Consumer Reports Top 10 and Bottom 10 Automotive Makes in Quality
03-01-2006, 10:45 PM
#1
Consumer Reports Top 10 and Bottom 10 Automotive Makes in Quality
"After Lexus, Honda and Toyota, the brands rounding out the top ten for reliability were Mitsubishi, Subaru, Acura, Scion, Mercury, Mazda and Suzuki.
The ten lowest-rated brands were Audi, Infiniti, Saturn, Lincoln, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, Land Rover, Hummer and Porsche."
...wow. European makes got their asses kicked.
Here's the whole enchilada.
Japanese Cars Score Highest in Magazine
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By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: March 1, 2006
Filed at 11:11 p.m. ET
DETROIT (AP) -- For the first time, all the top picks in Consumer Reports' annual vehicle guide are made by Japanese automakers.
The Honda Civic is the magazine's top small sedan, while the Toyota Highlander Hybrid is the top mid-sized sport utility vehicle, according to results released Wednesday. Vehicles from Nissan Motor Co. and Subaru, a division of Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd., round out the top picks in 10 categories.
Asian brands also fared best in the magazine's survey of vehicle reliability. Toyota Motor Corp.'s Lexus brand was first, while Honda was second and the Toyota brand was third. Ford Motor Co.'s Mercury brand was the only domestic nameplate to crack the top ten.
Consumer Reports' rankings are important to automakers, even though companies can't use the ratings in their advertising. Consumer Reports spokeswoman Lauren Hackett said the April auto issue is consistently the magazine's most popular, selling more than 300,000 copies at newsstands. That's twice as many copies as its second-most popular issue, the November electronics issue.
Consumer Reports began its top picks list in 1997. It is based on road and track tests, evaluations of comfort, convenience and fuel economy, crash protection ratings from the government and insurance industry and readers' reliability rankings. The magazine said it recently tested more than 200 vehicles to come up with its top picks.
Honda had the most winners, snagging top picks in five of the ten categories. Besides the redesigned Civic, the Honda Accord was the top family sedan between $20,000 and $30,000 and the Acura TL was the top upscale sedan between $30,000 and $40,000. The Honda Odyssey was the top minivan and the Honda Ridgeline, which is Honda's first entry in the pickup market, was the top pickup.
Toyota and Subaru each had two winners, including the Subaru Forester for small SUV and the Toyota Prius for ''green car.'' Nissan had one, the M35 luxury sedan, which the magazine called ''an excellent balance of performance, comfort and handling.''
Reliability rankings are based on a survey of Consumer Reports subscribers who are asked if they have had serious problems with their vehicles in the past 12 months. The survey questions readers about 17 different trouble spots. For this year's survey, readers rated their experience with 810,000 vehicles from the 1998 through 2005 model years.
Consumer Reports said Japanese and Korean brands had 12 problems per 100 vehicles, while U.S. automakers had 18 problems and European makers had 21 problems. Asian and U.S. automakers have been improving their scores but appeared to stall in 2005, the magazine said. European automakers' ratings haven't changed substantially in the last four years, the magazine said.
After Lexus, Honda and Toyota, the brands rounding out the top ten for reliability were Mitsubishi, Subaru, Acura, Scion, Mercury, Mazda and Suzuki. The ten lowest-rated brands were Audi, Infiniti, Saturn, Lincoln, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, Land Rover, Hummer and Porsche.
The ten lowest-rated brands were Audi, Infiniti, Saturn, Lincoln, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, Land Rover, Hummer and Porsche."
...wow. European makes got their asses kicked.
Here's the whole enchilada.
Japanese Cars Score Highest in Magazine
Article Tools Sponsored By
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: March 1, 2006
Filed at 11:11 p.m. ET
DETROIT (AP) -- For the first time, all the top picks in Consumer Reports' annual vehicle guide are made by Japanese automakers.
The Honda Civic is the magazine's top small sedan, while the Toyota Highlander Hybrid is the top mid-sized sport utility vehicle, according to results released Wednesday. Vehicles from Nissan Motor Co. and Subaru, a division of Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd., round out the top picks in 10 categories.
Asian brands also fared best in the magazine's survey of vehicle reliability. Toyota Motor Corp.'s Lexus brand was first, while Honda was second and the Toyota brand was third. Ford Motor Co.'s Mercury brand was the only domestic nameplate to crack the top ten.
