French 407
09-01-2004, 08:27 PM
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French 407
Taka .............(no where near as good as an Aussie 69)
Since you are unofficially our new car tester /pilot /journalist when you get your hands on the new Peugeot 407 could you give us your insights . :D
What do you guys think of this car ???
The only thingsFrench i like is their women and food ( no offence to any Frogs on the forum .) :p
cheers
michael
Since you are unofficially our new car tester /pilot /journalist when you get your hands on the new Peugeot 407 could you give us your insights . :D
What do you guys think of this car ???
The only thingsFrench i like is their women and food ( no offence to any Frogs on the forum .) :p
cheers
michael
Last edited by Lock & Load; 09-01-2004 at 08:35 PM.
09-01-2004, 11:00 PM
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I like French cars.
That particular 407 is a one off, mid mount v6. Interesting but hardly representative of the 407 sedan and wagon. Even the Peugot forum is a bit mixed when it comes to the looks of the standard models - they're pretty nose heavy looking. The story behind the extended nose is that it's for pedestrian safety - seems like they didn't follow Mazda's lead with the sub-bonnet-skin-cones
(mandatory RX-8 content maintained!)
That particular 407 does it for me, but it's not something I'd consider owning over, say, an RX-8, s8 RX-7 or even my 405 Mi16.
Gomez - I know people who say the same thing about rotaries :P (and Italian cars, and British cars...)
Random French car + rotary facts: Citroen built a series of LHD GS hatches with the NSU engine. Citroen were going to put a 3-rotor into the DS (or was that CX? Both of which are FWD) but got cold feet due to the oil crisis.
That particular 407 is a one off, mid mount v6. Interesting but hardly representative of the 407 sedan and wagon. Even the Peugot forum is a bit mixed when it comes to the looks of the standard models - they're pretty nose heavy looking. The story behind the extended nose is that it's for pedestrian safety - seems like they didn't follow Mazda's lead with the sub-bonnet-skin-cones
(mandatory RX-8 content maintained!)That particular 407 does it for me, but it's not something I'd consider owning over, say, an RX-8, s8 RX-7 or even my 405 Mi16.
Gomez - I know people who say the same thing about rotaries :P (and Italian cars, and British cars...)
Random French car + rotary facts: Citroen built a series of LHD GS hatches with the NSU engine. Citroen were going to put a 3-rotor into the DS (or was that CX? Both of which are FWD) but got cold feet due to the oil crisis.
09-01-2004, 11:54 PM
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I had a Pug. It ratted and squeeked and failed electrics from day one.
I've learnt the Poms can't build decent cars......or aeroplanes for that matter. But on a happy note, if the Pug had been a good car I would still have it and would not have enjoyed the excellence in design and build quality that is the RX-8. I thank the Peugeot company for their commitment to mediocre auto construction... :D
Cheers, Gomez.
I've learnt the Poms can't build decent cars......or aeroplanes for that matter. But on a happy note, if the Pug had been a good car I would still have it and would not have enjoyed the excellence in design and build quality that is the RX-8. I thank the Peugeot company for their commitment to mediocre auto construction... :D
Cheers, Gomez.
09-02-2004, 03:17 AM
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Don't mind the styling of the 407 too much, it's quite masculine.
I must say that its certainly an improvement over their other models which are seen as a "chick's cars" or "oxford street cars".
I must say that its certainly an improvement over their other models which are seen as a "chick's cars" or "oxford street cars".
09-02-2004, 04:17 AM
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Originally Posted by nojooc
Don't mind the styling of the 407 too much, it's quite masculine.
I must say that its certainly an improvement over their other models which are seen as a "chick's cars" or "oxford street cars".
I must say that its certainly an improvement over their other models which are seen as a "chick's cars" or "oxford street cars".
Agreed the styling is possibly the cars best feature .
Funny you should mention oxford street , are you aware the RX8 got 2nd place in the Gay expo motoring award ....phew
thank goodness they voted the Audi roadster in first place .No wonder lately i have had a few suss types checking my car out .
cheers
michael
09-02-2004, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Gomez
I had a Pug. It ratted and squeeked and failed electrics from day one.
