Make or break for Mazda ?
09-30-2003, 05:12 AM
#1
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Worcestershire
Posts: 434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Make or break for Mazda ?
I'm not one for polls, but do others think the 8 is a "make or break" car for Mazda ?
Personally I believe, as its the "Halo" car for the whole range, it is a M/B car for them. Alot rests on this car for Mazda, and they are in danger of letting slip this opportunity, especially as there is still no delivery date.
I have been on this forum a while now, and threatened to cancel once before. This seems churlish now as the car is so near (?) but I'm all out of patient and goodwill.
AnilS.
Personally I believe, as its the "Halo" car for the whole range, it is a M/B car for them. Alot rests on this car for Mazda, and they are in danger of letting slip this opportunity, especially as there is still no delivery date.
I have been on this forum a while now, and threatened to cancel once before. This seems churlish now as the car is so near (?) but I'm all out of patient and goodwill.
AnilS.
09-30-2003, 05:14 AM
#2
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
mate,
You come so far, the car is definately going to be here in November. I have the letter same as you. We are now only talking 4 weeks or so. Not long considering the 7 months we have already waited.
I feel the same way but now we got the letter if they **** that up
think they might have a number of lawsuits coming there way if they dont make november.
You come so far, the car is definately going to be here in November. I have the letter same as you. We are now only talking 4 weeks or so. Not long considering the 7 months we have already waited.
I feel the same way but now we got the letter if they **** that up
think they might have a number of lawsuits coming there way if they dont make november.
09-30-2003, 05:53 AM
#3
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Herts - UK
Posts: 350
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As you say, this is a halo car for Mazda. It has got to attract attention, get good press coverage, look good and be the kind of car people admire (before they decide they can't really justify the expense and buy a 6 instead). I think they are definitely on to a winner on that score.
It has also got to enhance Mazda's reputation for innovation and engineering excellence, so it has to be really reliable too in spite of the huge quantity of new technology. Hopefully they've got that covered.
Unfortunately, I don't think the issues that concern us right now (slipped delivery dates and possible horsepower shortfalls) are really key to the success of the RX-8 project as far as Mazda is concerned, so they are not really receiving the same attention.
Anyway, I am happy with "November" (which I am of course interpretting as November 30th) as a delivery date. Just so long as they stick to it.
It has also got to enhance Mazda's reputation for innovation and engineering excellence, so it has to be really reliable too in spite of the huge quantity of new technology. Hopefully they've got that covered.
Unfortunately, I don't think the issues that concern us right now (slipped delivery dates and possible horsepower shortfalls) are really key to the success of the RX-8 project as far as Mazda is concerned, so they are not really receiving the same attention.
Anyway, I am happy with "November" (which I am of course interpretting as November 30th) as a delivery date. Just so long as they stick to it.
09-30-2003, 06:03 AM
#4
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Kidwelly,Wales, UK
Posts: 595
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't think that the RX8 is a make or break car for Mazda as sports cars are not their core market. Family saloons , small cars and the MX-5 are their main market and they trade on reliability and value rather than excitement.
A successful RX8 may bring about a change in customer perception of Mazda but I don't think the failure of the RX8 will kill Mazda , but it would prabably kill the rotary.
A successful RX8 may bring about a change in customer perception of Mazda but I don't think the failure of the RX8 will kill Mazda , but it would prabably kill the rotary.
Last edited by AndyPearce; 09-30-2003 at 06:12 AM.
09-30-2003, 07:49 AM
#6
As said, make or break is lot sof volume on new cross platform (2,3 and 6) cars.
The RX-8 wont ever make money cause of its realtivly low volumes, as such is ahalo car, but mazda have to be VERY carefull with the 8, any problems may drag their reputation down, 1 reason for no turbo I would have thought.
The RX-8 wont ever make money cause of its realtivly low volumes, as such is ahalo car, but mazda have to be VERY carefull with the 8, any problems may drag their reputation down, 1 reason for no turbo I would have thought.
09-30-2003, 08:54 AM
#8
Mucho Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Herts - UK
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As usual , the ace is right on the money....
That is what we really want.
A no frills , fast , lithe , slap you in the face, NormAspirated RX7....
and for that to happen , the RX8 has gotta work commercially , not just as an automotive curiosity.
That is what we really want.
A no frills , fast , lithe , slap you in the face, NormAspirated RX7....
and for that to happen , the RX8 has gotta work commercially , not just as an automotive curiosity.
