Originally Posted by Pkskull77

I find it extremely offensive that so many people degrade you for wanting a car that’s fast off the line. I don’t understand what’s so bad about that. Nor do I see the comparison between small dicks, and premature ejaculation. I can assure you I have a problem with these issues, but at the same time I do dislike the 8’s acceleration. With the way you get treated bring this topic up you would think I just advocated killing small children. If I have a problem with the acceleration you need to respect that, just as I respect your appreciation for the cars other features. If debates like this did not exist the club would have about 10 threads.


Coming into my purchase I was well aware of the 8’s shortcomings, but not fully informed on how extensive the acceleration issue was. I knew the car was low on ponies, but I believe that it’s weight, and gearing, propped it up. The issue for me isn’t 6 seconds, because that’s plenty fast, its how hard you have to beat it to get there. Dropping the clutch as 7,000 RPM’s is not acceptable, as you can only do that so many times before your buying a new clutch. In reality the 8 is somewhere around 7-7.5 seconds off the line. This is a fact that is not widely advertised in the magazines, shows, and articles describing the 8.

Originally Posted by MazdaspeedFeras

it certainly isnt 7.5 seconds either (maybe with you its 7.5 seconds to 60 but you already admitted you dont drive over 7000 rpm anyway), peak torque is a nice sounding number, but the entire torque curve is what makes a car go...look up your physics and calculus and look at the area under the total torque curve and compare that to other cars and all of a sudden you may see differently, this car was designed to deliver torque over a large powerband, and guess what if you dont use it all you dont get it all. You don't have to dump a clutch to get maximum performance i find feathering from 4500 to 5000 gives me maximum road grip. but you dont really care right, you seem to enjoy self deprecation so keep at it...

Originally Posted by truemagellen

Obviously you are obsessed with the Pre-Mature Ejaculative state only torque and torque is all that matters...so you can hop light to light, beating the little teenage snot that pulls up next to you

Originally Posted by RX8-79

I said 'complete package' meaning it can stop and corner as well as it can accelerate, has luxury features/conveniences, and is fun to drive. The Legacy, in my book, lacks all those.

It's fast, but it can't handle as well as a regular 6, let alone the M/S. It's right at or over $30k for the GT, but doesn't even offer HID, NAV, one-touch up/dwn windows, or keyless start, all of which the M/S will have. Nice car to look at, but not for me.

Originally Posted by MyRx-8yourcar

First off the Legacy GT is not 30K. I don't know where you got that from but my 05 which I bought in August was 26K....cheaper than my 8. Secondly the stoping power and cornering of the Legacy is very good for a sport sedan and just by adding STI "Pink" springs improves it even moreso. So I think your comment about it not handling as well as the regular 6 is way off. I have driven both and can say that the 6 is no where near the car as the GT. Yes the GT is fast....and will still remain faster than the MS6 stock for stock.

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

I never said I don't drive over 7000, I just will not go from stopped dropping the clutch at that level. While I've got your attention, what do you mean by feather? When you accelerate using this technique do you get the burning smell?

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

Do most of you guys who give the 8 a quick start from a stopped position, feel like your abusing the car? Anytime I take of quick, I honestly feel like something’s going to break? In my experience if it feels that way you should back off!

I have never really owned a sports car so I don't know if this is unusual but the RX-8 just feels really delicate when I drive it. Every time I mash it hard I worry about breaking it. Have any of the guys who owned something sport before the 8 experienced this in their former cars?

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

I've seen this video before, and the car looks impressive, but something strange is afoot. I'm convinced that Mazda greased his pockets. Although the 8 is easier for a beginer to drive fast, a true proffesional driving both cars could easily put up a better time in the 350z. Then they get really silly and rank it with the M3. I don't know how scientific the laps were, but the RX-8 can't hold a candle to the M3.

This is one of the articles that convinced me to go with the RX-8 over the Zed. If I was going to defend the 8, this is the video I would use. I just don't buy their results.

Originally Posted by IcemanVKO

The Trap speeds on the 350z and the Rx8 are very close, 92, and 95 mph I think.

Originally Posted by AbusiveWombat

Actually the 350z traps around 100 mph on average.

Pkskull - I know what you mean about the RX8 needing to be rung out to beat the average SUV. While the RX8 is certainly quicker at any speed, at low speeds most cars/trucks are fairly quick. Especially when they have a boat load of low end torque (full size trucks). It's at the high end that sports car really shine and easily pull away. And by high end I mean 60mph+.

Also, don't worry about your clutch with high rpm shifts. 90% of the wear and tear on a clutch is getting started. Up and down shifts hardly do a thing. The RX8 needs all 9000 rpms to feel quick, imposing a 7000 rpm limit would drastically reduce maximum acceleration.

Originally Posted by RX8-TX

Just have a question about your last sentence....how do you know?

Originally Posted by MyRx-8yourcar

The MS6 Numbers are out there... :)

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

This is especially difficult becuase I am a car fanatic, I love driving, and love sports cars.

