as far as i can tell it's gonna be full manual (see the clutch pedal?). i think they ditched the paddles cause of all the negative responses. i dunno, i kinda liked the paddles but full manual is more fun prolly :cool:

oops, meant to be a reply to general tojo

hopefully they will retain the push button start button...

AND the credit-card key thing with the multi-user engine parameters...

just in case my GF wants to borrow it

i just hope is a 6 speed:D

the last I heard was 6 speed manual of Austrailia - 6 speed auto/stick of the US.

this thing looks to be a regular standard tranny. And let me tell ya, I wouldn't buy one if it's not.

Let me put your fears to rest.....The SMG transmission may be an option, but it appears that mazda will be putiing a Six Speed in it. And the one with a shifter you throw, not tap or pull or push or paddy whack, and a clutch. If you go to Mazda USA (http://www.mazdausa.com) you will something on the specs of the RX8, it states 18" rims on the MANUAL and 16" rims on the AUTOMATIC, I think that an SMG would be hard to do properly on a sub 30k car, which again I repeat is Mazdas goal. I feel that the pricing will be very similar to the Nissan 350Z. Sub 30k but if you load it up, with useless to a sport car options like a navigation system (weight saving hint: get a map) or the Monster Ampage Stereo you could get above the 30K mark. Sun roof is still in the air, I like em, what do you think?

As for the SMG, maybe an option but all pictures and stats released by Mazda show a shifter, not a knick knack paddy whack system.

I'd rather have a 6 speed. Sunroof? I don't need one. The top looks ok the way it is (without a sunroof).

I don't care what kind of transmission it will have, its going to be my daily driver, nothing more. But a six speed would be nice, and i wouldn't mind a sunroof.

Six speed all the way. Tho a sun roof would be a nice added bonus.

yes. 6-speed definately. moon/sun roof would be nice also.

Six speed with a sunroof definatly

6 speed baby

Manual Please....its the only way for it to be a true sports car

Really looking forward to a sunroof. May not purchase wihout it because for me its competition is a few roadsters. And I would also opt for a manual.

I don't give a rat's ass, give me an RX-8. I want it and I want it NOW!!!

As long as there is no torque convertor, I will be happy.

6 speed all the way, it wouldnt be a true sports car if it wasnt a stick 6 speed. Sunroof i would most likely also get because it also adds the whole sprts car affect also.

What about those drivers who want the simplicity of an automatic transmission. I love stick, but I sometimes I wanna get in a just go. Or maybe drive with one hand and eat a burger in the other. GOD FORBID I STAIN THE SEATS!!! Manumatic transmission would be awesome, best of both worlds. Forget the Sun/moon roof. I WANT A T-TOP!

I'd be interested in something like Audi's Multitronic CVT if they could make one that could handle the 250 bhp and got rid of the fake shift points (which are really pointless). A transmission like that would almost always be in the powerband and would suit the characteristics of a rotary quite well IMO. Most likely faster than any manual transmission. But a paddle shift with electronically controlled clutch would be loads of fun too. I don't subscribe to the theory that a 6-speed is the only way to go, but a conventional torque converter equipped automatic has no place in a car like this (even if they had one in the FDs).

Well, make mine a 6 speed.

And, definitely sunroof/moonroof whatever the heck they're called. Preferably the glass one.

I love rowing my own boat and I don't want a gimmicky transmission. Mazda will have to give it a six-speed instead of a five-speed manual just to be competitive with all of the other sports cars and sports coupes currently and soon to be on the market.

I doubt the sunroof will be offered due to what I read about how they designed the chassis. They were pretty creative to accomadate the pillarless design. There is a heavy reinforcement on the leading edge of the suicide door. That reinforcement links to some heavy duty beams on the top and bottom that run across the car to provide side impact strength. Considering that, I don't think we'll be seeing a sunroof.

KayakDaddy,

Where did you find this info for the structure of the chassis. I've pretty much read everything I could find and haven't seen that? Just curious as to where I can get my hands on more info that I've seemed to miss. Thanks.

cshepley, just wondering where did you get info on the Multitronic CVT, I've sean a little bit about it, but I'm still unclear and interested in its workings.

Synergy, I've heard that the chassis was reinforced through the roof as well, but I'm not too sure where I got my information... and I heard this about 6 monthes ago though.

