Is anybody in here waiting for automatic RX8 yet? I've seen pictures of it, and looks awesome. Have to decide between rx8 and mazda6.

http://edmunds.com/new/2004/mazda/rx8/100220565/photos.html?tid=edmunds.n.prices.leftsidenav..13.M azda*

BTw which one do u think will be better in acceleration 0-60 and 1/4 mile? Mazda6 auto (7.5/16.0 sec) or Mazda RX8 auto?


Thanks

I am waiting for a manual. Why would you want to suffer the power loss to get an auto? If you aren't an enthusiast or it is traffic conditions that warrent the auto then the 6 would be a good alternative due to its much lower price. If this is your weekender then I think an auto would be a terrible choice, (my opinion).
You won't be able to wring the performance out of the rotary with the early shifting auto. A better choice for an auto-performance car would be something that delivers at lower RPMs.

So mazda rx8 auto will be slower than mazda6 auto?

getting an auto rx8 totally defeats the purpose of getting an rx8

Originally posted by tribal azn
getting an auto rx8 totally defeats the purpose of getting an rx8

Does mazda RX8 auto sucks that much? When I drove automatic rx7, it was ok and I didnt mind having auto too. I though RX8 auto would be even cooler.

Originally posted by Haris


Does mazda RX8 auto sucks that much? When I drove automatic rx7, it was ok and I didnt mind having auto too. I though RX8 auto would be even cooler.

no i dont think that the rx8 auto sucks, but if ur getting an rx8 why get a auto? i mean its a enthusaites car, for people who love to drive. its like buying a gun without buying bullets. or eating cereal without the milk.

but whatever, its ur money, ur choice, do whatever u want.:)

you can definitely buy watever you want, but i agree, if you want an auto and a pretty decent ride, then the 6 is a good choice... getting an auto on the rx-8 is almost unthinkable... i live in the LA area, and the traffic is not bad enough to make me get an auto.. but its ur choice... at least you will look like an enthusiast... like i told my friend who bought a 97 M3 auto... "WHAT THE FUK"???

>>getting an auto rx8 totally defeats the purpose of getting an rx8<<

>>getting an auto on the rx-8 is almost unthinkable<<

I disagree. But I want the auto-manual tranny....like my Acura TL has. Sometimes when crusing the backroads I like shifting myself. Other times (80% of the time) I'd rather let the car do it.

I am following this closely to see what Mazda offers. I am also watching to see what Mazda is putting in the navigation system...and what add on services it will include beyond navigation. Can they match or better Acura? So far they haven't even matched what my '99 TL has.

I'll also be watching to see if a trailer hitch can be added...like I could to my TL...
http://acmenet.net/~jeffny/hitch.html
....YEAH! A TRAILER HITCH!! :) heehee

I'm a Mazda fan, I had a '90 626. But I won't buy an RX8 just for performance. It's got to be comfortable and somewhat practical too.

Jeff

Haris,

I don't know what your situation is that you would need to get an auto. Maybe you have a lot of traffic in your area, or maybe there is another reason.

Me personally, I would love to get a manual, but because my wife cannot drive one (believe me she has tried) I will have to settle for the auto. However, it doesn't bother me at all. I am probably in the minority on this board when I say that I want the car for the looks and styling, and not so much for the power. I believe 205 HP will be more than sufficient for me. Besides, I intend to wait another year or two for the car, so maybe by then the auto will have more HP. If it doesn't, oh well.

As for the 6, I agree it is a pretty nice car. In fact, I am trying to talk my wife into getting one and then I could get the 8. I doubt that will happen though. I don't think you can go wrong no matter which of the two you pick. Get the car you want to get with the transmission you want and don't worry about what anyone else thinks.

Haris: y dont you wait for the test drive... that way you can decide which is SUITABLE for you! ;)

Most ppl here or even in the rx7 forum, will encaurage you to get the manual... and do you know y? simple! more power as well as cheaper to maintain compare to the auto...

My friend has the Mazda6... and it is a great car... so its really up 2 u dude... ;)

*wisper* but personally... get the 8 whether it's a manual or auto... u wont regreat... :D

Me personally, I would love to get a manual, but because my wife cannot drive one (believe me she has tried) I will have to settle for the auto.

