REVIEW: Ric Shaw Controller - Fitted
03-08-2004, 10:06 AM
#1
REVIEW: Ric Shaw Controller - Fitted
Hi all,
Here is the latest scoop from the House of Hymee.
This evening we fitted a "Ric Shaw" piggy-back ECU. The special thing about this one is that we fitted it without cutting or splicing any of the wiring loom. We did this with the latest Hymee special - a custom made wiring harness that plugs directly into the factory connectors. The harness is a product of at least 25-30 man hours work by myself and a silent partner.
Don't ask me for any coightometer reports. The dyno will reveal all when we get it on there. (Remember - mine doesn't have "Safe Mode")
Note - the unit was installed with Ric's "base tune". We have the cable and software to be able to tune the unit ourselves. A very experienced rotary engine tuner will be doing a full tune on the unit in the very near future.
Here is what I do have to report:
More details to come when we do some proper tests in a controlled environemnt, and do a full tune.
Cheers,
Hymee.
PS - I just awarded myself the Post of the Day! Actually - a tie with EASTMOON. All your base are belong to us, grasshopper!
Here is the latest scoop from the House of Hymee.
This evening we fitted a "Ric Shaw" piggy-back ECU. The special thing about this one is that we fitted it without cutting or splicing any of the wiring loom. We did this with the latest Hymee special - a custom made wiring harness that plugs directly into the factory connectors. The harness is a product of at least 25-30 man hours work by myself and a silent partner.
Don't ask me for any coightometer reports. The dyno will reveal all when we get it on there. (Remember - mine doesn't have "Safe Mode")
Note - the unit was installed with Ric's "base tune". We have the cable and software to be able to tune the unit ourselves. A very experienced rotary engine tuner will be doing a full tune on the unit in the very near future.
Here is what I do have to report:
- Unit looks very good, and professional. Nice black case, much smaller in all dimensions than the factory ECU.
- Comes with a "blank off" plug to allow the unit to be switched on/off without un-installation/re-installation.
- Car started first go with "blank-off" installed.
- Car started first go with unit operational.
- Car drove just fine.
- Real time ODBII data logging (via my scan tool and software) showed the Air/Fuel ratios in a much more desirable range. This shows the fuel control is performing its intended function.
- We fiddled with the Ignition timing in real time (while the engine was running) and noticed the difference. We held it at about 2000 RPM and pulled a bunch of timing out, and the revs dropped off correspondingly. This shows the Ignition control is performing its intended function.
More details to come when we do some proper tests in a controlled environemnt, and do a full tune.
Cheers,
Hymee.
PS - I just awarded myself the Post of the Day! Actually - a tie with EASTMOON. All your base are belong to us, grasshopper!
Last edited by Hymee; 03-08-2004 at 10:09 AM.
03-08-2004, 02:53 PM
#4
aka Smoothy
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Hymee,
Great stuff. I wait with much interest to hear the results of your testing. Are you going to look at
1) Stock Car
2) With Rics tune
3) After the unit has been professionally tuned?
Your Hymee wiring harness that plugs the unit directly into the car sounds awesome.
Congratulations on a great job.
Great stuff. I wait with much interest to hear the results of your testing. Are you going to look at
1) Stock Car
2) With Rics tune
3) After the unit has been professionally tuned?
Your Hymee wiring harness that plugs the unit directly into the car sounds awesome.
Congratulations on a great job.
03-08-2004, 06:32 PM
#10
Originally posted by skc
I would be interested in seeing the dyno results.
I would be interested in seeing the dyno results.
Originally posted by skc
BTW what are the benefits of upgrading the ECU...I am a novice when it comes to upgrades.
BTW what are the benefits of upgrading the ECU...I am a novice when it comes to upgrades.
Or are you talking about the benefits of the unit itself? It is not a replacement for the PCM. It plugs into the PCM and "takes control" of ignition and fuel (in simple terms). All other operations/functions of the car are still in-tact. In fact, after we had been plugging and un-plugging a couple of times, my radio still had all it's station presets, remembered what station is was on, and the A/C still held it's settings. Even the Trip computer rembered I had done about 450km
The cruise control worked flawlessly (well, I didn't check for the random "surge" I usually get on "resume", but that is random anyway, and is a behaviour of the car, not the piggy-back).
Cheers,
Hymee.
Last edited by Hymee; 03-08-2004 at 06:35 PM.
03-08-2004, 07:28 PM
#12
How long? Oh - about 1/4 mile. Or 15 Seconds. Hehehe. Only joking. I first spoke to Ric on the... Hang on a bit...
