I have a greddy turbo kit installed but want to boost more psi (9 or 10 psi) im gonna buy bigger injectors but i talked to an RC injector specialist and said that instead of getting 4 550cc i can get 2 750 cc and put one of the 750cc closes to the port so it can shoot direct fuel to one of the rotary then set up the other 750 cc the same way with the other rotar. the other two stock injectors should even up with the 750cc that distributes fuel to each rotar. It is cheaper and seems like a good idea because it is receiving the same cc total to each rotar. but Idk if its risky.What do you guys think?

....What?

^ what he said. Lol i like how he said "ro-tar" Reminds me of one of my friends that said it like...roooowww--taaaar >>.

get 2 blue injectors from an AT rx8 and stick them in the P2 positions ...

And then an engine management system that can control them.

I got two matched 780cc injectors for you if you are interested.

sorry i typed it in a hurry i edited to explain better.

sorry i typed it in a hurry i edited to explain better.

sorry - makes even less sense now :lol:

I would direct you to the thread that explains the injector layout but some unsociable person removed the pictures LOL

lol. thats what he said and i called a rotary specialized and said that it would work. thats y i was jw.

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=150432&highlight=injector

that thread did have all the info you would need but not anymore - have a read anyway - if you want a good laugh .

Seriously - just fit the blue injectors like i said - you will get away with doing that without changing your engine management (i have done this) because they are only 20% bigger than stock . The larger injectors will definately need management so that is an extra cost .....

What management are you using ?

This what you were looking for? The links are just broken. Hardly sure that is an unsociable act.

http://www.rx8club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=138317&d=1241497509

oh i see. but i got emanage ultimate.

P1 is the bank of two. Secondaries are the inner most injectors of the bank of four and P2 are on the outside.


Now if someone could tell me how to differentiate the wires for the two secondaries from the colors on the wires, I would be greatly appretiative.

oh i see. but i got emanage ultimate.

ah - you have the emangle urinate . Not good .......

thanks gives a better picture of the injectors now.This what you were looking for? The links are just broken. Hardly sure that is an unsociable act.

http://www.rx8club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=138317&d=1241497509

They are buried under the UIM. The UIM is not difficult to remove the SECOND time you remove it. The first time is somewhat longer. I highly recommend leaving the two bolts/nuts holding the UIM to the Oil filler alone and taking them off as a unit. That saved me hours right there.

Dont touch the p1s unless you absolutely have to. Bank two is much easier to access.

To be honest, I still have no idea what you are trying to do, but if you get ahold of an int-x I seriously do have two 780cc injectors that I need to get rid of.

They are buried under the UIM. The UIM is not difficult to remove the SECOND time you remove it. The first time is somewhat longer. I highly recommend leaving the two bolts/nuts holding the UIM to the Oil filler alone and taking them off as a unit. That saved me hours right there.

Dont touch the p1s unless you absolutely have to. Bank two is much easier to access.

To be honest, I still have no idea what you are trying to do, but if you get ahold of an int-x I seriously do have two 780cc injectors that I need to get rid of.

ohh now i understand wat your saying.thanks.

no im not trying to remove my p1 injectors. but that was an option that the RC specialist gave me but i wasnt too sure wat he was talking about. yeah im trying to but pretty expensive.lol

but thanks for the injector offer but im gonna have it running how i have it for now until i get money :lol:.

ah - you have the emangle urinate . Not good .......

oh really dang. y is that.

Seriously - just fit the blue injectors like i said - you will get away with doing that without changing your engine management (i have done this) because they are only 20% bigger than stock .

Wow. That is some seriously bad advice.
Why would you say something so misleading?

oh really dang. y is that.

Because Emanage is horrible and will probably result in you blowing your engine.

Because Emanage is horrible and will probably result in you blowing your engine.

I wouldn't go that far. The E-Manage can go quite a long way.
Its just not really up to the task of handling the elevated power levels that almost everyone goes for as soon as the GReddy kit is fitted to their car.

so what is the next suggestion for injectors if i choose something other than AT blues(these are good to about what hp?) for FI above 350hp. The cheaper the better I was looking yesterday and it seemed most places wanted +$200 for a set but there were a few at a fraction of the cost why?

Are the blue injectors enough for the BNR upgraded turbo or should I just go with 650s? There isnt much info with the BNR turbo yet so Im not sure which to go for. Im only looking to be around 310-320whp. BNR said their turbo should be able to flow enough for 360whp so 320 should be easily obtainable. I just dont want to go to big on injectors cause then they get hard to dial in.

Big injectors are easy to dial in with the AccessPORT.
I run 850cc in my P2s.

Big injectors are easy to dial in with the AccessPORT.
I run 850cc in my P2s.


Ok so here's a direct easy answer question.

What size, brand, and where should I get injectors for a BNR 60-1/greddy turbo should I get?

I'm not getting much information when I search for rx8 injectors:uhh:

just a FYI...I am trying out this service...getting the P2 injectors modded to flow 720cc for 25 bucks an injector
http://kgparts.com/index.php?page=rx8modinject

I'm sure some people will think it's a bad idea...but I thought why not for $50? I will let everyone know how it goes.

btw my hands are pissed at me after removing the injectors, lol...
tight spots in engine bay=cut and bloody hands FTL

Big injectors are easy to dial in with the AccessPORT.
I run 850cc in my P2s.