Consumer Reports' rankings are important to automakers, even though companies can't use the ratings in their advertising. Consumer Reports spokeswoman Lauren Hackett said the April auto issue is consistently the magazine's most popular, selling more than 300,000 copies at newsstands. That's twice as many copies as its second-most popular issue, the November electronics issue.
Consumer Reports began its top picks list in 1997. It is based on road and track tests, evaluations of comfort, convenience and fuel economy, crash protection ratings from the government and insurance industry and readers' reliability rankings. The magazine said it recently tested more than 200 vehicles to come up with its top picks.
Honda had the most winners, snagging top picks in five of the ten categories. Besides the redesigned Civic, the Honda Accord was the top family sedan between $20,000 and $30,000 and the Acura TL was the top upscale sedan between $30,000 and $40,000. The Honda Odyssey was the top minivan and the Honda Ridgeline, which is Honda's first entry in the pickup market, was the top pickup.
Toyota and Subaru each had two winners, including the Subaru Forester for small SUV and the Toyota Prius for ''green car.'' Nissan had one, the M35 luxury sedan, which the magazine called ''an excellent balance of performance, comfort and handling.''
Reliability rankings are based on a survey of Consumer Reports subscribers who are asked if they have had serious problems with their vehicles in the past 12 months. The survey questions readers about 17 different trouble spots. For this year's survey, readers rated their experience with 810,000 vehicles from the 1998 through 2005 model years.
Consumer Reports said Japanese and Korean brands had 12 problems per 100 vehicles, while U.S. automakers had 18 problems and European makers had 21 problems. Asian and U.S. automakers have been improving their scores but appeared to stall in 2005, the magazine said. European automakers' ratings haven't changed substantially in the last four years, the magazine said.
After Lexus, Honda and Toyota, the brands rounding out the top ten for reliability were Mitsubishi, Subaru, Acura, Scion, Mercury, Mazda and Suzuki. The ten lowest-rated brands were Audi, Infiniti, Saturn, Lincoln, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, Land Rover, Hummer and Porsche.
03-01-2006, 11:47 PM
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^^ agreed.
Also...
There are some pretty subjective categories there and big questions about the nature of their survey and road and track tests. This kind of thing has been discussed here before, but still... especially with Mitsubishi coming out in the top 10...
Also...
It is based on road and track tests, evaluations of comfort, convenience and fuel economy, crash protection ratings from the government and insurance industry and readers' reliability rankings.
03-01-2006, 11:56 PM
#4
Weird, wasn't there just an article recently that had alot of the american auto companies as the most reliable cars?
Wish I had the link, but I remember reading it on cnn.com somewhere not long ago. Something isn't adding up....
Wish I had the link, but I remember reading it on cnn.com somewhere not long ago. Something isn't adding up....
03-01-2006, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Steiner
I'm surprised Mitsubishi is in the top 10 and Infiniti is in the bottom 10.
. lol. so that makes sense.
03-02-2006, 01:38 AM
#10
i pwn therefore i am
I know everyone craps on Mitsubishi, but I own one and know close to a dozen other people well that have one. I talk about cars and all that with them and I have never heard anyone have any problem with any Mitsubishi ever.
I shopped around at 2 dealers and they were both very professional, no nonsense kinda places. I've been serviced at 3 dealers (all maintenance stuff since I've never needed any repair in my 3 years of owning it) and they've all been fast, well-priced (for a car dealer anyways), and professional.
But, I've also had a Saturn. And this was when they were rated #2 in service right behind Lexus. They had AMAZING service. But their cars sucked terribly. I didn't know anyone who had a Saturn (and I probably knew 6 or 7 that did) that didn't have major problems.
So, there's two sides of the coin. The ratings are clearly not going to be perfect. All I know is my Saturn was pile of crap and my Mitsubishi has been phenomenal.
I hope I haven't cursed myself for like with this post.
I shopped around at 2 dealers and they were both very professional, no nonsense kinda places. I've been serviced at 3 dealers (all maintenance stuff since I've never needed any repair in my 3 years of owning it) and they've all been fast, well-priced (for a car dealer anyways), and professional.
But, I've also had a Saturn. And this was when they were rated #2 in service right behind Lexus. They had AMAZING service. But their cars sucked terribly. I didn't know anyone who had a Saturn (and I probably knew 6 or 7 that did) that didn't have major problems.
