For those of you who busted your engines and need it replaced were you using synthetic or non-synthetic motor oil?

Blends will be considered non-synthetic here as most 5w-20 oils are blends.

What relevance does synthetic or non-synthetic oils have to do with busted Renesii?

fucking close this shit already

What relevance does synthetic or non-synthetic oils have to do with busted Renesii?


Mazda requires the use of non-synthetic in the renesis.
Also of note is a TSB from Mazda showing a busted renesis from synthetic use.

Uhh yeah if its in the mazda hand book to use non-synth then thats what I'll go with.

MC requires the use of non-synthetic in the renesis.
Also of note is a TSB from MC showing a busted renesis from synthetic use.

Yeah, but who knows how that engine was treated

MC requires the use of non-synthetic in the renesis.
Also of note is a TSB from MC showing a busted renesis from synthetic use.

prove anything you say. mc hammer? mc what... this is the same bullshit again...

beers :beer:

MC=Mazda Corporation

ITs just pretty sad that people cant type these days. Im having my MC donalds Premium Roast Coffee right now

the picture on the TSB was due to BABYING THE ENGINE, NOT BECAUSE OF SYNTHETIC OIL. Its a known problem, theres no solution to it unless you rev it up every so often, and it HAS NOTHING to do with Synthetic oil

Its already wrong to inject Engine oil into the combustion chambers already, Mazda has no choice tho, because its easy for people to understand and get.

Good god, I dont know anything about Rotary engine before, but come on people, dont open your mouth blah blah blah when you dont know jack about what excatly is going on.

As far as I know(read), people with Dead engine mostly are people :

Baby their engine who never rev their engine
AT cars with 1 oil cooler

And I believe 5w20 is another cause. NO one else on earth has this recall, what does that mean ?

Close this crap already

ITs just pretty sad that people cant type these days. Im having my MC donalds Premium Roast Coffee right now

the picture on the TSB was due to BABYING THE ENGINE, NOT BECAUSE OF SYNTHETIC OIL. Its a known problem, theres no solution to it unless you rev it up every so often, and it HAS NOTHING to do with Synthetic oil

Its already wrong to inject Engine oil into the combustion chambers already, Mazda has no choice tho, because its easy for people to understand and get.

Good god, I dont know anything about Rotary engine before, but come on people, dont open your mouth blah blah blah when you dont know jack about what excatly is going on.

As far as I know(read), people with Dead engine mostly are people :

Baby their engine who never rev their engine
AT cars with 1 oil cooler



And I believe 5w20 is another cause. NO one else on earth has this recall, what does that mean ?

Close this crap already


I always find it amusing that rednecks think they know more about the renesis than japanese engineers. The TSB clearly states synthetic is the issue. Not revving enough may be an issue, but the TSB makes no mention of it.

My engine was changed at 13,000 miles about a year ago. Oil changes were performed by my Mazda dealer. For topping it off, I used Castrol GTX. At that milage, it wasn't due to the oil.

Because they CANNOT *Recommend* people to rev their engines, cuz it might rinse alot of legal issues.

Its always easier to blame on one thing than to test everything on the market. Someone point a good example of why Harley Davidson said no to Synthetic oil for a long time without anything to back themself up. and recently (couple years ago) all of the sudden they *recommmend* Synthetic. Why ? cuz therese enough users out there use Synthetic oil with excellent results.

My engine was changed at 13,000 miles about a year ago. Oil changes were performed by my Mazda dealer. For topping it off, I used Castrol GTX. At that milage, it wasn't due to the oil.

Thank you.

and what I've read so *far*, most of the FAILED engines only use *semi synthetic or Mineral oil* only. there are hardly anybody who said *I use Synthetic and my engine is fuxked*

Does that mean Semi / Mineral is bad? Of course NOT !

Many many MANY of those crying *synthetic are bad babies* have nothing to Proof but that tiny little picture of Mazda's TSB. and just ignored tons of users out there use Synthetic for years with lower engine/oil temp, longer life and so on.

and I find really funny that people like you, would add whatever to the engine bay when Mazda does not recommend them.

