Since a lot of people are speculating that the drop in hp is due to port ECU remapping to meet California emission standards, did the Canadian cars go through the same process? There is too much havoc in general to sift through it.. :)

Anyone here has dynoe'd their car or taken it to the drag strip for curiosity? Please, don't post up your 14.0 sec GTECH measured numbers.. :p

Is there any way to tell without using a Dyno?

It would be nice if Canadian cars were faster than the US ones... we usually get less of everything instead of more!

Well there are those "port" modification stickers right? It would be nice to know what they mean. Other than a Canadian car dyno plot I don't think there is any way to compare. If the Canadian cars "poop" out on the dyno after 6200 rpm and produce only about 180whp then we'll know it's the same ECU map as the US cars. :(

How much is a dyno run? I have GS so it would probably be the best type to run since there is no TCS or DSC.

I'm out of $$$$ right now :( but I might get around to it.

Although today I had 4 adults in the car and it STILL hauls ASS, I am not overly concerned.

Typically dyno time is around $60 an hour.. a bit more of you want to have an O2 plot.

Originally posted by mdmaclean
Is there any way to tell without using a Dyno?

It would be nice if Canadian cars were faster than the US ones... we usually get less of everything instead of more!

Oh, don't worry, we did, as usual.
RX-8 in USA has 48 month/50K mile warranty.
We get 36/80k kilometer.

In the sense of the offer to compensate the shortage of horsepower with "free service" that translates into 1/4 less of compensation too.

Originally posted by Quick_lude
Well there are those "port" modification stickers right? It would be nice to know what they mean. Other than a Canadian car dyno plot I don't think there is any way to compare. If the Canadian cars "poop" out on the dyno after 6200 rpm and produce only about 180whp then we'll know it's the same ECU map as the US cars. :(

The Canadian cars do not have the Port Campaign stickers like they do in the USA.
But that does not mean they did not do the port modifications.

For example, we have had the new oil dipsticks installed.
Not by the dealer, as my dealers service manager knew nothing about it.
I had to call Mazda Canada to confirm that the dipsticks hade been changed.

We need to dyno a couple Rx-8s. Soon some cars will have 3-4k km on and will be available for dyno.

I've got 7600 km on mine now. But, I'm happy with the power as is, and am not too interested in having a dyno test. Time and money, you know! If someone else wanted to pay for it, I'd consider - but the variables are significant - Calgary is at a higher altitude than most other cities in Canada, do you trust the compensation corrections, what make and model of dyno are used and how they can be compared to results from other dynos (they can't), etc... so any dyno results will be less than conclusive .

Regards,
Gordon

Someone told me that its normal to get around 35 % loss in the HP from engine to wheel , since this car is rear wheel , not front wheel drive ( which is 10- 15 % loss )
.


Just wondering

35%?
That would be an extremely inefficient drive train.

For a modern RWD car, with goodies such as a Carbon Fibre driveshaft etc such as the RX-8, about 15% loss would be good.. maybe as high as 20%.
Anything higher then that would be unheard of.

I have about 3300km on mine, and my altitude above sea level is...well.. I just looked out my window and saw the ocean, so not much. :)

I'm thinking about getting my car dynoed, but the guy around here is kind of expensive. (About $50 per session, or usually about 3 runs.) so I'm kinda holding back.

I was course-working with the guy who owns it for 2 days at the Solo 2 Eastern Regionals first weekend of August, so maybe I'll see if he will cut a deal to settle this question.

Originally posted by Redshift
(About $50 per session, or usually about 3 runs.) so I'm kinda holding back.
That is a normal price, you will not find it any cheaper.

If I was the owner I would like to know.. it's not a matter of "my car feels fast enough" it's getting full value for your hard earned money. Because if I paid for near S2000/350Z acceleration but got RSX-S acceleration that is not right. Sure hp isn't everything.. but it's an important part of any sports car.

On a rotary car the dyno loss should not be more than 20%, maybe even less. This car should dyno at least 200-205 whp.

Since we are in the Canada forum here I'll ask this simple question though.

What cars in the SAME price range of the base RX8 can be had in base form with more power and similar handling etc.

I can't think of any.

The Nissan Altima is close, but handling bites on that car and it feels HUGE

The Acura TSX, doesn't have more power it has a lot less 200Hp and it's FWD and it weights more.

The Mazda 6 is getting close at 220Hp, great handling not sure about the weight.


The US members seem to always compare to teh S2000 or the G35c, but in Canada it's not comparison.

I paid $43 out the door for the Base RX8, the S2000 is 48 MSRP, the G35c is over 43 MSRP the 350Z is 43 MSRP.

The TSX is 34 MSRP so that's close and the fully loaded Mazda 6 is 32 MSRP.

I'm worried we won't get compensated because there is nothing out there in the same price range.

Seriously if I wanted to return the RX8 I would have to think long and hard as the only other car on my radar was the TSX and it won't be as fun to drive.

The only thing that even has me THINKING about selling is the gas guzzling.

Even rated at a lower HP the car is at a good price in Canada.