So, there's two sides of the coin. The ratings are clearly not going to be perfect. All I know is my Saturn was pile of crap and my Mitsubishi has been phenomenal.
I hope I haven't cursed myself for like with this post.
03-02-2006, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by saturn
I know everyone craps on Mitsubishi, but I own one and know close to a dozen other people well that have one. I talk about cars and all that with them and I have never heard anyone have any problem with any Mitsubishi ever.
I shopped around at 2 dealers and they were both very professional, no nonsense kinda places. I've been serviced at 3 dealers (all maintenance stuff since I've never needed any repair in my 3 years of owning it) and they've all been fast, well-priced (for a car dealer anyways), and professional.
But, I've also had a Saturn. And this was when they were rated #2 in service right behind Lexus. They had AMAZING service. But their cars sucked terribly. I didn't know anyone who had a Saturn (and I probably knew 6 or 7 that did) that didn't have major problems.
So, there's two sides of the coin. The ratings are clearly not going to be perfect. All I know is my Saturn was pile of crap and my Mitsubishi has been phenomenal.
I hope I haven't cursed myself for like with this post.
I shopped around at 2 dealers and they were both very professional, no nonsense kinda places. I've been serviced at 3 dealers (all maintenance stuff since I've never needed any repair in my 3 years of owning it) and they've all been fast, well-priced (for a car dealer anyways), and professional.
But, I've also had a Saturn. And this was when they were rated #2 in service right behind Lexus. They had AMAZING service. But their cars sucked terribly. I didn't know anyone who had a Saturn (and I probably knew 6 or 7 that did) that didn't have major problems.
So, there's two sides of the coin. The ratings are clearly not going to be perfect. All I know is my Saturn was pile of crap and my Mitsubishi has been phenomenal.
I hope I haven't cursed myself for like with this post.
What you described is typical anecdotal evidence.
It is human nature to weigh our own experiences and those of family and friends more highly than scientific data.
It's always a good thing to question the science in order interpret the evidential data most effectively... But citing individual exceptions to what the evidence points to as proof that the conclusions are false is not scientifically sound.
There will always be exceptions to the rule.
03-02-2006, 01:50 PM
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porsche is a bit of a surprise.
The ford holdings are not (jag, linc, and rover). Vw and Audi have been making crap for years, although I love the way Audi's look.
Not sure if Infiniti belongs there, but I really don't know anyone who owns one. I always thought Nissan was at the lower end of the jap makers.
I do know a few who own MB's and they definitely belong where they are. My friends cars were always in the shop.
Are you sure on the merc thing because the news is reporting that all ten top makers are japaneese?
I guess ford and GM will have to cut thier prices some more...but it is surprising that VW can have such low quality and such high prices. How do they stay in business...
The ford holdings are not (jag, linc, and rover). Vw and Audi have been making crap for years, although I love the way Audi's look.
Not sure if Infiniti belongs there, but I really don't know anyone who owns one. I always thought Nissan was at the lower end of the jap makers.
I do know a few who own MB's and they definitely belong where they are. My friends cars were always in the shop.
Are you sure on the merc thing because the news is reporting that all ten top makers are japaneese?
I guess ford and GM will have to cut thier prices some more...but it is surprising that VW can have such low quality and such high prices. How do they stay in business...
03-02-2006, 02:09 PM
#16
i pwn therefore i am
Originally Posted by sharward
No not cursed, but you'll be politely challenged.
What you described is typical anecdotal evidence.
It is human nature to weigh our own experiences and those of family and friends more highly than scientific data.
It's always a good thing to question the science in order interpret the evidential data most effectively... But citing individual exceptions to what the evidence points to as proof that the conclusions are false is not scientifically sound.
There will always be exceptions to the rule.
What you described is typical anecdotal evidence.
It is human nature to weigh our own experiences and those of family and friends more highly than scientific data.
It's always a good thing to question the science in order interpret the evidential data most effectively... But citing individual exceptions to what the evidence points to as proof that the conclusions are false is not scientifically sound.
There will always be exceptions to the rule.
Once one person says "Mitsu is crap" it gets reposted 7,000 times. People here are saying they're surprised by Mitsubishi being on the top 10 list. I wonder what data they're using to make these "scientific" claims.