09-30-2003, 10:45 AM
#10
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
its been said already i dont think this is make or break for mazda the mx5 will continue to sell in its role as a very good hairdryer.
The 6 series has been critically acclaimed even though it looks crap. The wife has a 323 which for its price is superb.
Mazda are a very reliable car manufacturer so that image isnt going to change.
However, this car will make or break the rotary concept. I think the engine is a sound idea but the eco-friendly aspect (more like lack of) is something that will need to be researched, only the success of this car will contribute to that.
Its just managing to scrape under the emissions issues. Going forward the rotary has to become more fuel efficient and eco-friendly otherwise Europe with its stringent rules will mean we never see a rotary again.
The 6 series has been critically acclaimed even though it looks crap. The wife has a 323 which for its price is superb.
Mazda are a very reliable car manufacturer so that image isnt going to change.
However, this car will make or break the rotary concept. I think the engine is a sound idea but the eco-friendly aspect (more like lack of) is something that will need to be researched, only the success of this car will contribute to that.
Its just managing to scrape under the emissions issues. Going forward the rotary has to become more fuel efficient and eco-friendly otherwise Europe with its stringent rules will mean we never see a rotary again.
09-30-2003, 10:55 AM
#11
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Cornwall, England
Posts: 1,119
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Flagship maybe......... make or break NO.
Too small volume compared to MX5 and 6 even the new 3.
It will be a great car, we already know that and in it's class will sell well I feel.
For those wishing to cancel, I agree with your sentiments but, it will make no difference to Mazda, they can sell your car in an instant with such strong demand.
I'm looking forward to cruising in mine in the next month or so:D
Cheers
Oilman
Too small volume compared to MX5 and 6 even the new 3.
It will be a great car, we already know that and in it's class will sell well I feel.
For those wishing to cancel, I agree with your sentiments but, it will make no difference to Mazda, they can sell your car in an instant with such strong demand.
I'm looking forward to cruising in mine in the next month or so:D
Cheers
Oilman
10-01-2003, 02:13 AM
#12
Greek Power
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Greece
Posts: 439
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by morganrogers
As usual , the ace is right on the money....
That is what we really want.
A no frills , fast , lithe , slap you in the face, NormAspirated RX7....
and for that to happen , the RX8 has gotta work commercially , not just as an automotive curiosity.
As usual , the ace is right on the money....
That is what we really want.
A no frills , fast , lithe , slap you in the face, NormAspirated RX7....
and for that to happen , the RX8 has gotta work commercially , not just as an automotive curiosity.
The Mazda mechanic(s) who said that the RX7 is a possibility if the RX8 goes well, also said that the Renesis, given the proper cooling, is an amazing engine for turbo
Since the rotary doesnt give a dime about lowering compressions, new gaskets, stronger pistons etc etc, its just a matter of slapping on the turbo(s), installing a VERY decent I/C, upgrade fuel, water and oil pumps, and be about your business
Can you say "1308cc, 350HP in stock form" ?
Last edited by The Ace; 10-01-2003 at 04:06 PM.
10-01-2003, 02:25 AM
#13
Mucho Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Herts - UK
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well - much as I respect the rotary knowledge of 'the ace' I;m gonna disagree on this.
Turbos , while fun, are always a compromise.
Need more power ? Cant be bothered to engineer it in ? Bung on a turbo ! Lazy , lazy , lazy !
For me at least , the NA aspect of the Renesis while making all those horses (double my old NA rotary) is the real genius.
I for one will be hoping for a larger NA rx7 ! ! !
Turbos , while fun, are always a compromise.
Need more power ? Cant be bothered to engineer it in ? Bung on a turbo ! Lazy , lazy , lazy !
For me at least , the NA aspect of the Renesis while making all those horses (double my old NA rotary) is the real genius.
I for one will be hoping for a larger NA rx7 ! ! !
Last edited by morganrogers; 10-01-2003 at 03:58 AM.
10-01-2003, 03:05 AM
#14
They wont go near another turbo rotary purely for reliability reasons. Even if they engineed one well, plenty of people are gona up the boost n chip them like mad, and thrash them into the ground.
80% (pulled out of hat) of peoples rotary worries are down to the 3rd gen rx-7's turbo heat problems. Plus its twin turbo was so expensive (eaqual to another engine) that it pushed the price way up - and also contributed to its leary handling tag.
I dont think they'll go for a turbo because of these reasons alone, prehaps a supercharger, but I dont think there as suited to rotaries?