Umm, if you love to drive a manual, but your wife can't - buy the manual!!! This way, you're the only one driving it! JMO

... i live in the LA area, and the traffic is not bad enough to make me get an auto

danielk015
Junior Member

Registered: Sep 2002
Location: Irvine, ca

You live in south OC thats not the LA area. Thats a totally different county. You live in the suburbs. I myself live in north OC. But I have to commute every morning and night to and from LA. Not to mention drive around LA during the daytime. Don't tell me LA traffic is not bad. I know for a fact there is traffic in south OC. But only in the morning and night rush hour. LA has traffic even at night.

Sheesh get your facts straight.

*breathe in, breathe out*

Ok sorry about that, anyways the whole point of getting a sports car is to drive it fast and drive it hard. Why get a sports car if you're just going to use it to pick up your grandma.

Y&Y... yeah if you want to get that technical.. and north orange county, so where do u live, fullerton?? HB??? Buena Park?? That is like 10-15 miles up... wow, you are so much closer to LA... i have to go up to LA a lot for work and i understand the traffic, it is bad... but my point was, IT IS NOT BAD ENOUGH to make ME, THAT IS MEEH get an auto... for others, that might be a different situation... man, sorry to get ur skirt in a ruffle, i didnt think that that remark of me living in the LA area was so technically wrong... maybe i shouldve said IMO... LOL...

oh, btw... to get more technical... irvine is in central orange county, cities like Laguna Hills, Mission Viejo, SJC are south orange county... SHEESH get your facts straight

Although I expect everyone on this forum to be enthusiasts just by virtue of finding the site and participating on it, I would imagine a LOT of people (the regular public) will buy this car just for the looks and the price. They will never see the high side of 6000rpm, and never notice whether the car has 250hp or 150hp. For them the automatic will be fine and will sell well - remember this is a mass-produced car at 30,000 units per year (by the second year).

If someone on this site has a good reason for wanting an auto, and they are aware of the power deficit and the hint of a poor review from Laguna Seca, why give them a hard time about it. Personally I would just recommend anyone who wants an auto to test-drive both transmisstions and choose what suits them. I for one will be braving the Houston traffic every day in my slick-shifting 6MT.

I you want the automatic I'd wait a year or so. It sounds to me like Mazda will be releasing an SMG type of tranny and the current auto is just temporary.

Originally posted by danielk015
oh, btw... to get more technical... irvine is in central orange county, cities like Laguna Hills, Mission Viejo, SJC are south orange county... SHEESH get your facts straight I commute from Coto de Caza (SOUTH COUNTY) to Santa Monica everyday. 66 miles each way! Talk about traffic! I am moving closer so I can enjoy the MT vs regreting it. :)

Hey puppy1,

try looking for a place in culver city I heard the neighborhood is not bad and the rent is not all that expensive. The only thing is that parking sucks sometimes depending on the apartment.

if youve "mastered" the manual, than it will never bother. Its only if you can just do it that traffic and the such is a problem.
________
LOVE HELP FORUMS (http://www.love-help.org/)

Originally posted by ndfi98
Haris,

I don't know what your situation is that you would need to get an auto. Maybe you have a lot of traffic in your area, or maybe there is another reason.

Me personally, I would love to get a manual, but because my wife cannot drive one (believe me she has tried) I will have to settle for the auto. However, it doesn't bother me at all. I am probably in the minority on this board when I say that I want the car for the looks and styling, and not so much for the power. I believe 205 HP will be more than sufficient for me. Besides, I intend to wait another year or two for the car, so maybe by then the auto will have more HP. If it doesn't, oh well.

As for the 6, I agree it is a pretty nice car. In fact, I am trying to talk my wife into getting one and then I could get the 8. I doubt that will happen though. I don't think you can go wrong no matter which of the two you pick. Get the car you want to get with the transmission you want and don't worry about what anyone else thinks.

Yea, basically traffic is my biggest concern. I already have 240sx stick-shift and I just have to change to auto tranny. I just hate shifting every 5 seconds. And I am not buying a car to race with, so it wont never be on the track. Basically it's all because of design and it is not expensive. But I'll test drive both 6 and 8 with automatic tranny and see which one I like the most.