Hey, as long as you dont have a problem dialing them in, Im good since youre doing the tuning! I think for now, Im going to go with the blues in the P2 for the time being. We had to take a 15% paycut at my job so Im having to budget what I can. Hoping my Cobb gets here soon so I can have to some time to get used to it before I get everything ready to send to you.

Hey, as long as you dont have a problem dialing them in, Im good since youre doing the tuning! I think for now, Im going to go with the blues in the P2 for the time being. We had to take a 15% paycut at my job so Im having to budget what I can. Hoping my Cobb gets here soon so I can have to some time to get used to it before I get everything ready to send to you.
if money is an issue look at my post about the kg parts upgrade...you really don't want to have to change the injectors too frequently, it's a project to get to them

if money is an issue look at my post about the kg parts upgrade...you really don't want to have to change the injectors too frequently, it's a project to get to them

Ya, they have an ad on eBay that I had checked out last night. Ive heard ups and downs of "reworking" stock injectors. I think Ill just stick with my original plan of the blues until I feel like I need to go to the next level with the 650s. But for sure write a report on how your injectors work out. If they work like they should, I might just go that route.

KG parts has a good rep and has been doing this with subies for years. I feel confident and I will report my findings for sure! :)

oh and I would go for the 720cc over the 650cc

I saw that site where they rework your yellows. I dont see how it would be an issue as long as they are reputable, bench them, and match them, particularly in the p2 or secondary (late staged) position.

I have a set of four yellows, but went with 650s. Maybe if I ever run up to the mid 80% duty cycles, I will get them bored out and switch back.

BTW, getting to the injectors is NOT a hard thing to do the SECOND time you do it. You just have to go through the pain the first time. You learn the tricks pretty quick.

^oh I've taken my uim off many times....I guess it's just more of a nuisance if anything

I gotta wonder if the latencies would be identical to stock once they are reworked? Could you ask them thisquestion if you dont already know?

good question, let me find out

here we go:
http://injector-rehab.com/kbse/lag.htm

Thanks.

I also am curious if you got a cold-side upgrade. Sorry but I havent been following.

AND FINALLY! If you still have your injectors off and your injector connectors labeled, could you check and see what the wire colors are on center two (p2) injector connector wires? I cant figure it from the wiring diagram

Thanks.

I also am curious if you got a cold-side upgrade. Sorry but I havent been following.

AND FINALLY! If you still have your injectors off and your injector connectors labeled, could you check and see what the wire colors are on center two (p2) injector connector wires? I cant figure it from the wiring diagram
I got this upgrade:
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=168057

and yes I just sent my injectors out to be serviced so I can check the wire colors.

Here we go Carbon

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg119/jonathanwells81/DSC01891.jpg
blue/white goes to the 2nd injector; green/white goes to the 3rd injector

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg119/jonathanwells81/DSC01892.jpg
you can see what harness it comes off of in this pic

and for fun...my current engine bay. so sad.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg119/jonathanwells81/DSC01893.jpg
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg119/jonathanwells81/DSC01894.jpg

Wow. That is some seriously bad advice.
Why would you say something so misleading?

how about because I actually have tried it and it worked fine - reduced my duty cycle on the secondaries from 100% down to 95% without changing anything with the management .

what didn't you like about that suggestion ?

isn't 95% duty cycle still too high?

yes - but better than 100 .....

wow, I didn't want to go above 85% as that's already pushing it

perhaps that is why MM spazzed - heh

blue/white goes to the 2nd injector; green/white goes to the 3rd injector




Thanks man. That is GREAT help.

Heading home from vacation. Had to send my injectors off to get machined (Brice from Fluid helped me out). Hopefully they are back and I can get them in and running before the weekend.

how about because I actually have tried it and it worked fine - reduced my duty cycle on the secondaries from 100% down to 95% without changing anything with the management .


Wanna explain how that happened (other than LTFT)?
When those P2s are firing, you are in open loop, so the PCM has no idea that they are 20% bigger and it will run stupid rich.
That you managed to get enough LTFT to mitigate that fact is merely a random result of your particular driving style.
For everyone else, following your advice will result in a TON of extra fuel at 6200 RPM and nothing else.

Wanna explain how that happened (other than LTFT)?
When those P2s are firing, you are in open loop, so the PCM has no idea that they are 20% bigger and it will run stupid rich.
That you managed to get enough LTFT to mitigate that fact is merely a random result of your particular driving style.
For everyone else, following your advice will result in a TON of extra fuel at 6200 RPM and nothing else.

Sure . I put in the Blues , retuned the the afrs to achieve mid 11s right across the board and after doing that noticed my duty cycles had reduced ....

The effect on fueling is less than what you descibe BTW .

Total capacity stock = 2080
Total capacity after adding Blues = 2280

Extra capacity = 9%

Hardly enough to strangle your engine .....

