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So... my engine just went... what now?

Old 08-02-2018, 11:03 PM
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So... my engine just went... what now?

Driving home the other day and pretty sure the apex seals failed, getting it checked out this monday. Started talking with the wife about options if indeed it needs a new engine. She currently drives a 2015 Yukon, use it mostly for the kids, so I have not presented this to her yet but she has expressed some interest in a minivan (yes, i know, we're all shaking our heads..) so we sell the yukon, get a cheaper minivan, i get a Colorado/ Canyon with the diesel in it and keep the 8 to eventually put a new engine in it. Anyone have any experience with the Colorado/ Canyon with the diesel engine? Ever since they came out i've wanted one. How about recommendations on a minivan? Or I'm open to other ideas, pretty much comes down to needing a car to get me to work.
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Old 08-02-2018, 11:17 PM
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why do you think you lost an apex seal? if you buy a mini van, shread your man card. i have a friend with a colorado its a quad cab that she ordered with a v8, zr1 or zr2 cant remember the #. anyway its a great little truck but the bed is pretty useless. we went kayaking and the boats were hanging more than half way out
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Old 08-02-2018, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by 200.mph View Post
why do you think you lost an apex seal? if you buy a mini van, shread your man card. i have a friend with a colorado its a quad cab that she ordered with a v8, zr1 or zr2 cant remember the #. anyway its a great little truck but the bed is pretty useless. we went kayaking and the boats were hanging more than half way out
The reason i think it was an apex seal is because i got it to start but it was struggling pretty bad to stay running. The original failure happened when i was accelerating up an on ramp, took it to red line like i like to do, about the time i hit 9k it sounded like the car backfired (which it's never done before) shifted up a gear and eased into the throttle and it started vibrating really bad and had very little power, within 15 seconds the check engine light started flashing, pulled to the side of the road and shut it off. Towed it home, the next morning attempted to see if it would start (usually starts right up) cranked for about 15 seconds before it started, it revved to 2k like it normally does when it's cold, then almost immediately settled to idle and was jumping from 600 to 900rpm, so shut it down after about 10 seconds of that. I should probably mention my 8 is a 2007, has 67k on the odometer, and this is it's first engine, which I've taken care of religiously since i purchased the car 4 years ago.
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Old 08-03-2018, 12:13 AM
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how old is ignition? does it have a cat? what codes?
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Old 08-03-2018, 02:23 AM
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Originally Posted by 200.mph View Post
how old is ignition? does it have a cat? what codes?
replaced coils, wires and plugs at 48K, yes it has a cat, and idk what the codes are. None of the local auto stores will let me borrow a scanner. You thinking it might've been the cat that failed? clogged the exhaust stream?
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Old 08-03-2018, 07:26 AM
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Dude, quit being a macho idiot and get the wife a damned minivan. They're good cars whose only failing are the idiots who believe the combined misogyny and misandry when their peers say they aren't manly because women use them to drive kids around. What's more manly than getting **** done with your kids in a vehicle perfectly designed for the task? Besides, it's not for YOU so what do you care?

Regarding the '8: Check your ignition components and catalytic converter. Get a compression test. Gather data now, speculate later.
Jumping to conclusions like this is usually a sign that you're subconsciously looking for a reason to make a change.

That said, worst case scenario, it will be about $3k for a Mazda reman motor and $1k for fluids/tools/incidentals. If you're of below average handyness then add at least $1.2k for R&R, more if you go to a dealer.

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Old 08-03-2018, 07:33 AM
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Pull the plugs and see what's on them. Oil, metal fragments, coolant, etc. And get those codes read.

​If the plugs look clean/normal, the problem is elsewhere. Ignition would be my first guess, could be as simple as a spark plug wire got loose.
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Old 08-03-2018, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by NotAPreppie View Post
Dude, quit being a macho idiot and get the wife a damned minivan. They're good cars whose only failing are the idiots who believe the combined misogyny and misandry when their peers say they aren't manly because women use them to drive kids around. What's more manly than getting **** done with your kids in a vehicle perfectly designed for the task? Besides, it's not for YOU so what do you care?

