Front Number Plates??
09-10-2007, 12:50 AM
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Front Number Plates??
Hi all.Just wondering what the laws are in NSW regarding front number plates are.I see plenty of cars driving around without them but when I took mine off my rx8 i was pulled over within days for a stern warning. I asked 3 other police about it later and have got 3 different answers ranging from "not sure" to a "no" and a "yes"??? (I"m thinking Drewman and Enforcer may be of some assistance)
09-11-2007, 01:01 AM
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Yes, there are further rules stating the visibility requirements. its along the lines of on a 45 degree angle from the centre of the car, 20 meters in front you must be able to see the plate.
09-11-2007, 01:09 AM
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http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/n...98478/s24.html
Read subclause 2.
IMO the cops that said 'no' and 'not sure' are correct. I don't know of any case law on this though.
I was going to test it, and went to court prepared to argue the point (if you get done for no front plate in NSW now it is 3 points and $300 ) but because they had taken to long to get to court it was tossed out as out of jurisdiction (they only get 6 months from date of infringement till the date they generate the court notice setting your court date) since it was cut'n'dried and took less court time.
(at the time i was booked I showed them a printout of the legislation, one said 'that just means motorbikes', the other said 'it didn't matter'
a previous encounter and the HWP was pretty cool, brought out his folder with that section and the page that contained subclause 2 was conspicuously missing - he thought it was interesting so sent me on my way)further edit: the above is for NSW only
Last edited by quick_dry; 09-11-2007 at 01:24 AM.
09-11-2007, 01:12 AM
#12
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I am not that brave to test it on the court.
On the subject of front plate. What is the position of the law in painting it on the front bumper... in the same format, size and font of the real plate????
On the subject of front plate. What is the position of the law in painting it on the front bumper... in the same format, size and font of the real plate????
09-11-2007, 01:16 AM
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Actually the minute I posted that I found the actual legislation (Victoria only):
Road Safety (Vehicles) Regulations 1999
222 Affixing number plates
(1) A registered operator of a registered vehicle must ensure that each number plate issued by the Corporation for the vehicle is permanently affixed to the vehicle so that (assuming the vehicle to be on level ground)—
Road Safety (Vehicles) Regulations 1999
222 Affixing number plates
(1) A registered operator of a registered vehicle must ensure that each number plate issued by the Corporation for the vehicle is permanently affixed to the vehicle so that (assuming the vehicle to be on level ground)—
(a) except as set out in subregulation (3)—
(c) any cover on the number plate—
(e) in the case of a trailer or motor cycle—the number plate is affixed to its rear.
My apologies to the OT police up front...I am still not 100% sure on the rules for CHANGING a central mounted number plate to an offset one. There is clear guidelines for if the car comes manufactured like that, but if you change it then I dunno
(i) the number plate is at all times in an upright position parallel to the vehicle's axles; and
(ii) the number plate is at all times not more than 1⋅3 metres above ground level; and
(iii) in the case of a motor cycle—the centre of the number plate is at all times not less than 30 centimetres above ground level; and
(b) except as set out in subregulation (3), the numbers or letters (or both) on the number plate are clearly visible from a distance of 20 metres from the number plate at any point within the space produced by a horizontal arc of 90° and a vertical arc of 45°, as indicated by the shaded areas in figures 5 and 6; and(c) any cover on the number plate—
(i) is clear, clean, untinted and flat over its entire surface; and
(ii) has no reflective or other characteristics that would prevent the successful operation of a device approved for use under a law relating to the detection of traffic offences; and
(d) in the case of a motor vehicle other than a motor cycle—one number plate is affixed to the front of the vehicle and another to its rear, except as provided in subregulation (2);(e) in the case of a trailer or motor cycle—the number plate is affixed to its rear.
Last edited by auzoom; 09-11-2007 at 01:40 AM.
09-11-2007, 01:32 AM
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as does a little further digging - it isn't as clear cut as the RTA make it out - legislation trumps whatever the RTA says
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/n...98478/s24.html
Read subclause 2.
IMO the cops that said 'no' and 'not sure' are correct. I don't know of any case law on this though.