Sure . I put in the Blues , retuned the the afrs to achieve mid 11s right across the board and after doing that noticed my duty cycles had reduced ....

OK. Now what is wrong with this statement in the context of this thread?








oh i see. but i got emanage ultimate.

OK. Now what is wrong with this statement in the context of this thread?

Yeah OK - I guess I assumed that anyone clever enough to put new injectors in would know to retune the AFRs ... My bad
I thought you were refering to the need to RESCALE the injectors . Something I don't think is totally necessary for injectors only slightly bigger than stock ....

Yeah OK - I guess I assumed that anyone clever enough to put new injectors in would know to retune the AFRs ... My bad
I thought you were refering to the need to RESCALE the injectors . Something I don't think is totally necessary for injectors only slightly bigger than stock ....

Well, you are rescaling the injectors, technically.
You picked a new AFR target that responded with the desired AFR.
Bet the commanded value isn't the same as the resultant value.
In the case of the e-Manage, you can change the injectors scaling by 20%, but you would need to know how and I'm pretty certain the OP has no idea.

My modified injectors from KG Parts are being shipped back. It was only 1 day turnaround time. The results of the modification was better than expected. I was looking to get 720cc, but after modification and cleaning they are rated at 820cc. Not bad for $50. Attached is the pdf file that shows the injector flow.

will the AT blue injectors do the job to break 300 whp? i can probable get these for a killer price anybody know the part number for the injectors?

Yep - they sure will , with room to spare . I'm at around 320+ now and still have room to move ...

will the AT blue injectors do the job to break 300 whp? i can probable get these for a killer price anybody know the part number for the injectors?

I got mine on eBay for $100. Some people that part cars out are catching on that the blue injectors are being used in 6speed turbo applications so the prices are on the rise. There was a couple on there the other day, think they were $120.

since i work at mazda i want to see what my cost is...thats why i was looking for the part number

so you just replace the P2 injectors with the blue ones ?
need a PCM recal ?

why not changing all the 6 with more powerfull injectors ?

Unless you are boosted, you dont need larger injectors.

As for the primaries, they are used for idle and cruise. So why add bigger injectors just to idle? The secondaries and P2s are used in boost. P1s are not, iirc.

You'll also complicate tunning for no good reason. From what I understand you don't need anything bigger unless you plan on going above 300 whp so why complicate things when a set of blues will be more than sufficient

If you guys are referring to flash tuning, than be aware that the latency is different for the blues yet there is only one data entry point for latency aside from the primaries on the 6 port engine. You want to have the same latency for all four injectors in this bank.

/\ please elaborate . I've been running the blues for a year now without issue .
What diference in latency is there between the yellows and the blues ?

What diference in latency is there between the yellows and the blues ?

The "blues" have about .7ms lag (at nominal BARO and voltage) compared to the "yellows".

/\ got any idea what kind of issues you might see with this ?

/\ got any idea what kind of issues you might see with this ?

Relatively unstable fuel delivery with output values lagging behind commanded values anywhere from 1% - 5% in a fairly unpredictable fashion.

For most people, it will simply be a tuning variation that will be exacerbated by BARO and battery condition.
If you are only shooting for a 1/2 point of AFR here and there, it probably wont be a problem, but it will make you wonder why your tune "wanders"

/\ please elaborate . I've been running the blues for a year now without issue .
What diference in latency is there between the yellows and the blues ?

fail.

i made it almost a month! ;)

beers :beer:

ok, so if I want...adding like a 650cc...wich ones should I change : the P1? P2 ? or auxilary

in fact I have 330whp.... and I want more...so if I have to change all 6, I do not care !

fail.

i made it almost a month! ;)

beers :beer:

:banghead:

ok, so if I want...adding like a 650cc...wich ones should I change : the P1? P2 ? or auxilary

in fact I have 330whp.... and I want more...so if I have to change all 6, I do not care !

There is a thread around here where someone just modified their yellows and got 800cc - o5rex8 I think . Put those in the P2 position and you should be sweet .

Also : where is your dyno ?

^^i just purchased those fuel injectors from 05rex8 hopefully i will be installing them at the beggining of the year

/\ how come he did not use them ?

has anyone actually used the injectors from KG Parts? I need to get some upgraded injectors and really don't want to have to tear off the upper intake more then 1 more time. Does anyone have a suggestion of where to get them now that MM has stopped shipping them?

Its not that I'm not shipping them, but I have a looooooong list of purchasers who never returned their cores.
So, I've run out until those people start sending back their old injectors.

ebay ?
where can I found the blue injectors, I'll first replace my auxiliary's with those ones.

Its not that I'm not shipping them, but I have a looooooong list of purchasers who never returned their cores.
So, I've run out until those people start sending back their old injectors.
Send my AP out and mine are all yours.

MM I have mine out of the car already, if i send them to you can you send them back with the accesport?

Its not that I'm not shipping them, but I have a looooooong list of purchasers who never returned their cores.
So, I've run out until those people start sending back their old injectors.

MM,

I sent you back my old fuel injectors back in July and still have not received my core charge refund! I even sent you a tracking number.....

Please check your emails!

/\ how come he did not use them ?
I have some others
those were a back up set