Regarding the '8: Check your ignition components and catalytic converter. Get a compression test. Gather data now, speculate later.
Jumping to conclusions like this is usually a sign that you're subconsciously looking for a reason to make a change.

That said, worst case scenario, it will be about $3k for a Mazda reman motor and $1k for fluids/tools/incidentals. If you're of below average handyness then add at least $1.2k for R&R, more if you go to a dealer.
A mini-van is a trophy to one's virility!
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by NotAPreppie View Post
Dude, quit being a macho idiot and get the wife a damned minivan. They're good cars whose only failing are the idiots who believe the combined misogyny and misandry when their peers say they aren't manly because women use them to drive kids around. What's more manly than getting **** done with your kids in a vehicle perfectly designed for the task? Besides, it's not for YOU so what do you care?

Regarding the '8: Check your ignition components and catalytic converter. Get a compression test. Gather data now, speculate later.
Jumping to conclusions like this is usually a sign that you're subconsciously looking for a reason to make a change.

That said, worst case scenario, it will be about $3k for a Mazda reman motor and $1k for fluids/tools/incidentals. If you're of below average handyness then add at least $1.2k for R&R, more if you go to a dealer.
lol I've never been hesitant to get the minivan for my wife, they really have some neat features in them these days. "IF" it is the engine I am more then capable of swapping or even rebuilding it myself, I've rebuilt multiple engines before and have all the tools (besides an engine hoist) to do so. What i don't have is the time, which usually results in me paying someone to do the work for me. It's going to the dealer on Monday to get a compression test done, but before then i'll be checking a few things.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Loki View Post
Pull the plugs and see what's on them. Oil, metal fragments, coolant, etc. And get those codes read.

​If the plugs look clean/normal, the problem is elsewhere. Ignition would be my first guess, could be as simple as a spark plug wire got loose.
Thanks for the advice, i will definitely pull the plugs before i take it anywhere.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:14 AM
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minivans
I don't like minivans, principally on styling and some of the packaging of drivetrain components. Practicality-wise? They are amazing. Honda has made the Odyssey a pretty good looking family hauler, I can't really think of a compelling minivan besides it or the Chrysler Pacifica, but I'm not too well informed of that segment either. Seems people are really lapping up the CUV/semi-SUV market, and manufacturers are putting a lot into that segment because of it. Mazda, FIAT, and GM's family of brands all have good options here for families.

At the end of the day, remember that it will be your wife driving it, and it should make her happy above all else; if a minivan is what she wants and it makes financial sense, a minivan she should have.

Colorado/Canyon
I, like you, lust for a Colorado/Canyon, likely with the diesel. The V6 is fantastic, but it is still a hi-po car engine at the end of the day, and shows it with the better top-end power than anything else. The diesel is a from the ground up truck engine and said to be a reliable one at that. I'd say drive both back to back and make your own decision on which fits you best.

I really wanted a ZR2 until I spent some time with it. The real standout for them is the shocks, the appearance stuff is fluff and I was disappointed to find out the hood is not actually vented, it is just decorative plastic. If they were only 1-2k more than a Z71 second-hand, I might still be on-board, but the Z71 offers some solid multi-terrain chops, hauling capability, and comfort inside a good balance of vehicle size.

RX-8
It is possible you ate a seal, the conditions were right for it, however it is still possible something else happened. You'll need a compression test and visual inspection to validate.

