

badinfluence

It isn't crap, try to do it. Do everything in the kit besides the bubbler and light the mixture. I had a buddy try it with a mason jar because he didn't think it was working. He was picking glass out of his hand for a week. The lid is the only thing that saved his face from getting destroyed by the glass.

The bubbler is there to keep you from blowing yourself up.

poacherinthezoo

Hydrogen only has a 1s orbital (no p/d/f orbitals). Are you suggesting that hydrogen can simultaneously bond to another hydrogen atom AND oxygen at the same time? In which case both the hydrogen and the oxygen would be violating their duet/octet rules for stable electron configurations.

It doesn't take a PhD in chemistry to realize this is not a stable bonding configuration.



Here in lies the problem:

badinfluence

The argument "it doesn't work" has been foiled.

The process produces a flammable gas if properly executed.....The end.

What you choose to do with that gas has nothing to do with the theory. The fact is that it is a flammable gas, and it can combust. The end.

How the molecules bond isn't something that a normal person is going to care about. There is also a few ways to make the gas, in different forms.

For example, it has been proven that adding a PWM regulator to the electrodes decreases the power consumption and increases the results.

poacherinthezoo

Call it what you like but at the end of the day what is actually burning is hydrogen.

jasonrxeight

well here is your problem. just because you dont care about science doesnt mean it does not exist. regardless, there is many ways to burn hydrogen gas, just like there are many ways to burn gasoline. you can run it rich, you can run it lean. the ideal is 2:1 for burning hydrogen just like 14:1 for gasoline.

badinfluence

I do care about the science, but I don't really care to argue about it on a forum. If it was a more classroom or debate environment I would love to talk about it. All I am trying to prove is that HHO works on some level, not that it plain and simply "doesn't work."
The purity is what changes. I can't get into how the the bonds work, but I know it is called HHO because it bonds H-H-O. If it is properly done it will increase gas milage on self tuning cars and smaller 4cyl engines like a Geo Tracker or a Fiero.

2:1 isn't the Stioch ratio like I thought, it is a purity ratio. If you dig into that limelight it will explain a lot more about the interworkings.

You bring up a great point that I didn't. IT IS possible to run a car on HHO, BUT, you need a high compression ratio like diesel does. You can run a car on E100, but you need a 18:1 compression ratio to get good power out of it. I would think with HHO you would need a really really high ratio since it is uncompressed Hydrogen.