Like I said, again and again, I believe that it has to do with, mostly with 5w20 and people baby their engines.

5w30 people has no engine recall.

SYnthetic or not, its your choice, but I really dont get why people just want to blame on something when most of the people have excellent results with it.

TCdiesel, should've searched, seen this comming from a mile away.

Don't get me wrong. I've always used synthetic in my pistons because it is a superior lubricant and I want to use it for my rotary. Most people who own the renesis are car enthusiasts and want the best for their engines so they last a long time. Hopefully, this poll will give us some statistical evidence on the issue.

and Also , I want to say that Mazda is really stupid about this one.

Idemitsu has been selling *Rotary safe* oil for a long time, its Synthetic AND they co-devolpe it with Mazda AND they won Le mans 24 with it AND they even said it on their site that it results in less wear and improve heat transfer.

If what Mazda said is true (Synthetic will result in Carbon Build up), that means Idemitsu is Lying ! (So does RP, but get to that later). and they should sue them for false Advertizing !!!

but if they SUE them, that means they're complete bullshit in *co-devolop* with them to create those oil. How does a company created some oil thats going to harm their own engines? and people who use them might be able to Sue Mazda and idemitsu base on this. which is going to raise some MORe legal issues.

Mazda is crying wolf, so they can say *no free replacements* to more dead engines

simply changing it to 5w30 should be able to solve most of the lube problems. but another sad part is that they gotta listen to Ford, at least in North America market.

and Also , I want to say that Mazda is really stupid about this one.

Idemitsu has been selling *Rotary safe* oil for a long time, its Synthetic AND they co-devolpe it with Mazda AND they won Le mans 24 with it AND they even said it on their site that it results in less wear and improve heat transfer.

If what Mazda said is true (Synthetic will result in Carbon Build up), that means Idemitsu is Lying ! (So does RP, but get to that later). and they should sue them for false Advertizing !!!

but if they SUE them, that means they're complete bullshit in *co-devolop* with them to create those oil. How does a company created some oil thats going to harm their own engines? and people who use them might be able to Sue Mazda and idemitsu base on this. which is going to raise some MORe legal issues.

Mazda is crying wolf, so they can say *no free replacements* to more dead engines

simply changing it to 5w30 should be able to solve most of the lube problems. but another sad part is that they gotta listen to Ford, at least in North America market.

Amen brothah! preach on yo' bad self ! hehe

I agree with everything you said. after 14K miles on the car i switched over to syn-oil and everything has been great. i have over 32K now.

Don't get me wrong. I've always used synthetic in my pistons because it is a superior lubricant and I want to use it for my rotary. Most people who own the renesis are car enthusiasts and want the best for their engines so they last a long time. Hopefully, this poll will give us some statistical evidence on the issue.

Search rotarygod's posts.

/thread

Don't get me wrong. I've always used synthetic in my pistons because it is a superior lubricant and I want to use it for my rotary. Most people who own the renesis are car enthusiasts and want the best for their engines so they last a long time. Hopefully, this poll will give us some statistical evidence on the issue.First off, you simply need to do your research and follow the research of others who are more experienced in this field. Mazda legal team has spoke and just threw a "no synthetic" rule out there for consumers. Mazda's technical people have spoke and said synthetics are fine, some recommended, and they even listed which ones they liked. If you try to point synthetics as the cause of carbon buildup just know its inherent to the engine and the same happes with conventional oil. Search.

Also your very simple poll of synthetic or non-synthetic as the basis of an engine failure is certainly cutting it dry. Are you accounting for other variables in your "statistical evidence"? Because you will need to know a lot more than what type of oil that person used.

I will also point out that another member here has used RP for 30k out of 32k miles and their recall inspection has passed with flying colors. Synthetic what?

This thread needs to be locked. We already have 4984651321498465161 threads on the same subject.

I will also point out that another member here has used RP for 30k out of 32k miles and their recall inspection has passed with flying colors. Synthetic what?

This thread needs to be locked. We already have 4984651321498465161 threads on the same subject.