Here is a good place to start:
http://www.sae.org/automag/techbriefs_01-00/03.htm

European Car also had an excellent article on it about a year ago.

Originally posted by Strider
cshepley, just wondering where did you get info on the Multitronic CVT, I've sean a little bit about it, but I'm still unclear and interested in its workings.

Synergy, I've heard that the chassis was reinforced through the roof as well, but I'm not too sure where I got my information... and I heard this about 6 monthes ago though.

As long as there is a six speed I'll be happy. My brother just got a new M3, and I don't think i would get it with anything other than a 6sp. A targa top would be neat, as would a SMG transmission (both as options), but I believe that these would significantly raise the price of the vehicle. The only options I would want would be a sunroof and a sport package if they offer such a thing (for added suspension stiffness etc, nicer wheels). I'm 17 and working my ass of during the summer, and will for the next 5 years till I'm done college. This is the car that I want! Just out of curiosity....would an rx-8 with say, 40,000 miles on it and the options mentioned above be more than $23,000 in 2007? The other cars I'm looking at would be an E36/46 M3 in good condition or a new Acura RSX-S. I need something that has a trunk and two usable rear seats. Anywho, I'll get one eventually!

Synergy,

Sorry I didn’t reply about the side impact reinforcements sooner, I’ve been on vacation. I don’t know exactly where I read that, but there were pretty specific details about it in an article somewhere.

I’ve read everything I’ve been able to get my eyes on about the RX-8 in print and online. I’ll go back through quickly and see if I can find it. I’ll post the link if I do. It sounded like an ingenious design, but I would expect nothing less.

OK, I found it, the information about the side impact reinforcements. It is actually part of a more comprehensive article about the RX-8, perhaps the most complete one to date. Here is the link to the first page of the article.


http://www.roadandtrack.com/features/ArticleDisplay.asp?ArticleID=7&page=1

The information about the invisible B-pillar is on page four of the main article. There are also smaller sections about behind the scenes, photo gallery, video, and specifications.

Enjoy!

I would like a 6 speed, Sunroof, and Yokohama AVS tires on 18" light weight rims. I wouldn't mind a Bose stereo, but I don't personally care about the subwoofer. I would also like a limited slip differential, ABS, and if possible, AWD. That would be awesome! I love the Skyline, S4, TT and the STi. I don't see why it wouldn't be considered? I've heard else where of a return to some AWD cars in Mazda's line-up. Mazda6?

I think AWD would make the car too heavy to be pushed around effectively by its low torque engine. ABS I could do without, but LSD and light weight rims are a good thing.

Originally posted by n22lasing
I would like a 6 speed, Sunroof, and Yokohama AVS tires on 18" light weight rims. I wouldn't mind a Bose stereo, but I don't personally care about the subwoofer. I would also like a limited slip differential, ABS, and if possible, AWD. That would be awesome! I love the Skyline, S4, TT and the STi. I don't see why it wouldn't be considered? I've heard else where of a return to some AWD cars in Mazda's line-up. Mazda6?

Even outside of the weight aspect, AWD doesn't feel like RWD. AWD may help the car stick, but RWD is RWD, i need say no more.

they shouldn't even make it in automatic..a waste of a car

Now that I look at the pedals... I hope the gas pedal goes down lower so that you can heel and toe more easily. I'd prefer if they's just attach it to the ground--the way I"m used to. :p

6 speed manual and no other tranny for me. Give me a clutch any day. Love that short shifter. Spoke to the Mazda guys at the NY Auto Show about the sun/moon roof and was told that the chassis was reinforced through the roof due to the suicide door layout and the roof was not likely to be coming.

Originally posted by Donny Boy
6 speed manual and no other tranny for me. Give me a clutch any day. Love that short shifter. Spoke to the Mazda guys at the NY Auto Show about the sun/moon roof and was told that the chassis was reinforced through the roof due to the suicide door layout and the roof was not likely to be coming.
Yea, it's kinda disapointing, but oh well :) I'll just open my windows!

I use my slider more than I use my air conditioner, very disappointing. I guess we all have to make sacrifices.

Oh well. A moonroof would've been nice, but a stiff structure with those trick suicide doors is better.