80% (pulled out of hat) of peoples rotary worries are down to the 3rd gen rx-7's turbo heat problems. Plus its twin turbo was so expensive (eaqual to another engine) that it pushed the price way up - and also contributed to its leary handling tag.
I dont think they'll go for a turbo because of these reasons alone, prehaps a supercharger, but I dont think there as suited to rotaries?
10-01-2003, 04:00 AM
#15
Mucho Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Herts - UK
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
3rd gen RX was about £20K in the USofA.
Only in the UK was it £35K and it killed it dead !
So the sequential turbo (while expensive) cannot have been the sole reason for hefty price tag....
Only in the UK was it £35K and it killed it dead !
So the sequential turbo (while expensive) cannot have been the sole reason for hefty price tag....
10-01-2003, 04:14 PM
#16
Greek Power
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Greece
Posts: 439
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, like I said, the mechanics that said those things about the RX8/RX7 also said that "this is just a hypothesis" No one knows if the RX8 will do SO good as to warrant a new RX7......
However, unfortunatelly you can do only so much with an N/A rotary (as with any other N/A internal combustion engine). You can ditch all cats, you can enlarge the throttle body, you can bridge-port the hell out of the engine, but you will still end up with a 1308cc N/A rotary engine producing no more than 300HP.
Slapping on a turbo is neither as simple or as easy as morganrogers makes it to be. Its not the "easy way out", nor is it a "compromise". F/I is just a different way of increasing the HP/torque output of an internal combustion engine. Simple as that. The fact that the rotary engine has increased operating temperature in comparison with a piston engine is the only and major problem for Mazda. Thats why I said that this requires a very decent I/C, and upgraded pumps all around. But the above setup will send the HP over the 350HP mark easily
As for the "problems" that you are all mentioning, apart from the S1 version of the FD ('92-'93, very few models), which indeed had overheating problems built-in :o , all the other -newer- models had none. Its only the stupidity and/or misinformation of the owners that led to the bad name for the FDs (and the rotaries in general)........
No one knows if the RX8 will do SO good as to warrant a new RX7......However, unfortunatelly you can do only so much with an N/A rotary (as with any other N/A internal combustion engine). You can ditch all cats, you can enlarge the throttle body, you can bridge-port the hell out of the engine, but you will still end up with a 1308cc N/A rotary engine producing no more than 300HP.
Slapping on a turbo is neither as simple or as easy as morganrogers makes it to be. Its not the "easy way out", nor is it a "compromise". F/I is just a different way of increasing the HP/torque output of an internal combustion engine. Simple as that. The fact that the rotary engine has increased operating temperature in comparison with a piston engine is the only and major problem for Mazda. Thats why I said that this requires a very decent I/C, and upgraded pumps all around. But the above setup will send the HP over the 350HP mark easily
As for the "problems" that you are all mentioning, apart from the S1 version of the FD ('92-'93, very few models), which indeed had overheating problems built-in :o , all the other -newer- models had none. Its only the stupidity and/or misinformation of the owners that led to the bad name for the FDs (and the rotaries in general)........
10-02-2003, 03:06 AM
#17
Originally posted by The Ace
Well, like I said, the mechanics that said those things about the RX8/RX7 also said that "this is just a hypothesis" No one knows if the RX8 will do SO good as to warrant a new RX7......
However, unfortunatelly you can do only so much with an N/A rotary (as with any other N/A internal combustion engine). You can ditch all cats, you can enlarge the throttle body, you can bridge-port the hell out of the engine, but you will still end up with a 1308cc N/A rotary engine producing no more than 300HP.
Well, like I said, the mechanics that said those things about the RX8/RX7 also said that "this is just a hypothesis"
No one knows if the RX8 will do SO good as to warrant a new RX7......However, unfortunatelly you can do only so much with an N/A rotary (as with any other N/A internal combustion engine). You can ditch all cats, you can enlarge the throttle body, you can bridge-port the hell out of the engine, but you will still end up with a 1308cc N/A rotary engine producing no more than 300HP.
Originally posted by The Ace
Slapping on a turbo is neither as simple or as easy as morganrogers makes it to be. Its not the "easy way out", nor is it a "compromise". F/I is just a different way of increasing the HP/torque output of an internal combustion engine. Simple as that. The fact that the rotary engine has increased operating temperature in comparison with a piston engine is the only and major problem for Mazda. Thats why I said that this requires a very decent I/C, and upgraded pumps all around. But the above setup will send the HP over the 350HP mark easily
As for the "problems" that you are all mentioning, apart from the S1 version of the FD ('92-'93, very few models), which indeed had overheating problems built-in :o , all the other -newer- models had none. Its only the stupidity and/or misinformation of the owners that led to the bad name for the FDs (and the rotaries in general)........