My brother had a Toyota for which he never changed the oil. It was running fine at 30K miles. The engine did not blow until a bit past 70K.

Why do people have such strong objections to this poll? If synthetic oil isn't a problem, then the results from this one and the parallel overall synth/dino should come out the same. And it will certainly be more convenient than wading through all the "I've used synthetics for the past 10 miles and my car is running fine" posts.

If there's another poll for the same topic, then this one should be nuked. But if there's not, then calls to close it smack of "I've made up my mind, don't ask questions."

Ken

Actually I would like to see more then 5 votes from legitimate sources.

My motor is still in fine condition at 8,000 miles. Hopefully it still will be at 80,000.

I doubt that synthetics will really cause any harm but I don't want to be the test mule to find out either. Personally I don't mind changing oil every 2-3000 miles it's very easy to do on the RX8.

My brother had a Toyota for which he never changed the oil. It was running fine at 30K miles. The engine did not blow until a bit past 70K.

Why do people have such strong objections to this poll? If synthetic oil isn't a problem, then the results from this one and the parallel overall synth/dino should come out the same. And it will certainly be more convenient than wading through all the "I've used synthetics for the past 10 miles and my car is running fine" posts.

If there's another poll for the same topic, then this one should be nuked. But if there's not, then calls to close it smack of "I've made up my mind, don't ask questions."

KenBecause this topic is like going to the grave of Repeat the Horse, digging him up just to beat his rotten corpse.

It is also really annoying when people come in and post on a subject that they have not researched and speak as if their opinion is fact. Ignore the research that other companies/individuals, including Mazda, has done supporting synthetic. Maybe I am just really PMS'ing today.

turbodesiel,

where in europe do you live?

beers:beer:

Amen brothah! preach on yo' bad self ! hehe

I agree with everything you said. after 14K miles on the car i switched over to syn-oil and everything has been great. i have over 32K now.


thx :)

I mean seriously, sooner or later someone who is greedy enough would sue Idemitsu for it, then if they're found guity, the person would sue Mazda afterwards, because Mazda was the one who *co-develop* Idemitsu's oil and gave Idemitsu an *OK* in their OWN rotary powered car.

Mazda, its time to wake up and stop crying wolf. Synthetic is not bad. Or else you're going to feel sorry when the *shit* really happens. :bootyshak

well i've run synthetic in my car since 200 miles and no problems yet 52,000 miles later...

According to those crying babies, your engine might blow as soon as you reach 52001 miles !!!!!!!

Hey, you never know !

According to those crying babies, your engine might blow as soon as you reach 52001 miles !!!!!!!

Hey, you never know !

good cause i don't plan on doing the recall anytime soon. and since i moved tince in the last month i have yet to get my recall letter, so i can play the ignorance card

Well, but if you're on 50K ish miles, you might want to do the recall first before your extended warranty runs out. Just to be safe, ya kwow my man ~

Hey guys. I am a conventional oil user and my engine blew? Could it be because I mentioned using synthetic sometime in the future?

Yes, you're right. because you betray the Non-Synthetic Empire, your engine has been cursed.

So does your future engines. Theres no forgiveness !!!! Until you get rid of Synthetic oil in your mind !

Hey guys. I am a conventional oil user and my engine blew? Could it be because I mentioned using synthetic sometime in the future?
ahahahaha, your engine got scared?

I think so Blue. Everytime I say "Synthetic", the engine starts to sputter then dies.

So does your future engines. Theres no forgiveness !!!! Until you get rid of Synthetic oil in your mind !Hmmm, you think Mazda will perform a vaccum test on my brain? I have been thinking synthetic for 15k miles now. Will they be able to see that I have synthetic on my mind? In the early and sometimes late hours I find that I have powerloss.

I think so Blue. Everytime I say "Synthetic", the engine starts to sputter then dies.


oh SNAP!

Mazda requires the use of non-synthetic in the renesis.
Also of note is a TSB from Mazda showing a busted renesis from synthetic use.

