Finally the new... Supra
 

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx8...d1c1d55b59.png
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After 6 years the new Supra reborn... Will we get the new Rx vision after 6 years too in 2021? :fingersx:

1993 Supra came with 320 BHP and competed with Corvettes and Porsche's. A 1993 Mustang Cobra came with I think 240 BHP.

Twenty-five years later and the new. Supra will have somewhere from 335-380 BHP (estimates). Mustang GTs now come with 460 BHP and a base model corvette comes with 455 BHP.. So in 25 years corvettes and mustang have effectively doubled their horsepower, and the new Supra is increasing horsepower 4.6% (335) to 18.75% (380) all for a 63k price tag????? Also no manual transmission???

Who's gonna pay 63k for the new Supra and get smoked by the first new mustang they come across. I didn't expect a GTR killer, but damn this car looks to be a disappointment...

This is kinda rx8 vs FD all over again. IMO

Kind seems to me like they are trying to make a grand touring car or a pony car rather than a sports car.

That said, I also think this is one of the problems with shared platform development. You give up some control to gain some economy of scale. I'm almost certain that Subaru would love to sell a BRZ with an STi motor in it but are probably hampered by contracts (and the 90/10 production limit).

As for acceleration, how heavy is it? Is it as heavy as a Mustang or Corvette?

The RX-8 was priced a lot lower when it came out. It was only meant to compete with 350Z and S2000.

Supposed to be lighter than a Mark 4 Supra, so I would guess lighter than a mustang and probably the same weight as a corvette. I'm not saying the car will be a dog, but I don't think this is going to live up to the hype of the Supra as you would expect. This is a re-badged BMW with an automatic transmission.

So they are giving you the choice a new z4 coupe, or save that money for the C8 mid-engine corvette. If I was in the market I'd wait for the C8. or just get a C7 or a BRZ and turbo it. I hate being bias about this new supra but everything they are doing I don't like.

Also after reading this. I care even less. https://www.caranddriver.com/toyota/supra

This is just going to make it harder to get a MK4 supra lol.

That car and driver article sounds promising to me. They actually drove it, say it feels great. Numbers aren't everything (as the RX8 demonstrates). The pictures there also look much better than at the start of this thread.

Also says the BMW and Toyota teams took different paths and aren't attached at the hip. We'll seen when Z4 news starts coming out.

That ZF 8 speed auto is in damn near every car from Chrysler to BMW, it's a very good unit.

At the end of the day they need to make a car that fits in today's market, rather than relive memories of the past. There is no point in competing with Corvettes, you will not win. Instead sounds like they want to compete downmarket where there isn't a clear dominance.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx8...a14da8fbbb.jpg
I would still want a manual though...if they can pull off all of the best of the previous Supra mark characteristics...I would be tempted.

or I could just get this and be done....
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx8...c95478a52b.jpg

^ Unfortunately it'll spend most of its time in service.

I know but it is soooo good. Car & Driver has been hooning a 300C loaner while their's has been in the shop for weeks.

Two many doors for me.

Its been said that the new Supra will not be offered with a manual transmission. Disgusting.

i JUST WANT TO SEE IT LOSE IT'S STUPID CAMOUFLAGE, IT IS UGLY AND GIVES ME A HEADACHE TO LOOK AT.

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I think there was a change.org or a similar protest at one point about this.

Maybe they will eventually consider it?

It's just so odd that the new Corolla hatchback(not even a hot hatch) will be offered in manual and it's not just an afterthought(available with mid-trim and even comes with an auto rev match button), and yet a full blood sports car doesn't...

These are either concepts or renderings. Some of the designs definitely won't be carried over to the production models.

Just look at those side mirrors.

Yes those were just the concept designs, I wish this new car looked half as good... with the camo, the new Supra looks like a face lifted/revision of the GT86, in terms of design, stance, and stature...

it in (in essence) the Turbo GT86 that everyone begged for, and now that Toyota is giving us something similar, no one is happy with it. (Which is why they never bothered to do it for real) I don't understand why they have waited so long to give us a non camo version.... I think they are building too much hype for the car, and it is just going to end in mass-disappointment.

