Just received a copy of the internal "RX-8 Product and Comparison Guide" which itemizes all the significant items, options, packages, etc, and gives details that can be pointed out to the customer during a showroom walkaround.

Interestingly, it also identifies what Mazda considers to be the key competitors to the RX-8 - Audi TT Coupe, BMW 330Ci Coupe, Honda S2000, Infinity G35 Sport Coupe and Nissan 350Z - and includes detailed comparisons against all five.

It's a 338KB Word document and I've posted it here (http://www.snikte.net/rx-8/03_rx8_pc_guide.doc). Enjoy!

EDIT: updated the link

I'll start looking over this 54 page document tomorrow at work, thanks!

It's a lot of repetitious pages in that thing... I just skimmed it and I think 40 of the pages are just repeats :p

RX-8 vs BMW 330Ci
- Comment A

RX-8 vs Honda S2000
- Comment A

Lotta crap in there, so I didn't learn a thing :(

Good to have though... and some things about DELIVERY on the car are interesting.. otherwise nada :)

Yeah, a lot of it is thinly disguised propaganda, 'tis true, but I thought it was interesting to see the things that they want the sales folks to push.

I haven't read through it all yet myself, but I did find this bit interesting:
RX-8 TARGET CUSTOMER DEMOGRAPHICS

The Mazda RX-8 is targeted at image-makers and performance-seekers who see their cars as a thrilling form of self-expression. These buyers are primarily single men in their early thirties who work hard in order to play hard. They are financially comfortable college graduates who actively pursue new experiences.

hmm, I'm not in my thirties, but I do work hard so I can play hard

besides the age discrepancy, it actually describes me pretty good :)

Interesting reading...One thing that stood out was in the section for giving a thorough delivery. There is a paragraph describing a cold-shutdown procedure. It closly resembles the procedure from the 2nd Gen RX-7 (which was due to a glitch in the fuel computer). In short, it says to allow the car to idle for 5 minutes, then rev to 3000 rpms, return to idle, and turn off the engine. Kinda odd.

Oh yeah, there was one more thing that caught my eye: repeated warnings to not use the navigation system while driving. LOL!:p

I like this one:

•Uses a glow-in-the-dark trunk release slide lever to reduce the chance of an individual becoming trapped inside the trunk.

People are always getting trapped inside my trunk now, this is really going to help out.

Originally posted by tripwire
I like this one:

•Uses a glow-in-the-dark trunk release slide lever to reduce the chance of an individual becoming trapped inside the trunk.

People are always getting trapped inside my trunk now, this is really going to help out. Those internal release handles are mandatory on all US vehicles these days. No more transporting kidnapees in the trunk.

Hey, and it's got a Valet Trunk Lockout System:

On the RX-8, a one-touch trunk-lid release button is integrated into the lower left-hand side of the instrument panel. A valet trunk lockout system provides for situations where customers must leave their vehicle with another person, such as a parking attendant, and want to prevent the trunk from being opened with the remote trunk-lid release. Show your customer the location of the trunk-lid release button and operation of the valet trunk lockout system:
• Move the trunk-lid release lockout switch in the glove compartment to the OFF position. The remote trunk-lid release button cannot be operated.
• Give the valet only the secondary key, which does not open the trunk.
• Move the trunk-lid release lockout switch to the ON position. The remote trunk-lid release button can again be operated.

Originally posted by tripwire
Hey, and it's got a Valet Trunk Lockout SystemI guess that prevents the valet from removing your suitcases, but since the reat seat passthrough can still be removed, it doesn't prevent access to smaller items in the trunk.

yeah, I wonder if the secondary key won't unlock the rear-seat passthrough as well ??? as I noticed it locks from inside the cabin.

I noticed one error in their comparisons with competitors - Mazda claims that the S2000 does not have Xenon lights, but every S2000 I've seen has them!

Regards,
Gordon

Originally posted by tripwire
yeah, I wonder if the secondary key won't unlock the rear-seat passthrough as well ??? as I noticed it locks from inside the cabin. Ah, that would make sense. The pre-production model I sat in didn't have any means of locking that panel.

I never knew that that tire pressure monitoring uses a radio frequency to trip the "low presure" light.

Originally posted by Puppy1
I never knew that that tire pressure monitoring uses a radio frequency to trip the "low presure" light.

If it didn't, then you'd have a wire coming off of each wheel. :)

you'd think they would use Bluetooth for something like that.

On people accessing the trunk from inside the car.

I thought the trunk Pass through was also lockable using a leaver in the trunk.

If this is in the passenger compartment then whats the point?

Originally posted by tripwire
you'd think they would use Bluetooth for something like that.