Thanks guys! :D

Originally posted by Haris


Yea, basically traffic is my biggest concern. I already have 240sx stick-shift and I just have to change to auto tranny. I just hate shifting every 5 seconds. And I am not buying a car to race with, so it wont never be on the track. Basically it's all because of design and it is not expensive. But I'll test drive both 6 and 8 with automatic tranny and see which one I like the most.

Thanks guys! :D I think the 6 is probably the better choice as it's got great handling, better in the snow, and has more room inside and in the trunk. The RX-8 will beat the 6 on looks (imo) and handling, but gas mileage and snowy weather are other things to look out for.

and btw the auto in the rx8 has only 4 gears which is kinda stupid, at least put 5

Originally posted by tribal azn
and btw the auto in the rx8 has only 4 gears which is kinda stupid, at least put 5

If auto RX8 is slower than automatic mazda6, then I dont know why they even made it. It should be at least like 0.5 - 1.0 seconds faster.

Originally posted by tribal azn
and btw the auto in the rx8 has only 4 gears which is kinda stupid, at least put 5

i suppose you're not down with the engineering, eh?? well, FYI, to the extent of my knowledge, it's impossible to make a slushbox (which is what the RX-8 will have) with more than 4 forward gears and reverse... those 5 and 6 speed autos are SMTs, i believe... and there's a rumour about Mazda developping a 5 speed SMT for future auto RX-8's...

and to respond to your comment Haris, the deal with the RX-8 is that it's more than just a straight line car: it's a sports car. the Mazda 6 has a pretty big, pretty torquey engine in it to compete on that horsepower battlefield Nissan, Toyota, Honda, GM, Ford, and Dodge are competing on with their sedans, and really needs to have some pretty big guns to compete (on paper). the RX-8 will absolutely destroy any of these cars around a track, auto or stick (supposing of course the auto could take that kind of punishment, even in a limited amount), if not in a straight line... but yeah, speed is the reason people are big on the stick. it's a comprimise, right??

I just can't imagine why someone would want an automatic in a sports car. The whole idea is the driving experience, right? If I only wanted two pedals to push in a fun vehicle I'd buy a go-kart.

I understand that Mazda HAD to put autos out so they can sell more cars, but I feel that it removes the soul of the car. If I were Mazda and could ignore the financial aspect I wouldn't even offer it in auto.

But that's just what I think.

-Also, I'm gonna be pissed when I'm looking for a used RX8 and I walk up to it, look inside, and see an automatic. (Shaking my head)

Originally posted by wakeech


i suppose you're not down with the engineering, eh?? well, FYI, to the extent of my knowledge, it's impossible to make a slushbox (which is what the RX-8 will have) with more than 4 forward gears and reverse... those 5 and 6 speed autos are SMTs, i believe... and there's a rumour about Mazda developping a 5 speed SMT for future auto RX-8's...

I thought BMW had a "regular" 5spd auto tranny in their cars before? :confused:

Originally posted by wakeech


i suppose you're not down with the engineering, eh?? well, FYI, to the extent of my knowledge, it's impossible to make a slushbox (which is what the RX-8 will have) with more than 4 forward gears and reverse... those 5 and 6 speed autos are SMTs, i believe... and there's a rumour about Mazda developping a 5 speed SMT for future auto RX-8's...




huh what the hell? pass the crackpipe.

most cars now have 5 speed autos, thats pretty much the standard. hell bmw has a 6 speed auto. u dont need smg to have more then 4 gears.

and to put only 4 gears in a sports car(sporty car, whatever u wanna call it) is just plain stupid

*nod* it's true...

The new Volkswagen Touraeg has 6 speed auto.

If you are physically infirm, I could see the automatic Rx-8 as a viable car.

The automatic Rx-8 is really slow, 0-60 in 8.5 1/4 in 16.5 @ 85, compared with 6.5 for the 6 speed Rx-8 and 15.0 @ 95. The Rx-8 auto is as fast as the new Accord 2.4 I4 automatic.

