http://www.astraracing.com/portal/modules/My_eGallery/gallery/wallpapers/rx8%20volumex%20motorshow%202004.JPG

:) :) :)

hey sweet.

got any more technical information on your go-fast goodies?
info on application to street performance?

oh sweet, i saw that pic in the 20, rx8 parts thread! i was curious about the SC!

I hope it's 370HP Supercharged Renesis and not something else :(

It's a supercharged Renesis, don't worry...
;)

Is this the one using the roots style blower only or is this the compound turbo/supercharged setup?

It's pretty sweet!

what a monster!!!

It would be interesting to find out more info on this

If they'd add strakes, they could go to an even 400 hp.



ps: got any under the hood shots?

We used a "roots type" supercharger called VOLUMEX. It has been created for the old grp.B FIA rally cars but modified by us. We fitted also an air/air intercooler, remapped the Ecu and changed the exhaust system. The engine is strictly derived from that used in the "RX8 Sport Cup".
It sounds like an UFO and flames from the rear exhaust even with usual european 98Ron fuel.
About a street application....who knows? ;)

We used a "roots type" supercharger called VOLUMEX. It has been created for the old grp.B FIA rally cars but modified by us. We fitted also an air/air intercooler, remapped the Ecu and changed the exhaust system. The engine is strictly derived from that used in the "RX8 Sport Cup".
It sounds like an UFO and flames from the rear exhaust even with usual european 98Ron fuel.
About a street application....who knows? ;)
You remapped the ECU?
Can you go into more detail on how you did that?

Yes.
First we have to disconnect the main chip (CPU) from the board, closa e "jumper", then we have to reprogram it. We modify the mapping LUT with a freeware sw that can be also downloaded from my website. The only problem has been the checksums, but a Milan based company fixed thi problem. Thats it.
About tha MAF sensor, i read a lot of people think it is the mai problem, but i don't understand why since we had no problem to manage absolute pressures up to 2 bar just only with a few little changes. ;)

Incredible. What do Richard Paul, Rotary God, and the other experts have to say about this?

Will do a lot of new tests and Km on the European circuits since Feb. '05 with the MY'05....who would like to see, have a look or also test the cars has only to contact Astra. If you prefer you can come here at Astra to have a direct look...we'll be pleased.
:)

Will you fly me out to test and see them in person? :)

is there any way you can work with some of the current groups that are trying for street apps, on re-mapping the ECU? Hymee comes to mind.....

Hmm. I wonder if this is the "technique" that JDM tuners are using to do their re-mapping? The same goes for Racing Beat, or did they get something from Mazda for their effort?

This sounds like the method used in the old FD remapped ECUs...there was a custom daughterboard needed to plug into a socket where the original microcontroller was, and the controller would in turn plug into the socket. This was necessary because the stock ECU used the on-board ROM of the microcontroller for some of the maps that needed to be changed. I'm a little surprised something like this will work on an ECU like the RX-8 though...its an order of magnitude more complicated than the FD.

jds

Yes.
First we have to disconnect the main chip (CPU) from the board, closa e "jumper", then we have to reprogram it. We modify the mapping LUT with a freeware sw that can be also downloaded from my website. The only problem has been the checksums, but a Milan based company fixed thi problem. Thats it.
About tha MAF sensor, i read a lot of people think it is the mai problem, but i don't understand why since we had no problem to manage absolute pressures up to 2 bar just only with a few little changes. ;)

I don't see why... the CPU in your PC is pretty complex, but doing something similar can allow you to overclock it (although usually it requires advanced cooling measures). Or how about chipping your X-Box so you can override the ROM and run a custom OS... or how about chipping PS? Sounds like it's relatively simple and pretty common...

Since the beginning oy the year we did this job only on 3 street cars.

The next one is this:
http://www.simoniracing.it/mkt/cars_girls/584.jpg

This is the show car used by the winner of the championship who is also the owner of the bigger tuning company in Italy.



http://www.simoniracing.it/mkt/cars_girls/535.jpg

This is his (our) race car:
http://www.astraracing.com/portal/immagini_portale/leo/simonia.jpg


RX8 is not a so common car here in Europe and we have been so busy in developing the racing version we had no time to tune also more street cars (which is not also oyr main business).
But I think in 2005 we'll put our racing 8s experience in some more "street version" spare.
By the way all the "racing" spares are already there for sale, if you love to drive a street car with a 180/150k spring and without the rollcage which strengthen the chassis of the 174% (tested on the bench, torsinal forces EC95 stds).