Yeah that's Mazda's excuse for not tunning the car properly.

Well, Mazda created a great design You guys gotta admit that, we cant really blame them for the tunning because NA is a *special* stupid Ford owned market, no engine recall for the rest of the world besdies NA so you know ....

but yeah .... it took Mazda how many years to tune protege ......

I think so Blue. Everytime I say "Synthetic", the engine starts to sputter then dies.

Hmmm, you think Mazda will perform a vaccum test on my brain? I have been thinking synthetic for 15k miles now. Will they be able to see that I have synthetic on my mind? In the early and sometimes late hours I find that I have powerloss.

Didnt you know that theres a mind reading machine in every rx8 out there? they cannot read anything else but the word *Synthetic* in your brain. They decode them and send it over to Mazda's HQ by Lasers for processing.Then their HQ will return an encrypted code using sucky AES to the ECU so it will turn into limp mode. :angel: :angel: :angel:

Why do people have such strong objections to this poll? If synthetic oil isn't a problem, then the results from this one and the parallel overall synth/dino should come out the same. And it will certainly be more convenient than wading through all the "I've used synthetics for the past 10 miles and my car is running fine" posts.

If there's another poll for the same topic, then this one should be nuked. But if there's not, then calls to close it smack of "I've made up my mind, don't ask questions."

Ken
Agree 100%. Didn't find an obvious duplicate of this poll, and it is worth seeing the results. It should make it pretty easy to say Mazda is making synth. oil a scapegoat.

Yeah that's Mazda's excuse for not tunning the car properly.


the tsb is for europe.. not the usa... and the epa is the scapegoat for mazda tuning... or mazdas fault for trying to extend cat life...

beers :beer:

the tsb is for europe.. not the usa... and the epa is the scapegoat for mazda tuning... or mazdas fault for trying to extend cat life...

beers :beer:


what's the epa... don't flame me you assholes.

what's the epa... don't flame me you assholes.

search bitch!

enviromental protection agency...

the guys that give us cats...

beers :beer:

turbodesiel,

where in europe do you live?

beers:beer:

and is this thing on??? country in europe??? give us a clue...

please help us here... we dont have a clue.

beers :beer:

I've had 2 engines replaced, used only mineral oil.
Synthetic oil is definitely NOT the problem.

Thank you

Its just sad that those crying babies would never listen no matter how many proof we shown them. They just gonna listen to what Mazda's lawyers said.

I've had 2 engines replaced, used only mineral oil.
Synthetic oil is definitely NOT the problem.:SHOCKED: No way! Someone must have paid you to say that or you must have thought synthetic and your engine exploded. Either way synthetic was the cause.

:SHOCKED: No way! Someone must have paid you to say that or you must have thought synthetic and your engine exploded. Either way synthetic was the cause.

My 8's engine, actually the whole drivetrain will soon self-destruct because I've been feeding her Synthetic Oil since 1000 miles !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now maybe I should start writing my Will ... After my 8 blow up and kill me, I would love to it the reminds of it to my brother .... but remember do NOT put Synthetic or Think of it or else you have to write another will brother ..... :angel:


But seriously, what happen to all those anti-synthetic crying babies, they never show up when you need them.

I think syn / dino oil debate threads s/b banned...
It's like talking about religion or politics here - sheesh!

This poll is interesting and useful - and it's NOT a syn / dino debate. The syn oil folks here who are up in arms over this should be in favor of keeping it open becuase so far from the results, there's clearly no correlation between the type of oil used and engine failure.

the point is that, so far, its about the same AND we're not even sure if some of the *dino* lover or *Synthetic* lover actually vote the opposite just to make the other side look bad.

this thread is completely stupid in the first place. IT has been PROVEN that Synthetic does not cause problems, the problem is with the gas we put in, and people who baby their freaking engine. but no matter what, crying babies will just listen to whatever they love to hear(Dino oil), and ignore all other facts, and would not listen to Stuff that they dont like(for example Mazda does not recommend Aftermarket parts, but Dino babies still put them in, wtf is that)

search bitch!

enviromental protection agency...

the guys that give us cats...

beers :beer:

You cockbag you had to flame me anyway huh! haha!