From my market search (final prices with all taxes):

S2k: 53k
G35C 6mt Brembos 53k
350Z Performance 53.x k
350Z Track 55.6k
STi 55.6k

RX-8 GS 43k
RX-8 GT 46.xx k
RX-8 GT/SR 48k

GS has no DSC (huge minus imo).

Hence, there is a considerable price diff but we also need to factor in the additional gas the 8 will need.

Finally, all the other more expensive cars in the list are faster than the 8.

What is better value is hard to tell.

Why would no DSC be a huge minus when we only have 180 hp? ;)

What about the WRX (not the STi)...I think that is pretty close in performance and price. Of course the RX-8 looks much better and probably handles better too.

Other than that, nothing else really appeals to me.

Originally posted by Wing
Since we are in the Canada forum here I'll ask this simple question though.

What cars in the SAME price range of the base RX8 can be had in base form with more power and similar handling etc.

I paid $43 out the door for the Base RX8, the S2000 is 48 MSRP, the G35c is over 43 MSRP the 350Z is 43 MSRP.

I'm worried we won't get compensated because there is nothing out there in the same price range.

Seriously if I wanted to return the RX8 I would have to think long and hard as the only other car on my radar was the TSX and it won't be as fun to drive.


I agree with you.
One car that has about the same performance and price is the Toyoto Celica TRD GT-S:
It is selling in Edmonton for $32,515 Canadian.

I know I am going to get some flame as it is different than the RX-8, but from a features and performance point of view it is actually pretty similar.
As far as compensation goes, I just spoke to Mazda Canada, and as of now they still have no response, and have not made the offer in Canada.

The RX-8 is still a nicer car, IMHO, but at least this gives us a reasonable comparison.
The Infinit Q35 coupe is also a very fair comparison.
It is well equipped, will beat the RX-8 on a track, and is comparably priced.
It sells here in Edmonton for 47K, ready to drive away.
4K more than my 8, but by the time I add parts to get the performance back, a pretty fair comparison.

Originally posted by WankelWannabe
What about the WRX (not the STi)...I think that is pretty close in performance and price. Of course the RX-8 looks much better and probably handles better too.

Other than that, nothing else really appeals to me.

It is actually apretty fair comparison.
Same power, actually better handling, and the bonus of 4 wheel drive.

Much less in the way of luxury items, and much less "gee whiz" factor, however, as it has been out for a while, and the STi is faster, of course.

Still, looking more attractive all the time.

The earlier comment that said an RX-8 6 speed GT is $48K is all wet.
I bought mine at sticker, with freight and PDI, Ming, and all fees for just over $42K at my local dealer.
I suspect once word gets out the waiting list will shrink pretty fast.

canzoomer your forgetting 1 thing.

the $3k+ in taxes! Because your in Alberta you don't have the pay the PST, and your LUCKY! But every other province has a provincial sales tax. I paid $43k for the GS after tax, would have been under 40 in Alberta :(

So for the majority of canadians the G35c is way over, as the difference in tax alone is close to a grand!

Originally posted by Wing
Why would no DSC be a huge minus when we only have 180 hp? ;)

Because with the huge 18" wheels and RWD it is not that difficult to lose it in a turn and then you write it off. Or do a 360 on the highway. It's easy. With DSC on, a write off will never happen (well, almost unless you go straight for a wall).

Originally posted by WankelWannabe
What about the WRX (not the STi)...I think that is pretty close in performance and price. Of course the RX-8 looks much better and probably handles better too.

Other than that, nothing else really appeals to me.

How about insurance! I got a quote on the WRX and it was over twice the cost of my RX-8.

RX-8 $1,300.00 (tax included)
WRX $2,600.00 (taxes not included) :eek: :eek: :eek:

NEWS FLASH!!

I just received a call back from Mazda Canada.
I had enquired Friday and this morning to see if they were downgrading the claimed HP in Canada too.
They are. Same as USA

I asked what they were offering, and they tell me that is similar to the USA:
Free scheduled maintenance for the warranty period.
$500 cash back.

You should note that I said "similar"

In the USA they are offering $500 back, in US dollars.
In Canada they are offering us $500 Canadian

In the USA they have a 4 year warranty.
In Canada it is a 3 year warranty.

Taking their $1,200 claimed value for the service in USA as true, that means we are being screwed to the tune of about $400 on the service and $175 on the credit.

Good stuff!

Although I agree we are getting screwed, at least we are getting SOMETHING!

I need winter floor mats, and winter wheels. The $500 will be MOOCHOO help for this, and the $30 savings every 8000Km will help for oil changes.

You know what else sucks? Apparently in the US they get free loaners and a free tank of gas, we get neither :(.

Damn, had too much fun driving the car to notice this thread. So I take it we only have 238 HP in our car now? Just a quick question, so how do I go about and get this free maintenence and 500 bux Canadian back? Do I call my salesman? Or do I talk to the dealership manager? Help would be appreciated! Thanks a lot!