The unit has been purchased outright at (full price) from Ric so we could do our own totally independant evaluation.
The "Hymee Special" Harness was done independantly from Ric, by myself and SP (the Silent Partner).
Cheers,
Hymee.
The unit has been purchased outright at (full price) from Ric so we could do our own totally independant evaluation.
The "Hymee Special" Harness was done independantly from Ric, by myself and SP (the Silent Partner).
Cheers,
Hymee.
03-08-2004, 08:38 PM
#14
The purpose of the unit is to tune the car to an "optimum level" of efficiency.
Traditionally, factory tunes very in degress between rich and pig rich. The RX-8 is rich. The idea is to lean out the mixture as well as optimise the ignition timing.
Most people would do this mod for more power and better "driveability". But it can also be beneficial to fuel economy. Surely if the mixture is not so rich, then it is better for the environment as well. So potentially winners all round.
Cheers,
Hymee.
Traditionally, factory tunes very in degress between rich and pig rich. The RX-8 is rich. The idea is to lean out the mixture as well as optimise the ignition timing.
Most people would do this mod for more power and better "driveability". But it can also be beneficial to fuel economy. Surely if the mixture is not so rich, then it is better for the environment as well. So potentially winners all round.
Cheers,
Hymee.
03-08-2004, 08:48 PM
#15
rock-->o<--hard place
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I guess it is also dependent on the fuel you use (ie, 98 RON v 95) -- is that right?
When I saw the other (US) thread on Ric's unit, I was somewhat daunted by the amount of calibration one could do. So it will be interesting to see what you achieve.
Do you know whether Ric has any dyno results?
When I saw the other (US) thread on Ric's unit, I was somewhat daunted by the amount of calibration one could do. So it will be interesting to see what you achieve.
Do you know whether Ric has any dyno results?
03-08-2004, 10:28 PM
#16
aka Smoothy
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Do you know whether Ric has any dyno results?
I have spoken to Ric about this issue. He is quite guarded in his response. I suspect that he does not want to make claims that are later shown to be wrong. He was openly sceptical of some of the claims that have been made here about what simply changing the fuel & ignition maps can do for this non forced injection motor. When I pressed him on the type of gains that this modification would get I got the impression that he was talking in the range of 10 to 15kw. That is just the feeling I got from Ric. I am extremely curious to see what results Hymee gets!
He struck me as an honest and open guy that could be trusted.
03-09-2004, 02:05 AM
#18
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Two great innovators working on the same project - and in harmony. Hard to beat.
I have knelt at Ric's shrine on Parramatta Rd; now looking forward to meeting my other guru, Hymee la Croix, at Wakefield - and in the mean time reminding him about those boring old catbacks.
I'm anticipating with the same enthusiasm the hardware as well as the software..
Rock On!
jack
I have knelt at Ric's shrine on Parramatta Rd; now looking forward to meeting my other guru, Hymee la Croix, at Wakefield - and in the mean time reminding him about those boring old catbacks.
I'm anticipating with the same enthusiasm the hardware as well as the software..
Rock On!
jack
03-09-2004, 05:38 AM
#19
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Hymee,
After being the first to get one of your grills and as your Hymee cat-back test pilot, please place me at the front of the que for your latest project!
Hats off to Ric Shaw also for producing what sounds like a top-notch TUNE-ABLE mod for the '8.
After being the first to get one of your grills and as your Hymee cat-back test pilot, please place me at the front of the que for your latest project!
Hats off to Ric Shaw also for producing what sounds like a top-notch TUNE-ABLE mod for the '8.
03-10-2004, 07:44 PM
#21
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Originally posted by Hymee
The purpose of the unit is to tune the car to an "optimum level" of efficiency.
Traditionally, factory tunes very in degress between rich and pig rich. The RX-8 is rich. The idea is to lean out the mixture as well as optimise the ignition timing.
Most people would do this mod for more power and better "driveability". But it can also be beneficial to fuel economy. Surely if the mixture is not so rich, then it is better for the environment as well. So potentially winners all round.
Cheers,
Hymee.
The purpose of the unit is to tune the car to an "optimum level" of efficiency.
Traditionally, factory tunes very in degress between rich and pig rich. The RX-8 is rich. The idea is to lean out the mixture as well as optimise the ignition timing.
Most people would do this mod for more power and better "driveability". But it can also be beneficial to fuel economy. Surely if the mixture is not so rich, then it is better for the environment as well. So potentially winners all round.