Slapping on a turbo is neither as simple or as easy as morganrogers makes it to be. Its not the "easy way out", nor is it a "compromise". F/I is just a different way of increasing the HP/torque output of an internal combustion engine. Simple as that. The fact that the rotary engine has increased operating temperature in comparison with a piston engine is the only and major problem for Mazda. Thats why I said that this requires a very decent I/C, and upgraded pumps all around. But the above setup will send the HP over the 350HP mark easily
As for the "problems" that you are all mentioning, apart from the S1 version of the FD ('92-'93, very few models), which indeed had overheating problems built-in :o , all the other -newer- models had none. Its only the stupidity and/or misinformation of the owners that led to the bad name for the FDs (and the rotaries in general)........
We know a NA rotary , now rotor tips etc are fairly sorted, is a reliable motor. The public perviece them as unreliable in the extreem, uneconomical (still there!) and dirty (one reason for missing a few HP for euro stage 4).
The next gen RX-7 has to do a few things. Has to be quick ( 250bhp-300bhp at least), light (1200kg ish) and under £30k.
But still theres an awful lot of competition in that range.
10-02-2003, 04:29 AM
#18
Greek Power
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Greece
Posts: 439
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by RobDickinson
Its most likely to be a 1500cc 2 rotor, so somewhere over 300bhp, will do a light car for mid £20k.
Its not what the problem is, its what the public percieve. Any new RX-7 has to compete against a lot of cars, some of which will sell more just because of its badge (porsche boxter etc).
We know a NA rotary , now rotor tips etc are fairly sorted, is a reliable motor. The public perviece them as unreliable in the extreem, uneconomical (still there!) and dirty (one reason for missing a few HP for euro stage 4).
The next gen RX-7 has to do a few things. Has to be quick ( 250bhp-300bhp at least), light (1200kg ish) and under £30k.
But still theres an awful lot of competition in that range.
Its most likely to be a 1500cc 2 rotor, so somewhere over 300bhp, will do a light car for mid £20k.
Its not what the problem is, its what the public percieve. Any new RX-7 has to compete against a lot of cars, some of which will sell more just because of its badge (porsche boxter etc).
We know a NA rotary , now rotor tips etc are fairly sorted, is a reliable motor. The public perviece them as unreliable in the extreem, uneconomical (still there!) and dirty (one reason for missing a few HP for euro stage 4).
The next gen RX-7 has to do a few things. Has to be quick ( 250bhp-300bhp at least), light (1200kg ish) and under £30k.
But still theres an awful lot of competition in that range.
And I dont think that the next RX7 will have "only" 250-300HP. This was the case with the FD, and that was 10 years ago. The latest FD (SpiritR
) had 280HP, and was about 1200Kg anyway......so I'm guessing that Mazda, if they decide to go ahead with this, will be aiming at more than 300HP (if they go F/I then more than 350HP), and around the same weight......Dont know about the price though......the FD was fairly expensive, so I guess the new RX7 will be too. And again I disagree about the reliability issues: the "public" (i.e average Joe Doe) should stick to their SUVs, pick-ups, and Corollas. Everyone has to treat and operate each machine like its manual says. If they dont know how to, just dont buy it (and keep their mouth shut when discussing this machine
). You and I know that this is not true, since all these people will start talking about the "problems" they had, because of their ignorance and/or stupidity, but still................ah, its a lost cause anyway, so why bother ?
10-02-2003, 05:04 AM
#19
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Kidwelly,Wales, UK
Posts: 595
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by The Ace
And again I disagree about the reliability issues: the "public" (i.e average Joe Doe) should stick to their SUVs, pick-ups, and Corollas. Everyone has to treat and operate each machine like its manual says. If they dont know how to, just dont buy it (and keep their mouth shut when discussing this machine ). You and I know that this is not true, since all these people will start talking about the "problems" they had, because of their ignorance and/or stupidity, but still.....
...........ah, its a lost cause anyway, so why bother ?
