Renesis_8

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/01/10/d...y-and-outback/

A link to the new 2008 Legacy. With a 3.0L H6 boxer engine.

"The 2008 model year also marks the debut of the range-topping Legacy 3.0 R, transplanting the 3-liter DOHC 245-hp Flat-6 engine that's already under the hood in its Outback sister car. Paddle-shifters for the 5-speed auto are also new, and the car bobs and weaves on a Bilstein suspension setup. And while it may not have the clout of a premium German badge, the 3.0 R makes a compelling case against the usual suspects from Europe."

The new facelift is really ugly, and they'll price it above the 2.5GT.

IMO this car wont sell at all. It'll be in lexus/infiniti terriority. For a little less speed, I would get a IS250 AWD, and G35 AWD sedan w/ 300hp for more $.

I have always liked Subaru, but the recent face lifts and interior changes/lack of changes makes me worry about what their future plans are. Are they following Toyota and Honda in making boring cars? B/c there is no future in that, they're too good at it.

The 2.5GT spec B was an interesting car, but they're discontinuing it. And there probably wont be a Legacy STi coming anytime soon/if at all. That leaves the Impreza STi, and i hope they dont screw up the next face lift. The EvoX looks good now, but again its not about looks for these AWD rockets.

Although Subaru has always been a AWD only company, with the market shifting towards RWD for performance now, I wonder if Subaru will take a hit. Also AWD drivetrains are slowly making way into most mid-size sedans. Soon it'll be standard. Subaru is really lacking a selling point for their cars. I am not asking how they got thru the past with AWD only, but the future seems even tougher for them. Last I checked, their sales have not grown by much yearly, maybe 1%? when the domestics are in red. Even Mazda is racking up sales in recent years.

Last but not least, engine. Can they keep up with the competition? Turbocharging gives their engines a lot of potential, but they're really weak on the NA side. 4 and 6 cyclinders. Also there comes fuel economy, reliability (if they turn up the boost the meet competition), and the turbo-shy crowds.

Anyone know what they're doing / planning to do?!!?
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Ike

Well, for one... Subaru has set yearly sales records in each of the last 4 years and Dec. '06 was their highest monthly sales in their history. Seems to me they're doing just fine... Subaru was also the only car line to get a recommended rating for every car in their lineup by Consumer Reports magazine, a feat even Honda nor Toyota could match.

The 3.0R is not a replacement for the Spec B and they will continue to offer the 2.5 L turbo version along with the 6 cylinder. It's simply another engine option. The facelift is a minor one and makes the car look better in mine and many other peoples opinions. It got rid of the ugly overhang that the USDM cars had that many people complained about.

AWD is getting more and more popular and this is going to continue to help Subaru even if other car companies are adding AWD models. So whats the problem here? Your worries are unfounded and lack any sort of cogent argument.

Japan8

+1

dmc27

Yeah, kinda contradicting yourself. After commenting on the new look you say "its not about looks for these AWD rockets" - plus "For a little less speed, I would get a IS250 AWD, and G35 AWD sedan w/ 300hp for more $"??? Makes no sense.

If it's not about the looks, what's it about? I would guess speed. So if you buy on looks you don't go for and evo or subie (sorry Ike - the evo is fugly) - and if you buy for speed, you don't spend extra on a lexus that doesn't perform as well.

Personally, I'd go subie if I wanted AWD, with a brief look into the evo. Subie gets awards for their engines & performance all the time.

Renesis_8

Sorry for the confusion, but i was referring only to the STi about its looks+AWD rocket. And IS250, G35 are more direct competitors to the soon to be released 3.0L Legacy.

I know its not happening yet, but I believe when Camry/Accords/Mazda6 are equpped with an AWD option, many would go that route. And in fact the next gen Mazda6 will come with AWD as an option.
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dmc27

Oh. Well, I've always thought the Impreza platform is ugly. The new nose taken from the tribeca just makes it worse, so I guess I'll agree w/you on the new facelift being worse. Looks like they added a cleft lip to an already ugly child.

I love the legacy, but I see your point about the AWD 6 - b/c the 6 has a nicer look. But none of 'em are different enough to really put that big a dent in the subie sales.

eqt2010

Not all AWDs are the same...
Do some research and then you'll know why Subaru's AWD is so famous.

terrypk1

i think you have a good point here. the subi in my opnion is UGLY and in terms of preformance (not the sti) they are not that good with the G35 and IS350 and the BMW 3 series. Though i do believe that subaru has the best AWD system among other manufactures, how many people will actually go and do research about the AWD system. To most people, as long as there is an AWD system, the system is all the same despite different companies.
so i think it's gonna be harder for subi to sell since their interior sucks and look ugly.

Astral

Who the hell is the designer at Subaru? Time for someone to get fired!

Just when I thought the look couldn't get any worse. Here's to the look of the GC8 2.5 RS coupe, the last great looking Subaru.

Renesis_8

Well, good thing is that they didnt give the legacy the "airplane lift". the one on impreza and the martian tribeca......

Also i learned that the spec.B sold very well after some browsing on the legacy forum. but... they're discontinuing it...

Oh did I mention that they're overcrowding the steering wheel?!

edit: the major blow to the subaru crowd is that the wagon is dropped.

It'll only be legacy sedans and outback wagons. no wagons for legacy and sedans for outback.

editx2: this makes me laugh, a post from the legacy forum.


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dmc27

nice. New slogan:

Subaru - Let's face it, you're getting uglier and fatter, why shouldn't your ride?

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Maybe thats why Toyota owns Subaru and use Subaru's plant to make Toyota's car. Oh I mean Fuji Heavy Industry.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

^^ yup.

For example if you compare Mazda's AWD (MS6) to Any Subaru's AWD .....

Ike

Toyota doesn't own Subaru. They own 8.7% of the shares which they bought from GM in 2005. It's a good partnership and much better than GM.

There have been no official collaborations yet so I don't know what you're talking about when you say Toyota uses Subaru plants to make Toyota cars. Subaru later this year will be helping produce some Camrys in the US but that's it. But that's a good thing for Subaru. It takes the place of Isuzu at the plant which has been running under capacity since they pulled out in 2003. It also means Toyotas quality control systems will be put in place. Subaru will learn from the best in the business and increase revenue by producing the Camrys. Seems like a win win situation to me...

VikingDJ

Now here's a Subaru that would make the STI and EVO look like petty wanna be's in every single aspect including looks and performance. Too bad it can't ever see production, and was only made to showcase themselves.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0hDqlASKHc

Ike

That's not really a Subaru, although it is a very cool car. It's also not much faster than an Evo FQ-400.

terrypk1

woo. prodrive. COOOl. i have seen the pictures from 2 years ago. i thought it would only be a concept, but hay, it's real.
well, i think the subaru people should take a closer look at this awesome car based on their engines.