But seriously, what happen to all those anti-synthetic crying babies, they never show up when you need them.

here i am. actually mentioned this to brillo awhile ago in a conversation. re reading some of the recall documents Ive come to a different understanding of some of the syntax used.

first- Mazda is concerned about the extra buildup left over when burnign some synths. its not lawyer talk its fact- some synths leave deposits when burned that in combination with the carbon buildup causes issues. this buildup can cause engine problems. just the few reports we've had here of carboned up APVs should be enough for anyone to believe it.

but the part im understanding the recall has to do with the emissions part of the recall. i believe that one thing they are worried about is the deposits leaving the engine then burning in the CAT. this material burns at a high temp causing over heating of the CATs and excellerating the premature failure.

this is only a theory of mine with no proof yet other than some wording in the recall documents that suggested it to me. i have of course emailed Mazda for some information. They seemed to be "receptive" to the idea of some technical answers, so we'll see what they say.

I believe the problem is within the stuff that oil companies added to their oil. and those are the stuff that causes problems. Since to be Synthetic you have to be at least Group IV or V, and those are known to be more *pure* than the regular oil.

but my question is, some oil companies put the excat same thing to their Mineral lineup, and what Im thinking is that, everyone for some reason pay special attention to Synthetic oils. but what about non-synthetic ones with the same addons ?

There are alot of failed engines eats nothing but Mineral oils for their life, still have carbon and stuff. but no one really look into that.

dont get me wrong- its definetly an additive or combination of additives that are being looked at. or rather the deposits left after those additives have been through a combustion cycle. i was told earlier this year that Mazda was having the dealerships send in oil samples of what the service center usually buys in order for MNAO to "approve" its use or not. maybe not all but definetly some were doing so. And yes mazda is looking at all the variations as of course it is not THE determining factor. but it is/was a factor that keeps/kept coming up so they had to address it.

Had there not been such a debate of good/bad of synthetic for the renesis, I'd be using synthetic oil. However, I use regular oil that the dealer puts in (free oil changes for life) and top off with Castrol GTX. I think it would be interesting to know if they have determined what additives may be the cause of the problem. My family has always used synthetic in their regular piston engines without problems but I'm the only one with a rotary so I don't have much frame of reference. It'd also be interesting to know if there is a significant difference in how the oil burns compared to in a regular engine based on the design that would make it more likely to be a problem in a rotary versus piston. :dunno:

What do you use zoom?

To expand on that point, as RG has talked about, most do not see the difference in that they are both the same. It's just that Mineral Oil is something that is naturally created and Synthetic is something that is artificially created as but is still natural. The thing to watch out for, in any oil, is how it is formulated. This gets into alot of technical speak so just read RG's post:

Any time we get something in the final product that we don't want, we call it an impurity. In oils we may have compounds that we refer to as aromatics as well as some other things that get into the base oil. How well these aromatics are filtered out determines what grade of base stock we have in motor oil. Group I oils have the most contaminants. Up to 10% of the total base stock! Group II oils have a little more distillation (refining) done to bring these contaminants down somewhat. Up to this point we all still agree that we have conventional "dino" oil.

A Group III oil will take the refining process one step farther through a process called hydrocracking. This is whee we go back to the chemistry equation balancing act from above. Through the introduction of hydrogen (hence the "hydro" in hydrocracking)into the mix under high temperatures and pressures, the hydrogen molecules add themselves to the aromatics (contaminants) to completely change their molecular structure into somethig else. The end result is naphtenes and alkines. A chain of napthenes is called paraffins but through the hydrocracking process the aromatics are gone. This is a good thing. Through a simple chemistry formula balancing act in the real world we have taken something we didn't want and rearranged it with some outside help into something we did want. This process is not naturally occurring and therefore "synthetic". This is what makes a synthetic what it is. It may still be from a "dino" based oil. The end product is still something natural. It was the way we got it that wasn't.