We took about 1 week with an 8s engine on the dyno to get the best mapping at the beginning of the year, playing with the "opened" ecu and mappings.

Tomorrow we'll be still there on th dyno to play with the my'05 engine and new mappings to get some hp more.

We never run a street car engine as it is with the opened Ecu. All the street cars we did had the racing engine, intake and exhaust fitted.

Is the driver Giampiero Simoni?

Ci vediamo dopo, grazie per l' informazione.

L.Schiavo (from Salerno)


Since the beginning oy the year we did this job only on 3 street cars.

The next one is this:
http://www.simoniracing.it/mkt/cars_girls/584.jpg

This is the show car used by the winner of the championship who is also the owner of the bigger tuning company in Italy.



http://www.simoniracing.it/mkt/cars_girls/535.jpg

This is his (our) race car:
http://www.astraracing.com/portal/immagini_portale/leo/simonia.jpg


RX8 is not a so common car here in Europe and we have been so busy in developing the racing version we had no time to tune also more street cars (which is not also oyr main business).
But I think in 2005 we'll put our racing 8s experience in some more "street version" spare.
By the way all the "racing" spares are already there for sale, if you love to drive a street car with a 180/150k spring and without the rollcage which strengthen the chassis of the 174% (tested on the bench, torsinal forces EC95 stds).

We took about 1 week with an 8s engine on the dyno to get the best mapping at the beginning of the year, playing with the "opened" ecu and mappings.

Tomorrow we'll be still there on th dyno to play with the my'05 engine and new mappings to get some hp more.

We never run a street car engine as it is with the opened Ecu. All the street cars we did had the racing engine, intake and exhaust fitted.

Sounds like we are on the edge of a technique for cracking the ECU's secrets.....


S

The driver is Alan Simoni ;)

this seems about the most promising work i've heard of... racers always find a way

What kit is on that car?

it's not a kit. it's astra racing's custom racecar.

it's not a kit. it's astra racing's custom racecar.

:( Thats too bad.

The remapped ECU mod (for the FD, which is what this sounds like) is really nothing like overclocking a PC. The program that the microcontroller runs was stored in two places...an external EPROM and the internal ROM on-board the chip itself. Once you've cracked the code itself, replacing the part in the EPROM is pretty obvious...you program your own EPROM with the modified code and stick it on the board in place of the other one. The other part is a bit more tricky....the daughter board basically moved the CPU off the main board, and replaced it with the CPU at its new location and an additional external EPROM. The EPROM is connected to the CPU via some address decoding logic such that whenever the address of the internal ROM is selected, it is now fooled into grabbing the data in the new EPROM.

Its a pretty straightforward thing really...you're right about that. I'm not even sure the RX-8 would need the daughter card, it all depends on whether they're using internal ROM or not. I guess the complexity really comes into play in the cracking of the code itself. This ECU does so much more that there's a lot of extra crap to wade through in order to find the parts you want to mess with. That's why I was questioning the ease of remapping the thing, but I guess we've been hearing about people working on this for a while, so once that's done, you're right...the hradware mod is much the same as for any other ECU. Hmmm....anyone have any documentation describing the architecture of the ECU??? :)

jds

I don't see why... the CPU in your PC is pretty complex, but doing something similar can allow you to overclock it (although usually it requires advanced cooling measures). Or how about chipping your X-Box so you can override the ROM and run a custom OS... or how about chipping PS? Sounds like it's relatively simple and pretty common...

it's not a kit. it's astra racing's custom racecar.

Yes.
We're working just now on a street version of the front bumper (1 pre-production piece in stock now) and the rear wing (20 in stock now).

Pre prod. front bumper pic:

http://www.astraracing.com/portal/modules/My_eGallery/gallery/mazda/DSCN3619.jpg .

It is all carbon fibre made as the rear wing is.

wow the tiger-head on the side of the car ruined it all for me. gross.

Will do a lot of new tests and Km on the European circuits since Feb. '05 with the MY'05....who would like to see, have a look or also test the cars has only to contact Astra. If you prefer you can come here at Astra to have a direct look...we'll be pleased.
:)

wow, that is very tempting, especially when you have a 300+hp street version of the car. Damn our countries are so close, I can even bring my 8 over there, so you can 'fix' it!! :rolleyes:

Tell us more hfalex... Does astra provide accomodation for anyone who comes from far away? ;):D

wow the tiger-head on the side of the car ruined it all for me. gross.

