It's coming back!!!!!!!! (more next rotary 'news')
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Love the beating the dead horse
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More rumor milling, they have a lot of problems with the article that undermine it's credibility.
While it's built on the same simple design philosophy as the new MX-5, we're told final design is a long way from being production-ready. Still, Mazda's rotary development continues, and we hear engine capacity is around 600cc per rotor, slightly smaller than the RX-8's 650cc. Mazda is still deciding between twin or triple rotors; one source suggests a twin rotor is most likely, making the new RX-7 engine a 1.2-liter, That's where the MX-5 comes in. It will likely end up weighing 2,400 pounds, so the RX-7 should weigh about 2,800 pounds |
Ahh, I think this particular article has more than a sniff of plausibility to it. Obviously, everyone has been speculating for some time, but Autoweek is a fairly reliable industry source. For me, with only two seats, I couldn't entertain it myself, but if they've made any progress on the emissions side, this could be the real deal.
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i never quite understood why people really feel the need to have it come back.
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Not a need, a desire. I'm sure there are things from history that you would like to see again, even though it may not be logical, economically viable, etc...
If time keeps marching on, even piston powered cars of today will be labeled with all the same things that the rotary gets now "inefficient", "dirty", "poor mileage", etc... , but it probably won't stop people from wanting them. How many Chevy big block engine fans are there out there? How many of them would like to see a return of what they like? It's the same thing. There are even people that work to bring back the steam engine. |
it was a loaded question, i know some people like being unique.
but that aside the rotary engine already nearly put mazda under once, the RX8 probably didn't do them any favors either. i personally don't mind it mainly because of the parts on the shelf, if i were paying a shop to build my car i would choose something else more viable. the cars turn cheap rather quickly with the only exception being the FD, so that is another benefit. |
From Mazda's perspective, they have indeed made that decision. We see the proof of that with the SkyActive car lineup and initiative.
If they do end up producing a rotary, it will be because someone in the company that can make money decisions is still enough of a kid at heart to want to make something just because they want to, and it won't be for any reason that involves economics or regulations. Assuming that the company is making enough money off of the other cars available, even selling it at a loss wouldn't put them under. Even with CAFE, there isn't really a problem, since Mazda is leading the CAFE pack, no other manufacturer beats them at their CAFE score. They have plenty of flexibility in that metric to produce a rather inefficient car sold in the quantities that the rotary would fetch. In the end, I don't think anyone will disagree with the fact that there is simply no logical business case for producing a rotary. But all it takes is someone who doesn't care about making a logical business case. Mazda has a history of doing what they want, and to hell with people that say it couldn't or shouldn't be done. |
well there was a time when the engine was competetive with piston engines but those days are long gone, which is probably also why mazda chose to cut their losses.
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They just showed a brand new rotary design in a never before seen size... I don't see that as "cutting their losses" :) They are clearly still developing it.
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i take anything that is in testing with a grain of salt, companies always have projects in the fire that never go anywhere. look at the detroit auto show and how many of those cars from every manufacturer imaginable never see the light of day.
if mazda could overcome the wear characteristics and improve sealing then the engine may live again. the current iteration of the rotary engine is still half a century old. |
Agreed. Even if it was a "production" engine, it is a 330cc generator and that isn't viable as a main powerplant in a sports car anyway. Maybe a sport bike or a gokart, but nothing bigger. I take it as only that they haven't disbanded the rotary development division, and are still spending money on it. We may get the rotary we want out of it eventually, or we may not. Regardless of what the future holds, it's proof that they haven't tossed in the towel yet. And if they haven't, I won't either.
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I think we have two factions at Mazda.
First there are the long time engineering staff and maybe some of the middle management that love the uniqueness of the rotary engine and believe it gives Mazda an identity in the industry. These guys are working on their own time, throwing around ideas on how to make a new rotary engine car work. Then you have the new president and his bean counters that don't give a rats ass. The short term bottom line is all they care about. I know many of us hope the first faction can convince the other that they can make it work. I have no idea what is going to happen but, I'm not going to hold my breath. I've said this before, If there is a new RX, it will first be shown at the Tokyo Auto Salon, Chicago or Los Angeles Auto Shows. The new Miata will be introduced at the 2015 Chicago Auto Show. |
:offtopic:Off topic but if there is another RX wouldn't it be a RX9 not a 7?
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Old rumors of a 2017 rotary had it being called a RX7 (not a RX9) , strictly a two seater (with a mandatory small rear seat in Asian markets) built on a stretched next-generation MX5 platform with a NA 300 HP direct-injection skyactive 16X rotary engine with possible laser ignition system and 40% better fuel economy and meeting US/Euro emission standards.
