Peter Sawko

I've been reading posts in the Tech Garage section about the aftermarket exhaust systems and their claims that they can increase horsepower as mush as 10 hp.

Since the cost of a Borla System is being quoted at about $560 with less than an hour installation time I'm wondering why Mazda hasn't offered anything like this to us.

I'm assuming either they don't agree with the added horsepower assesments; they are concerned about how this would affect the engine or they don't want to be put in a position that would require them to provide this modification to all future cars.

The current offer would easily offset the costs for this modification if the increase is there and there are no significant downsides.

What are your thoughts?

o_town_racer

I seem to remember something like this with a Mustang Cobra a few yrs back and Ford's remedy was to install new exhaust and intake from aftermarket sources to raise the HP to the quoted levels. I'm guessing that Mazda is letting us RX-8 owners decide how we want to deal with the issue instead of making an arbitrary decision for us. In most cases, installing an aftermarket exhaust will significantly increase not only air-flow, but noise as well. By giving us the money to modify our cars as we wish, Mazda is recognizing their error, but not dictating our resolution. Perhaps an owner is fully satisfied with the power of their RX-8 and likes a quiet exhaust....then the $500 could be used for other goodies (dressup or otherwise).

Keep the shiny side up!

Turbo Matty P

if I remember correctly the HP issue was with the 99-00 Cobra. Ford placed a factory recall because cars were advertised to produce 320hp and were unable to outrun the 260hp GT. Fords response to this was to remove 2 catalytic converters and replace the other 2 with higher flowing pieces. They also removed the resonators. From what I understand Ford not only met but excceeded their previous claim of 320hp. I have a buddy who says his car is closer to 335hp. I would actually prefer the Borla system factory installed, first for warranty reasons and secondly, if I had a $500 visa card laying around my wife would use it to buy "girl-crap". This motor has a lot more to offer than 238hp. It's just going to take a bit of time to figure out what mods work best. Don't think Mazda will rest on their laurels.

mikeb

I'm just glad my 500 is on the way and I look forward to exhaust, intake and header mods

Peter Sawko

First thanks for these responses. It seems I'm not the only one that has considered this.

Two issues were raised, one regarding additional noise and the other regarding warranty.

On the warranty, other posts indicate that the Mazda warranty would remain intact except on the exhaust system unless a problem were traced to the exhaust modification. Also. Borla has a lifetime warranty on their exhausts. Do you all think that a Mazda dealer could be trusted to install this? According to Borla it's a simple 30 minute job.

On the noise issue other posts on this site claim no decibel increase but instead a tonal change. The current pipe is nice but I'm not sure a lower tone would be offensive enough to offset the advantage of increased hp.

Does anyone disagree about the claimed increases?

mikeb

honestly I wouldn't have mazda install exhaust
I'm in cali and there is many aftermarket tuner shops that I think will go a beter and probably less expensive install

DijabutiA

i think the horsepower issue stems from everybody burning rich, since rotarys arent known for quality emmisions i dont think an "aftermarket" exhaust is something Mazda can do
regardless of raw numbers, its still pulling 14.5's like they said

Peter Sawko

are you saying an added 10 hp will not increase performance?

bureau13

Well, Mazda DID say that subtracting 9 hp didn't affect performance... :-D

As for Mazda using the Borla (or any aftermarket) exhaust as a remedy for their power problems...I don't see it happening. There are potential for noise and emmissions issues...not that a cat-back is going to really affect emissions, but is it CARB certified yet? Well, maybe...but Mazda isn't going to want to get into dealing with all of that for some aftermarket piece. Plus, how can they deny your warranty claims due to unapproved exhaust if they're the ones who put it on? (Cynical? Me?)

jds

dcfc3s

Mazda designed the car to be as quiet as possible. For no apparant reason, all RX-7's have also been VERY quiet stock - seems like they'd let a little noise out of the car considering it's a sports car . I can sympathize with the '8, since it's supposed to be a more comfortable sports car for budding families.

Anyhow, Mazda does have pretty strict noise regulations they have to meet as a car manufacturer, same as emissions regulations. As a user, these regulations don't mean much - we're not held to the same standard. Makes sense, considering the majority of the cars on the road aren't modified in any way - most of the cars on the road are quiet .