I've learnt the Poms can't build decent cars......or aeroplanes for that matter.
Must be why those British cars won the London-Sydney marathon in the 70s (Austin 1800s for a start), or why those Peugeots won rallies in the 80s (group b 205 T16). I hear the Peugeot and Citroen factory teams are doing well in the WRC the last few years.What's that noise? Oh, just another Airbus falling out of the sky :p
(stir, stir...)
...I thank the Peugeot company for their commitment to mediocre auto construction... :D
One car and you besmirch the whole company? I'm glad that nothing's gone wrong with your -8.
09-02-2004, 03:06 PM
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The Peugeot I had was a 2001 306Xsi....top of the range, and the last of the 306's. I bought it new.
After ten odd years of 306 development, they should have had a well sorted car. The side airbag warning light kept coming on due to a poorly designed connector under the front seats. The solution? Peugeot had the dealers remove the connectors and solder the wiring! Too bad if ever the seats had to be removed. The rear wiper had a mind of it's own and would come on of it's own volition due to a faulty relay. There was something always rattling above the drivers sunvisor, I think it was the radio ae cable.....only did it on a hot day and the dealers tried to fix it twice. One of the twin thermofans failed....it sheared the locating dowel. The rear honeycomb composite parcelshelf wasn't bonded properly internally....the horrible noise when the stereo was above five grated like a mis-aligned speaker coil. They replaced it under warranty after I convinced the dealer I hadn't abused the stereo and blown a rear speaker. The CD player rattled in the dash...I removed it and put insulation tape around the perimeter to get it to fit snugly. The heatshield for the exhaust fouled the gear linkage so that whenever the car was in second gear, a rev dependant vibration that sounded like a jar of washers had been thrown down the throttle body eminated from the engine compartment! There's more, but I'm trying to forget that whole sorry episode.
Peugeots are ****, fullstop. Yes, I tar them all with the same brown poop covered brush. The poms built my old 306 and they never built a decent car. The poms also built the Bae 146....a corroding bucket of pus if ever there was one. And so slow it is the only jet ever to have suffered engine damage after ingesting a bird up the tailpipe!
I also am glad nothing is wrong with my 8 . Not a thing has gone awry in the dizzy six months I've had it!
Enjoy......!
Gomez :D .
After ten odd years of 306 development, they should have had a well sorted car. The side airbag warning light kept coming on due to a poorly designed connector under the front seats. The solution? Peugeot had the dealers remove the connectors and solder the wiring! Too bad if ever the seats had to be removed. The rear wiper had a mind of it's own and would come on of it's own volition due to a faulty relay. There was something always rattling above the drivers sunvisor, I think it was the radio ae cable.....only did it on a hot day and the dealers tried to fix it twice. One of the twin thermofans failed....it sheared the locating dowel. The rear honeycomb composite parcelshelf wasn't bonded properly internally....the horrible noise when the stereo was above five grated like a mis-aligned speaker coil. They replaced it under warranty after I convinced the dealer I hadn't abused the stereo and blown a rear speaker. The CD player rattled in the dash...I removed it and put insulation tape around the perimeter to get it to fit snugly. The heatshield for the exhaust fouled the gear linkage so that whenever the car was in second gear, a rev dependant vibration that sounded like a jar of washers had been thrown down the throttle body eminated from the engine compartment! There's more, but I'm trying to forget that whole sorry episode.
Peugeots are ****, fullstop. Yes, I tar them all with the same brown poop covered brush. The poms built my old 306 and they never built a decent car. The poms also built the Bae 146....a corroding bucket of pus if ever there was one. And so slow it is the only jet ever to have suffered engine damage after ingesting a bird up the tailpipe!
I also am glad nothing is wrong with my 8
. Not a thing has gone awry in the dizzy six months I've had it! Enjoy......!
Gomez :D .
