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NO RX-9, slight chance for RX-7
I could have added this to the RX-9 news but this is BIG so here it is in it's own thread thanks to Bernie of Rotarynews.com.There will be no RX-9. All things said about it appear to have been pure rumor although we could still get an RX-7 maybe :
http://blog.caranddriver.com/mazda-n...slim-but-real/ Paul. |
WOW. No idea what to believe anymore at this point
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Seriously. Mazda really needs to come clean and tell us whats going on.
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This is what I heard a year ago from a credible person; they wanted to build a back to basics (A la first gen) RX-7. An affordable rotary sport car.
I think this is as legit as it gets until Mazda says something. The next big sports car announcement should be regarding the new MX-5 and I would guess they will leak or release official word and images about that within months. Can they make the business case for a new RX-7? I sure hope so. Would I love to see a RX-8 successor as well (4 seat, 4 door), absolutely but I don't see it at the moment. If Mazda was a more cash rich corporation, maybe. Paul. |
Are you guys for real?
This hasn't been completely and totally obvious for the last 3 years? I'm quite happy with "optimism" and all, but there has been nothing but clear, constant communication from every angle - the manufacturer, the market, the economy, the enviro-fascists - that the rotary is dead. It was dead in 2008, but the re-tooling of the RX-8 was a low cost way to prolong the return on the initial buy-in for the RX-8. No one wants a new rotary-powered car. Seriously. Take every rotary enthusiast you know, have heard about or imagined existed. Now, take that list and cross off all the people that you know are not in the position to purchase a brand new car right now. Pretty f-ing short list, isn't it? Even if you multiply that list by 50, it still isn't enough reason to lure a manufacturer into diverting funds from known money-making platforms into one that will destroy the CAFE numbers, skew the fleet EPA ratings, skew the collision and resale value numbers, screw-up the Edmunds and CR fleet reliability ratings and generally only lose money in an economy where there is no longer any serious brand loyalty, especially from new-car-buying individuals. Rotary car owners want old cars. They want cheap cars. They want magic cars. But they wont drop cash on new cars in the volume that makes it practical for a manufacturer - especially in the contemporary market where a specialty sports car must have near-30 MPG and over 300 HP while being essentially ZLEV and under $30k. Wake up. |
Sadly I'm not surprised by the article which is unfortunately a statement of the obvious. Given all the challenges an automaker faces (especially a small one) you need a massively compelling business case for each car you sell and frankly there just isn't one right now for another RX.
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Honestly... i think Mazda is making this more complicated then it really is.
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Originally Posted by MazdaManiac
(Post 3988559)
Are you guys for real?
This hasn't been completely and totally obvious for the last 3 years? I'm quite happy with "optimism" and all, but there has been nothing but clear, constant communication from every angle - the manufacturer, the market, the economy, the enviro-fascists - that the rotary is dead. It was dead in 2008, but the re-tooling of the RX-8 was a low cost way to prolong the return on the initial buy-in for the RX-8. No one wants a new rotary-powered car. Seriously. Take every rotary enthusiast you know, have heard about or imagined existed. Now, take that list and cross off all the people that you know are not in the position to purchase a brand new car right now. Pretty f-ing short list, isn't it? Even if you multiply that list by 50, it still isn't enough reason to lure a manufacturer into diverting funds from known money-making platforms into one that will destroy the CAFE numbers, skew the fleet EPA ratings, skew the collision and resale value numbers, screw-up the Edmunds and CR fleet reliability ratings and generally only lose money in an economy where there is no longer any serious brand loyalty, especially from new-car-buying individuals. Rotary car owners want old cars. They want cheap cars. They want magic cars. But they wont drop cash on new cars in the volume that makes it practical for a manufacturer - especially in the contemporary market where a specialty sports car must have near-30 MPG and over 300 HP while being essentially ZLEV and under $30k. Wake up. :mad: LOL |
Originally Posted by CrazyJek
(Post 3988568)
Honestly... i think Mazda is making this more complicated then it really is.
Go ahead - un-complicate it for us. |
Depressing.
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From a business stand point they gain almost nothing whatsoever from making another rotary, and risk losing tons of money to satisfy such a small group of enthusiasts. Not gonna happen.
Next new car is going to be a Mazda 2 anyways, aren't there rumors of a Mazdaspeed version? |
Originally Posted by alz0rz
(Post 3988665)
Depressing.
Now I guess I will be deciding between the Genesis Coupe and 370z. FML |
I guess the Mazda NA rep (who owns a one of a kind RX-8) who traveled all that way to come to the Texas8 just flat out lied to us then. And I guess when he put one of the design guys at Mazda on speakerphone for us all to thank that was just a charade.
Anyone wanna place any bets that there will be another rotary powered car? |
Originally Posted by MazdaManiac
(Post 3988559)
Rotary car owners want old cars. They want cheap cars. They want magic cars.