There is absolutely zero rocket science involved installing a cat-back - even with inadequate tools and doing it the first time, you're looking at maybe an hour. Fortunately this will be on a relatively new car that doesn't have an exhaust that's rusted together . There's two nuts that hold the cat-back to the cat, then a few rubber hangers that you have to slip off - that's it, the cat-back is on the ground. Paying someone to install a cat-back should be a crime . I could almost understand on an American car that has to have the exhaust cut and welded to remove or install new stuff, but on a Japanese car it's all bolt- on.

Dale

Peter Sawko

Thanks for the installation info.

This noise issue has got me going! Am I going to sound like a kid racer? I don't want to be getting fines for noise polution.

I'm going to ask Borla about the warranty, emissions and noise issues raised here.

Any further comments are appreciated.

Thanks

Turbo Matty P

Peter, don't worry about borla's sound. They are arguably the best exhaust manufacturer in the world. The tone of a Brola system is very much like a snarl. Think 2003 Mustang GT without the volume and you'll get the point. I used Borla on my supercharged Contour SVT and it was AMAZING. Around 4500rpms the car almost roared at passerbys! Borlas don't make volume increases as much as tonal changes. the deep, slight burble (from a piston engine) is very nice. I'm not real sure how the rotory engine will sound, but I can't imagine Borla releasing substandard equipment.

Xenophanes

I own a 2001 Mustang with a Borla cat-back exhaust (yes I know it isn't an 8, but just hang with me here). First off I must say that the Borla exhaust is exquisite. It is 100% stainless steel with mandrel bent piping. Second, as far as I know all of Borla's mufflers and cat-backs have a million mile warrantee. The steel will not rust over time.

The sound on my Mustang is amazing. At idle it rumbles. At WOT it rips. If you drop off after WOT it pops and sutters.... sounds great! Borla mufflers don't drone like some other performance mufflers such as Flowmasters and such and it doesn't sound fake like Spintechs (which sound annoyingly raspy) or rice-ish such as Magnaflows. You won't get pulled over for noise. It isn't like a kazoo ricer muffler.

I recently moved to California in 2002 with my Mustang. I had installed the cat-back earlier that year. Upon switching to a Ca resident, I had to go to one of the certified smog places (you know... the kind that don't cheat). Basically they made me take off my CAI because it wasn't CARB certified, but they allowed me to get tested with the exhaust. The guy didn't look twice. Additionally, it didn't change my emissions profile. If anything it had less pollutants than with my stock exhaust.

The Borla cat-backs usually consist of pipes which you bolt together. The fit is good. The exhaust hangers/brackets they provided with the kit were a little bit shotty looking, but they are much stronger than the stock exhaust hangers (your not going to see them anyway). Install on my mustang took only 2 hours (took us 1 and 1/2 hours to remove the stock exhaust).

Before I get flamed.... I am working on a deal now. I just need to get a good trade-in value on my stang.

mikeb

I dont know
borla is american
Borla is good for mustang,svt,camaro
But, I think I'm gonna wait for greddy, HKS and others for my exhaust

Turbo Matty P

hahaha, racist!!

Lee Chun

most of you whining about 10hp can't even drive the full 238..

mikeb

you dont even have the car

Digisan

Sounds like an SCC article, LOL. Ohhh ahhh, it needs to be JDM or it isn't cool.

Winning_BlueRX8

Have any of you heard/seen the ad for spiralmax? It is a small device that fits inside of (i'm not very technical, sorry) a car's air hose and creates a vortex of air that is supposedly supposed to increase HP and gas mileage.... Anyone tried it out? They boast an increase of HP ranging from 0-11 HP or so.

Napboy

put on your flame suit, then seach for the vortex intake. sounds like the same thing. total joke.

mikeb

think about it
How many mustangs , camaros, firebirds use apex, blitz, HKs exhaust.
They dont they use borla, flowmaster , etc

Digisan

What is the relevance of your statement?

mikeb

point being
most american cars use american products
most imports use import parts

Digisan

There will be alot of aftermarket american parts for the 8. I think I will buy from the locals, that way if I need tech support it's easy to communicate.

mikeb

what are you saying people that work for greddy in Irvine california can't speak english