I'd get a reman for it and call it a day, especially right now as Mazda has been providing almost all-new hard parts, making it essentially a new motor.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Aweaver2112 View Post
lol I've never been hesitant to get the minivan for my wife, they really have some neat features in them these days. "IF" it is the engine I am more then capable of swapping or even rebuilding it myself, I've rebuilt multiple engines before and have all the tools (besides an engine hoist) to do so. What i don't have is the time, which usually results in me paying someone to do the work for me. It's going to the dealer on Monday to get a compression test done, but before then i'll be checking a few things.
If you're near Chicago, I can help you. We could probably knock it out in about 12 hours if nothing else breaks.
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by NotAPreppie View Post
If you're near Chicago, I can help you. We could probably knock it out in about 12 hours if nothing else breaks.
Thanks for the offer but I'm in northern utah...
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Old 08-03-2018, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by furansu View Post
minivans
I don't like minivans, principally on styling and some of the packaging of drivetrain components. Practicality-wise? They are amazing. Honda has made the Odyssey a pretty good looking family hauler, I can't really think of a compelling minivan besides it or the Chrysler Pacifica, but I'm not too well informed of that segment either. Seems people are really lapping up the CUV/semi-SUV market, and manufacturers are putting a lot into that segment because of it. Mazda, FIAT, and GM's family of brands all have good options here for families.

At the end of the day, remember that it will be your wife driving it, and it should make her happy above all else; if a minivan is what she wants and it makes financial sense, a minivan she should have.

Colorado/Canyon
I, like you, lust for a Colorado/Canyon, likely with the diesel. The V6 is fantastic, but it is still a hi-po car engine at the end of the day, and shows it with the better top-end power than anything else. The diesel is a from the ground up truck engine and said to be a reliable one at that. I'd say drive both back to back and make your own decision on which fits you best.

I really wanted a ZR2 until I spent some time with it. The real standout for them is the shocks, the appearance stuff is fluff and I was disappointed to find out the hood is not actually vented, it is just decorative plastic. If they were only 1-2k more than a Z71 second-hand, I might still be on-board, but the Z71 offers some solid multi-terrain chops, hauling capability, and comfort inside a good balance of vehicle size.

RX-8
It is possible you ate a seal, the conditions were right for it, however it is still possible something else happened. You'll need a compression test and visual inspection to validate.

I'd get a reman for it and call it a day, especially right now as Mazda has been providing almost all-new hard parts, making it essentially a new motor.
Yeah i was looking at the ZR2, thanks for letting me know it's probably not worth the premium everyone thinks it is. Out of curiosity what's the market for RX8's like where you are all located? Here my car is only worth around 7k (with a running engine), which doesn't really matter since if it's a small fix I won't even consider selling it. Love it too much to sell!

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Old 08-03-2018, 04:53 PM
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Get the minivan. They typically get better MPG and have more space than comparable SUV's. My wife has had an Odyssey (2003) and a Mazda 5 (2010). I'd recommend both, though the tranny in the Honda self-destructed at 97K miles. The Mazda was trouble free for the 120K miles we owned it. Obviously there is a big difference in size. We have 3 kids (teenagers) and the only time the Mazda 5 felt too small was when we took it on vacation, but solved that with a car top luggage carrier.

If the motor in your 8 is shot, definitely consider the reman route suggested by furansu.
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Old 08-03-2018, 09:40 PM
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So those are the two lower spark plugs on both rotors, they look normal for having close to 20k on them right? I also pulled my mid-pipe off and inspected it, no rattling and the honeycomb catalyst looked intact. I then decided to see how she'd run without the mid-pipe, took probably 10 seconds of cranking before the engine caught and did the same thing as before, jumped to 2k rpm then down to a jumpy idle around 700-900rpm for about 10 seconds then promptly died. So idk... does that sound like no compression?
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Old 08-07-2018, 02:40 PM
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So the dealer just sent me the results of the compression test and it's definitely NOT holding compression so I guess I need a new motor. They quoted $4,500 for a reman and $2k for labor, that seems way high. Anyone know if I can get a reman any cheaper from somewhere else? Looking at some rotory builders sites (pineapple racing) I could get a built motor for that cost...
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Old 08-07-2018, 02:50 PM
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I think reman is usually about $3k + $1k core?

I know 9krpm had his turbo Renny built by Pineapple Racing and he highly recommends them, so I'd say go ahead and check them out. A rebuild shouldn't be an issue for them.
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Old 08-07-2018, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by UnknownJinX View Post
I think reman is usually about $3k + $1k core?