It has only been 13 years since the 5 speed automatic was introduced, and 10 years since you could get one in a car.

http://www.sovereign-publications.com/auto-art-2.htm

http://www.zf-group.co.uk/Press/6hp26pressrelease.htm

And now the heavy duty 6 speed from ZF, is in the V12 7 series-ZF 6hp32. in addition to the ZF 6 hp 26 The E49 new 5 series will have 6 speed automatics from day one, ZF 6 hp 19 for the new Valvetronic I6's, so the only BMW line that is in need one, is the 3 series. The new Audi S4 will get one a little latter this year.

"walk up to it, look inside, and see an automatic. (Shaking my head)"-ohhno15

seriously...
________
Lovely Wendie (http://www.lovelywendie99.com/)

*yawn* If people are mentally infirm, they may try to use words and specific numbers to sound like they know what they are talking about. ;)

Originally posted by MikeW
If you are physically infirm, I could see the automatic Rx-8 as a viable car.

The automatic Rx-8 is really slow, 0-60 in 8.5 1/4 in 16.5 @ 85, compared with 6.5 for the 6 speed Rx-8 and 15.0 @ 95. The Rx-8 auto is as fast as the new Accord 2.4 I4 automatic.

It has only been 13 years since the 5 speed automatic was introduced, and 10 years since you could get one in a car.

http://www.sovereign-publications.com/auto-art-2.htm

http://www.zf-group.co.uk/Press/6hp26pressrelease.htm

And now the heavy duty 6 speed from ZF, is in the V12 7 series-ZF 6hp32. in addition to the ZF 6 hp 26 The E49 new 5 series will have 6 speed automatics from day one, ZF 6 hp 19 for the new Valvetronic I6's, so the only BMW line that is in need one, is the 3 series. The new Audi S4 will get one a little latter this year.


That's waaaayyy to slow. It seems as they made that for show only. I though cause it was a sport, it should be faster than mazda6. If u think about it, mazda6 stick shift 0-60 is 6.8 too.

Originally posted by Haris
That's waaaayyy to slow. It seems as they made that for show only. I though cause it was a sport, it should be faster than mazda6. If u think about it, mazda6 stick shift 0-60 is 6.8 too.

Haris, Buger was just pointing out that MikeW is just guessing with those performance numbers, because no official numbers exist: in reality, we really don't know how fast or slow either of these cars will be. but, unofficial and preliminary testing of 0-100km/h (which is 62mph) came in at about 6.2s or something, which could very well mean that an American spec RX-8 doing 0-60mph with the right conditions may sprint it in less than 6s... again, speculation, as were Mike's numbers.

and Mike, thanks for the links... but i still can't see in my mind the design of a 5 speed slushbox... or it's advantages (other than MAYBE cost) over a pneumatic or hydrolically actuated SMT... :confused:

Originally posted by Y&amp;Y
Hey puppy1,

try looking for a place in culver city I heard the neighborhood is not bad and the rent is not all that expensive. The only thing is that parking sucks sometimes depending on the apartment. Thanks for the info, but I'm already in escrow for a 75 year old historical home in Moterey Park. This is ONLY 21 miles from my job in Santa Monica! But its right near my parent's home. They are over 70 now, so I want to be close. I'm going from a $1.4m mansion to a $400k fixer-upper.

Originally posted by ohhno15
I just can't imagine why someone would want an automatic in a sports car. The whole idea is the driving experience, right? If I only wanted two pedals to push in a fun vehicle I'd buy a go-kart.

I understand that Mazda HAD to put autos out so they can sell more cars, but I feel that it removes the soul of the car. If I were Mazda and could ignore the financial aspect I wouldn't even offer it in auto.

But that's just what I think.

-Also, I'm gonna be pissed when I'm looking for a used RX8 and I walk up to it, look inside, and see an automatic. (Shaking my head)


Ohhno15: i know how u feel... but where i live, some of the Royal Family in Brunei have Ferrari Modena Station Wagon in an auto!!! :D now this is a family Sport Car!!! ;) so not everyone is like u dude...

it will definitely be a plus if its a 5 or 6 speed auto... just my 0.2..