I was going to test it, and went to court prepared to argue the point (if you get done for no front plate in NSW now it is 3 points and $300 ) but because they had taken to long to get to court it was tossed out as out of jurisdiction (they only get 6 months from date of infringement till the date they generate the court notice setting your court date) since it was cut'n'dried and took less court time.
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/n...98478/s24.html
Read subclause 2.
IMO the cops that said 'no' and 'not sure' are correct. I don't know of any case law on this though.
I was going to test it, and went to court prepared to argue the point (if you get done for no front plate in NSW now it is 3 points and $300 ) but because they had taken to long to get to court it was tossed out as out of jurisdiction (they only get 6 months from date of infringement till the date they generate the court notice setting your court date) since it was cut'n'dried and took less court time.
Originally Posted by subclause 2(a)
due to the construction of the vehicle it is not practicable to comply with those paragraphs, and
Originally Posted by Subclause 2(b)
the number-plate is affixed in a manner that complies so far as practicable with those paragraphs.
The RTA GUIDELINE I posted is a summary of the INTENT of the legislation.
PS subclause 2 in the NSW legistlation are subsection 3 in the VIC.
09-11-2007, 01:33 AM
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that act also provides for not having a front plate in subregulation 3 which wasn't posted:
(3) Paragraphs (a) and (b) of subregulation (1) do not apply to a number plate
of a vehicle if-
(a) due to the construction of the vehicle it is not practicable to comply
with those paragraphs; and
(b) the number plate is affixed in a manner that complies as far as
practicable with those paragraphs.
The Vic law doesn't make any mention of where it has to be positioned on teh front, so yes, you can put it anywhere so long as it complies with the visibility arcs and stays parallel to the ground, etc.
EDIT: cheers auzoom, i was just looking up the vic stuff when i saw your previous post I wasn't trying to be specific to the 8 which has plenty of space for a plate.
(3) Paragraphs (a) and (b) of subregulation (1) do not apply to a number plate
of a vehicle if-
(a) due to the construction of the vehicle it is not practicable to comply
with those paragraphs; and
(b) the number plate is affixed in a manner that complies as far as
practicable with those paragraphs.
The Vic law doesn't make any mention of where it has to be positioned on teh front, so yes, you can put it anywhere so long as it complies with the visibility arcs and stays parallel to the ground, etc.
EDIT: cheers auzoom, i was just looking up the vic stuff when i saw your previous post
I wasn't trying to be specific to the 8 which has plenty of space for a plate.
Last edited by quick_dry; 09-11-2007 at 01:36 AM.
09-11-2007, 01:43 AM
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Yeah OK...Guess I was being specific to the RX-8 but in this day and age, no car manufactured since the 80's cant have a plate "practically" affixed.
PS I updated my legislation post to include a link to the legislation
PS I updated my legislation post to include a link to the legislation
09-11-2007, 01:50 AM
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Well, there you go. Without reading the legislaion though, I got off once because I was pulled over for having dirty numberplate covers, when it was the actual plate that was dirty. Is it ok for me to have dirty number plates?
09-11-2007, 06:48 PM
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No, I am sorry, it is that simple when you read the legislation and take its intention rather than your intention or trying to find ways to twist it to what you want.
Basicaly you MUST have a number plate on the rear AND the front that is "clearly" visible unless its unfeasible to have one there. The fact that others go without does not make it right or legal, neither does the fact that you dont want to have one on.
Cheers
Andrew
Basicaly you MUST have a number plate on the rear AND the front that is "clearly" visible unless its unfeasible to have one there. The fact that others go without does not make it right or legal, neither does the fact that you dont want to have one on.
Cheers
Andrew
09-11-2007, 06:54 PM
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That Mini is also in breach.
The famous clause 2 exception is very hard to satisfy for modern vehicles, especially when the car is ordinarily registered by the dealer with a front plate attached - prima facie evidence that it is practicable to do so.
Very few (read none) magistrates are gonna get you up on that argument for the RX8.
The famous clause 2 exception is very hard to satisfy for modern vehicles, especially when the car is ordinarily registered by the dealer with a front plate attached - prima facie evidence that it is practicable to do so.
Very few (read none) magistrates are gonna get you up on that argument for the RX8.
09-11-2007, 08:03 PM
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