And again I disagree about the reliability issues: the "public" (i.e average Joe Doe) should stick to their SUVs, pick-ups, and Corollas. Everyone has to treat and operate each machine like its manual says. If they dont know how to, just dont buy it (and keep their mouth shut when discussing this machine
). You and I know that this is not true, since all these people will start talking about the "problems" they had, because of their ignorance and/or stupidity, but still................ah, its a lost cause anyway, so why bother ?
10-02-2003, 05:25 AM
#20
Ace, unless you misse dmost of the late 90's and early 00's , mazda was in a world of crap.
Ford bailed them out and now have them back on track again - but its not like ford are makin huge profits to help out if times get tough either. They've just announced 3000 more job losses in europe:/
Whatever mazda make, it has to make money, and not damage their reputation, they cant afford it.
When I said 250-300bhp + 1200kg , thats a minimum they must meet.
Yes the last rx-7 was 280bhp in japan , but that wasnt with new euro emmisions, and was with a turbo.
I dont see a turbo on the rx-7 unless they realy want to compete with things like the boxters, TVR's etc.
A 3 rotor would be nice, but heavier, and tons more money, 3 rotor (20b)is equivelant to something like a 4.0 v10 and would be priced simlaly, imagine the fuel costs lol - and that has to be considered. 2nd gen RX-7 was a comparative faliure because of the low power causing mazda to gear it so low it was too uneconomical.
A 1500cc 2 rotor would hit 300bhp, right on the money, which is looking likely. Prehaps a turbo 'sport' version would be 350+, prolly priced in boxter teritory tho.
Ford bailed them out and now have them back on track again - but its not like ford are makin huge profits to help out if times get tough either. They've just announced 3000 more job losses in europe:/
Whatever mazda make, it has to make money, and not damage their reputation, they cant afford it.
When I said 250-300bhp + 1200kg , thats a minimum they must meet.
Yes the last rx-7 was 280bhp in japan , but that wasnt with new euro emmisions, and was with a turbo.
I dont see a turbo on the rx-7 unless they realy want to compete with things like the boxters, TVR's etc.
A 3 rotor would be nice, but heavier, and tons more money, 3 rotor (20b)is equivelant to something like a 4.0 v10 and would be priced simlaly, imagine the fuel costs lol - and that has to be considered. 2nd gen RX-7 was a comparative faliure because of the low power causing mazda to gear it so low it was too uneconomical.
A 1500cc 2 rotor would hit 300bhp, right on the money, which is looking likely. Prehaps a turbo 'sport' version would be 350+, prolly priced in boxter teritory tho.
10-02-2003, 05:30 AM
#21
Greek Power
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Greece
Posts: 439
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by AndyPearce
I don't know about anyone else but I've never had the chance to read an owners manual before buying a car. Many people buying the RX8 will be unaware of things like the oil usage issues. It's a strange eliteist attitude you have with this car (or rotarys), don't you want mainstream recognition for this car or engine?
I don't know about anyone else but I've never had the chance to read an owners manual before buying a car. Many people buying the RX8 will be unaware of things like the oil usage issues. It's a strange eliteist attitude you have with this car (or rotarys), don't you want mainstream recognition for this car or engine?
On the other hand, I REALLY hate attitudes and comments like "well, although Mazda and the dealer and the mechanic and the guy at the newsstand told me that I should take care of the oil level, I never really cared and didnt even check once, so now that my engine is fried, I really blame Mazda for not making the FD idiot-proof"
You catch my drift ? Its not that I dont want people to test, and check, and criticise the RX8, its just that I dont want people to blame the car/Mazda/dealer/mechanic for their ignorance, stupidity and/or indifference to this machine's operating instructions
Last edited by The Ace; 10-02-2003 at 05:32 AM.
10-02-2003, 05:46 AM
#22
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Kidwelly,Wales, UK
Posts: 595
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by The Ace
I surely wish that all those who bought the FD actually read the manuals, paid attention to what Mazda and its dealers told them, and actually cared for their car. I also most certainly want mainstream recognition for the RX8, because that will bring a new RX7 that much closer.......
On the other hand, I REALLY hate attitudes and comments like "well, although Mazda and the dealer and the mechanic and the guy at the newsstand told me that I should take care of the oil level, I never really cared and didnt even check once, so now that my engine is fried, I really blame Mazda for not making the FD idiot-proof"
You catch my drift ? Its not that I dont want people to test, and check, and criticise the RX8, its just that I dont want people to blame the car/Mazda/dealer/mechanic for their ignorance, stupidity and/or indifference to this machine's operating instructions
I surely wish that all those who bought the FD actually read the manuals, paid attention to what Mazda and its dealers told them, and actually cared for their car. I also most certainly want mainstream recognition for the RX8, because that will bring a new RX7 that much closer.......