There are a bunch of "stick snobs" here. It's one thing to prefer one tranny, or even despise another. But once you get to the point of telling someone else that they or there car aren't worthy because they prefer an automatic (for whatever reason), you need to get over yourself.

---jps

Originally posted by WankelWannabe
I you want the automatic I'd wait a year or so. It sounds to me like Mazda will be releasing an SMG type of tranny and the current auto is just temporary.

I had never heard that Mazda was going to put an SMG (Sequential Manual Gearbox, aka, semi-automatic, F1 type transmission) in the 8. Has there been confirmation of this?

If so, I am probably going to wait. The SMG would seem to be the best of both worlds: the performance of a manual and the convenience of an automatic

Originally posted by Sputnik
But once you get to the point of telling someone else that they or there car aren't worthy because they prefer an automatic (for whatever reason), you need to get over yourself.

Do you laugh at people who order a double cheeseburger and have a diet soda to go with it? I do. I think buying a sporty car and neutering it with a slushbox is the same thing. "Drink deep or not at all."

HOWEVER--my fiance has an automatic RX-8 on order because of her personal preferences (she can drive stick but doesn't like to in commute) and I'm sure as hell not gonna laugh at her. Life is full of compromises and if you're set on an automatic why not get a sporty one?
________
Lovely Wendie (http://www.lovelywendie99.com/)

Originally posted by PUR NRG
Do you laugh at people who order a double cheeseburger and have a diet soda to go with it? I do.

You shouldn't laugh. How do you know that the person is not diabetic or otherwise physiologically sensitive to sugar? :p I order a diet soda to go along with my double cheeseburger all the time, not because I think I'm dieting, but because I will feel dizzy and shaky if I have all the sugar in a regular soda. At 6'2" tall and 165 lbs, dieting is the last thing on my mind :)

HOWEVER--my fiance has an automatic RX-8 on order because of her personal preferences (she can drive stick but doesn't like to in commute) and I'm sure as hell not gonna laugh at her. Life is full of compromises and if you're set on an automatic why not get a sporty one?

I couldn't agree with you more. Just because you want the conveniences of an auto doesn't mean you should have to go buy a Camry. :)

Originally posted by gusmahler
I had never heard that Mazda was going to put an SMG (Sequential Manual Gearbox, aka, semi-automatic, F1 type transmission) in the 8. Has there been confirmation of this?... There has been no official confirmation of either a SMG or an MPS RX8.

We only have reliable information from a couple of sources that both are being seriously considered. I know for a fact that the SMG in the Toyota MR2 Spyder was delayed over a year because Toyota needed that extra time to develop it to their satisfaction. And they knew well before the release of the car (something like a year) that the SMG would not be ready for initial release. Now, this is speculation on my part, but notice how the concept and prototype RX8s had SMGs up until the yellow concept (about a year ago).

The thing is, we won't know for sure until things are officially announced.

---jps

Originally posted by Sputnik
Now, this is speculation on my part, but notice how the concept and prototype RX8s had SMGs up until the yellow concept (about a year ago).

Can you elaborate? According to the press kit the production car has paddle shifters. Unfortunately the shift time borders on 1 sec.
________
New Mexico Dispensaries (http://newmexico.dispensaries.org/)

Originally posted by PUR NRG
Can you elaborate? According to the press kit the production car has paddle shifters. Unfortunately the shift time borders on 1 sec. The prototypes had SMG style trannies (manual trannies with a hydraulically activated clutch controlled by a computer), while the 2004 production version either has a 6 speed manual (5 spd avail. outside the U.S.), or a 4 speed automatic that can be controlled by paddles on the wheel.

---jps

Originally posted by Cihuuy



Ohhno15: i know how u feel... but where i live, some of the Royal Family in Brunei have Ferrari Modena Station Wagon in an auto!!! :D now this is a family Sport Car!!! ;) so not everyone is like u dude...

it will definitely be a plus if its a 5 or 6 speed auto... just my 0.2..

Just because rich people have a ferrari in an auto doesn't mean that's it's a good idea. Don't even get me started on the fact that it's a station wagon.