I agree with you!!!!!!
;) ;) ;) ;) :)

The remapped ECU mod (for the FD, which is what this sounds like) is really nothing like overclocking a PC. The program that the microcontroller runs was stored in two places...an external EPROM and the internal ROM on-board the chip itself. Once you've cracked the code itself, replacing the part in the EPROM is pretty obvious...you program your own EPROM with the modified code and stick it on the board in place of the other one. The other part is a bit more tricky....the daughter board basically moved the CPU off the main board, and replaced it with the CPU at its new location and an additional external EPROM. The EPROM is connected to the CPU via some address decoding logic such that whenever the address of the internal ROM is selected, it is now fooled into grabbing the data in the new EPROM.

Its a pretty straightforward thing really...you're right about that. I'm not even sure the RX-8 would need the daughter card, it all depends on whether they're using internal ROM or not. I guess the complexity really comes into play in the cracking of the code itself. This ECU does so much more that there's a lot of extra crap to wade through in order to find the parts you want to mess with. That's why I was questioning the ease of remapping the thing, but I guess we've been hearing about people working on this for a while, so once that's done, you're right...the hradware mod is much the same as for any other ECU. Hmmm....anyone have any documentation describing the architecture of the ECU??? :)

jds


Ah... I see. A bit more complex than overclocking your CPU, but almost on par with chipping your PlayStation or X-box.

I think that this is definitely the best solution... if anyone can solve the mystery. Outside of FI applications, how can you beat the ability to access and change all the various afr maps and timing maps the 8 uses.

Any of your electrical engineer types... want to take a crack at it? ;)

You said you have 20 rear spoilers available? how much? :D Also..I'm surprised no one has said anything about the second pic with the model in it.. not that i don't love the pic....but rules in this forum clearly state no nudes.. you can clearly see her nipples. i'd like to keep this site something i can browse on my government computers at work...thanks.

Their Italian fer crizz sakes, not as uptight as we are.
I love Italy, espesially their cars. They all have soul even the lowly Alfa has soul.
I don't know where they put it, I've taken them apart looking but never found it.
I had my 275 GTB apart down to damn near nothing and never found where it is, but it's in there. In that car by the ton.

:cool: Great information and pics , great to see that you guys are kicking some serious butt .

cheers
michael

Oops, missed your reply....I'd love to build the daughter board (if one is needed here) that would be easy enough. Cracking the code however is the problematic part!

jds

Ah... I see. A bit more complex than overclocking your CPU, but almost on par with chipping your PlayStation or X-box.

I think that this is definitely the best solution... if anyone can solve the mystery. Outside of FI applications, how can you beat the ability to access and change all the various afr maps and timing maps the 8 uses.

Any of your electrical engineer types... want to take a crack at it? ;)

You said you have 20 rear spoilers available? how much? :D Also..I'm surprised no one has said anything about the second pic with the model in it.. not that i don't love the pic....but rules in this forum clearly state no nudes.. you can clearly see her nipples. i'd like to keep this site something i can browse on my government computers at work...thanks.

prude :p

Oops, missed your reply....I'd love to build the daughter board (if one is needed here) that would be easy enough. Cracking the code however is the problematic part!

jds

Seeing the work that has gone into the AUX module... it we could get people with simliar skills to work on this project... if successful, who needs a CZ or an Emanage? :D

Seeing the work that has gone into the AUX module... it we could get people with simliar skills to work on this project... if successful, who needs a CZ or an Emanage? :D

and it will take forever to be complete just like the aux mod...JUST KIDDING GUYS

no seriously some techies here should pool their knowledge and start testing and tinkering and crack the ECU and then PARTY! then SCs with 350WHP and more

did I mentioned you'd be rich! :)

Hmm... in some other thread about the MS6, someone replied to a comment about an "easy" 300hp by getting a "chip" that it has taken until now for M6 owners to start to crack the ECU look at flashing it. I was thinking that there is a good chance that the ECU's are the same, at least at the core. Think of Ford and their ECU that is used across so many model cars and trucks. Just economy of scale. Thus the work the M6 guys are doing may hold some potential for the 8 as well... Just some random thoughts.