On the other hand, I REALLY hate attitudes and comments like "well, although Mazda and the dealer and the mechanic and the guy at the newsstand told me that I should take care of the oil level, I never really cared and didnt even check once, so now that my engine is fried, I really blame Mazda for not making the FD idiot-proof"
You catch my drift ? Its not that I dont want people to test, and check, and criticise the RX8, its just that I dont want people to blame the car/Mazda/dealer/mechanic for their ignorance, stupidity and/or indifference to this machine's operating instructions
10-02-2003, 06:35 AM
#23
Registered
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Preston, UK
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can see both your arguments:
1. read the instructions or it's ur own fault
2. blown engines = bad press despite any warnings
wouldnt it be possible to have a multistage oil level gauge and when it gets near empty ( if stupidly ignored) the engine cuts out.
I can hear you sayin what happens if ur doin 100mph in the outside lane and the engine cuts out!! but this does kinda happen with the fuel gauge too and surely better to happend than a seized engine :-)
just a thought,
Paul
1. read the instructions or it's ur own fault
2. blown engines = bad press despite any warnings
wouldnt it be possible to have a multistage oil level gauge and when it gets near empty ( if stupidly ignored) the engine cuts out.
I can hear you sayin what happens if ur doin 100mph in the outside lane and the engine cuts out!! but this does kinda happen with the fuel gauge too and surely better to happend than a seized engine :-)
just a thought,
Paul
10-02-2003, 06:48 AM
#24
Mucho Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Herts - UK
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From TheAce
Just for the record , I never meant to imply it is simple - I am sure I wouldn't be able to do it on my black and decker workbench.
As for 'easy way out' or 'compromise' - well , I think you are wrong.
It's OK , that is your opinion , but mine is that it is a compromise. Forced induction is an easy way to big power. I know people who have had 180bhp from their saxos by bunging a turbo on it - and this is a little 8valve 1.6. And realistically , all it involved was a bolt on turbo kit and some remapping of fuel supplies. A turbo is, relative to NA mods, an quick and dirty way to big power.
A far more elegant solution would be some kind of larger NA design (with appropriate porting etc) , and this would have the double benefit of increased reliability and a better chance with Joe Public. Plus a NA rotary is a thing of beauty in my warped mind.....
All opinions expressed , purely my own (etc etc....)
Slapping on a turbo is neither as simple or as easy as morganrogers makes it to be. Its not the "easy way out", nor is it a "compromise".
As for 'easy way out' or 'compromise' - well , I think you are wrong.
It's OK , that is your opinion , but mine is that it is a compromise. Forced induction is an easy way to big power. I know people who have had 180bhp from their saxos by bunging a turbo on it - and this is a little 8valve 1.6. And realistically , all it involved was a bolt on turbo kit and some remapping of fuel supplies. A turbo is, relative to NA mods, an quick and dirty way to big power.
A far more elegant solution would be some kind of larger NA design (with appropriate porting etc) , and this would have the double benefit of increased reliability and a better chance with Joe Public. Plus a NA rotary is a thing of beauty in my warped mind.....
All opinions expressed , purely my own (etc etc....)
10-02-2003, 06:50 AM
#25
Would be best to have a low oil light come on when you get to the low oil line on the dipstick.
I know my focus doesnt, low oil light wont come on until the oil level is way to low.
but people expect modern cars (at least 4-5yo ones) to only need work on them during the scheduled services.
If you need to do anything in between serviced people phreak, there just not used to it anymore. Prolly why tons of people drive round with bald tyres, low pressure tyres, no brake lights etc.
Its partly the manufacturers fault anyhow. Tjere making cars need less regular maintanance, which is good, but also making them much less able to be maintained by yourself - which means dealer revenue.
I know my focus doesnt, low oil light wont come on until the oil level is way to low.
but people expect modern cars (at least 4-5yo ones) to only need work on them during the scheduled services.
If you need to do anything in between serviced people phreak, there just not used to it anymore. Prolly why tons of people drive round with bald tyres, low pressure tyres, no brake lights etc.
Its partly the manufacturers fault anyhow. Tjere making cars need less regular maintanance, which is good, but also making them much less able to be maintained by yourself - which means dealer revenue.