Originally Posted by ggreen29

Based on your statements so far I think all of these clauses are false. You may think they are true, but the reality is different. If you love driving and love sports cars you should love this car because it's a great sports car (or at least a really good 4 seat sports car-like car). Sports cars are about handling, something that almost never comes up in your complaints. For a sports car the turns are the thing (lateral acceleration). If cornering or suspensions don't interest you most then you shopped in the wrong car category.

Since almost all your whinings are about linear acceleration and suburban drag racing, you need a muscle car or a sporty/sports sedan. If most of your thinking involves straight lines then you shouldn't even be interested in sports cars, let alone love them.

Almost all of my commuting involves straight line driving, but I have a great time with my 8. There's about 10 minutes of suburban stop lights, but accelerating in a straight line to the next light holds no interest for me. Then it's about 20 minutes of freeway driving, which is pretty boring. But between those two is a moderately tight, two-lane 270º on-ramp that is great source of fun. I love the way the car's weight shifts on the turn as I adjust the gas pedal, the squeal of the tires on those days I'm feeling really spirited, bringing the car to the outside on the exit, the whine of the engine as it approaches the redline...and especially when there's a muscle car or sports sedan right behind me on the entrance (or better yet, in front of me with the other lane open), and by the time they get to the freeway I'm 200 yds downrange and they're just a dot in my mirror. That single turn makes the whole drive fun; the anticipation, the turn, and the remembering. It's what sports cars are all about.

I've been in the company car and driven by turns with elevation changes or bumps and wished that I had my 8 and how much fun it would be to take those turns. Someday I may even drive the hour it'll take just so I can take those turns a few times. If you don't think like that then you don't want a sports car.

And the MSP Mazda6 looks interesting (but heavy)...just to get it back on topic.

Originally Posted by MyRx-8yourcar

First off the Legacy GT is not 30K. I don't know where you got that from but my 05 which I bought in August was 26K....cheaper than my 8. Secondly the stoping power and cornering of the Legacy is very good for a sport sedan and just by adding STI "Pink" springs improves it even moreso. So I think your comment about it not handling as well as the regular 6 is way off. I have driven both and can say that the 6 is no where near the car as the GT. Yes the GT is fast....and will still remain faster than the MS6 stock for stock.

Originally Posted by RX8-TX

Did you drive one? or are you going by magazine reviews? I think you should visit you local Subaru Dealer (too much NPR for me... :p ) and take a look at it...again. Because..."Subaru, driven by what's inside."

Originally Posted by RX8-79

I meant GT Limited (which seems to be an appropriate moniker), since all the ones I've seen were $30k or above. I'm sure since you bought one you believe the Legacy handles and stops better than the 6, but it doesn't in my book, and test data backs up my opinion. C&D got .81g on the skidpad and 196ft from 70 mph for the LGT back in the Oct. 04. Not only is that worse than all the other cars tested, it's worse than the 6s.


Subaru has aspirations to move upmarket in the automotive chain, they've publicly said so. My point is, if they want to charge near-luxury car prices, justify it with luxury features.

Originally Posted by MyRx-8yourcar

Again...I don't know where your looking, but even the limited doesn't go above 30K; thats STI land.

Originally Posted by IcemanVKO

There there is the rareness. The MS6 will likely be much more rare, than the 8, but will likely not catch as many looks.

Originally Posted by IcemanVKO

I am torn between a car that will be fast, handle well, with room to spare, and a slightly less practical, yet sexy eye catcher, with a unique yet quirky engine.

Originally Posted by IcemanVKO

Back to topic ...

Either car would be hard to improve with after market add ons.

Originally Posted by IcemanVKO

It rarely snows here in Birmingham, AL, so I'll likely not need the AWD, but I am curious as to how that will improve my wet weather and cornering.

Originally Posted by Rotarian_SC

All I can say is when I see the MS 8 I will laugh. I will think back to this guy. He goes and buys a MS 6 because it was released two years after the 8 and was faster (somehow I doubt it will be much faster if it is), but then Mazda releases another car in two more years that is faster than his MS6. I can already see this coming on the 6 boards ;).

Originally Posted by RX8-79

I sure hope this wasn't directed at me. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'm (strongly considering) buying the M/S6 because I like what I see, not because it's faster than my 8. I'm past teenage years and have no short dick issues, ergo speed is way down on my list of priorities.

Originally Posted by Rotarian_SC

No, I was referring to Pkskullz, but it holds true for anybody who would buy the MS6 after it came out because it was faster and they were upset Mazda made something faster than the RX8.

Originally Posted by RX8-79

Gotcha. Wasn't sure, but that's kinda what I was thinking, since he seems a bit manic about having a fast car.

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

I'm hardly manic about having a fast car, I'm simply confused about Mazda's reasoning for releasing a Sedan that's faster than their Sports Car. Just doesn't make sense to me.

.

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

I also don't understand why Mazda waits 2 years to realease a version of the car they could build right now.

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

Instead of giving us the choice between a tame version (the current 8) and a Turbo Charged version (MS Speed) now, the want us to buy the faster one later on. Essentially, they make two sales for the price of one. Just silly.

Originally Posted by shigginsrx8

I hate to say it, but I think you bought the wrong car. If what you are worried about is getting "dusted" in drag races then you should get something different. I am fairly confident that if you took your car to a track you could at least keep up with these other sports cars provided equal drivers, and for sure beat the 6.