I still can't believe the pic hasn't been taken down it is almost a month...VIVA LA BREASTS!

Will do a lot of new tests and Km on the European circuits since Feb. '05 with the MY'05....who would like to see, have a look or also test the cars has only to contact Astra. If you prefer you can come here at Astra to have a direct look...we'll be pleased.
:)
Hfalex,

Are you guys coming to Spa or Zolder this year?
I'm VERY interested in re-calibrating my PCM. I'd like to know how much you know about the RX8 calibration. A bit more spark, a bit more fuel (sic Powerchips) is not what I'm interested in.

Fabrice (Belgium)

I can see that girls nipples SWEET!

Well "she" sure had a nice uhh....square jaw. Ulp. :(

I can see that girls nipples SWEET!

the fun is unfortunately over :( unless you visit a certain vendor who has a picture gallery with many pics from this and other photoshoots :) (non-nude of course ;))

omg,,,,

I missed the breasts and the new news about Italian RX8 tuning..

Abitavo in Milan tanti anni fa.... e voglio tornare

Hfalex,

Are you guys coming to Spa or Zolder this year?
I'm VERY interested in re-calibrating my PCM. I'd like to know how much you know about the RX8 calibration. A bit more spark, a bit more fuel (sic Powerchips) is not what I'm interested in.

Fabrice (Belgium)

Re-post due to mammary chit-chat ;)

Well I hate that tiger too, but if you had 370 HP you have the right to use it and show off on the streets.

Just thought I would check in here.

Any news from these guys on cracking the PCM?

I don't understand why no one else has cracked the ecu yet. I doubt its any more complicated than cracking an xbox/PS2 or any of the other computers people have hacked over time. I could be wrong but I'd bet all of the chips are COTS parts that have datasheets available online. I'd bet a couple motivated computer engineers could have it cracked in two months and have it reprogrammed in three or four. If there's some people local to me that would want to give it a go, I'd be willing to invest some time into trying it. I'm an EE and my concentration in college was embedded systems, so I have some experience doing this kind of stuff. The only two problems are 1. I wouldn't be willing to experiment on my ecu since I know that sucker is gonna cost big if it gets fried. Maybe a junk yard has one they'll let go for cheap though. 2. I don't currently have access to a good oscilloscope or Digital logic analyzer.

what these folks do is take the chip off the board do somethign with a jumper, then change the programming with a bit of software, then put it back to gether and back into the car. Not the easiest of tasks to make widely available. now the best way would be to just be able to flash mdified maps to the PCM still in your car with no modification.

that is coming- several people are working on it. who will be first? i have a feeling we will know soon

that is coming- several people are working on it. who will be first? i have a feeling we will know soon

Sounds like someone already knows :rolleyes:

can that someone kindly share their info then.....

did anyone go to this guys website, he said he was giving the programming software away for free

did anyone go to this guys website, he said he was giving the programming software away for free
Where did you read that?

Fabrice

on his website- ive got a copy myself. so do several other people. but its uselss unless you know what you are doing. plus they had a checksum issue that was fixed by a seperate company that you would need to know details about.

on his website- ive got a copy myself. so do several other people. but its uselss unless you know what you are doing. plus they had a checksum issue that was fixed by a seperate company that you would need to know details about.

And what can you do, zoom44, with that piece of software? Is it only the one used to view and modify a dowloaded mapping? Or does it enable you to downmoad / upload too?

Fabrice

Bump for zoom44

its a bit of software that gives you a graphical representation of the hexidecimal and an easy way to modify it. this can be saved etc. its all in italian (easily translatable) and the company that made it no longer supports it and will not give any furthur info about it. i dont know how Astra uses it exactly. i know they remove a chip from the board and move a jumper. this must allow them to program or modify the programmimg of the chip. whether they have to "downoad" the map change it and then "upload" it or if they just change it thru a direct connection i dont know. you could use it to change any hex code actually- i used a couple of bits of flash code i have laying around to play around with it a little to understand the interface.

oh the website. the program is called carwaves. half way down the page

http://www.hfalex.it/grggt.htm

its a bit of software that gives you a graphical representation of the hexidecimal and an easy way to modify it. this can be saved etc. its all in italian (easily translatable) and the company that made it no longer supports it and will not give any furthur info about it. i dont know how Astra uses it exactly. i know they remove a chip from the board and move a jumper. this must allow them to program or modify the programmimg of the chip. whether they have to "downoad" the map change it and then "upload" it or if they just change it thru a direct connection i dont know. you could use it to change any hex code actually- i used a couple of bits of flash code i have laying around to play around with it a little to understand the interface.
Hi zoom44,

That's the piece of software Alex showed to me in Spa. Without downloading/uploading capability, it's useless.
I confirm they do as you said : they have to "download" the map, change it, and then "upload" it. That's what he told me anyway. He also mentionned to me the slight hardware mod they have to perform before being able to communicate with it.
Ok next step now is to find a way to download/upload stuff.