Why? More expensive and probably has higher battery consumption. Standard RF has been around for years and is very cheap. No need to use higher technology than necessary, unless you want to be able to hookup your laptop to the sensors and monitor the pressure in realtime. :)

Come to think of it, I wonder how long the battery lasts in each of those transmitters? And how would you know if the battery died (short of letting all of the air out to see if the light comes on)?

bluetooth power consumption is way low, but it's probably not the most optimal application for Bluetooth, it may be a bit too excessive.

getting a read-out on the Navigation system would be pretty sweet. I really think the nav should have been designed to spit out more information concerning the health of the car.
Even my 2002 Explorer has a little computer that tells you
trip time
remaining miles to empty
oil life
all fluid levels
digital compass
ambient temp.

maybe that kind of stuff will make it in the RX-9

Do not operate the Navigation System while driving.

Obey traffic regulations. Read the 2004 Mazda RX-8 Owner’s Manual for complete instructions.

It's nice to know that you are spending $2K on a nav system whose use is not recommended while driving!! :)

funny how it's not recommended for driving, yet it sits in the center of the dashboard. in your car.

it'll give the passenger something to do while feeling depresseed about being unable to drive my RX-8. :)

Originally posted by medcina
Come to think of it, I wonder how long the battery lasts in each of those transmitters? And how would you know if the battery died (short of letting all of the air out to see if the light comes on)?

Most or all of these transmitters get their power by the wheel movement. As the wheel turns the censors is moved through earths magnetic field which generates voltage in a coil and powers the transmitter and pressure sensor. Excluding component failures it should last a long time.

Originally posted by jtdwab


Most or all of these transmitters get their power by the wheel movement. As the wheel turns the censors is moved through earths magnetic field which generates voltage in a coil and powers the transmitter and pressure sensor. Excluding component failures it should last a long time.

a kinetic engergy converter? sweet!

Originally posted by devMan
It's nice to know that you are spending $2K on a nav system whose use is not recommended while driving!! :)

It is not recommended to change the nav system settings or select a destination while in motion. The system is meant to be on while driving and give you voice commands to turn. Its a standard lawyer clause which says we told them not to walk and chew gum at the same time so we aren't liable for anything. If you haven't looked the demo on the US RX-8 sight from mazda has the same warning with a little more detail added.

Its also not recommended to dial / use cell phones or tune the radio while in motion. Those warnings have been around for years. When the car is moving you are supposed to drive the car and do nothing else. In the long run I'm supprised McDonalds doesn't have a disclaimer on bags and cups saying they don't recommend eating while driving (not withstanding putting a hot coffee cup between you legs).

on the not using the nav while driving front, after reading the bit on the website the language used there is very clear that they mean do not fiddle with the controls or attempt to put in new destinations while in motion. they suggest parking or pulling over in a safe place to input things. they do not mean to not listen to it or glance at the map to find your way.

All-new 250-hp, 1.3-liter, 2-rotor, in-line, RENESIS rotary engine (6-Speed Manual)

Question. How is it that the Renesis is an "in-line"?

Originally posted by Y&Y


Question. How is it that the Renesis is an "in-line"?

because the rotors are 'in a line', one in front of the other?

I wonder if a V-shaped rotory engine will ever be made? Not even sure how stable it would be in making a V.

I hope that question mark is a typo.

I know most of you guys already know this, but the reason I think why the RX-8 Product and Comparison Guide is so repetitive is that the Mazda Corp wants the sales people not to forget to annoy us car buyers with info we already know.

Originally posted by tripwire
... getting a read-out on the Navigation system would be pretty sweet. I really think the nav should have been designed to spit out more information concerning the health of the car.

Even my 2002 Explorer has a little computer that tells you
trip time
remaining miles to empty
oil life
all fluid levels
digital compass
ambient temp.

maybe that kind of stuff will make it in the RX-9

Or RX-3 ... or RX-6 and RX-7!

:D

And along those thoughts ...

Originally posted by tripwire
... getting a read-out on the Navigation system would be pretty sweet. I really think the nav should have been designed to spit out more information concerning the health of the car.

I picked this image up from another website - they claim it came from the May issue (Subscription ONLY) of Road and Track and it came with a supplement on the RX-8 and RX-8 Mazda Speed. Sorry no caption to include.

(And the May Road and Track supplement on the RX-8 that I picked up at the Mazda Rev-It-Up Event, here in Dallas, didn't show it either?)

I wonder if you could still use NAV too?

I'm ready for a job at Mazda now after reading that. Good find man!