Cheers,
Hymee.
Why would Mazda or any other respected manufacturer deliberately map settings that are SIMULTANEOUSLY too rich, burn excess fuel, pollute more, develop less power AND compromise driveability? Doesn't make much sense to me, unless they are either totally incompetent, or the ONLY justification they had for the current settings was engine longevity.......
Surely when you chip or reprogram a car you are likely to achieve pluses in some areas and minuses in others, otherwise if it can be done so easily with a "win" on EVERY front why didn't Mazda do it in the first place?
No disrepect to Ric Shaw or you Hymee - but I'm really curious to know how this is supposed to be achieved.
03-10-2004, 07:56 PM
#22
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rotary engines blow if they are too lean. They need to run rich in order to keep the seals lubricated. given the market of buyers out there for the cars, i assume that they want to make sure that engine life is retained.
Lean makes them detonate. drop an apex seal etc.. you dont want that.
Lean makes them detonate. drop an apex seal etc.. you dont want that.
03-10-2004, 08:27 PM
#23
I can't believe at this advanced stage, I'm still reading posts like the two above this one.
NickG and Kas - please read these threads:
Greddy/Trust E-Manage Fuel Computer Install
Combustion and the 13B-MSP
Rotary engines do not blow if they are too lean. You are confusing your issues.
The Mazda tuning situation has been beaten to death.
NickG and Kas - please read these threads:
Greddy/Trust E-Manage Fuel Computer Install
Combustion and the 13B-MSP
Rotary engines do not blow if they are too lean. You are confusing your issues.
The Mazda tuning situation has been beaten to death.
03-10-2004, 08:50 PM
#24
Thanks Jeff.
Fella's - We are not trying to run the engine "lean". We are trying to run the engine "less rich" than it is (which is too rich).
Nick, no offense taken, and a valid question. There is a safety factor build into all factory tunes. It covers many things including crap fuel and manufacturing tolerances. The idea with what we are doing is to get an optimal tune for each individual car.
If the car makers build things so "good", why is it, for example, that a std 225kW LS1 can be easily and cheaply "tuned up" to 300kW, without compromising longevity? (A 300kW GTS has basically identical internal components in it as a std LS1, except for a different cam and different sized valves, and a bit of head work.).
I'm not saying the Renesis has the same potential % gains as the LS1, but the reasons why are applicable.
The are many, many things on every production car that the engineers might have liked to be better, but have their hand forced (designed compromised) by others where $$ is more important than performance. Fortunatley, the RX-8 does not seem to exhibit many of these compromises, compared with say a Commodore.
All we are trying to do is find where those compromises have been made, and in some sense get our cars performing like the designer intended.
Cheers,
Hymee.
Fella's - We are not trying to run the engine "lean". We are trying to run the engine "less rich" than it is (which is too rich).
Nick, no offense taken, and a valid question. There is a safety factor build into all factory tunes. It covers many things including crap fuel and manufacturing tolerances. The idea with what we are doing is to get an optimal tune for each individual car.
If the car makers build things so "good", why is it, for example, that a std 225kW LS1 can be easily and cheaply "tuned up" to 300kW, without compromising longevity? (A 300kW GTS has basically identical internal components in it as a std LS1, except for a different cam and different sized valves, and a bit of head work.).
I'm not saying the Renesis has the same potential % gains as the LS1, but the reasons why are applicable.
The are many, many things on every production car that the engineers might have liked to be better, but have their hand forced (designed compromised) by others where $$ is more important than performance. Fortunatley, the RX-8 does not seem to exhibit many of these compromises, compared with say a Commodore.
All we are trying to do is find where those compromises have been made, and in some sense get our cars performing like the designer intended.
Cheers,
Hymee.
03-10-2004, 08:51 PM
#25
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Originally posted by MazdaManiac
I can't believe at this advanced stage, I'm still reading posts like the two above this one.
NickG and Kas - please read these threads:
Greddy/Trust E-Manage Fuel Computer Install
Combustion and the 13B-MSP
Rotary engines do not blow if they are too lean. You are confusing your issues.
The Mazda tuning situation has been beaten to death.
I can't believe at this advanced stage, I'm still reading posts like the two above this one.
NickG and Kas - please read these threads:
Greddy/Trust E-Manage Fuel Computer Install
Combustion and the 13B-MSP
Rotary engines do not blow if they are too lean. You are confusing your issues.
The Mazda tuning situation has been beaten to death.