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Thoughts on RX-9 Engine

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Old 07-19-2018, 09:07 PM
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Thoughts on RX-9 Engine

I know we've been talking about the "RX-9" for like 12 years now but, once again, Mazda has gone and stirred the pot with the RX-9 rendering and supposed info from sketchy sources saying the production version will be showcased this October. The link below is supposedly a rendering, but we've seen these before. The only difference this time is the number of websites reporting it. That doesn't make it true, but it does look more like what I'd expect from Mazda.

https://www.motor1.com/news/249330/m...tary-comeback/

Honestly, I don't care about the car. I want to see the new engine. Or more importantly, I want to see if the new engine has fixed a lot of the issues we've had with the Renesis and, secondly, if will it fit in an RX-8. Obviously it's all rumors and speculation right now, but with talk of 400hp w/ stock turbo, better low end torque, and better thermal efficiency, I can't help but get a little excited at the idea of waiting for someone like Brettus to get their hands on one in the next few years and stuff it into an 8.

That being said and with this all being the same smoke and mirrors 12 years later, the actual specs don't matter to me as much until they official specs are released. I'm just curious what other folks are thinking about this, if at all and would you drop in a "SkyActiv-R" to your 8 if it really is everything the websites claim it to be?
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Old 07-19-2018, 09:31 PM
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Old 07-19-2018, 09:43 PM
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If they ever make another rotary car(that's not just a range extender), they won't sell the new rotary alone like Chevy sells their LS engines.

I'd rather wait at this point. I mean, the beige-mobile maker decided to finally bring something exciting to the table... and forgot to offer a manual option. Big oops.
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Old 07-19-2018, 10:44 PM
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200, I thought I was pretty clear on being skeptical but perhaps not enough. Do I think they'll build another rotary vehicle? Sure. Does that mean I'm buying into everything being reported by every website out there? No. But like everyone else on this forum, I've got a soft spot for the rotary and I'd rather swap rotor for rotor than go piston if I can help it.

JinX, agreed, I do not think they'd sell the engine by itself. Even if they did, sitting just outside Phoenix I have access to some pretty impressive u-pick type junk yards. If the engine were to live up to the hype or even just have better performance/reliability than the Renesis, I could see myself keeping an eye out for when the stereotypical rich-kid swings his tail end into a Jersey barrier and junks it.
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Old 07-19-2018, 10:47 PM
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i know what ya mean i just doubt it will happen. i think we would all like another rotary but im very doubtful
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Old 07-19-2018, 10:53 PM
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If all you want is an engine, you might have better luck with Pratt&Whitney, they've also filed some patents. Or, you know, unicorn tear injection.
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Old 07-20-2018, 09:33 AM
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Did we really need this?

I vote to lock or merge.



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Old 07-20-2018, 09:37 AM
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Nothing personal OP, if it was up to me all of the RX9/Vision/Concept threads would be locked until Mazda officially announced a production run, and not another concept.
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Old 07-20-2018, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by BigCajun View Post
Nothing personal OP, if it was up to me all of the RX9/Vision/Concept threads would be locked until Mazda officially announced a production run, and not another concept.
No worries. I can understand the frustration of rampant conjecture basically adding nothing productive to our conversations and debating imaginary or unsubstantiated numbers.

Mod are more than welcome to delete.
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Old 07-21-2018, 08:35 AM
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I doubt Mazda will ever make a production rotary again. The 13b-MSP was a failure, it was a step backwards from the 13b-REW as far as durability and power.

In an age where a Mustang GT can be bought from the factory and fitted with a twin turbo or blower and make 700-1000hp with relative ease, how can Mazda ever think they will compete with a engine that puts out 150 lb/torque and shatters like glass with any appreciable amount of boost?

In the last 20 years, piston engines are getting stronger, more reliable, better fuel mileage, etc.

Rotary engines have stagnated. Unless there is a significant advancement in rotary technology, the rx8 is likely the last car with a rotary.
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Old 07-21-2018, 10:21 AM
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That Renny had a different purpose than a REW, not quite a step backwards. If Mazda saw a market for another RX7, they could easily go back to peripheral port and turbos. A Corolla engine is not a step backwards from a 3sgte, different purposes.

The problem is rotary or no rotary, there isn't a big market for such a car, and Mazda need to move volume to grow. They can't afford to waste production and research money on small volume halo cars. Even the RX8 was a gamble.

So is there a purpose where a rotary still has an advantage over pistons? I don't see one on land. Sea or air, different story.
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Old 07-21-2018, 01:55 PM
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The way I see it, it's pointless to have a powerful ICE, really. Electric motors are proven to be superior in straight-line acceleration.

Focusing on handling is a bit more viable IMO. Electric cars are all still pretty heavy due our limited battery tech, so ICE still has an edge here.