Besides, I'm really sick of my current car's sunroof dripping on me during rainstorms. I know all sun/moon roofs don't do that, but its turned me off them.

sorry donny boy but the mazda guys told you wrong. i think there will be a sun/moon roof (what is the dif anyway?) available. the latest spy pic definetly shows some glass on the roof, they must have found the right spot to cut out between the reinforcing in the roof.

Hey zoom....What picture are you referring to? Can you post a link please?

Thanks A lot-

Houston RX8

Just got the 350Z in....Damn it's tight....Hope Mazda will compete....

this one
http://www.rx8club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=160&stc=1

Hey zoom....thanks for the reply....


houstonRX8

That could be just a reflection.

We need more certainty than that right now... that pic doesn't give it to me! :(

Originally posted by zoom44
...i think there will be a sun/moon roof (what is the dif anyway?) available... A "sunroof" is made out of glass, while a "moonroof" is made out of sheetmetal. But both have been used for the other at times.

---jps

okay, in that case the pic is showing a sunroof. herc you are correct that is alot of reflection. but it is definetly from glass and not from the metal that the rest of the roof is made from. you can see the difference between the reflections from the different materials. look at the space between the gutter above the passenger side and where the glass starts. you can see (well i can and i could be seeing what i want to see) the corner of the sunroof and the line of the side as it goes forward.

Originally posted by zoom44
okay, in that case the pic is showing a sunroof. herc you are correct that is alot of reflection. but it is definetly from glass and not from the metal that the rest of the roof is made from. you can see the difference between the reflections from the different materials. look at the space between the gutter above the passenger side and where the glass starts. you can see (well i can and i could be seeing what i want to see) the corner of the sunroof and the line of the side as it goes forward.
I see how you can tell.. but I'm still going to just think it's NOT there so I don't get my hopes up :)

it must be manual, sunroof it doesn't really matter to be, the push button starter would be cool to show off, heh

It doesn't look like a sunroof to me. Looks like a reflection. If it was a sunroof, where are sealing lines around the glass? By this, I mean the border of the sunroof that prevents leakage of water into the car? There usually some border, either a the spongey black seal you have around your door, or some cut out area. The transition to the "glass of the sunroof" is just too instantaneous.


Looks to me like it's the reflection of the top of the white building in the background.
At least that's my guess....

BTW, I would like a sunroof....
I drive with the sunroof and windows open all the time.....

Betcha there's a sunroof.:o

I think that an SMG would be hard to do properly on a sub 30k car, which again I repeat is Mazdas goal

someone else

my response

A SMG would not be too difficult considering that a Toyota MR2 spyder has it as a relatively low cost option. It doesnt shift nearly as fast as the SMG's on Ferrari's and soon to come BMW's, but it is a cool option. I would go for a 6 speed though

Originally posted by irresistibo
I think that an SMG would be hard to do properly on a sub 30k car, which again I repeat is Mazdas goal

someone else

my response

A SMG would not be too difficult considering that a Toyota MR2 spyder has it as a relatively low cost option. It doesnt shift nearly as fast as the SMG's on Ferrari's and soon to come BMW's, but it is a cool option. I would go for a 6 speed though
SMG sucks.

Sure, it shifts faster, like .01 seconds for a shift. Big woop.

There's a certain feeling when you can FEEL the power coming off the clutch and you applying it when you gas it. The interaction with the car is what I love about manual transmission. It's not all about racing, which is what SMG transmissions are generally for. Manual transmission allows you to have a lot of fun that granted, is probably not good for the car, but is FUN FUN FUN!

Want to smoke some tires for kicks? Rev it up, drop that clutch!
Want to do a reverse or forward 180? Clutch in, hit that wheel hard and then shift into another gear. You'll be spinning your friend's heads around!
360s? Clutch in, handbrake... oo lah lah! :D

I can understand SMG in F1 racing, but in any other race.. a driver should SUFFER for a missed shift! It's part of the skill of the driver. SMG takes that away and adds more to the technology of the car instead of the driver, which makes racing more boring than it is already (I'm not a fan, as you imagine hehe).

Anyways... SMG sucks. Manual is the only option for me. The other option should be SMG with one automatic setting. Better than that tiptronic crap they offer with cars now.

But of course.. that's a pipe dream.