09-02-2004, 05:46 PM
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Yep, that'd be a Pommie built one. 
In some defence, I can report the French built ones seem more solid, but that is based on a series of rentals while I was working in Europe.
Reminds me of my Golf GTI. I sold a Cooper S to get that car. Well, it had a clutch cable, and that clutch cable was routed through ... hell... and used to break. FFS, do you think it was ever possible to get the dealer or VWA to admit the problem....
In some defence, I can report the French built ones seem more solid, but that is based on a series of rentals while I was working in Europe.Reminds me of my Golf GTI. I sold a Cooper S to get that car. Well, it had a clutch cable, and that clutch cable was routed through ... hell... and used to break. FFS, do you think it was ever possible to get the dealer or VWA to admit the problem....
09-02-2004, 06:00 PM
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I think it's fair to say that, in general, the mass market Euro manufacturers - Peugeot, Renault, VW, Fiat, Opel, Ford etc- still have yet to catch up with Japanese build quality levels. That's not to say they don't build some interesting and worthwhile cars, just that they don't screw them together as well.
VW especially had some serious low points in the 1990's, whilst perversely at the same time they were trumpeting their quality at every opportunity. The MkIII Golf - which I had in VR6 form - was atrociously badly built, with really nasty paint, horrible squeaky, cheap plastics and poor reliability. Things have improved somewhat at VW since - especially in trim quality, if not build - but they are still invariably well behind the Japanese in most independent reliability surveys.
It's ironic that for a while there Peugeot was regarded as building some of the toughest and longest lasting cars in the World - eg , 404, 504 and 505. Even today you will still find ancient 504's all over Africa being used as private taxi's. Since the 80's though it seems all they managed to do was get the chassis right, raising the bar for small hot hatches several notches higher in this respect, but plumbing new depths in material and build quality.
I think the only mainstream Euro manufacturers that have been truly serious about build quality are Mercedes, BMW, Porsche and Audi and even these have had some notable lapses in the past decade or so. Current Mercs lack the battleship build of the old W123 series, BMW's Z3 and E36 3 series had numerous problems after launch etc. Heck, after all these years Audi is STILL trying to understand why sticking 60-65% of the vehicle's weight over the front wheels, with a good proportion of this AHEAD of the wheels might explain why the A4 and A6 so consistently fail to outhandle the 3 and 5 series...
VW especially had some serious low points in the 1990's, whilst perversely at the same time they were trumpeting their quality at every opportunity. The MkIII Golf - which I had in VR6 form - was atrociously badly built, with really nasty paint, horrible squeaky, cheap plastics and poor reliability. Things have improved somewhat at VW since - especially in trim quality, if not build - but they are still invariably well behind the Japanese in most independent reliability surveys.
It's ironic that for a while there Peugeot was regarded as building some of the toughest and longest lasting cars in the World - eg , 404, 504 and 505. Even today you will still find ancient 504's all over Africa being used as private taxi's. Since the 80's though it seems all they managed to do was get the chassis right, raising the bar for small hot hatches several notches higher in this respect, but plumbing new depths in material and build quality.
I think the only mainstream Euro manufacturers that have been truly serious about build quality are Mercedes, BMW, Porsche and Audi and even these have had some notable lapses in the past decade or so. Current Mercs lack the battleship build of the old W123 series, BMW's Z3 and E36 3 series had numerous problems after launch etc. Heck, after all these years Audi is STILL trying to understand why sticking 60-65% of the vehicle's weight over the front wheels, with a good proportion of this AHEAD of the wheels might explain why the A4 and A6 so consistently fail to outhandle the 3 and 5 series...
09-02-2004, 06:16 PM
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A side bar on those 504's in Africa -- especially the wagons -- to hearten WRX owners
The demand for them is such that it made the 504 wagon THE most stolen vehicle in Europe, where they are stolen to order and shipped off to Africa.
The demand for them is such that it made the 504 wagon THE most stolen vehicle in Europe, where they are stolen to order and shipped off to Africa.