Originally posted by zoom44
on the not using the nav while driving front, after reading the bit on the website the language used there is very clear that they mean do not fiddle with the controls or attempt to put in new destinations while in motion.Exactly. "Do not operate it" does not mean "do not have it in operation."

i just gleaned this bit of info while reading

"Instant Mobility System (IMS) Emergency Flat Tire Repair Kit
The IMS emergency flat tire repair kit included with the RX-8 enables a temporary repair of a slightly damaged flat tire resulting from running over nails or similar sharp objects on the road surface. In the event of a flat tire, drivers should follow the instructions in the kit to repair the tire temporarily. After temporarily repairing a tire with the kit, the vehicle should be taken to a Mazda Dealer to have the tire replaced. While the RX-8 is not equipped with a spare tire as standard equipment, a temporary spare tire is available as a dealer-installed accessory."

does that really say after doing the temporary repair yourself that the tire then needs to be
replaced instead of just repaired by a proffessional. and if so why would i take it to mazda? unless they are going to give me an extreme discount on the tires it would be cheaper to go to a dedicated tire place.

Originally posted by bwayout
And along those thoughts ...



I picked this image up from another website - they claim it came from the May issue (Subscription ONLY) of Road and Track and it came with a supplement on the RX-8 and RX-8 Mazda Speed. Sorry no caption to include. I wonder if you could still use NAV too? That photo is what sold me on the $2k price for the nav unit. Not that Mazda will provide this additional info upgrade, but I'm sure there will be aftermarket stuff that can be connected to the factory screen.

Originally posted by zoom44
...does that really say after doing the temporary repair yourself that the tire then needs to be replaced instead of just repaired by a proffessional... Yes, while the "fix-a-flat" stuff temporarily fixes the tire, it will do long term damage to it, possibly causing delamination down the line, if it is left in there. This goes for any "fix-a-flat" type product. Keep this in mind before using such a product on any of your tires.

---jps

well than that just might put me in the "getting the spare" group. although i'll have to wait awhile the donut spare will be cheaper in the long run than having to replace one of those tires because of a simple puncture.

I have had to use the good old fix-flat a few times and the tire dealer has always made a point of saying that they completely washed out the inside of the tire when they repaired it -- I don't think it will be an issue unless somebody leaves the residue inside the tire for a long time.

I have had my current vehicle for 9 years and have never once used the spare tire (yes it does have low profile tires 245/17's).

Originally posted by Sputnik
Yes, while the "fix-a-flat" stuff temporarily fixes the tire, it will do long term damage to it, possibly causing delamination down the line, if it is left in there. This goes for any "fix-a-flat" type product. Keep this in mind before using such a product on any of your tires.

---jps

While at work I was talking to two of my co-workers (both are real car nut experts) about the "fix-a-flat" spray and lack of spare tire on the RX-8 and one of them used it in the past, and warned me that it's a real hard time consuming mess to clean off from inside of the wheel rim!

Plus Sputnik is right that you can't repair the tire after it gets sprayed with that gook! This is only an emergency measure, you not suppose drive it for any long length of time becaue the tire starts to get eaten up from the inside out from that same gook that pluged the original hole (there's that word: "delamination" - The act of splitting or separating a laminate into layers), so he went to buying run-flats! Either way, you have to replace the tire(s - most of todays tire designs make you replace the bad one and the tandem tire)

Both have run-flats (on a corvette and original Mustang) and don't mind the loss of handling ... and both take their cars out to run at the race track.

Personally, I wish the trunk had room for a spare without taking up the rest of the space ...

:(

It's going to look very silly when I mount my spare tire on the back bumper like a Jeep and throw off that wonderful 50/50 weight distribution!

;)

Not!

:p :D

Edit: I forgot to mention that my co-worker said that it takes 2 cans to fix a tire!

Originally posted by RXhusker
... the tire dealer has always made a point of saying that they completely washed out the inside of the tire when they repaired it -- I don't think it will be an issue unless somebody leaves the residue inside the tire for a long time.

RXhusker, That's great to hear! What brand do you use?

:)

I wonder what the time frame or distance is considered safe (...less than 5 miles? under 50?) to drive around on?

I'll have to ask my friend and do a search on the web, he told me that he always had to replace the tire and they were nologer repairable due to the "gook" inside

OK, since I'm getting off topic, I'm going to post my links over here:

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?threadid=4677&perpage=15&pagenumber=3

RX-8 Forum > General Topics > RX-8 Discussion > Whos Is/Isn't Getting Spare Tire Kit & Why?

;)

Been thinging alot about the spare/no spare. So today I went to my dealer,had him pull up my order on the Mazda screen and put a check on the spare option...Up came a new screen with my spare on the order...easy! ....but costly..If you ever cut the tire ,the can of "gunk" is useless...