I know 9krpm had his turbo Renny built by Pineapple Racing and he highly recommends them, so I'd say go ahead and check them out. A rebuild shouldn't be an issue for them.
Yeah i'd rather pay that amount for a built motor then just get a reman from mazda at that price...
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Old 08-07-2018, 06:36 PM
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So it just occurred to me that I got rear-ended about 3 months ago resulting in $5k+ in body repairs, could that accident have resulted in premature seal failure? The reason I ask this is because I didn't get any of the usual signs of a weakening engine, no gradual loss of power or hard to start (hot or cold starts)...
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Old 08-07-2018, 06:40 PM
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lol no
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Old 08-07-2018, 08:29 PM
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The EXACT same thing happened to my RX-8 today (keep in mind I just bought it last Friday.... ....).

Please let me know what details you find out. I had to have the car towed to the nearest Mazda dealership but they were closed. Looks like I'm not going to work tomorrow
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Old 08-08-2018, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Aweaver2112 View Post
So the dealer just sent me the results of the compression test and it's definitely NOT holding compression so I guess I need a new motor. They quoted $4,500 for a reman and $2k for labor, that seems way high. Anyone know if I can get a reman any cheaper from somewhere else? Looking at some rotory builders sites (pineapple racing) I could get a built motor for that cost...
I haven't checked Utah, but you may find a Utah/Nevada dealer that offers good pricing with some searching around; review what I wrote below for more info on engine pricing and typical dealer handling of it. The part number for the reman engine is: N3H3-02-200R-V0

Posted this for another owner, figured it may help with your decision.
Originally Posted by Furansu
For what it is worth, the cost price of the reman is roughly $2650, that is how much it costs for one from Mazda Motorsports, and how much a dealership will pay for the motor. All dealers offer markup so that they can profit on parts sales, most more than others. $2800-3200 is a good price from a dealer for the engine, more than that and they are gouging, which is most of the dealers. TX, FL, and some of the North-East have very good dealerships that do not gouge owners and offer sub $3500 prices on the engine.

The fact that you are paying the dealership to do the install, you may be able to get them to cut a better price on the engine, at least insist as much, maybe speak with the service manager directly and see if they are amenable to the idea. I bought my car with a bad engine from the dealership, knowing it was bad. I spoke to the sales manager whom engaged the parts manager and I got them to drop the engine price from $3900 to $2950 since I was taking the car off their hands as-is.

Here are the best prices I've found from dealers, NotAPreppie was a big help in getting this list together:

(TX) https://www.promazdaparts.com/oem-pa...-n3h302200rv0/
(NY) https://www.mazdanyparts.com/oem-par...e-n3h302200rv0
(TX) https://www.russellsmithparts.com/oe...e-n3h302200rv0
(IL) https://www.mazdaswag.com/oem-parts/...e-n3h302200rv0
(RI) https://www.newautoparts.com/oem-par...e-n3h302200rv0
(FL) https://www.coxmazdaparts.com/oem-pa...e-n3h302200rv0
(NM) https://www.realmazdaparts.com/oem-p...e-n3h302200rv0
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Old 08-08-2018, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by stronkrotor View Post
The EXACT same thing happened to my RX-8 today (keep in mind I just bought it last Friday.... ....).

Please let me know what details you find out. I had to have the car towed to the nearest Mazda dealership but they were closed. Looks like I'm not going to work tomorrow
I'd suggest starting your own thread, if you want to get to the bottom of what happened. While it might sound like the same, your root cause may be different from the original poster here.
Good luck!
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Old 08-09-2018, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by furansu View Post
I haven't checked Utah, but you may find a Utah/Nevada dealer that offers good pricing with some searching around; review what I wrote below for more info on engine pricing and typical dealer handling of it. The part number for the reman engine is: N3H3-02-200R-V0

Posted this for another owner, figured it may help with your decision.
Thanks for the info! I was thinking what the dealer quoted me was pretty high. I'm going to do some searching and see if it's a possibility to get the engine shipped direct to me from mazda and go around the dealerships because i can do the install myself. Thank you for the part number.
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