09-02-2004, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by timbo
A side bar on those 504's in Africa -- especially the wagons -- to hearten WRX owners
The demand for them is such that it made the 504 wagon THE most stolen vehicle in Europe, where they are stolen to order and shipped off to Africa.
The demand for them is such that it made the 504 wagon THE most stolen vehicle in Europe, where they are stolen to order and shipped off to Africa.
(Michael, you don't mind if I hijack you're thread for a minute do ya?! I mean, it is a Peugeot thread, we should get off topic as much as we can!...thank's mate... :D .)
....I was looking at a secondhand one of those instead of the Peugeot. The had held their value incredibly well. I was after nice hatch and they fit the bill, but were as dear as a new 306. The killer was I saved four grand off the RRP of the 306, the 307 was two months away and the dealer was happy to clear stock.
My point about all this to Saru is that Peugeot dropped the ball when it came to quality control. And not just in production.....but in design. I couldn't drive a 206. I am no Thorpey, I have average sized feet, but the pedal placement in that thing is atrocious. Not quirky......, atrocious!
I'm off to take a Panadol now....:p .
Gomez.
09-03-2004, 12:59 AM
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meh , we had a 1999 306 Gti-6 and it was a fantastic car.. no problems, slight sunroof cover rattle that was easily fixed. Other than routine maintenence nothing went wrong with it. at all, ever. 80,000 km later we got the RX-8 and had issues with the paint at purchase so.....
Rowds
Rowds
09-03-2004, 01:03 AM
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See Michael I have seen the topic of this thread for a while and have not even viewed it. That is how i see the car. I will go in when I have time.
Cheers
Stephen
Cheers
Stephen
09-03-2004, 02:39 AM
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Originally Posted by RRS
meh , we had a 1999 306 Gti-6 and it was a fantastic car.. no problems, slight sunroof cover rattle that was easily fixed. Other than routine maintenence nothing went wrong with it. at all, ever. 80,000 km later we got the RX-8 and had issues with the paint at purchase so.....
Rowds
Rowds
09-03-2004, 05:01 PM
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LOL Gomez... things are good, but hectic ATM I can't say I've really been home much lately!
/complete thread jack..
I still read stuff, but don't have a lot to contribute ATM,... RX-8 is great, but I don't get to drive it much, about 3200 km in 6 months on the clock! , we taking it to canberra in November to run in a Navigational Rally with REACT, which should be fun.
Otherwise busy with preparing the slow rally car for the slow driver (me) to run down in Canberra on the 18th of september.. hmm better get out to the garage to get stuff underway...
Cheers
Rowds
I can't say I've really been home much lately! /complete thread jack..
I still read stuff, but don't have a lot to contribute ATM,... RX-8 is great, but I don't get to drive it much, about 3200 km in 6 months on the clock! , we taking it to canberra in November to run in a Navigational Rally with REACT, which should be fun.
Otherwise busy with preparing the slow rally car for the slow driver (me) to run down in Canberra on the 18th of september.. hmm better get out to the garage to get stuff underway...
Cheers
Rowds
09-03-2004, 07:18 PM
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..and as a "happy" Pug owner (wifes actually) of a 307 (totally random everytime you turned the key! several mystery ECU problems) and idled like a Lambo (tractor not Diablo) i agree on the arrrrrrrrgh!!! By the way we moved to NZ and left in for sale in Aus...anyone!!
And on pommy cars, I've had two, a 56' MGA which was one of the most enjoyable cars to do the ton in (old style) and a Midget, girlfriend loved it! which I traded on a Series 1 RX7. That was a hundred years ago and after 5, 4wd's thank god for the '8!!!
Mikey
And on pommy cars, I've had two, a 56' MGA which was one of the most enjoyable cars to do the ton in (old style) and a Midget, girlfriend loved it! which I traded on a Series 1 RX7. That was a hundred years ago and after 5, 4wd's thank god for the '8!!!
Mikey
09-05-2004, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Gomez
Wow, thats amazing. And a nice post NickG.....interesting you mention the VR6....