Now to move on to the Group IV and V synthetic oils. Their base stocks are different. Sort of. Group IV base stocks are called Poly Alpha Olefins. Remember how I mentioned alkenes above? An Alpha Olefin is an alkene where the carbon-carbon double bond is between the #1 and #2 carbons in the molecule. Again, it's just a process to create this but the original product was all natural! A poly-alpha-olefin takes this one step farther and is nothing mroe than a polymer made by polymerizing an alpha olefin. This is a Group IV base stock. It was a base stock that made an natural end product through unnatural processes. Group V oils may use different substances as a base stock but still arive towards the same end result which is something natural through an unnatural process.

Now just to throw a little bit of conspiracy into things let get into a human equivalent of the synthetic oil. Lets say a woman wants to have a baby but for some reason the husband's troops are awol. They decide to use artifical insemination. A doctor goes in and fertilizes the egg in a way that is not natural (or fun!). 9 months later they have a baby. Do we consider the baby a synthetic human? Nope. We consider the conception artifical but we don't call the final product artifical. Synthetic oils are a process but the end result is all natural. Their advantages are that we can go in and get rid of or convert what we don't want into something better. In regards to the baby comparison just think of it as gene manipulation to create a smarter human. The bad sides of synthetics have been during the formulation stages early on where some compounds were allowed to exist that didn't do rubber parts any good. This was easily taken care of. The carbon buildup issues have nothing to do with the base stock but rather with what is added to it by each oil manufacturer. This is the additive package.
http://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php?p=1529314&postcount=322

i use the stuff the dealer puts in adn i top off with whatever is on sale at freddies. usual castrol i think. or valvoline

I got a case of Castrol GTX a few months ago because it was on a really good sale (price per bottle this way ended up being around half the price than if I were to buy one at a time) and I've heard it was good quality.

and Also , I want to say that Mazda is really stupid about this one.

Idemitsu has been selling *Rotary safe* oil for a long time, its Synthetic AND they co-devolpe it with Mazda AND they won Le mans 24 with it AND they even said it on their site that it results in less wear and improve heat transfer.

If what Mazda said is true (Synthetic will result in Carbon Build up), that means Idemitsu is Lying ! (So does RP, but get to that later). and they should sue them for false Advertizing !!!



hmmm...I don't see you are really supporting your point here... I am not against synthetics nor I'm in favor.
First of all, you can't mention Idemitsu oil and Le mans 24 in your argument. Oviously Idemitsu is a racing oil. Furthermore, the conditions that Idemitsu bases their results are much different than the use through "ordinary driving"... Le mans is a 24 hour endurance race. High engine stress for a long period of time.

If people want to use synthetics, I'm fine with it. If they want to use mineral or semi-synthetic, I'm fine with it too. ONLY TIME WILL TELL.
PLEASE CLOSE THIS THREAD> NOT ANOTHER SYNTHETIC DISCUSSION PLEASE

You cockbag you had to flame me anyway huh! haha!


it was totaly in jest.. i forgot the smiley...

cockbag.. have not heard that for awhile.

beers :beer:

here i am. actually mentioned this to brillo awhile ago in a conversation. re reading some of the recall documents Ive come to a different understanding of some of the syntax used.

first- Mazda is concerned about the extra buildup left over when burnign some synths. its not lawyer talk its fact- some synths leave deposits when burned that in combination with the carbon buildup causes issues. this buildup can cause engine problems. just the few reports we've had here of carboned up APVs should be enough for anyone to believe it.

but the part im understanding the recall has to do with the emissions part of the recall. i believe that one thing they are worried about is the deposits leaving the engine then burning in the CAT. this material burns at a high temp causing over heating of the CATs and excellerating the premature failure.

this is only a theory of mine with no proof yet other than some wording in the recall documents that suggested it to me. i have of course emailed Mazda for some information. They seemed to be "receptive" to the idea of some technical answers, so we'll see what they say.


the part i would like to understand is why on some cars the cat fails and other the apex seals dry out under certian conditions.... but rarely does a car have both problems.

beer :beer:

Hmmmm......That would be pretty interesting to determine why that is. If it's the same kind of situation that causes both things to happen, sounds like random chance as to what you end up with. :dunno:

I take mine in tomorrow afternoon to drop off for the recall. Now, if I can figure out how to squeeze in about 300 miles of driving tonight I'll be due for an oil change too. LOL

What I dont understand is why people use synthetic in the first place. If you change your oil as per recomendations, its just a waste of money. But if it is a preference of yours to use synthetic because you think it will protect better, go ahead...I dont think Mazda would say synthetic could be an issue just to cover their ass. They are not denying engine claims as a result of someone using synthetic, they are just saying they have seen issues associated with the use of synthetic.

I got a case of Castrol GTX a few months ago because it was on a really good sale (price per bottle this way ended up being around half the price than if I were to buy one at a time) and I've heard it was good quality.
wow, this is the first time I have read a post of yours and it somewhat made sense! Congradulations!

Blue you need to back off the BunnyGirl stuff. You make comments in threads she isnt even in. even your compliments are back handed and rude. just cut it out already

You get him Zoom :smiley_12

What I dont understand is why people use synthetic in the first place. If you change your oil as per recomendations, its just a waste of money. But if it is a preference of yours to use synthetic because you think it will protect better, go ahead...I dont think Mazda would say synthetic could be an issue just to cover their ass. They are not denying engine claims as a result of someone using synthetic, they are just saying they have seen issues associated with the use of synthetic.

Because it does protect better. No need to deny it because it has been proven. Lower Engine temp. is the biggest prove.

People are crying because Mazda "does not recommended it" years years YEARS before that TSB show up.

Actually they go against it back when 20 something 30 years ago that the OLD FORMULA SYNTEHTIC OIL melt the rubber o rings. What are we now ? 2006 ?

Do you Anti-synthetic for rotary people have ANY idea what has been changed for all these years? Technologies.

We use mp3s instead of tapes., we have Athlons X2 instead of 8088.

What does that mean ? things change.

and I think someone of you might want to re-read what excatly I said before about Idemitsu and Mazda. then you'll get the idea.

Idemitsu makes nothing but Full synthetic oil, if Mazda has prove that Synthetic is bad, they should sue them right away for *falseful advertizment*. but if they sue them, Im sure Idemitsu will counter sue Mazda as well since they co-devolpe the oil with Idemitsu.

Nothing happens now , right ?

Maybe there are some Synthetic out there that might cause problems. but most people who has problems are people who has never been to this board. I would say 90 % of the people does not even know wth he has under the hood. does not know that to keep the engine happy the owner has to rev it high every once in a while, same thing goes for piston engines too! but sadly too many uneducated users out there.

and Mazda, by saying *no synthetic* could save them millions of dollars in warranty repair. and its *legal for them* to say whatever they want.

By saying something thats perfectly legal AND it would save the company multi million dollars. Why not ?

I voted synthetic, but I don't blame the oil and I drive my car to 9k at least 3-4 times a week. In fact after I break in the new motor I’m going to use Royal Purple again. What the problem might be for me is I take my daughter to the bus stop and I let my car idle 5-10 minutes while waiting for the bus. Either it is to hot, to cold or the damn mosquitoes my car is left running. All that time adds up at the end of the year. This might be my problem if my car is not injecting enough oil at low rpms. If that is the not the reason someone please tell me what is.

If royal purple was so good it should have protected your engine from busting in the first place then.