The SMG in the Toyota MR-Spyder is not faster than a manual. About 1 second slower to 60 mph, actually. It was only offered to quell the cries of people who wanted the Spyder but didn't want to learn to drive a stick. Toyota never planned on offering it in the first place.
BMW's SMG is, on the other hand, a transmission I wouldn't mind having in my RX-8. But for $2400 US, I'll keep the clutch pedal thanks. :) If you cruise the BMW forums, the SMG's are having some reliability issues with the clutch disks and getting stuck in gear.

Originally posted by Grimace
The SMG in the Toyota MR-Spyder is not faster than a manual. About 1 second slower to 60 mph, actually. It was only offered to quell the cries of people who wanted the Spyder but didn't want to learn to drive a stick. Toyota never planned on offering it in the first place... Being an active member of the MR2 community since before the Spyder became a concept, I can say that from very early on, Toyota intended to include the SMT with the Spyder. In fact, they did not get it to their liking, so they did not include it until some two years later. The length of time might seem excessive, but when you consider the fact that it is for a car that they have a limited production of, I would imagine that the development budget was pretty limited.

Again, as a member of the MR2 community, I can attest that the SMT has to break in, and the 1 second deficit shrinks significantly. But even then, a well-broken in SMT does not perform up to the manual's standards.

For my Miata, I'll keep the manual. For this car though, I would like to have a SMT (or SMG, whichever they end up calling it). When I had my Pontiac Grand Prix, I tried left-foot braking (out of boredom, frankly). I found that even with that car, with "spirited driving", left-foot braking made a difference. Not only in reaction time, etc, but in how you could drive the car (you HAD to trail-brake that car to get it around tight corners quickly). And, the ability to scoot around with both hands constantly on the wheel, and a foot per pedal, made for a different driving experience. And lastly, I'd like to be able to put it into an "automatic" mode in stop-and-go traffic, and give my bad knees a break.

---jps

Originally posted by Sputnik
Being an active member of the MR2 community since before the Spyder became a concept, I can say that from very early on, Toyota intended to include the SMT with the Spyder. In fact, they did not get it to their liking, so they did not include it until some two years later. The length of time might seem excessive, but when you consider the fact that it is for a car that they have a limited production of, I would imagine that the development budget was pretty limited.

Again, as a member of the MR2 community, I can attest that the SMT has to break in, and the 1 second deficit shrinks significantly. But even then, a well-broken in SMT does not perform up to the manual's standards.

For my Miata, I'll keep the manual. For this car though, I would like to have a SMT (or SMG, whichever they end up calling it). When I had my Pontiac Grand Prix, I tried left-foot braking (out of boredom, frankly). I found that even with that car, with "spirited driving", left-foot braking made a difference. Not only in reaction time, etc, but in how you could drive the car (you HAD to trail-brake that car to get it around tight corners quickly). And, the ability to scoot around with both hands constantly on the wheel, and a foot per pedal, made for a different driving experience. And lastly, I'd like to be able to put it into an "automatic" mode in stop-and-go traffic, and give my bad knees a break.

---jps
Your reasoning is very rational to me, but I still love my clutch and stickshift :)

It's the people who either don't know how to drive manual, or physcially can't drive it who will benefit most from SMG.

Not many people race their cars on a track, they buy sports cars for FUN. And a clutch enables me to have a helluva lot more fun than with a stupid clicker :P

Originally posted by Hercules
Your reasoning is very rational to me, but I still love my clutch and stickshift :) I understand. I wouldn't want one in my Miata, or whichever "tuner" car I may happen to have. ...Not many people race their cars on a track, they buy sports cars for FUN. And a clutch enables me to have a helluva lot more fun than with a stupid clicker :P Well, my point wasn't a "track" thing, I never took the "Pontiac Grand Pig" on track. But what I am trying to get across is that you can still have FUN with this setup. Shifting gears isn't a major part of having fun in a car, not for me anyway. It's kind of like trying to explain how fun a Miata is. You can put it into words so that a person can comprehend what you're talking about, but few are ever able to really understand until they live with a Miata (or a similar car) for a couple of days.

I mean, have you ever gone to a go-kart track where the carts are left-brake/right-gas, and there are no gears on it? Aren't those fun?

And there will be plenty of those who buy this particular car as a "compromise", and an SMT will be much less of a compromise than a "tip-tronic", isn't it? Even then, there are plenty of those who buy automatic Miatas.