....I was looking at a secondhand one of those instead of the Peugeot. The had held their value incredibly well. I was after nice hatch and they fit the bill, but were as dear as a new 306. The killer was I saved four grand off the RRP of the 306, the 307 was two months away and the dealer was happy to clear stock.
My point about all this to Saru is that Peugeot dropped the ball when it came to quality control. And not just in production.....but in design. I couldn't drive a 206. I am no Thorpey, I have average sized feet, but the pedal placement in that thing is atrocious. Not quirky......, atrocious!
I'm off to take a Panadol now....:p .
Gomez.
....I was looking at a secondhand one of those instead of the Peugeot. The had held their value incredibly well. I was after nice hatch and they fit the bill, but were as dear as a new 306. The killer was I saved four grand off the RRP of the 306, the 307 was two months away and the dealer was happy to clear stock.
My point about all this to Saru is that Peugeot dropped the ball when it came to quality control. And not just in production.....but in design. I couldn't drive a 206. I am no Thorpey, I have average sized feet, but the pedal placement in that thing is atrocious. Not quirky......, atrocious!
I'm off to take a Panadol now....:p .
Gomez.
09-05-2004, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by RRS
I still read stuff, but don't have a lot to contribute ATM,... RX-8 is great, but I don't get to drive it much, about 3200 km in 6 months on the clock! , we taking it to canberra in November to run in a Navigational Rally with REACT, which should be fun.
D
09-07-2004, 07:19 PM
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No worries, Rowds. I think Fro is a bit reluctant to spread the word widely as the supp regs are not approved yet.
Nice to know that we'll have a '8 to start things off.
Nice to know that we'll have a '8 to start things off.
09-08-2004, 11:58 PM
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10 points in defence of Poms and Frogs:
(1) Pug 206 GTI (mid 90's model). Best l'il car I ever owned.
(2) Pug 504. Tougher than a cornered Brisbane Lion. The Ute of the African Bush. Lived in Zambia for 5 years , beat the **** out of it but refused to die
(3) Citroen 2CV. My first car. Best suspension ever and brilliant for back-seat off-road activities.
(4) Concorde. The only Frog/Pom cooperative project other than beating the Krauts twice a century. Apologies in advance to offended Krauts.
(5) Bridgitte Bardot (giving my age away now)
(6) TVR Chimera - what an ***!
(7) Austin Allegro - worst car ever built. My dad had one with a hexagonal steering wheel. So bad it was brilliant.
(8) Lotus Elise - came a close second to the 8. Sheer magic but 2 seats and $90k
(9) Old Rollers. Nothing else like em for sheer prestige and presence on the road
(10) Maggie Thatcher - OK now you know my taste in women.
The 8's in for a service as we speak at City Mazda. The service receptionist didn't know what a flash was. Can anybody help her out?
Cheers
Ian (Aussie Pom hybrid)
(1) Pug 206 GTI (mid 90's model). Best l'il car I ever owned.
(2) Pug 504. Tougher than a cornered Brisbane Lion. The Ute of the African Bush. Lived in Zambia for 5 years , beat the **** out of it but refused to die
(3) Citroen 2CV. My first car. Best suspension ever and brilliant for back-seat off-road activities.
(4) Concorde. The only Frog/Pom cooperative project other than beating the Krauts twice a century. Apologies in advance to offended Krauts.
(5) Bridgitte Bardot (giving my age away now)
(6) TVR Chimera - what an ***!
(7) Austin Allegro - worst car ever built. My dad had one with a hexagonal steering wheel. So bad it was brilliant.
(8) Lotus Elise - came a close second to the 8. Sheer magic but 2 seats and $90k
(9) Old Rollers. Nothing else like em for sheer prestige and presence on the road
(10) Maggie Thatcher - OK now you know my taste in women.
The 8's in for a service as we speak at City Mazda. The service receptionist didn't know what a flash was. Can anybody help her out?
Cheers
Ian (Aussie Pom hybrid)