Only happens when the rotary lovers hearts can overrule the bean counters logic. But never count out Mazda to surprise you and never count out the rotary engine. As an RX owner since 1973, I have seen Mazda come back from the dead several times and the rotary has come back with them (oil crisis, emissions crisis, corporate financial crisis, corporate takeovers etc.) . Never give up the faith in spite of any current pro or against rumors or "official" announcements. |
Originally Posted by niteshade247
(Post 4569975)
:offtopic:Off topic but if there is another RX wouldn't it be a RX9 not a 7?
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i have never heard of a production RX9 unless the turbo 12A FB somehow got that label, which was just a misleading title given to it through rumor.
the RX6 was the only series passed over. |
Originally Posted by Karack
(Post 4570235)
i have never heard of a production RX9 unless the turbo 12A FB somehow got that label, which was just a misleading title given to it through rumor.
the RX6 was the only series passed over. |
For what they're worth (RX rumors surfaces again):
* Mazda RX-7 Revival Rumors Resurface Again; Could get a 250HP Rotary Engine - Carscoops * Mazda RX-7 successor in the works | report | carsguide.com.au |
At least the artists for those sites got the rendering in-line with the Kodo language.
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probably is really like to beat a dead horse....:D: but i'm seeing a lot of products/projects in sportscar from Japanese carmakers...
-new supra -new NSX, new basic roadster -new affordable nissan sportcar ect... Mazda can't be remain stopped only with the mx-5 (co-financed by Fiat or FCA) maybe there is a possibility but only after 2017 |
My point was just simply if they make a completely redesigned RX shouldn't it be a RX9 not a 7 as there is a 8. Even if they use a MX frame all the rotaries have been RXs have they not?
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not true the rotary started life in the cosmo and there was a pick up truck too but i can tremember the name.
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There are two different theories for whether it would be a "7" or a "9"
"9" theory reasons: 1) It could be a "9", simply because of the increasing numeric number of the major designs that the RX line has generally been following in the past or 2) to keep the "7" always meaning the FB, FC, and FD, which is a huge part of Mazda's history "7" theory reasons: 1) Mazda's current numeric model system is based on vehicle size, with 2 being the smallest, 9 being the largest. A car that is smaller than the 8 could be anything numerically lower, with "7" being favored. Making it an "RX-6" or "RX-5" are entirely viable as well, since that is closer to the size of the MX-5 (which general theory and agreement is that it will be based on that platform, although the next one sounds like it would be closer in size to a "2") or 2) Going back to a small rotary sports car will always make people think of the RX-7, so using the "7" name will be a return of that car, if it's fitting enough. The reality is, we have no idea what Mazda will name it. It might not even be numeric :) (but probably will) |
Mazda wont reuse the RX9 since it has been used before on a rotary sedan (see above). Mazda will want to and need to evoke the spirit and popularity and fame of the RX7. As a fourth generation RX7 this car would immediately have credibility and spark excitement among the automotive press and longtime rotary advocates. This car will just sell better as an RX7 and not an RX9. I have owned all three generations of RX7 and would buy the fourth generation in a heartbeat. Also remember this car will be set to compete with the New Nissan Z and the New Toyota sports car, so an RX7 nameplate is a natural, harking back to the legendary rivalry between the early Z, RX7, and Toyota Supra.
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Whatever the number is, it will probably be chassis code "FF"...
Go ahead, start the jokes now, they won't ever stop. |
Originally Posted by gwilliams6
(Post 4570431)
Mazda wont reuse the RX9 since it has been used before on a rotary sedan (see above). Mazda will want to and need to evoke the spirit and popularity and fame of the RX7. As a fourth generation RX7 this car would immediately have credibility and spark excitement among the automotive press and longtime rotary advocates. This car will just sell better as an RX7 and not an RX9. I have owned all three generations of RX7 and would buy the fourth generation in a heartbeat.
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I don't think the fact that there was a previous RX9 precludes Mazda from naming a future model as one. The name wouldn't have been used in almost 40 yrs since Mazda previously used it. And, other manufactures resurrect names that haven't been used in decades for cars in other size classes.
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I'm personally a fan of calling it an RX-5 or RX-6, assuming it's small enough to justify, assuming it is actually going to happen.
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Cool some new info I didn't know although I had herd once about a rotary powered truck. Thanks I now under stand the numerical system of the RX line. What ever happens ide be up to buy anther rotary powered car.
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Originally Posted by 200.mph
(Post 4570428)
not true the rotary started life in the cosmo and there was a pick up truck too but i can tremember the name.
Originally Posted by niteshade247
(Post 4570464)
Cool some new info I didn't know although I had herd once about a rotary powered truck. Thanks I now under stand the numerical system of the RX line. What ever happens ide be up to buy anther rotary powered car.