Used Fix-A-Flat brand. Tire was repaired both times. I took car immediately (within 24 hours) to the tire dealer for repair. They certainly didn't say the tire had to be replaced just because I used the fix-a-flat. I think the biggest concern is keeping the can in the car. There have been cases reported where the cans exploded due to the heat. Definitely supposed to keep in the trunk and avoid long exposure to very high temps. I think I would avoid I lived down in AZ in the summer!

Originally posted by RXhusker
Used Fix-A-Flat brand. Tire was repaired both times. I took car immediately (within 24 hours) to the tire dealer for repair. They certainly didn't say the tire had to be replaced ...
Glad to hear it!

:)
Originally posted by RXhusker
... I think the biggest concern is keeping the can in the car. There have been cases reported where the cans exploded due to the heat. Definitely supposed to keep in the trunk and avoid long exposure to very high temps. I think I would avoid I lived down in AZ in the summer!
That might not be a good thing for me, living here in Texas. It gets mighty darn hot in the summer ... even in the shade

:(

Why not just buy a small electric air pump (the kind that plug into the cigarette lighter socket) and a Safety Seal Repair Kit (Link (http://www.safetyseal.com/store/autokits.htm)). Use the seal as a temporary remedy until you can take it into get repaired properly.

I thought the tire repair kit did come with a small electric air compressor you plug into the 12V outlet and well as the spray to plug the hole?

Originally posted by DTECH-RX
I thought the tire repair kit did come with a small electric air compressor you plug into the 12V outlet and well as the spray to plug the hole?

Didn't know about the compressor.. But the safety seal kit is a plug not spray.

Originally posted by Superfan


Didn't know about the compressor.. But the safety seal kit is a plug not spray.

When I saw the car in southbeach it had the spray not patch

Originally posted by RotorGeek


When I saw the car in southbeach it had the spray not patch

I know, I'm just pointing out that we would be better off buying a patch kit instead of using the spray.

Originally posted by Superfan
I know, I'm just pointing out that we would be better off buying a patch kit instead of using the spray. Neither the patch kit nor the spray is going to help you if you get a cut or puncture in the sidewall, though... (it sounds unlikely, but the only flat I've had on my own cars in the past 15 years has been a 3" long, 1/8" diameter metal rod that somehow punctured my tire halfway up the sidewall on my way to work; when I got out of my vehicle at work I could hear the tire hissing...)

Hi Eccles,

thanks for the interisting information.

Did I overlook it, or are there really no hints for salespeople on how to deal with questions about fuel consumption? Or is it such a non-issue in the US?

Originally posted by RXhusker
Definitely supposed to keep in the trunk and avoid long exposure to very high temps. I think I would avoid I lived down in AZ in the summer! [/B].

I live in the Phoenix area and have had a can of fix-a-flat in my truck for a couple of summers with no problem. I prefer using the plug repair kits and keep a small compressor in the vehicle, I've used them on my MK7 twice and they work great!:)

Originally posted by Werner
Did I overlook it, or are there really no hints for salespeople on how to deal with questions about fuel consumption? Or is it such a non-issue in the US? No, you didn't miss it - it's not mentioned at all. Gas is cheap here (certainly compared to European prices), but I'm unsure if it was left out because they didn't have numbers available when that document was written or if they simply have no good answer if anyone asks!

Originally posted by eccles
they simply have no good answer if anyone asks! I'll bet it's this.

It was interesting to compare with original "engineering"
Press Kit before Mazda USA's write-up. Two mistakes
(or liberal stretching for the purposes of conciseness) are:
1.)Power Plant Frame isn't locked to the chassis. In fact the purpose of the 'dynamic dampers' on this closed section are to
isolate NVH.
2.)"Triple H" body construction does not contribute to quietness.
This structural element allows thinner sections while giving rigidity. If the floor, cab sides and roof flexed, the car would be rejected I'm sure.

Anyways the engineers are working on the Miata replacement
and do not see any of these abuses.

I don't mean to distract the spare tire solution discussion here.... but some of the info in the Sales Guile is hilarious. I didn't read through the whole thing, but I read the comparison part for the Audi TT, BMW330, and G35 Coupe. If a Mazda rep were to tell me this stuff in person, I would probably burst out laughing. My favorite is the 0-60 estimates on the last page, it's the "Let's find the slowest time for all of the other vehicles." Oh well, it's their sales guide, they can do what they want with it, I just hope Mazda sales people know better than to present show their customers this guide as the holy grail to sell the car.

btw: did the guide even mention anything about lighter weight and ease of entry/exit on the RX8?

And under "Comfort" it says nothing about an unprecedented-in-a-sports car ride. The whole definition of Comfort in terms of
inspiring confidence, just like has happened in JSG's direct experience, is lost on these yo-yo's.