I agree - it should be available in manual with a premium on an automatic DCT. I am looking forward to it coming.

I recall sonic posting an article a while ago that said that Toyota didn't put a MT in also because they couldn't nail down the shifter feeling or something. They felt that the shifter feels way too heavy, and couldn't make it feel lighter without sacrificing durability(*cough*MX-5 gearbox*cough*).

I mean, if you really want the stick shift, just buy the BMW Z4. They share the same platform.

looks like bat mobile to me

and now the Supra takes to the RX-7 FD - more trolling

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/2...mb-141646.html

It's just some dude's rendering.

Not that I care about the Supra since you know, still no MT. And yes "aUtOmAtIc ShIfTs FaStEr", don't care. If I don't want a third pedal, I'd just buy a hybrid or EV.

I know it was just a rendering (that's why I said trolling). I do want a third pedal and it frustrates me that auto companies are removing this option even though the take rate [for MT] is constant. It's a cost savings.

What it translates to me - I'll wait and not buy a new car and buy a (manumatic like a Supra) once depreciation hits. Scr@#$ you auto companies.

I don't know, man. I wouldn't be so eager to buy a used Mk V Supra down the line.

It uses a lot of BMW parts. Keep this in mind. We will have to see reliability down the line(though I am skeptical, to say the least), but I am sure maintenance is not just like any other Toyota's. It's going to be just as over-engineered as a BMW.

Personally I would just buy a used Corvette(which also has MT) and call it a day. GM small block is a tried and true design, and if you like modding there is tons of aftermarket for it as well. I think you already know this, though.

I know the E-series BMWs have their reliability issues - but surprisingly about the same as a mid '00-10s Honda Accord - shock replacement at 150K, A/C issues (yes Honda I'm still p@ssed that you never recalled the 2005-2010 for compressor issues), power windows, etc. To me it was a wash. The F-series and now B-series it will be Turbos on top of that - I expect the 1.5L Honda "Tubro" to fail at some early 100K point as well since that's where the smaller diaplcement gets its 'powah'.

Out of all the issues Accords have, these you mentioned are actually not all that common. 98~05 V6 Accord auto trans slipping or 08~12 V6 Accord VCM oil consumption are much more serious and common from what I have seen.

I have owned a V6 Accord auto before the 8 and now an I4 manual, both 08. I can't speak for shocks since neither of them have that high of mileage, but both of them have ice cold A/C and power windows work without a hitch. The I4 has a broken switch so the auto up didn't work on the driver's side. A junkyard switch fixed that.

And heh, how much does it cost to fix up a Honda versus a BMW? The latter is a lot more complex and harder to take apart, not to mention the cost of parts.

As for the last sentiment, that's why even as a ex rotary owner, I still believe in no replacement for displacement and I will pick an NA car as much as I can. My Accord is NA so nothing to worry about on that front. With turbos, you are adding more stress to a smaller piece of metal. You can do the physics.

That said, most people probably don't drive Accords like BMWs so I don't think the engine will be that bad. Only time will tell, though.

Anyway, pretty silly to compare an Accord to a BMW performance car, hence why I brought up the Corvette. Good performer but without all the headache as a BMW, plus IMO it looks cooler than BMW(especially with the growing size of the grille nowadays).

Anybody here own one?

they likely wouldn’t be wasting their time here if they did ...

Nope, ZERO interest in a Toyota Z4

... 😂

I remember someone on this forum actually has a new Supra. Can't remember who it is off the top of my head.

The upcoming power boost on the 2021 or -2 Supra will be a good upgrade. I'm still in the need for at least 3 seats so these wonderful cars (718, Supra, Corvette) do not meet my needs right now. Having back seats and trunk space is a must - another reason I went with the RX-8. Heck if Mazda would put the inline 6 with Turbo in a new Mazda 3 (dare I say + MT) - they'd get a huge following.