Also, it looks like Mazda will be sticking to the side port from this point on. It's hard as it is to meet emission standards.
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Old 07-28-2018, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by strokercharged95gt View Post

Rotary engines have stagnated. Unless there is a significant advancement in rotary technology, the rx8 is likely the last car with a rotary.
I thought the 16X solved a lot of issues with the Renesis, but they never put it into production because there wasnít a market for it and Mazda didnít have the resources to put it out
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Old 07-28-2018, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by MAstray1990 View Post


I thought the 16X solved a lot of issues with the Renesis, but they never put it into production because there wasnít a market for it and Mazda didnít have the resources to put it out
It was proposed around the time period of the global recession. That was its main problem.
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Old 07-28-2018, 02:35 PM
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When there is some independent tests on the new 16X, I will believe the Mazda engineers.

Remember when the rx8 was advertised with 250 hp (215-220rwhp)?

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Old 07-28-2018, 03:04 PM
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If 16X ever comes out in a production car, it would probably be much more expensive than an RX-8.

One of the highlights for that engine is that the whole thing is made of aluminum, including the side plates(which has always been made of cast iron). That will increase the cost.
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Old 07-28-2018, 04:19 PM
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As much as I loathe discussing the hypothetical Mazda RX9/Vision fantasy, the bugaboo they face is emissions.
As long as they have oil injection into the combustion chamber for lubrication purposes, I highly doubt they'll ever meet the stringent, current emissions standards.
It's why I don't put any faith in the future of the rotary.
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Old 07-30-2018, 05:42 PM
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Obviously it is old news that Mazda or anyone in the auto industry will not produce a rotary/wankel powered vehicle. My question is what is the general consensus of the concept or looks of the proposed vehicle? Would you buy one if it was powered by a piston engine? I personally like the design and would consider it.
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Old 07-30-2018, 05:52 PM
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The rendering actually looks great, but even with a piston engine, I hope it's not just another I4T. Too many options on the market nowadays.

I can accept it if it's an I6 or V6 but even that's getting tougher nowadays.
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Old 07-30-2018, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Leo13 View Post
Obviously it is old news that Mazda or anyone in the auto industry will not produce a rotary/wankel powered vehicle. My question is what is the general consensus of the concept or looks of the proposed vehicle? Would you buy one if it was powered by a piston engine? I personally like the design and would consider it.
It can't be an RX without a rotary, and REs don't count.
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Old 07-30-2018, 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Gr8White View Post
I know we've been talking about the "RX-9" for like 12 years now but, once again, Mazda has gone and stirred the pot with the RX-9 rendering and supposed info from sketchy sources saying the production version will be showcased this October. The link below is supposedly a rendering, but we've seen these before. The only difference this time is the number of websites reporting it. That doesn't make it true, but it does look more like what I'd expect from Mazda.

https://www.motor1.com/news/249330/m...tary-comeback/

Honestly, I don't care about the car. I want to see the new engine. Or more importantly, I want to see if the new engine has fixed a lot of the issues we've had with the Renesis and, secondly, if will it fit in an RX-8. Obviously it's all rumors and speculation right now, but with talk of 400hp w/ stock turbo, better low end torque, and better thermal efficiency, I can't help but get a little excited at the idea of waiting for someone like Brettus to get their hands on one in the next few years and stuff it into an 8.

That being said and with this all being the same smoke and mirrors 12 years later, the actual specs don't matter to me as much until they official specs are released. I'm just curious what other folks are thinking about this, if at all and would you drop in a "SkyActiv-R" to your 8 if it really is everything the websites claim it to be?

Anyone else notice the wheels are 4 lug? what's up with that?
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Old 07-30-2018, 08:31 PM
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It' a clue! 4 rotors!!
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Old 07-31-2018, 08:49 AM
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There's no statement in that article regarding the provenance of that render. I'd bet dollars to donuts that Motor1 just had somebody whip that up for them to generate click-bait.
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Old 07-31-2018, 11:23 AM
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Because it is just that easy to whip up a rendering of that complexity not to mention the somewhat stellar aesthetics .

Originally Posted by NotAPreppie View Post
There's no statement in that article regarding the provenance of that render. I'd bet dollars to donuts that Motor1 just had somebody whip that up for them to generate click-bait.
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Old 07-31-2018, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Leo13 View Post
Because it is just that easy to whip up a rendering of that complexity not to mention the somewhat stellar aesthetics .
If you're good at your job and being paid for it, sure. Happens all the time.
Look at all of the previously posted crap from Motoring.com.au...

https://www.motoring.com.au/mazda-rx...ked-in-103563/
There, they say that Holiday Auto magazine whipped up those renders while claiming that the RX-9 is "locked in".

More on the autojourno press screwing with RX enthusiasts...
Notice in the above article that they say that the RX-9 is "not due to go on sale globally until January 2020", implying that this is the official on-sale date. But if you read the article they cite (their own), that figure comes from... their own asses. There's nothing in the cited article stating anything about 2020 except their own speculation.

Why do I bring that up? Because the motoring press loves to crow about things that get clicks. If it were a genuine Mazda render, indication some kind of movement on the project, every single car website would be posting it and claiming it's from Mazda rather than one website not making any claims about where it came from.
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