Look, I'm not going to say Mitsu is the unparalleled leader of all things great. I'm just saying plenty of people toss around second-hand information that is out of context or misinformed. I'm just trying to give my perspective on things.
03-02-2006, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by saturn
Once one person says "Mitsu is crap" it gets reposted 7,000 times. People here are saying they're surprised by Mitsubishi being on the top 10 list. I wonder what data they're using to make these "scientific" claims.
Look, I'm not going to say Mitsu is the unparalleled leader of all things great. I'm just saying plenty of people toss around second-hand information that is out of context or misinformed. I'm just trying to give my perspective on things.
Look, I'm not going to say Mitsu is the unparalleled leader of all things great. I'm just saying plenty of people toss around second-hand information that is out of context or misinformed. I'm just trying to give my perspective on things.
03-02-2006, 02:32 PM
#18
i pwn therefore i am
Originally Posted by Steiner
I drive a Mitsubishi, so let me rephrase and say that I'm pleasantly surprised Mitsu found their way into the top 10. For the last 3 years all I've been hearing about online while researching "STI vs. Evo" was that I should be cautious of buying a Mitsubishi...bad cars, bad company, etc. I have no first hand evidence to make me believe one way or the other yet, but based on the consensus in automative circles you can't tell me you expected to see Mitsu at the top of the list. Can you?
This is Consumer Reports and not some forum. They have different criteria and sources (as well as biases). I'm actually not surprised at all. When I saw this topic, I said, watch Mitsu be in the top 10 and all the people will be pissy about it.
Also, the Evo is a whole different animal. People prolly abuse the crap outta their cars and then expect Mitsu to replace it for free. I have no idea what the Evo experience has added to the companies reputation in the past few years.
I was on this forum for countless hours before test driving an RX-8. When I got in an AT RX-8 for the first time, I expected it to be slower than my 105 hp Saturn I used to own because of everything that I read on this forum.
You have to be careful what kind of filter you have on when reading forums or watching tv or anything. Right now, I'm filtering most of the Mitsu-hating out because I think it's just one of those things that's been overhyped. Just my two cents.
03-02-2006, 03:20 PM
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My dad has 3 mitsu for his business...they all were crap and didnt last long. My mother had a Diamante many years ago when it was their flagship car. At 40,000 miles, the timing belt went and the engine needed to be rebuilt. Lucky it was under warranty. It was a $6000 tab from the invoice I saw. No mitsu's in my famliy ever again.
03-02-2006, 04:51 PM
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I'm not sure that people were questioning the reliability of mitsu ( I'm sure some were), but more then likely they were questioning if the company as a car maker would be around long enough to last out the warranty. The problems mitsu is having aren't exactly the result of thier cars, but from bad business decisions that put them on the brink of bankrupcy. They make decent cars but still have not come around on the finacial side. The marketing plan that they gave you one year of driving without making any payments didn't help either...
It's hard to buy a car when your not sure there's going to be a mitsu to fix it when things break...would you?
It's hard to buy a car when your not sure there's going to be a mitsu to fix it when things break...would you?
03-02-2006, 05:05 PM
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"After Lexus, Honda and Toyota, the brands rounding out the top ten for reliability were Mitsubishi, Subaru, Acura, Scion, Mercury, Mazda and Suzuki
...For the first time, all the top picks in Consumer Reports' annual vehicle guide are made by Japanese automakers.
...For the first time, all the top picks in Consumer Reports' annual vehicle guide are made by Japanese automakers.
Nissan had one, the M35 luxury sedan, which the magazine called ''an excellent balance of performance, comfort and handling.''
03-03-2006, 02:21 PM
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hmmm...Porsche at the bottom of the list eh?
I'll keep you guys posted, but they don't seem to have too many problems over at the Porsche boards other than the gremlins that come out when you try to tow.
Oh well...we'll see I guess...
I'll keep you guys posted, but they don't seem to have too many problems over at the Porsche boards other than the gremlins that come out when you try to tow.
Oh well...we'll see I guess...
03-03-2006, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by rodrigo67
It's hard to buy a car when your not sure there's going to be a mitsu to fix it when things break...would you?
I'm not worried about Mitsubishi not being around, they're not going anywhere. If for some freak reason they do disappear there are plenty places I would trust as much if not more than Mitsubishi with my car. Also, when a car company goes under there are usually arangements made to take care of any needed warranty work.