---jps

6 speeds fully in manual mode and I'm happy.

knick knack paddy whack system :p
I'm sorry, I just couldn't resist.

Hercules- SMG certainly does not "suck". It may be impractical or undesirable to you, but that doesn't mean that the technology is without value.

I read recently either online or in Autoweek a quote from a guy in the BMW M division, saying that they would not offer sticks on future M cars because the SMG transmission is more technologically advanced, or on the cutting edge. It shifts faster than a stick, *can be* more reliable, and provides less transmission wear (correct me if I'm wrong). Now, this decision just seems asinine. I would hope that a good percentage of buyers would still elect to purchase the stick shift, however, in reading the statistic that over 75% (I believe it's 90%) of the Ferrari 360 Modena's are bought with the Magneti Marelli transmission, I am not that confident. I hope BMW will keep the 6 speed as an alternative in the future, because I know that at least a few buyers will never give up their stick, and I am one of them.

well, think about this, though... do and will (performance minded) buyers give up ABS??
do and will (performance minded) buyers give up power steering??

it's just the way things go... if it can enhance performance, once the cost comes down so most people can afford it, it'll usually stick...... i mean, really, someday you're not going to be able to find a performance car that DOESN'T have steering-wheel mounted paddles for your pneumatic SMG...

but, i'm with you ;) i'd like to have things raw again...

Originally posted by velociti
Hercules- SMG certainly does not "suck". It may be impractical or undesirable to you, but that doesn't mean that the technology is without value.

I read recently either online or in Autoweek a quote from a guy in the BMW M division, saying that they would not offer sticks on future M cars because the SMG transmission is more technologically advanced, or on the cutting edge. It shifts faster than a stick, *can be* more reliable, and provides less transmission wear (correct me if I'm wrong). Now, this decision just seems asinine. I would hope that a good percentage of buyers would still elect to purchase the stick shift, however, in reading the statistic that over 75% (I believe it's 90%) of the Ferrari 360 Modena's are bought with the Magneti Marelli transmission, I am not that confident. I hope BMW will keep the 6 speed as an alternative in the future, because I know that at least a few buyers will never give up their stick, and I am one of them.
I'm quite familiar with SMG and I never said it sucked, only that it was "sucky" to me. The system as designed works great aside from hiccups that time will take to remedy. However SMG for me is not useful, and will prevent me from buying a car offered with SMG only.

Originally posted by Hercules

SMG sucks.

whatever, I agree with you on wanting a stick.

I prefer a full manual car personally. They're more fun to drive and ultimately to enjoy.

Why all the discussion?? There will be a six speed transmission and there will be an automatic transmission. I don't know what type of automatic, but hey, it's an OPTION !!!!!! Just take what you like.
I prefer automatic above manual, not because I'm boring, but just because of the comfort it gives me. If there would be an SMG-like transmission, I sure would take that option.
I use my car to relax, not to let my heart beat out of my chest. (except from the beats of a good sound system ;) ) Especially here in Belgium where on every crossroad there is a static camera to snap you when you drive too fast. At least IF you are able to drive too fast... with all those traffic jams, Belgium is hell to drive... My mom even managed to rip the stick off of the manual transmission of our bmw 5 series!! (imagine how many gearshifts per hour she was making! - Gs/h LOL :D )

I hope you all respect each one's way of view and driving. You can't imagine life without different tastes. There is no "best" transmission anyway. All of them have good, but different points. It's just the customer who decides, so we are all lucky mazda offers both. The only thing I would prefer is that they also would use a 6-speed automatic transmission (e.g. The one from ZF like in the new bmw 7-series with semi automatic included) instead of a 5-speed automatic.

BMW's SMG system only costs about $2400 (invoice 2100)

Mazda should have no problem in offer a AutoManual system for $2500. so 25 + 2.5 = 27.5 out the door.

In the future BMW will have an SMG system with 7 gears (no more stick)

Torque converters usually have a maximum input speed of 7000 rpms (Ferrari 456M GTA). The regular RENESIS has it maximum torque at 7500, and max power at 8500. Obviously this would not work well with a torque converter.

Since Ford is all about being all encompassing. A special torque oriented RENESIS (~190 hp) that has very good low speed/low load torque would work well with a torque converter automatic.