Originally posted by Wing
Since we are in the Canada forum here I'll ask this simple question though.

What cars in the SAME price range of the base RX8 can be had in base form with more power and similar handling etc.


Although you are comparing sedans, imo you should also consider cars like RSX-S and Celica GTS. Yes they are fwd but with top notch handling, especially the Celica. Both cars have smiliar acceleration, about 14.9s in the 1/4. They are cheaper but have more luxury amenities like leather, sunroof when compared to the base RX-8.
Also WRX is in direct competion with the base RX-8 wrt to performance and interior design/amenities.

Now don't get me wrong, I still think that the 8 is a better overall car than those 3 but when you factor in the much worse fuel economy and $4-6K price differential, some people might now look elsewhere. :(

One thing I love about the RX-8 is the quiet ride, that I know I won't get in the celica or RSX.

Also INSURANCE as mentioned. EEEGAHDS!

I just came from a tiburon the HIGHEST car to insure. The Integra is #2 as a result so is the RSX! The WRX is HIGH as well :(

The RX8 is awesome the insurance rate is LOW, hopefully that doesn't change.

Yup, another plus for the 8. Hondas and turbocharged cars are terrible on insurance. :(

Taking their $1,200 claimed value for the service in USA as true, that means we are being screwed to the tune of about $400 on the service and $175 on the credit.

How quickly we forget ;) The car cost a lot less then in the US (exclude the taxes since Mazda doesn't get any of it). We also get heated mirrors, pissers etc. Where we do get the shaft is the 3 years vs 4. If you include the extra year it gets a little closer to the US price but it is still cheaper.

Originally posted by Wing
Good stuff!

Although I agree we are getting screwed, at least we are getting SOMETHING!

I need winter floor mats, and winter wheels. The $500 will be MOOCHOO help for this, and the $30 savings every 8000Km will help for oil changes.


Note: One of the things I asked Mazda Canada about was that 8000km interval, as I thought it seemed rather long.
I was advised that 3000 for the break-in, then every 5000 was more advisable..
They also told me that we should absolutely stick to the recommended 5W20 dino oil, nothing else. Adn the manual states that use of any fluids other than recommended will void your warranty.

BTW,in my first 1200 km I used 1/4 of a litre of oil.

Originally posted by Rx8Mango
Damn, had too much fun driving the car to notice this thread. So I take it we only have 238 HP in our car now? Just a quick question, so how do I go about and get this free maintenence and 500 bux Canadian back? Do I call my salesman? Or do I talk to the dealership manager? Help would be appreciated! Thanks a lot!

Mazda Canada is sending the registered owners a letter.
The lady I spoke with this afternoon told me should would fax it to me in advance, as I had asked earlier.

She is very nice, helpful and up-front about everything.

canzoomer, more advisable, but will they pay for that interval? Hmmm that's a good question now isn't it? ;)

HUmmm, so I guess with that 500 $ i'll go buy a computer to reprogram the ECU as soon as its comes out, there about 300 - 350 $ ..

Lexus IS300 is also comparable to Rx-8 in terms of comfort/performance/price. Plus its engine is turbo friendly.

MadJoker- Is it really that easy? I read that the ECU is encrypted.... Do JDM ECU's work on our cars, they might have the original spec fuel mapping, which I think is the issue. I wonder how much those cost? They would likely cost Mazda Canada much less than a class action lawsuit (although < 700 canadians are not likely launch this, I fact I suppose Mazda is considering right this very moment).

As of this post, the RX-8 has been removed from the main page, but they've updated the RX-8 Specs already:

http://www.mazda.ca/eng/cars/2004_RX8/root.html

Originally posted by mac


How quickly we forget ;) The car cost a lot less then in the US (exclude the taxes since Mazda doesn't get any of it). We also get heated mirrors, pissers etc. Where we do get the shaft is the 3 years vs 4. If you include the extra year it gets a little closer to the US price but it is still cheaper.

Actually this is not uncommon. For some reason many manufacturers charge way more in the USA than in the rest of the world.
For example, in Canada, the RX-8 that most of us have received is the MT6 in the GT package.
In Japan this retails for 2,750,000 Yen, which is equal to $32,815 in Canadian dollars.
Yes, it costs them more to ship it here, but not over $7,000
Sure, making them meet Canadian bumper regs might cost more.
However Canada actually has a stricter low speed collision test than the USA.
In Canada we have to pass the 2.5mph test, whereas in the USA it is a 5mph test.
That is why you can not buy a Mitsubishi Lancer EVO here.
It does not pass the Canadian test.

In the UK the list on th RX-8 is 21,995 Pounds.
Simply put, cars usually cost less in Canada

You forgot to include OZ, they are paying a whopping $62,610 for a base GT (GST included but not their luxury tax which can be substantial ie $68k on the road). BTW they don't get moon-roof or Nav and the auto's are $670 more. Keep in mind that the AUD$ = 0.91 CDN$ and their average salary are only a little higher then ours with similar cost of living. That's about $15k more then what we are paying and the only thing they get that we don't is the climate control.