I had a boss that had one, but at the time it had no significance to me. |
There may still be a rotary pickup somewhere in the NJ area, it came to one of our NJ/Del/Pa/Md meets a couple of years ago. I remember a few of them on the street decades ago. The cosmos was originally a two seat sports car and a later cosmos was a coupe even once with w/ a turbo 12A engine. The even later Eunos Cosmos was a three rotor twin-turbo that produced 300hp and 300ftpounds of torque (Japan only). The R100, the RX2, RX3, RX4 were all sedans and/or coupes. Whatever Mazda calls the next rotary, it just needs to perform, be reliable and get better fuel economy. If it does all that it will sell, if not it will be a dud. I don't expect Mazda to spend the money and come out with a dud. You can trace the whole Mazda rotary engine history and cars and years in link below.
Cheers and lol http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_Wankel_engine |
Originally Posted by alnielsen
(Post 4570515)
It was called the REPU for Rotary Engine PickUp
Called the "re-poo" typically But yea. There weren't very many of them made really. My cousin has one he bought brand new in 77'. We have several of them here in the Middle Tennessee area surprisingly. |
Originally Posted by reddozen
(Post 4570645)
Fixed...
Called the "re-poo" typically But yea. There weren't very many of them made really. My cousin has one he bought brand new in 77'. We have several of them here in the Middle Tennessee area surprisingly. |
I have faith in the rotary. If its a renovated rx-7 you cant tell me previous rotary owners, owners, and non owners wont want to get their hands on it. Its a sports car and those are made for the most part about fun. And the rotary sure as hell is a fun engine. Kind of reminds me of 2 stroke and 4 stroke debates with dirtbikes, and actually 2 stroke bikes and rotary engine cars are similar in alot of ways. As of now however ive got an rx8 in my garage with 4k miles on it and am going to drive it til it drops. It would be awesome to see a new rotary car out by the time that happens.
EDIT: 2 smokers were supposed to be gone by 2010 or something but its 2014 now and im lookin to buy a new one next season. |
i tend to say it as rapeyou
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I would be pretty disappointed if the new rotary has 250hp as the max offering in the generation. The level of performance should be higher.
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Autoweek story - new RX-7
Hi everyone,
Sorry if this is a repost, but in case you haven't seen it yet, this week's issue of AutoWeek has (another) story about the next coming of the RX-7: New Mazda RX-7 design, styling and on sale dates - Autoweek We all know how much these rumors can be counted on, and we've all seen Mazda's "official" comments that they can't make a business case for another rotary engine. But, like buying a lottery ticket, its something to keep our hopes up. |
merged to existing thread
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I wish they are going to put it a supercharger 16x 400-500hp powerful pure sports car ;)
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No thanks. I'd like to be able to buy it. I won't be pleased with a rotary return that is priced out of my reach.
Mazda hasn't pursued the power game anyway and I don't see that changing any time soon. |
Supra & Nsx shows their faces if Mazda needs POWER 300 hp isnt enough for RX-7 yes if it will be enough near 1000-1100 kgs. But that sale stragety is like a gamble you need power when you have big rivals. 90's they also limited nearly 280 hp limit with force induction now that limit near 400-500 now gtr35 550 hp near 1700 kgs..
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I disagree with your entire premise that more power automatically makes the car better.
I disagree that it needs to "compete" with any of those cars. I disagree that adding more power will make it sell better. I'm confident that Mazda will ignore what you consider to be "required" |
Originally Posted by RIWWP
(Post 4571705)
I disagree with your entire premise that more power automatically makes the car better.
I disagree that it needs to "compete" with any of those cars. I disagree that adding more power will make it sell better. I'm confident that Mazda will ignore what you consider to be "required" |
Yep, if anything the FD was less capable than the Supra TT, 300ZXTT, and 3000GTVR-4/Stealth R/T TT.
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So Mazda will be build next RX you guys call it maybe RX7 or RX5 whatever you call it. What is this pure sports car compete with ? BRZ or GT86, 370z ?
90's legendary sports cars must be compete together why Mazda plays behind them i don't understand if they put 300 hp sports car then supra & nsx will give respect about their power figures now gtr35 showing us its potential. If Mazda produce a sports car like s2000 and if it will be 300hp it is not enough both 50th anniversary or RX-7 brandname. |
Mazda doesn't pursue power numbers because Mazda understands that power isn't everything.
Look at the FR-S/BRZ/FT-86. It's horrifically underpowered according to people like you, but it was responsible for a sales increase for the entire Scion brand of about 30% (if i recall correctly). It is still hugely popular, contrary to what people like you would think. You don't need lots of power to have a fun car, and having lots of power makes the car more expensive than "common people" can afford. Affordable fun will generate far more sales than a 5 minute masturbation over a magazine article ever will. Who exactly will care if it doesn't compete with huge power cars? People that are more interested in stroking their ego than just getting out and enjoying what they have. I only look for a smile in the car I drive, who cares if there are other cars faster out there? Not me. If you will be disappointed by only 300hp from an RX-7, then I guess you will go buy something else with more power...or sit crying over cars that have the power you want but can't afford. Plenty of the rest of us will be smiling, not crying. |
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