But they wont drop cash on new cars in the volume that makes it practical for a manufacturer |
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 3988702)
I guess the Mazda NA rep (who owns a one of a kind RX-8) who traveled all that way to come to the Texas8 just flat out lied to us then. And I guess when he put one of the design guys at Mazda on speakerphone for us all to thank that was just a charade.
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 3988702)
Anyone wanna place any bets that there will be another rotary powered car?
Yes. I will absolutely take that bet. |
Originally Posted by MazdaManiac
(Post 3988707)
Indeed. No matter where they are in the food chain, they are still car salesmen and lying is what they do.
You want to bet that there will not be another rotary-powered car built by Mazda to replace the RX-8 in the upcoming product line as an immediate successor? Yes. I will absolutely take that bet. Well, I don't think so, he didn't have to be there in the middle of know where Texas to hang out and have dinner with us. I also don't see what he/Mazda would gain by lying to a bunch of rotary owners about a rotary that would never exist. He couldn't give many details but I strongly believe there will be another Rotary powered Mazda Sports Car after the RX-8. Whether it's in the upcoming product line or not is unknown but 2013 was mentioned. But I'll bet you $100.00 that another rotary powered Mazda sports car is coming in 2013 or 2014 at the latest :) |
Mazda's playing tricks on us.
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Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 3988718)
Well, I don't think so, he didn't have to be there in the middle of know where Texas to hang out and have dinner with us. I also don't see what he/Mazda would gain by lying to a bunch of rotary owners about a rotary that would never exist. He couldn't give many details but I strongly believe there will be another Rotary powered Mazda Sports Car after the RX-8. Whether it's in the upcoming product line or not is unknown but 2013 was mentioned.
Will he be anywhere for you to question him when it doesn't happen? I don't think so. They are all just Harold Campings. I run into these guys all the time. Mazda Corporate "executives". Glossy business cards. Some of them even have desks at Irvine. They all have "seen with their own eyes" the next rotary car. Or the next sports car. Or the next mini-van. Whatever group you belong to. They are out there as little tiny data-points in the corporate marketing scheme.
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 3988718)
But I'll bet you $100.00 that another rotary powered Mazda sports car is coming in 2013 or 2014 at the latest :)
I'll take it further - if it happens, the loser has to buy one. That day. Right away. Full MSRP. You up for that? |
I believe nothing these "news sources" have to say, one way or the other. When they actually show one, at an auto show, then I will be a believer.
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Originally Posted by Mazmart
(Post 3988552)
This is what I heard a year ago from a credible person; they wanted to build a back to basics (A la first gen) RX-7. An affordable rotary sport car.
I think this is as legit as it gets until Mazda says something. The next big sports car announcement should be regarding the new MX-5 and I would guess they will leak or release official word and images about that within months. Can they make the business case for a new RX-7? I sure hope so. Would I love to see a RX-8 successor as well (4 seat, 4 door), absolutely but I don't see it at the moment. If Mazda was a more cash rich corporation, maybe. Paul. Theoricaly, there is room for both cars into market......Nissan or Toyota can do a thing like this.... |
they better fking let me know, cause i am either gonna grab an R3, or i am going to grab the next one, been saving for a bit now.
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It looks like i'll have to find another chassis to work on when my rx8 is gone.
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Originally Posted by MattMPS
(Post 3988753)
Nissan or Toyota can do a thing like this....
That said, can you imagine if the FT-86 or the 370Z were low-horsepower and/or low fuel-economy cars? The FT will be here in November and we have already seen pre-production models rolling around. The Genesis is here and it barely sells on the same sort of promises the next-gen RX car would make. The 370Z already destroys everything the next RX could possibly be. Furthermore, do you really want to see a hybrid-rotary? The RX-8 is already a pig in the weight/power party. Sure, go ahead and add another thousand pounds of motor, battery and wire. |
the 370z is the winner right now, although the firewall sounds paper thin
Genesis is Ugly FT will come with a broken boxer Mazda? what about the manufacturing equipment? isn't there a lot of special tooling that goes into rotorys? do you think they will just abandon it? maybe it already is..... |
Originally Posted by MazdaManiac
(Post 3988807)
Nissan and Toyota have bigger market shares by many orders of magnitude.
That said, can you imagine if the FT-86 or the 370Z were low-horsepower and/or low fuel-economy cars? The FT will be here in November and we have already seen pre-production models rolling around. The Genesis is here and it barely sells on the same sort of promises the next-gen RX car would make. The 370Z already destroys everything the next RX could possibly be. Furthermore, do you really want to see a hybrid-rotary? The RX-8 is already a pig in the weight/power party. Sure, go ahead and add another thousand pounds of motor, battery and wire. With Audi and BMW producing a wealth of cars with over 300hp in both hatch, coupe and sedan shape it will be hard to compete here too. Their name is just established too well. The only way a wankel powered mazda car would draw some attention would be in supercar form, something mazda can't afford do produce right now. Anything else, unless stunning, would pass unnoticed and definitely be late to the game (ft and 370pig). |
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