If you are looking at a newer car and you like the Vette, give its little bro - the Camaro - a look.

I just picked mine up and there are things it does better than the C7. If you get them in stick shift, the 6-speed in Camaro SS is a ton better than the 7-speed in C7. The rear seats aren't spacious but they are there. The visibility will depend on the person but I personally find no issue with it whatsoever so don't let that discourage you. You will have to find out yourself.

The newer(2016+) Camaro SS is actually pretty impressive handling-wise. Supposedly GM used M4 as a performance benchmark for Camaro SS. The results show. Some are even arguing that it even beats the Vette in performance per buck - when new, a ZL1 costs about the same as a Grand Sport.

If you can find a used 2016+ SS, hop in and give it a try.

oh jeez, pushing for Camaro converts on his first day of ownership, in a Supra thread, on the RX8 forum ... that should be banned for life worthy right there. :rollingla

^It was the third day, for the record.

BTW, I just remembered who it was that bought the new Supra on the forum. It was DannyR3.

The chassis on the new Camaros really is something special. When you consider how cheap you can pick them up now its an incredible performance bargain. Only gripe from me is GM's V8 doesn't really feel like a sports car engine to me.

Yeah, the LS/LT family engines are not very rev-happy for sure but at the same time, not a lot of modern turbo engines the LT1 competes with are particularly revvy, either, and at least there is no turbo lag on the LS/LT engine.

Mustang's DOHC setup will be better for revving. The newest Mustang with 3rd gen Coyote can rev to 7500 RPM, while the Shelby GT350 can rev to 8200 RPM. If you like RX-8's high redline, the Mustang's engine will feel closer in that regard. I personally specifically wanted to try something different, though.

In the end, it's just personal taste. Do you want to have more torque down-low or do you want to have an engine that's more eager to rev?

well for something different you could try starting a Camaro specific thread and stop camaro bombing this one :suspect:

I was more talking about ponies in general, but yeah, should stay on topic.

If someone who has test-driven/owns one can chime in, I'd love to see some owner's perspective.

I don't think my local Toyota dealer has one but I haven't really checked, and around where I live I haven't seen one despite this being the sports car season.

you probably just thought it was a BMW Z4 :suspect:

Personally, I love the idea of the new Supra. I haven't had the chance to drive one yet, but the M2 is an absolute blast to drive. Imagining that experience boiled down into a smaller, lighter, more purpose built package is really appealing to me, if only it came with a manual.

I know its not a true Toyota with all of its BMW DNA but I'm ok with that. In this climate, Toyota was never going to build a brand new, dedicated sports car platform or a new inline 6 that can't be shared throughout their entire range, and BMW builds awesome inline 6's and sports car platforms.

Of course we all make fun of it, but I know that the chassis of the Supra is designed by Toyota so in stock form, it's a sports car versus Z4's more GT nature.

Personally, I don't mind the engine sharing as long as Toyota can make it reliable. With economy of the scale in mind, you can't expect Toyota to R&D and manufacture an I6 dedicated for Supra(a low-volume sports car).

The manual trans thing is not just a Supra-only problem(*cough*C8*cough*). And if you really want one and Toyota refuses to offer one, it might get enough aftermarket demand down the line for a relatively affordable conversion kit/dropkey swap.

Where I think Toyota went lazy is the interior and infotainment. That's where they could have more liberty and use some components from their other products. BMW electronics can be a nightmare to deal with, and having used the BMW automatic shifter, I absolutely hate using one. Drove a rental X3 before and it kept telling me how to use it. I'd take a manual BMW over an auto one for this reason alone.

This sounds like a major irritation.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/autos/news...cid=spartanntp

I read that article on R/T. That is a major test failure as I love to drive with my windows open and 'roof open. I did own an older Civic coupe that had the same issue. To me having a way to open the pressure relief vents that cars typically have in the trunk might help.

They solution in the RX8 is to open the rear flap windows


I had a car with a rear trunk vent thingy, seemed like it was a BMW. Maybe they left that detail out when Toyota got cheap on the purse strings :suspect: