Well, I had some time in the garage so I wanted change the oil and check out the RX8 air box and see how they used the Helmholtz tuning compared to other intakes I've seen. What I found was some oil in the intake track and just a little on the air filter too.

Is this normal for a rotary? It has about 1,400 miles on it, and the oil level was about 1/16" over full when I got the car home from the dealer. Since it was new and I knew the thing would consume some oil I left the level where it was and broke it in gently. By about 1,200 miles I was driving it fairly hard with trips to red line most trips. The oil level was on the full mark by the second fuel fill up and about 1/2 way between full and add when I changed it at 1,400 miles. Should I be worried about the oil in the air box or not?

Well, I know it was common for there to be a thin FILM of oil in the intake on the 3rd gen RX7, but that had a lot to do with the turbochargers. To see oil pooled in the hose like that makes me think there may be a bit of a problem somewhere. I'd take it in to the dealer just to be sure.

There was another post/picture of this problem with oil all over the filter on the rx8 general discussion forum.

Nope, this is definitely NOT normal. You likely have a leak in one of your oil cooler hoses, just like I did. In fact, oil in my air filter element (I have the Rotary Extreme intake) is how I noticed it.

Check this thread (http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16968) for more info. Get your car into a dealership, and keep an eye on your oil. The car will remain driveable if you don't run it hard, as the leak only occurs when you rev it hard. The reason it winds up in the air filter is that the oil sprays out under high pressure right into the cooling fan, which blows it everywhere... like into the intake.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the responces.

I don't think it's the oil cooler hose for two reasons. It's not droping any oil on the ground, the underside of the car is still clean and dry. The oil on the filter element is in line with the tube leading to the throttle body (close to bottom), not near the top inlet opening. I think the oil came from one of the crankcase vent hoses that lead into the accordian tube.

I'll drive the car for a few more miles and take another look (if the garage ever warms up). So far no massive oil consumption and no drivability issues. I still hope it is just the slight over-fill that the car came with. I was very careful not to over fill on the oil change.

Have you been to the dealer yet I'm curious to hear what they have to say?

We saw the same thing on my10ae's car and it had a leaky oil cooler hose just like Omnicron's car.

Originally posted by Speed Racer
We saw the same thing on my10ae's car and it had a leaky oil cooler hose just like Omnicron's car.

Thats what I said :D

Oh, this is very not good....

Checked the air filter today, oil everywhere.

Bottom is soaked, maf is dripping, big puddle under the airbox....

Picture of pool under box....

And for all the people who have trouble getting tyhe box open, this is how it's done....

Photo shows how the front/bottom of the case plugs into four grommets on the front wall, and the connection to the front piece of the inlet tract.

Push the whole deal back and up, until the inlet oval clears the little clip in the middle, then lift and open. Easy, and doesn't involve messing with any wires/connectors.
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doc

I've had the car for two months now and it still smells like burining old inside the car when I drive. I haven't seen any oil on the ground but I have added about 1/2qt since I purchased it. I haven't looked at the air filter yet. Have any of you with this oil leak problem had the problem of it constantly smelling like burning oil inside the car?

Doctorr:

The picture you posted is exactly what my air filter looked like. I did not have a pool of oil in the bottom of my air box though. Bring your 8 in to the dealer and have them check for a leaky oil cooler fittings/hoses. I had this problem and it is now fixed, but the remnants remain on my air filter. I did change to the K&N Typhoon. Have it looked at...

Originally posted by DrComputer
I've had the car for two months now and it still smells like burining old inside the car when I drive. I haven't seen any oil on the ground but I have added about 1/2qt since I purchased it. I haven't looked at the air filter yet. Have any of you with this oil leak problem had the problem of it constantly smelling like burning oil inside the car?

DrComputer,
This is normal - many of us experienced it. Factory protective coating burning off. If you do a search on oil, burning,smell you'll find more on this. If I remember correctly, the smell stopped around the 3rd month - probably at 3k miles for me.

You said you added 1/2qt, but did not say after how many miles. I think I had to do the same after around 600 miles. Oil consumption varies by how hard you drive your car too.

rx8cited

if you have oil in the intake and filter get your car to the dealer. it will cause problems associated with the MAF.

I have to wonder how many other owners have soaked filters.....

(There is no way the oil was 'sucked in' thru the intake, from a leak somewhere. The intake half of the box is dry & dusty. It definitely came up those hoses on the intake tract.)

I only looked as part of my monthly check, had no symptoms.

With the filter being kind of awkward to check, I bet there are a lot more that just haven't been checked yet......
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doc

I was also skeptical that the oil was coming from a cooler hose.

The pics show frank oil on the clean side of the assembly. This is not a good sign, coming from the PCV system.

Doctorr, I assume the oil that was on the exterior of the airbox(dirty side) was oil originating from the clean side.

It's definitely crankcase vent related or filler neckdesign related Check your oil levels and insure that it's not overfilled. Hopefully this is not a new problem surfacing. It has nothing to do with oil cooler hoses: no connection whatsoever.

So I just checked mine (2000 miles on the clock), and I've got the same issue... with a slightly different twist. From the pics I've seen of this, folks have had brownish black oil, making it look like it's from the motor. I on the other hand have red-dyed oil, and a very light weight at that. It reminds me very much of the K&N spray-on filter oil I used to use on my Miata's aftermarket intake... but the RX8's OEM filter is nothing like the K&N material- why would there be this kind of oil on it from the factory?

Has anyone else see this red oil??

Thanks...

The issue is a bad check/PCV valve in the hose highlighted in the photo below.
This is a "known" issue and has been addressed elsewhere on this board recently.

Pull the indicated hose off of the fitting at the rubber inlet bellows and apply vacuum/suction.
If you can draw air, the valve has failed. It should only allow air to pass in the other direction.

Originally posted by Maniac
The issue is a bad check/PCV valve in the hose highlighted in the photo below.
This is a "known" issue and has been addressed elsewhere on this board recently.

Pull the indicated hose off of the fitting at the rubber inlet bellows and apply vacuum/suction.
If you can draw air, the valve has failed. It should only allow air to pass in the other direction.

Makes sense, but why is my oil red? are we not talking about engine oil being sucked from the motor? In an OHC piston engine, a failed PCV would be pulling from the valve cover... where does this pull from on a rotary?


allyourbasearebelongtous... good stuff : )

I think they do spray the air filter with a lightweight oil. I'll check later.

The PCV system actually "pulls" from the top of the filler neck.
The hose that is leaking is supposed to be an inlet with a checkvalve, but if the valve fails, oil shoots out of it under heavy throttle.

Youhavenochancemakeyourtime.:p

Originally posted by Maniac
I think they do spray the air filter with a lightweight oil. I'll check later.

The PCV system actually "pulls" from the top of the filler neck.
The hose that is leaking is supposed to be an inlet with a checkvalve, but if the valve fails, oil shoots out of it under heavy throttle.

Youhavenochancemakeyourtime.:p

Cool- would be interested in knowing about any filter pre-treatment. I'll go check the PCV check valve now and see if it's failed. I have enjoyed some high-rpm pulls this week since I've been turning the DSC off.

Thanks...

someonesetusupthebomb!

I guess its time to head down to the dealer and have this fix this issue... :(

A few more data points...

- I took out the airbox again, this time disconnecting from the according tube so I could see what was going on further down the intake pipeline. There is a moderate amount of this red oil in the 'valleys' accordian tube.

- However, there isn't any oil beyond the tube- the butterfly throttle valve area is perfectly clean- not even a film of oil on it or around it.

- I also checked the PCV check valve, and it wouldn't let me suck (thankfully- I was afraid I would end up with a mouth full of oil :)

- I rechecked the front of the airbox, i.e. where it connects to the front of the car... not a hint of oil anywhere near the front of the box or the filter.

This tells me that oil isn't sneaking in from the motor, since it's red, and there's no sign of it around the vent tubes or throttle valve or intake manifold- it's just in the accordian tube and the airbox. I also don't think it's coming in from the outside (i.e. leaky oil cooler hoses), since there's no sign of oil at the front of the filter or airbox, or any oil in the engine bay at all, or dripping.

So that leaves the oil origin as the filter/airbox itself. Now I'm left thinking that Mazda is using a pre-oiled air filter for whatever reason, and now they're dying it red as not to confuse the techs, but in the earlier models they didn't and dirt darkened it making it look like motor oil? It seems much lighter in viscosity than motor oil, but 5W20 is a pretty light oil too... but it certainly isn't bright red.

Thoughts? I took a few pics if anybody wants to see the color of this stuff...

Thanks

-Sean

pic of the filter with red oil...

pic of red oil pooled in bottom of airbox...

pic of intake tube and throttle/intake manifold opening... notice the pooled oil in the tube, yet there's not a sign of oil the manifold opening-- it's clean & dry to the touch (and to the white paper towel I rubbed on it).

Originally posted by Maniac
The issue is a bad check/PCV valve in the hose highlighted in the photo below.
This is a "known" issue and has been addressed elsewhere on this board recently.

Pull the indicated hose off of the fitting at the rubber inlet bellows and apply vacuum/suction.
If you can draw air, the valve has failed. It should only allow air to pass in the other direction. Hmmm. Wonder if there'll be a TSB coming out on this soon...

Doctorr and others:

This oil in the airbox thing scares me a bit as well. I won't be replacing my air cleaner element for another couple months, (after sucking up the winter salt it's probably a good idea) but maybe there is a correlation between dealer or factory oil overfill and oily airbox/element. I'll let ya'all know what i find.

G8rboy, the element is probably supposed to be coated with oil as supplied, I know my Subarus elements were. I don't know why it would pool up in the airbox though. It appears the element has a spot where the oil is pretty thick.


Since my engine was (I thought) so heinously overfilled when I got the car, I'm expecting there may be a mess in there.

I tried doing a search for "PCV" and "check valve" and didn't find anything. Is it possible power needs to be applied to one of the solenoids or something before vacuum will pass through that hose? I don't see any evidence of a mechanical PCV valve on the engine anywhere.

KKM...did you get a chance to look inside your airbox?

Originally posted by KKMmaniac
I don't see any evidence of a mechanical PCV valve on the engine anywhere.

Maybe thats the whole problem;)

I was the one that started this post and I still haven't gotten my car to a dealer yet. It's an hour away and difficult to get away from work. Service is open on Saturday, but get this they don't have any "factory trained" technicians on Saturdays so there is no way I'll bring it in on a weekend.

I checked the air box yesterday and it had about 1/2 as much oil mostly in the accordion boot again. It also had about 1/2 as many miles since I last cleaned it so it seems to be a fairly constant "flow". The first time the oil did have a red tint, this time it's more brown like the dip stick oil color. I think the oil must be getting in there when the car is idling or stopped since the throttle body and butterfly are dry (basically every thing up stream from the boot). If it was happening at high rpm, I would think the oil would be all over the throttle body and it's not, it seems to be just running down hill towards the air box. If there is no PCV valve, or it's malfunctioning, that may explain the condensation on the dip stick too. I wonder if the two problems are related?

On a side note, I removed the two screens in the intake tube the first time I found the oil. I was thinking they may be a flow restriction. The only thing I noticed was the rough idle while they were out, I put them back in yesterday, and the idle is smoother now. Fuel MPG on three tank full was exactly the same with and without too. Seems to me the screens are "flow straightners" for the sensor.

exactly the help the airflow so that the MAF doesn't get false readings.

I hate to scare anyone but my observations so far with this are not pleasing. As usual I could be totally wrong.
I have observed no pcv valve either (don't think it needs it and I don't think they've used one in years.)
The ventilaton I've noticed so far is at the filler neck only (not at the hose indicated earlier). This also goes directly to the air intake hose.
Here's the bad part: a simple conclusion is that some are experiencing excessive crankcase pressure, most likely caused by blowby. In other words, combustion pressure may be getting by side seals, the new extra seal (I've forgotten what it's being called) and by the oil seals: forceing oil up the ventillation system.
Seem a little far fetched? I've seen some interesting things related to the side seal clearances being used on the renesis.
Another culprit could be the flatness or lack thereof of the flat housings. Often they are not flat even brand new.
I do hope I'm wrong.

Originally posted by CERAMICSEAL
I hate to scare anyone but my observations so far with this are not pleasing. As usual I could be totally wrong.
I have observed no pcv valve either (don't think it needs it and I don't think they've used one in years.)
...
I do hope I'm wrong.

Indeed, you are wrong.
As noted, there is a check valve (that is what a PCV valve is, BTW) in the other vent hose connected to the intake bellows.
Try it out, you will see what I mean.
This valve has failed on several cars and a combination of crankcase pressure and intake vacuum pulls oil into the intake.

I wouldn't post stuff like this if I hadn't tested it for myself...;)

CERAMICSEAL, 'Cutoff seal' is the name you are looking for.
This problem has me stumped...
Red oil? What? On an M/T? There is no red oil in a M/T. Weird...

Originally posted by Mr M
CERAMICSEAL, 'Cutoff seal' is the name you are looking for.
This problem has me stumped...
Red oil? What? On an M/T? There is no red oil in a M/T. Weird...

Yep- bright red, and very light weight. I went down in my basement and looked at some old aerosol K&N spray-on filter oil I had leftover from my Miata, and it's the same color and 'feel'. My filter is also pink, like it was lightly coated in the stuff. Made me wonder if on their long journey to the states if they were over-oiled, it could have collected to the front of the filter since it's at a tilt.

I'm going to clean up the airbox and the accordian tube today, and keep my eye on it every few days. I tried calling a few dealers yesterday, but most service departments were either closed, or their 'RX-8 guy' didn't work on saturdays. I'll try again tomorrow and see if I can talk with someone who has looked at several of these things, and can tell me if they're pre-oiled from the factory (and what they would look like if I tried to buy a new one from parts dept).

I just cleaned up the mess in the airbox, under the airbox, and in the tube... below is a pic of the paper towel I used to clean up the accordian tube- a very distinctive red. Smelling it also clues me off- there's not a hint of used motor oil to it (no gassy smell).

One of my concerns of this issue is the MAF sensor- if that gets coated it can't do it's job well- so I just pulled it and checked it out, and it's dry- not a hint of the mystery oil on it, which was a relief. This stuff is heavy enough to stay in along the bottom of the tube. I rotated my filter 180degrees so the sucking will occur at the clean end of the filter... hopefully any oil entering from the motor side would stain this spot, so I'll keep an eye on it.

purchased Jan 04, 2004 dry as a bone

Originally posted by jerrymac
purchased Jan 04, 2004 dry as a bone

Thanks for checking... are we talking about the filter, the intake tube, or both? Also, out of curiousity, what's your build date?

Check mine also and it was also dry.

Update-

I talked on the phone with a couple of service guys today at the local dealerships, and neither had heard of this yet (either why there's oil in the airbox, or where in the vehicle red oil would come from). One thought it might be failed ventilation/PCV issue, but when I described the color/smell of it, he said couldn't be that, then. Both also said the filter element comes dry, not oiled... so I'm still stumped.

I figured I would kill two birds with one stone and get my airbag wiring harness replaced at the same time I show them this 'issue', so I'm scheduled for a week from today. I saved my soaked paper towels in a baggy so they can try to figure out what it is, although there's still enough in the filter as well I'm sure. I'll post any info as I get it...

Hello all, I checked mine after reading through this thread and want to give an update. I have sub 3000 VIN vehicle received in late July. Took a close look at the air filter, bottom of the bin and holder, all pieces are dry as a bone. My filter color was white on one side and pink on the other.

I removed my K&N intake today to find oil inside the tubing. Nothing saturated, but there was a nice thin film of oil lined on the inside.(MAF dry) Put back to oem till the CF heat shield is release from VR. Gonna make an appt. to get this looked at at the dealer. Who ever gets this fix done first, please post up on what the fix was.

Thanks...

Indeed, you are wrong.
As noted, there is a check valve (that is what a PCV valve is, BTW) in the other vent hose connected to the intake bellows.
Try it out, you will see what I mean.
This valve has failed on several cars and a combination of crankcase pressure and intake vacuum pulls oil into the intake.

I wouldn't post stuff like this if I hadn't tested it for myself...

Actually, Ceramic is correct in one area and mistaken in another:
the hose that Maniac points out goes to a block that provides an air supply to the oil metering nozzles. The line off the filler tube appears to be the only crankcase vent. Where he's wrong is the 3rd gen has a pcv valve.
Hopefully his guess as to the cause of this will also be wrong.

I've been mistaken about if there is positive or negative vacuum to that hose going to the oil injection nozzles... or is it just an air supply to offset the *pull* of the seal passing by the nozzle. Damn, I need a life if that is on my mind...

Thanks 63. I've been wrong once or twice in life.:D

Well Ceramicseal, what where you thinking when you got that tatoo of a rotor on your forehead, I could understand a little rotor on your ankle, inconspicious, but a full pic of the R9 rotor.. come on now.. although the color they used for the *third oil seal* does match your eyes.

Originally posted by good'ol63
Where he's wrong is the 3rd gen has a pcv valve.

Depends on the year... '95 and later did not have a PCV valve coming from the filler neck like '93 and '94 models (the classic PCV valve from intake plenum to oil filler neck), the nipple is capped off. The PCV vents into the intake right before the primary turbo, where positive pressure is never seen. I know it had me scratching my head where the thing was until I discovered they changed it on the '95 models.

http://www.rx7turboturbo.com/robrobinette/pcv.htm

So you're both right - everyone's a winner.

Simon.
Thanks to Rob Robinette for an awesomely informative website.

BTW: I checked my airbox on the weekend and mine's completely dry also. No sign of oil or anything. My car is a 5/03 build with 9700 miles on it.

Habeeb, the oil nozzles have an atmospheric pressure feed to allow the oil to be sucked into the engine easier. If they weren't there you might end up with a vacuum in the oil feed hose.

(Incorrect comment about wet filter deleted 25.02.04)

Gyro;

Sorry, I haven't looked inside my airbox yet; I'm waiting until I can wash the engine and engine bay, (it has been a dirty, salty winter) and I'll replace the element at that time. I'm kinda anal that way, but I'm trying to keep dirt and debris out of the airbox and hoses.

Built 09/03 VIN ...116749 Some red oil at about 1,500 miles (photo at top of post). Cleaned it, found more oil 800 miles latter, after the oil change but not as red.

Originally posted by oi812
Built 09/03 VIN ...116749 Some red oil at about 1,500 miles (photo at top of post). Cleaned it, found more oil 800 miles latter, after the oil change but not as red.

Now we're getting some data we can start to correlate... my VIN is only about 100 cars from yours, also delivered to the great lakes area, and you're the only other one I've heard of having the red oil. Did the oil that followed up later smell like it was from the motor? Did you bring this up to your dealer?

Thanks...

No, I'm not talking "a little of the pink from the air filter".

I'm talking "about half a jug of 5w-20".

The pan under the air box is full of dark brown oil, and the filter is only dirty in the middle, but the whole bottom half is soaked in oil, weighs around 2 pounds!

The air box has a hole in the bottom (presumably to let any water out) and the oil is all over the pan below, and the radiator below that!

Contacting the dealer tomorrow!
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doc

Originally posted by Doctorr
No, I'm not talking "a little of the pink from the air filter".

I'm talking "about half a jug of 5w-20".

The pan under the air box is full of dark brown oil, and the filter is only dirty in the middle, but the whole bottom half is soaked in oil, weighs around 2 pounds!

The air box has a hole in the bottom (presumably to let any water out) and the oil is all over the pan below, and the radiator below that!

Contacting the dealer tomorrow!
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doc

Damn... how many miles do you have on your 8? And I hate to keep asking everyone, but does your intake oil smell like your motor oil/dipstick?

Thanks...

I wonder if some of the folks reporting high oil use and low mpg might have something like this going on... I could imagine an oil soaked airfilter (or dirty/oily MAF sensor) could account for some poor MPG. And oil leaking from somewhere into the intake would account for the high oil use...

SORRY, SORRY, SORRY!
I was wrong, you have DRY filters! I must have got confused with another vehicle when I said the 8 had a wet filter.

The only suggestion I can make it to be sure your engine oil is not over full, and take the vehicle to your dealer if you are still worried.

I don't know where the red oil came from, maybe it is engine oil mixing with something?

I am scheduled to bring my 8 in for the oil on the air filter and intake track and for the airbag recall. I will keep all posted as to what they find about the oil issue.

Ok, how about this: could there be a direct path from the oil filler neck to the airbox or air duct from the box to the throttle body? (If it looks like things are soaked with clean oil)

Those of us who have changed oil often, or have added oil many times would see the most severe pooling. (I would hope Mazda would have engineered the filler neck to drain down only into the sump!)

I checked my airbox last night since I'm taking my 8 to the dealership today for the recall fixes, and it was dry & clean. Whew!

Well mine is wet. Not a pool or anything and the filter is fairly clean, but I can see where there is oil down in there.

My 8's in at the dealer as I type hoping getting fixed. I will report what they find as soon as I know.

ok... I knew not to get my hopes up. Here is what they found, word for word on the service invoice:

"Called Tech Asisst Ref# 339008, checked oil cap, pressure w/o oil cap all systems normal, small amount of oil in air box. Advised to monitor, no abnormal conditions noted at this time"

So no abnormal conditions means ALL RX-8's have this issue? NOT. Oh well, I will keep an eye on this. If it turns out to be something big and causes an issue down the line, it documented.

Anyone else have any better luck?

Anyone have any updates? Any dealers find the "fix"?

Originally posted by my10ae
Anyone have any updates? Any dealers find the "fix"?

Took mine in this morning- I'm having them do the airbag wiring harness, check out the CEL I just got this weekend, and look at the oil-in-the-airbox issue. They're keeping it overnight, so I'll post an update tomorrow morning after I pick it up.

Cool thanks G8rboy....

Ok- here's what my service guy said... and while I'm a bit shocked it does make sense-- the red oil in my intake tract and airbox is definitely ATF.

He starts to ask me if I've taken it anywhere for service, starting to imply that I flooded it and took it somewhere to get fixed. I got pissed and told him the last place that had my car was their dealership at 12 miles on the ODO before I took delivery. I told him he had better do some research and find out if my RX-8 was transferred from another dealer or if they're the ones that did this. I mentioned that there's other cases of this oil-in-the-airbox issue from 'friends' of mine, and they've only seen this when someone tried to start a flooded '7 with the ATF trick, and if the oil is dark instead of red like mine, then it's because dirt from the filter darkened it.

So I'm not 100% convinced, but I have a new filter coming tomorrow- so with a clean tract and filter, time will tell if this is BS or not. I also had them flash me to the 'L' calibration since I threw a CEL a few days ago. When I pick it up I'll talk with the tech a little more...

Update-

The dealership was able to find a new air filter locally, so I picked up the car this afternoon. I talked a bit with the tech about where the ATF could have come from- they're pretty sure my car was delivered to that dealership directly- nobody asked for it to be transferred in, and they claim that they wouldn't have done the ATF trick if they had flooded an '8 getting off the truck.

The service manager was intrigued enough by this to put a call into MNAO and see if this was something they were doing at the port to help start the cars after the boat ride... I'll check back with him tomorrow and see if there's any official answer and post an update if there is any news.

Thanks for the update G8rboy. Still seems there is nop definitive answer from Mazda on this issue. :( I'm keeping a close eye on mine and it will be back in if it gets like it was the first time.

Originally posted by my10ae
Thanks for the update G8rboy. Still seems there is nop definitive answer from Mazda on this issue. :( I'm keeping a close eye on mine and it will be back in if it gets like it was the first time.

Did you replace your filter after cleaning up the mess? Mine had some much oil in it that it was still oozing out into the airbox a week after I cleaned it up. I'll be watching my filter closely, but based on the fact that the red oil was not 'native' to my car, I'm pretty sure it's not coming back.

I have heard that there was a lot of flooding when the RX-8s were pulled off the trucks initially, before they were aware of the flooding potential- I wouldn't be surprised if the ATF in the intake method was used early on to get some started. I'm very curious if Mazda will fess up to this being part of thier delivery SOP for a flooded car...even if they don't, I think my service guy's theory is the best one so far.

They also flashed my PCM and detailed my car... so far I'm pretty happy with these guys.

Nope my dealer did not replace my filter. :( I will be calling them again tomorrow for an oil change. I didn't even look at the oil and mileage when I brought it in last week. DOH! I will have them change it with 5-20 and also install my aluminum throttle pedal and red/black leather brake handle :)

Did your cars come from the same port (check the port sticker under the hood). Maybe its one dufus at one port.

So, are you guys with 'red oil in the intake tube all auto tranny guys? My manual tranny RX8's (116600) air filter is quite dry. I don't see where the Mazda tech guys could say where doctorr's 2 pounds of oil is within spec. Or how they could be suggesting you are dumping AT fluid in your car to fix a flooding issue when the dealers around here are handling flooding as a warranty issue.

Originally posted by islandsoon
So, are you guys with 'red oil in the intake tube all auto tranny guys? My manual tranny RX8's (116600) air filter is quite dry. I don't see where the Mazda tech guys could say where doctorr's 2 pounds of oil is within spec. Or how they could be suggesting you are dumping AT fluid in your car to fix a flooding issue when the dealers around here are handling flooding as a warranty issue.

No- I have a 6MT... not that it would matter- there should be no way for ATF to get into the airbox (even in an auto) through anything other than manual intervention.

Putting ATF in the intake when trying to start a flooded rotary was an old RX7 trick from what I've read- it would help "seal" the seals and build compression back up after too much fuel washed out the layer of oil between the seals and rotor housing (worst case of flooding). They quickly backed down from accusing me and think it was done at the port. I didn't hear back from the service mgr today regarding his conversations with MNAO on this topic, so I'll check tomorrow.

Might want to take a look at the latest TSB in TECH. Turns out the Repair Procedure "C" in the bulletin dated 3/11/04 dumps 20 cc s of oil into the intake manifold. Good bet they couldn't get your car started somewhere before you got the car and they did "C".

Interesting, except where they have you put the oil in the TSB isn't anywhere near the filter, it's engine side of the throttlebody pretty much just about where it gets to the engine intake.

Interesting TSB though...

Most of your Japanese cars that come over from Japan have their engines sprayed with a coating of COSMOLENE ( yellowish in color ) in order to protect it from salt-spray from the ocean and anything else that might come in contact with it.

This will burn-off in short order.
Otherwise, I hear that you can use a Zymol product called "Strick" to get it off. "Strick" works exceptionally well at this.

I have my car at the dealer now for this and several other problems. Anyone find a cause? Or is this one of the many mysteries fo the '8?

pcldletter:

Let us know what your dealer does/does not do in regards to the oil issue. I am curious if this is acutally getting back to Mazda as an "issue".

Dealer just called me. The oil in the filter "... is a normal occurance if you drive the car the way it was ment to be driven due to the fact that the oil is vented there."

The oil is vented into the airbox???

Am I missing something here??

Originally posted by huhsler
The oil is vented into the airbox???

Am I missing something here??

There is a vent hose from the top of the oil filler neck to the throttle body, which could theoretically allow oil to enter the intake tube and dribble down into the filter/airbox. I thought there was a check valve that should prevent this, but I could be wrong.

I showed DMENAC7 how the stupidly designed airbox opens up and found a light coating of dark oil on his filter as well.

Let me rephrase...

Oil is vented into the airbox...BY DESIGN ?

I detect the foul stench of Dealer BS!

...alternatively, if there isn't a check valve there and it IS by design, this sounds like a critically necessary mod is needed, eh?

Just worked on Canzoomer's car (moving coil packs around to find a flaky one). To do this the easiest way is to remove the intake rubber hose from the airbox to the throttle body. To remove that I had to take off the resonator on the side of the hose (so it would clear the strut tower brace). When I removed that plastic "box" I almost got soaked with the oil pouring out of it. It was about 1/3 full! It's easy to take off (one hose clamp). Check yours to see how much oil is in it. It obviously will detune it (it's a resonant chamber for noise control). The hose pleats were also holding pools of oil. I didn't look into the airbox. Throttle body was dry. BTW, his car has no screens on the intake right from the factory.

I think I found the cause of MY oil/filter problem....

I took it in for it's third oil change, and I heard the mechanics shouting in the shop - "How many jugs go in an RX-8?"

The disconcerting answer was shouted back - "Ity says here seven and a half!"

That kind of amount would come right out the filler kneck, but not before it had gushed into the filter. For me, the problem is solved!
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doc

Originally posted by pcldletter
Dealer just called me. The oil in the filter "... is a normal occurance if you drive the car the way it was ment to be driven due to the fact that the oil is vented there."

That's BS - I drive my car hard and I have no oil in the airbox at all...

I drive it hard as well and dropped in a green filter, the box and filter looked clean. I used to have a catch can for my 20g eclipse, but that was normal for that car, this car I'm not sure about! I'm still learning from rotarygod how this car works.

Is all that oil in the intake the new electroniclly mtered oil injection system? hahahah high tech stuff there....

I took my k&N filter off to check and I have a small coat of oil also

WTF

Well, I finally got my 8 to the dealer for the recall work at about 4,700 miles. I had a long talk to the "factory trained" technician. His theory is that "this only happens to you guys that change oil often" Basically he said that the if you pour oil in the filler neck too fast that some will get into the vent tube and run down hill into the accordion boot. He seemed quite confident in his theory until I mentioned that I first saw this before I ever added or changed the oil. The first time I looked at the intake (about 1,500 miles) was while I was waiting for the original oil to drain prior to re-filling it with fresh oil. I will test his theory at the 5k oil change by disconnecting the vent tube and running it into a small catch bottle to see how much new oil drains into it during the oil change.

Well after reading this thread, I promptly ran out to my garage and yanked the air filter.

There is no oil noticeable in the filter housing, there is a pink color on the engine side of the filter, but it evenly covered as if it was made that way.

My car has 2000 miles on it and was built 6/03

When I changed oil at 5K I disconnected the vent line from the filler neck to the accordion boot and put a can under it. The tube was bent downward slightly more than in it's stock position. Four quarts latter and the can and hose were bone dry. This time the accordion boot was also dry, but since I knew the oil change was almost here I was running about 1 quart lower than full for awhile. So far the car has been running fine and the air filter has never been completely soaked, just a small amount ever got to the filter. I'll keep checking every once in a while, but since this is not a huge amount of oil and the dealer now knows about it I'm not going to worry about it unless there are any drivability issues in the future.

I finally got around to checking the air filter element last Friday. I was thinking it could be soaked because the sump was overfilled when I bought up the car.

I found no trace of oil that shouldn't be there: the filter was pink on the top and white on the bottom.

I had intended to replace it, but it didn't look too dirty at ~10,500 miles. I think I'll wait until 15,000.

Has anyone learned why there is the oil in the airbox and whether it is a sign of any problems?

Also, is there an easy way to get to the air filter?

I replaced my air filter with a green filter at around 4000 miles. The air filter appeared to be clean, it was slightly pink on one side, thats about it though.

car made in dec 03.

WOW months of collected efforts and we basically have the same answer.......
we have no idea where the oil (not ATF) is comming from?!? oh... ok. :)

I have the same problem and would like to find out whats happening with this crap.

***IDEA*** I dont know if any Euro guys have this problems with their cars but ill bring my US spec to the dealer (actually its still there for the tranny....... FOR 4 MONTHS) and see what they think.... ill keep ya posted

actually i am "working" on this but just got on it in the past month and havent had much chance yet to do the actual work part. i could have some answer in the next coupl of weeks. stay tuned:)

As a follow-up, my problem was definitely from morons at the port flooding it and using ATF to get compression back. After cleaning it up several thousand miles ago, I haven't found a drop in the intake tract or on the filter- both bone dry.

Its Crankcasevent related. the ventilation is poor especially at high speeds. the oil in combination with the condense making the oil "foamy" , "milky" and "brown" after a while gets caught in so called oiltraps. the engine builds up pressure instead of venting causing the oil to stick in "oiltraps" and finally the intake. i think Mazda is working on a new ventilation. Of any of you guys
have had a fix from Mazda Please respond.