Mazda now the Benchmark for Toyota
02-22-2007, 10:52 AM
#1
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Mazda now the Benchmark for Toyota
http://blogs.motortrend.com/6201576/...ent/index.html
http://www.autospies.com/news/Toyota...-Mazda3-12560/
http://forums.motortrend.com/70/6214...ade/index.html
Apparently Toyota has used the Mazda3 as its styling and performance benchmark for the next gen Toyota Matrix
the reports all read something like this
but i found these quotes from Franz at Mazda and a toyota exec in one article:
"As we're well aware, companies like Toyota or Honda, they're gunning for us," Mazda North America design chief Franz von Holzhausen told reporters Wednesday. "They see the Mazda3 as a great product. Toyota is re-engineering, redesigning the (Toyota) Matrix based off the Mazda3 and the success that this car has had."
and
Toyota disputes von Holzhausen's take on its planned Matrix redesign, due out later this year, and denies it uses the best of other automakers' vehicles as benchmarks for its own. "We just do market research and see what the customer wants," said Toyota spokesman Bill Kwong.
So basically Toyota did research and found out most people would rather have a 3 so thats what they intend to build
http://www.autospies.com/news/Toyota...-Mazda3-12560/
http://forums.motortrend.com/70/6214...ade/index.html
Apparently Toyota has used the Mazda3 as its styling and performance benchmark for the next gen Toyota Matrix
the reports all read something like this
Toyota will replace its Matrix next spring with a new hatchback - possibly called the Blade - that will be patterned after the popular Mazda3, according to a report in Automotive News.
Like the Matrix (pictured at top), the new car is based on the Corolla compact, but will come sporting a thicker C-pillar and narrower greenhouse than its predecessor. A similar car is already sold in Japan as the Blade and in Europe as the Auris (pictured at left), but the U.S. version will receive different sheetmetal that closely follows the design of the Mazda3, which Toyota insiders consider the styling benchmark for the class.
toyota auris
The Japenese car receives a 2.4-liter four-cylinder that puts out 158 horsepower and 161 lb-ft of torque instead of the Matrix's 126 horse 1.8-liter four-banger. Toyota will have to keep that engine for the U.S. car if it is indeed serious about chasing the Mazda3.
Like the Matrix (pictured at top), the new car is based on the Corolla compact, but will come sporting a thicker C-pillar and narrower greenhouse than its predecessor. A similar car is already sold in Japan as the Blade and in Europe as the Auris (pictured at left), but the U.S. version will receive different sheetmetal that closely follows the design of the Mazda3, which Toyota insiders consider the styling benchmark for the class.
toyota auris
The Japenese car receives a 2.4-liter four-cylinder that puts out 158 horsepower and 161 lb-ft of torque instead of the Matrix's 126 horse 1.8-liter four-banger. Toyota will have to keep that engine for the U.S. car if it is indeed serious about chasing the Mazda3.
"As we're well aware, companies like Toyota or Honda, they're gunning for us," Mazda North America design chief Franz von Holzhausen told reporters Wednesday. "They see the Mazda3 as a great product. Toyota is re-engineering, redesigning the (Toyota) Matrix based off the Mazda3 and the success that this car has had."
and
Toyota disputes von Holzhausen's take on its planned Matrix redesign, due out later this year, and denies it uses the best of other automakers' vehicles as benchmarks for its own. "We just do market research and see what the customer wants," said Toyota spokesman Bill Kwong.
So basically Toyota did research and found out most people would rather have a 3 so thats what they intend to build
02-22-2007, 11:03 AM
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ahh here is the original source article - written by my freind Mark Rechtin at Automotive News
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...007/1528/pipes
when he writes it- its true.
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...007/1528/pipes
when he writes it- its true.
It may look like a three but it will probably drive like a Corolla; 'Snore Snore' 
02-23-2007, 12:44 AM
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They can try all they want to make it look like a Mazda3 hatch, but the end product will be frumpy and awkward looking with about 5" worth of wheel gap. The throttle will be jumpy and non-linear, and handling non-existent. It always blows me away how this is the same company that once produced great sports cars like the MR2, Celica and Supra. RIP Toyota, may you rot in Buick hell and NASCAR mediocrity.
02-23-2007, 09:13 AM
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Here's the problem though......your average Joe would rather buy a Toyota 3 than a Mazda 3 because of the perception of Toyota's superiority to every other car company. It won't matter that their copycar lacks all the driving dynamics of the Mazda 3.
This is why I hate Toyota and wish very bad things for them. They take someone else's brilliant and successful design and copy it for themselves. Then they just use the perception gap to sell more of their copycar than the original version they pirated.
What goes around comes around Toyota. (Chinese)
This is why I hate Toyota and wish very bad things for them. They take someone else's brilliant and successful design and copy it for themselves. Then they just use the perception gap to sell more of their copycar than the original version they pirated.
What goes around comes around Toyota. (Chinese)
02-23-2007, 11:49 AM
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Bruce Van
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I think Toyota is an outstanding car company and most of my family has one. I used to drive a Toyota pickup, Corolla, and a Lexus. Now I've got the RX-8.
Toyota has definitely lost its line of sporty cars. They dropped the Celica and more importantly the Supra. If there were as Supra, I'd probably be driving it now instead of the 8.