Originally posted by Sputnik
[B]


There are a bunch of "stick snobs" here. It's one thing to prefer one tranny, or even despise another. But once you get to the point of telling someone else that they or there car aren't worthy because they prefer an automatic (for whatever reason), you need to get over yourself.


What are you talking about? I need to get over myself? I'm probably one of the least wealthy people here talking about the RX8, I'm a Junior at Saint Louis University (an expensive school but I have a big scholarship). I only hope to one day buy a reasonably priced used RX8, and wanted to make the point that I'll hate seeing autos that someone bought for their 16 yr old daughter and she decided she wanted a jeep instead. Sorry I'm such a "stick snob". I just think that sports cars have a purpose, and that a 210 HP auto rx-8 is just a sheep in a wolf's clothing. At least I won't be buying the car for the image.:mad:

About the possible SMG:

That is what I'd like. I'm sure Mazda won't say whats planned now, they don't want people to not buy the car to wait for an SMG (and their plans may change in 6 months). I won't be in the market for a RX8 for 2 to 3 years anyway so at this point it dosen't matter if I know what their plans are or not...

In the picture of the steering wheel on this page...
http://media.mazda.ch/dossiers/RX-8/Photo-RX8-F.htm
...you can see the "Up" and "Down" shift paddles on the wheel. That would tend to indicate something might be in the works. (these aren't the brake paddles on the Evolve right?)

As far as peoples choice of Auto or Manual (or SMG)....take your choice, enjoy the car....live and let live. I find the whole idea someone else cares what somebody else drives silly....unless of course they are driving a GM car, THAT would make me scratch my head, poorest quality you can buy (I know from experiance!)....sorry, I got off topic there :) heehee

Jeff, in response to the paddle shifters you noticed... those actually just control the tiptronic transmission on the RX-8.

Just like you can shift on the shifter itself with the + and - pulls of the shifter, you can click it in with the paddles.

I believe however that Mazda should offer SMG on the MazdaSpeed version when that is released.

Hi Herc,

Thanks...but they don't have a tiptronic planned currently, right? Was that from one of their prototype cars?

I was also just going to add that in the next image on that web site (craftmanship9.jpg) it shows the gauges, and in the left dial is a big red numeric LED...looks like the gear indicator (just like on my Acura TL)

Originally posted by JeffNY
...but they don't have a tiptronic planned currently, right?... Wrong. The automatic offered with the 2004 RX8 is a tiptronic automatic.

---jps

>>Wrong. The automatic offered with the 2004 RX8 is a tiptronic automatic.<<

Thanks for the blunt reply, but what am I missing? I though Mazda was only going to offer an hydraulic automatic or manual gear box in 2004? I thought the "tiptronics" like you find in Porche or Audi are basically a manual (sequental) tranny controlled by fast solenoids...that can also be controlled by computer to act like an "auto". Humm....but maybe I am wrong...

Someone please enlighten me...

So you WILL be able to shift the auto tranny yourself? Like I can now in my TL? They call the tranny in a Boxter a "tiptronic"...is that hydraulic? Guess I misunderstood "tiptronic"

Originally posted by JeffNY
I though Mazda was only going to offer an hydraulic automatic or manual gear box in 2004?

A "standard" stick shift uses a lever to engage drive, 1st or 2nd gear. If you think about it putting it in 1st then manually "shifting" into second is no different than having steering wheel paddles that do the same thing--just with all the gears instead of just two. Same deal with a shift lever you pull to one side and then flick up or down to go through the gears. The interface for each is slightly different but the automatic transmission is the same in each.

SMG is a true "manual" gearbox with a computer controlled interface instead of foot-operated pedals. So while the operator controls (paddles) are the same the device operated on is completely different.
________
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As far as peoples choice of Auto or Manual (or SMG)....take your choice, enjoy the car....live and let live. I find the whole idea someone else cares what somebody else drives silly....
Here, here! Buy what you want; drive what you want. What do you care what someone else drives?

An uncharacteristic mistake on Wakeech's part saying that all 5 speed autos are SMT. Tut, tut ;).