Thanks for the info,

Fabrice

Fabrice- check your pm's

Fabrice- check your pm's
Read and replied to.

Fabrice

Alright, this thread kinda died out and I'd hate to think you guys were stuck for lack of support.

I don't spell well, but I am a degreed Computer Engineer and a practicing EE (designing circuit boards for embedded applications for 10 years). I currently work for a small design services company and my lab has o-scopes, logic analyzers, high quality solder stations and other useful things. Plus, my technician coworkers would back me up if I needed to build something complicated from scratch (like a special download cable).

It sounds like the S/W you're talking about is some sort of disassembler. Any embedded software engineer would have about three such disassemblers and if the chips are COTS we could get datasheets.

Do you guys need some help with the boards/chips? If we get some spare modules out of wrecked cars we could experiment with little risk.

If you search, someone has posted pics of their ECU taken apart. So you can at least know what all the chips onboard are.

In terms of cables and such... I'm seeing two possible options here...

1. Use the OBDII/CAN interface port to connect a simple menu-driven handheld interface device. Option for device <--> PC connection for full detailed reprogamming.

2. Mod the ECU so that either the stock maps and settings (such as throttle body) can be downloaded/uploaded -or- bypass the stock maps to external EPROM where you upload/download your maps/settings. In this setting (#2) you could use an AUX port (only) for this function so that when the dealer techs reflash the ECU it wouldn't erase your uploaded maps/settings.

Personally I favor #1, but beggars can't be choosers.

This is what those who want ECU reflashers are thinking of...

http://www.sctflash.com/

http://www.diablosport.com/main.php

http://www.snipertuningsfla.com/index.html (sorry... can't seem to find the main maker's page)

Hi zoom44,

That's the piece of software Alex showed to me in Spa. Without downloading/uploading capability, it's useless.
I confirm they do as you said : they have to "download" the map, change it, and then "upload" it. That's what he told me anyway. He also mentionned to me the slight hardware mod they have to perform before being able to communicate with it.
Ok next step now is to find a way to download/upload stuff.

Thanks for the info,

Fabrice

I wonder if you would pay at the mazdatechinfo site for the RX8 ecu programming if that program would open it?

... then you would just need to work your way through the program and pay off a service guy to upload it in your car -shrug-

The downloading and uploading of the software content of the PCM is not a real problem any more. Alex, who started this thread can do both and even modify the calibration (the maps). There are a few remaining issues though :
- he needs to modify the hardware in order to be able to retrieve the maps from the PCM
- nobody has an index (memory addresses) of the different parameters (scalars, functions and maps) in the calibration. Alex can only modify spark advance and O/L fuel. He hasn't got any other info to modify other parameters.

Fabrice

Harrison is working on making the CANScan also operate as a Pass-Thru device for software changes, it's been a while since I last spoke to him about it though

Harrison is working on making the CANScan also operate as a Pass-Thru device for software changes, it's been a while since I last spoke to him about it though
Again, not really what we're discussing here, as it wil only let you do your factory re-flashes yourself, and not recalibrating your PCM as you wish.

Mm...why did this thread kinda die out ? It had some really good information . Any updates ?

Alex doesn't come here much anymore ...

Damn.........

There is now a better thread about PCM re-calibration on this forum.

Fabrice

That would be ?

That would be ?
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=81801

Fabrice

Link us.

There is now a better thread about PCM re-calibration on this forum.

Fabrice


Better? LOL, send me a memo when someone can actually do a 370hp supercharger setup with it ....

^^^^ I see your point.

F

since we're on the subject- how's your project going Team?

not progressing as fast as I had hoped, but it's coming together :Peace:

everytime I turn around it's customize this and customize that, it should be worth it in the end though