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

I also don't understand why Mazda waits 2 years to realease a version of the car they could build right now. Instead of giving us the choice between a tame version (the current 8) and a Turbo Charged version (MS Speed) now, the want us to buy the faster one later on. Essentially, they make two sales for the price of one. Just silly.

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

If I end up first at a traffic light, and the person next to me wants to give it a quick run, I can do so without breaking any laws. If I don’t light up the wheels and stop accelerating when I hit the posted speed there’s not much a cop can do.

Originally Posted by JasonHamilton

They can give you a ticket for anything. In your example, you would get a ticket for ' exhibition of speed'

Originally Posted by IcemanVKO

PK, I can't say that I don't understand where you are comming from. And having not yet purchased my RX8, I appreciate your comments as it does weight on my decision.

I too want to have a car that can move, having that punch, both impresses your passengers and makes you feel good about your purchase, even if you don't use it to race others.



The Mazda 6 sells for 22-23 fully loaded. I just spoke with the salesman, and the MS6 will be 26-27. So basically you get a 6 + Turbo, and Suspension for 5 or 6 grand more.

It will cost a tad more than the 8 I plan to buy.

Now, if those were the only choices, the 8 would still in my book be even with the MS6, because of how much better it handles, and how much better it looks.

Yet there is another option. Put a Turbo in your RX8, and problem solved. The Turbo's for the RX8 will be out before the MS6. It will cost about 4-5k, and give you alot more power than the MS6. An RX8 with 300 BHP, will pretty much own anything stock on the road, except maybe a Viper, and it would give a Viper a heck of a run for its money.


Now you say Hey WAIT! I already bought a Car, why would I spend another 5k on it? Well if Mazda, had put the Turbo in the car, it would have cost another 4-5k, and wouldn't have near the 300BHP that the aftermarket turbos are targetting.

Originally Posted by MazdaspeedFeras

even gingerly accelerating im faster than 90% of cars out there in general traffic, i have no idea why anyone considers this car slow(unless you compare it only with sports cars, although i havent heard many call a porsche boxter slow, and the 8 is faster than a boxter)...if you are talking about on the streets this car accelerates plenty well, and pskull you say you only drive on the streets and that you never race, so frankly the acceleration should be enough how much more do you need?

Originally Posted by T.T.

According to your profile, you are not 16 years old. So why do you care so much about driving in a straight line? The curves are where it's at. The reason why you are not enjoying your car is because you are not trying to. Keep practicing your shift technique and learn how to corner. Maybe someday you'll beat those SUVs you are having trouble with. :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by Pkskull77

My argument has very little to do with other car brands, quite frankly I have learned to deal with the fact that the 8 is not a fast car. What bothers me is making the 6 faster than the 8? Modern car companies generally follow a formula in determining the performance, and pricing of their cars. Following that logic, you don’t build an economy car, and make it faster than your sports car. Now that the MS 6 will be the big kid on the block, who the heck is going to buy the 8? What does the 8 offer that the 6 doesn’t? Be honest if the MS 6 was out when you were buying your 8 which would you have purchased? The 6 could spell the end of the 8, making my car a failure, eliminating access to cheap aftermarket parts.

As for some of the other comments:
• There is nothing wrong with my head; I know a lot of 8 owners feel like I do. I fail to see the relationship between my disappointment and mental illness.
• Obviously I understand that my car will never be the fastest, but when you pay 31,000 for a sports car, you expect the acceleration to be proportional. There is no arguing the fact that the 8 is slow in proportion to similarly priced cars. Many will point out that 0-60 in 6 is not that bad, but that 6 second time is a pipe dream. In order to get your car moving that fast, you need to beat it into the ground. Try getting that 6 second time, with catching a whiff of your clutch going up in smoke.
• The SRT-4 is a Neon, I don’t care how much HP you put in it, that’s all it will ever be. I could never bring myself to purchase a Neon, so that car never crossed my mind. As for the performance, I can’t argue with that. It is a bit disturbing that they can get so much out of a Neon, but so little out of the 8.
• Why go with Mazda? It was in my price range, and after reading all the reviews of the 8, I thought it was the best decision. After owning the 8 for two months I find it hard to believe that so many critics loved this car. Aside from the handling, which in my opinion is useless on the streets, the car is far from extraordinary. In retrospect I think they were rewarding the 8 for being different, not for being better. In reality different is only better when it is associated with performance gains. Nothing about the 8’s differences give it any substantial performance gains (excluding the handling). The rear seat, and rear doors are a freaking joke. The rotary engine does rev high, but it really doesn’t deliver any associated performance improvements.

I know I sound like a bitter 8 owner, and quite frankly I am. This car has been nothing but a headache for me. To begin it’s not what I expected; I don’t think the car is fun to drive, nor is it efficient. Reliability has been the pits, I have spent several weekends getting it fixed. Flashes, Flooding Engines, and CEL’s. I have owned several cars, that cost far less than the 8, and none of them have given me so many issues. I just feel cheated. Throw in this whole MS 6 thing, and it just makes my blood boil.