Having driven many 5-speed autos with 'manual controls' I will say that cars like my IS300 (5 speed auto with e-shift - buttons for up/down on wheel) and G35, Acura CL, Audi A6, Chrysler 300M (gearstick with separate plane for up/down changes) are a long way from an SMT gearbox. A 'real' auto loses significant power to the torque convertor, and takes 0.5-1.0 seconds to make a shift (no matter where the manual controls are - paddles, buttons or gear lever). A clutchless manual (as in BMW M3, Ferraris, Porsches, Maseratis, MR-2) has no power loss and can shift very quickly (perhaps under 0.1 secs) - faster than a human can with a true manual. Usually they cost a lot ($2k - $10k).

The initial RX-8 auto will have paddle controls and be a regular 4 speed auto (I read somewhere because Mazda does not have a 5-speed in house (but what about 5-speed auto in Mazda 6s?), and they will not source one externally for the RX-8). One day Mazda MAY produce a clutchless manual gearbox (SMT) which will have no problems working with the higher-revving 247HP engine, but no dates have been set yet.

Originally posted by pelucidor

The initial RX-8 auto will have paddle controls and be a regular 4 speed auto (I read somewhere because Mazda does not have a 5-speed in house (but what about 5-speed auto in Mazda 6s?), and they will not source one externally for the RX-8). One day Mazda MAY produce a clutchless manual gearbox (SMT) which will have no problems working with the higher-revving 247HP engine, but no dates have been set yet.

i read somewhere that the 5speed auto from the mazda6 didn't fit right. but the japanes market seems to have it ( or another) as an option so now i'm at a loss to explain it.

Originally posted by JeffNY
>>Wrong. The automatic offered with the 2004 RX8 is a tiptronic automatic.<<

Thanks for the blunt reply, but what am I missing? I though Mazda was only going to offer an hydraulic automatic or manual gear box in 2004? I thought the "tiptronics" like you find in Porche or Audi are basically a manual (sequental) tranny controlled by fast solenoids...that can also be controlled by computer to act like an "auto". Humm....but maybe I am wrong...

Someone please enlighten me...

So you WILL be able to shift the auto tranny yourself? Like I can now in my TL? They call the tranny in a Boxter a "tiptronic"...is that hydraulic? Guess I misunderstood "tiptronic" Exactly like your TL now. Except that the RX-8 will be slower due to the fact the engine is detuned.

The 5 speed auto from mazda 6 doesn't fit because it's fwd, the rx8 is rwd. The Japanese market 5 speed is a manual transmission, not an automatic.

Originally posted by JeffNY
>>Wrong. The automatic offered with the 2004 RX8 is a tiptronic automatic.<<

Thanks for the blunt reply, but what am I missing? I though Mazda was only going to offer an hydraulic automatic or manual gear box in 2004? I thought the "tiptronics" like you find in Porche or Audi are basically a manual (sequental) tranny controlled by fast solenoids...that can also be controlled by computer to act like an "auto". Humm....but maybe I am wrong...

Someone please enlighten me...

So you WILL be able to shift the auto tranny yourself? Like I can now in my TL? They call the tranny in a Boxter a "tiptronic"...is that hydraulic? Guess I misunderstood "tiptronic"

Look here for all the info you need:

http://www.edmunds.com/news/innovations/articles/46873/article.html

Thanks for the info and web site guys...

Originally posted by JeffNY

Thanks for the blunt reply, but what am I missing? I though Mazda was only going to offer an hydraulic automatic or manual gear box in 2004? I thought the "tiptronics" like you find in Porche or Audi are basically a manual (sequental) tranny controlled by fast solenoids...that can also be controlled by computer to act like an "auto". Humm....but maybe I am wrong...

Someone please enlighten me...

So you WILL be able to shift the auto tranny yourself? Like I can now in my TL? They call the tranny in a Boxter a "tiptronic"...is that hydraulic? Guess I misunderstood "tiptronic"

This whole area is confusing because everyone uses different terminology (or worse, the same word to mean two different things: the Edmunds article listed above uses the word semi-automatic to mean something completely different from the way Formula 1 uses the word. I'll try to briefly summarize the differences:

Manual: uses a clutch and a gear shift selector that is manually operated by hand to change gears

Automatic: uses a torque converter to couple the engine with the transmission and the transmission automatically changes gears.