The Mazda3 is a very good car in its segment. One of my best friends traded in her Corolla for one and is loving it. She's a long time Toyota loyalist as well. As long as Mazda keeps making fun to drive cars that look great, they will do fine.
The Mazdaspeed3 was a great idea. Definitely gives the 3 line a better image and cool factor.
Toyota has definitely lost its line of sporty cars. They dropped the Celica and more importantly the Supra. If there were as Supra, I'd probably be driving it now instead of the 8.
The Mazda3 is a very good car in its segment. One of my best friends traded in her Corolla for one and is loving it. She's a long time Toyota loyalist as well. As long as Mazda keeps making fun to drive cars that look great, they will do fine.
The Mazdaspeed3 was a great idea. Definitely gives the 3 line a better image and cool factor.
02-23-2007, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by bruce_van
Toyota has definitely lost its line of sporty cars. They dropped the Celica and more importantly the Supra. If there were as Supra, I'd probably be driving it now instead of the 8.
Toyota used to have some good/decent sports and sporty cars.
Supra
Celica
MR2 (the older ones)
Lexus SC (the original coupe)
They are long gone and nothing seems to be taking their place. The TC is not even close.
Supposedly Toyota has something in the works to reintroduce the Supra...we'll see.
02-23-2007, 12:28 PM
#10
Momentum Keeps Me Going
Toyota has done what the majority of adults do.... grow up and change their thinking to frumpy and conservative, forget they were young and crazy, in love with go fast cars, daring styling, and just plain driving excitment. Even the so-called "hip" Scion is all nearly all flash - substituting "upscale marketing" and "LED lighting" for real sporty substance.
I've owned them, they used to be a whole 'nother car company years ago.... How could they go so far afield into Buickland just boggles the mind. I guess that's what a lot of people want... go figure
I've owned them, they used to be a whole 'nother car company years ago.... How could they go so far afield into Buickland just boggles the mind. I guess that's what a lot of people want... go figure
02-23-2007, 12:32 PM
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dependability and functionality are usually quite a bit higher than "feel" on most peoples lists. we view car as a hobby while majority of people views it as a means to get from point A to B.
02-23-2007, 01:23 PM
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The way i see it is that all Toyota has is the Camry. Beyond that, everything else is just below mediocre.
Their entry level Lexus cars are all based on the Camry (it looks so obvious). The upscale Lexuses are all copies of their German counterparts. There is nothing special in their cars, nothing to attract me to them. If you look at every other company out there, there is something special to that marque. GM and Ford make amazing V8 powered cars, Porsche defines feel in all their cars, Nissan has the iconic GTR and the amazing VQ, Honda is every teen/ricers dream, Subaru and Mitsubishi have rally, Mazda has the rotary, VW/Audi showcased engineering prowess with DSG in the Veyron, BMW has the worlds standard in the M3, etc. What does Toyota have? Hybrids aka Scams.
No offense to any toyota owners on here. I just don't know what people see in toyota.
Their entry level Lexus cars are all based on the Camry (it looks so obvious). The upscale Lexuses are all copies of their German counterparts. There is nothing special in their cars, nothing to attract me to them. If you look at every other company out there, there is something special to that marque. GM and Ford make amazing V8 powered cars, Porsche defines feel in all their cars, Nissan has the iconic GTR and the amazing VQ, Honda is every teen/ricers dream, Subaru and Mitsubishi have rally, Mazda has the rotary, VW/Audi showcased engineering prowess with DSG in the Veyron, BMW has the worlds standard in the M3, etc. What does Toyota have? Hybrids aka Scams.
No offense to any toyota owners on here. I just don't know what people see in toyota.
02-23-2007, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by CarAndDriver
The TC is not even close.
Supposedly Toyota has something in the works to reintroduce the Supra...we'll see.
Supposedly Toyota has something in the works to reintroduce the Supra...we'll see.
Their new "supercar" will be marketed in the US as a Lexus. The link below was all I could find quickly (and its OLD), but I recall seeing something last summer that indicated it would be a Lexus.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=7633
02-23-2007, 05:34 PM
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Its all about Style...
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Camry = Mazda6
Matrix = Mazda3
Well that is how it looks to me atleast.
Immitation is the best form of flattery I guess but come on.. dont flat out copy 'em. When I first seen the new Camry's front my first thought was "Oh a Mazda 6" then seen the toyota logo on the front and just had to scratch my head.
Matrix = Mazda3
Well that is how it looks to me atleast.
Immitation is the best form of flattery I guess but come on.. dont flat out copy 'em. When I first seen the new Camry's front my first thought was "Oh a Mazda 6" then seen the toyota logo on the front and just had to scratch my head.
02-23-2007, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Clavius
Camry = Mazda6
Matrix = Mazda3
Well that is how it looks to me atleast.
Immitation is the best form of flattery I guess but come on.. dont flat out copy 'em. When I first seen the new Camry's front my first thought was "Oh a Mazda 6" then seen the toyota logo on the front and just had to scratch my head.
Matrix = Mazda3
Well that is how it looks to me atleast.
Immitation is the best form of flattery I guess but come on.. dont flat out copy 'em. When I first seen the new Camry's front my first thought was "Oh a Mazda 6" then seen the toyota logo on the front and just had to scratch my head.
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