Tiptronic: This is the name Porsche uses for its system, but is sometimes generally applied to similar systems by different manufacturers. This uses a torque converter to couple the engine to the transmission. Thus, IT IS AN AUTOMATIC. The difference: there are levers, sometimes placed on or behind the steering wheel, sometimes by moving the gear selector knob to a different place. The levers allow you to change the gear of the transmission. But, make no mistake, IT IS AN AUTOMATIC TRANNY, with the associated power losses and long shift times. IMO, they are a useless gimmick.

SMT (Sequentiual Manual Transmission) or SMG (Sequential Manual Gearbox). This device uses a clutch to couple an engine with the transmission. However, there is no clutch pedal. You shift gears by pulling a lever behind the steering wheel. When you pull the lever, a computer controls the use of the clutch and the shifting of the gear. This is the system used in the Ferrari 360 and the BMW M3. The system is also used in Formula 1 cars (where it is typically called a semi-automatic transmission). The gear shifts are faster than any human can possibly do. Race drivers love it because you can't miss gears. In passenger cars, there is typically an automatic mode, where the gears are shifted automatically.

In summary, if a system uses a clutch, it is a manual. If it uses a torque converter, it is an automatic. That is how you can tell the difference, and not by the presence of buttons on the steering wheel.

As for the cars you discuss, the TL has a "Tiptronic" style shifter, but is an automatic, as are the Porsche and Audi systems you discuss.

What does this have to do with the RX-8? The RX-8 will have a manual and an automatic, but the automatic will have Tiptronic style shifting available. It appears that there are rumors of an SMT style gearbox, but it hasn't been confirmed.

From when the RX-8 was still in concept stage:
"The transmission is a true 6-speed clutch style manual transmission. Its wing shifter system merely throws the shift lever and actuates the clutch must faster than humans can do it. The automatic option on the center console just allows a computer to send the same shift signal to the transmission that the wing shifters would have if you flipped them manually. The transmission shift system should be famial to Drag Racers and also Ferrari enthusiasts. "

source: rotarynews.com (http://rotary.cep.net/view.php3?article=20010119.html)

From what I have read elsewhere, this shift system was NOT implemented.

Originally posted by pelucidor
An uncharacteristic mistake on Wakeech's part saying that all 5 speed autos are SMT. Tut, tut ;)

:p like i said, as far as i knew... i've never seen or had explained to me how a 5 or 6 speed slush box works, until Mike linked me (but that was hardly enough for me ;) i want to know more!!)

Thanks for the additional input guys. It was my understanding Mazda had decided to NOT offer the auto-manual ("Tiptronic") initially. That's why I asked. But I guess they will.

>>IMO, they are a useless gimmick.<<

Gus, well, maybe my TL tranny is a "usless gimmick" (for racing 300+ HP cars)...but it can still be fun :) Sorta like a Pet Rock I guess. Sometimes usless gimmicks help sell things. And my usless gimmick can still blow the doors off 90% of the cars out there LOL!

I always wondered why car makers never really pursued SMTs more. They are similar to the (simpler) sequental gear boxes on motorcycles. They would seem to be so much less complicated (and smaller and lighter) and cheaper to make than a hydraulic tranny. Maybe because the electronics now available weren't ready for such applications 10 or 20 years ago?

Jeff

Originally posted by JeffNY
Thanks for the additional input guys. It was my understanding Mazda had decided to NOT offer the auto-manual ("Tiptronic") initially. That's why I asked. But I guess they will.

>>IMO, they are a useless gimmick.<<

Gus, well, maybe my TL tranny is a "usless gimmick" (for racing 300+ HP cars)...but it can still be fun :) Sorta like a Pet Rock I guess. Sometimes usless gimmicks help sell things. And my usless gimmick can still blow the doors off 90% of the cars out there LOL!



OK, useless was probably a bit harsh. For pure acceleration, a Tiptronic style automatic is useless. When you floor a car with an auto, it will shift at the redline anyway, so "manually" doing so adds no performance. If you are in a highway passing situation, flooring an automatic will will put the car in an optimum gear already. No need for a Tiptronic.

It probably helps on twisty roads, though.