If royal purple was so good it should have protected your engine from busting in the first place then.


and that is aimed at whom????

if me the issue i have that has the motor being replaced showed up at 25 k miles... mazda replaced my mop at 30k miles. i switched to rp at 30 k miles...

so i am guessing that rp did not have anything to do with the problem...

maybe you could start a syn vs dino thread on a myspace forum...

beers :beer:

I voted synthetic, but I don't blame the oil and I drive my car to 9k at least 3-4 times a week. In fact after I break in the new motor I’m going to use Royal Purple again. What the problem might be for me is I take my daughter to the bus stop and I let my car idle 5-10 minutes while waiting for the bus. Either it is to hot, to cold or the damn mosquitoes my car is left running. All that time adds up at the end of the year. This might be my problem if my car is not injecting enough oil at low rpms. If that is the not the reason someone please tell me what is.


more to it than that... and it is not low rpms... it is / was cruising on light throttle.... ie. on cruise at 70 to 75 mph for long period of time..

this condion with to little oil injected in some cars causes the apex seals to dry... hence loss of power. and starting to run warm...

syn or dino is the same...

beers :beer:

What can possibly Mazda gain from not recommending syn oil? I suspect it has to do with plain old chemistry. An engine that has to burn oil to function is an engine that has to build up carbon in varying degrees. So one syn under "x" driving maybe good or bad, depending on chemistry plus pressures and temp. I suspect Mazda feels the variables are more controllable with good ol' dino but I ain't no chemist or SAE member. What is absolutely surprising to me is that after 30 plus years of rotary experience Mazda has not figured out what the oil chemistry best suited to minimizing carbon build up is. Or maybe they have but don't what us to know! In other words, the issue may not be so much syn vs dino but what it leaves behind when and how it burns.

What can possibly Mazda gain from not recommending syn oil? I suspect it has to do with plain old chemestry. An engine that has to burn oil to function is an engine that has to build up carbon in varying degrees. So one syn under "x" driving maybe good or bad, depending on chemestry plus pressures and temp. I suspect Mazda feels the variables are more controllable with good ol' dino but I ain't no chemist or SAE member. What is absolutely surprising to me is that after 30 plus years of rotary experience Mazda has not figured out what the oil chemestry best suited to minimizing carbon build up is. Or maybe they have but don't what us to know!

i could answer the theory behind you ?, buy you need to read this.

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=52856

then i can quote the maker of the rx8 motor about syn... and then we can... blah blah blah....

maybe the problem with carbon build up in europe is to much oil injeced into the motor at the wrong time...

a bit different than here due to epa where to little oil is injected at the right time...

do you think dino oil burns cleaner than syn????

read learn enjoy...

and btw. what year?

beers :beers:

If royal purple was so good it should have protected your engine from busting in the first place then.


wow,

took the time to read all your posts here... you dont no anything about anything....

i had to expain the epa to you, duh!

do you work for an oil comp or something?

beers :beer:

I'm getting a bad headache , man. Is it safe to say that whatever Idemetsu uses is pretty much best based on years of racing and taking rotaries apart, syn or not ? I don't know what burns cleaner, that's whole point. Temp and pressure - as in rpm's, etc, have a lot to do with it. In fact if syn runs engine at lower temp that could cause more deposits, so higher temps may be better for less carbon build up but bad for other reasons like seals.

more to it than that... and it is not low rpms... it is / was cruising on light throttle.... ie. on cruise at 70 to 75 mph for long period of time..

this condion with to little oil injected in some cars causes the apex seals to dry... hence loss of power. and starting to run warm...

syn or dino is the same...

beers :beer:
Thanks for the response Swoope. Hopefully I get my car back it's been a week now. Dealer broke my motor mount I've been waiting for it to arrive. And I do a trip every two weeks cruising around @70mph when I take my kids to visit the grandparents.

Thanks for the response Swoope. Hopefully I get my car back it's been a week now. Dealer broke my motor mount I've been waiting for it to arrive. And I do a trip every two weeks cruising around @70mph when I take my kids to visit the grandparents.

port a....

very cool... did school at ut, i miss austin.

if you have any ?s pm me.... can expain alot...

beers :beer:

What can possibly Mazda gain from not recommending syn oil? I suspect it has to do with plain old chemistry. An engine that has to burn oil to function is an engine that has to build up carbon in varying degrees. So one syn under "x" driving maybe good or bad, depending on chemistry plus pressures and temp. I suspect Mazda feels the variables are more controllable with good ol' dino but I ain't no chemist or SAE member. What is absolutely surprising to me is that after 30 plus years of rotary experience Mazda has not figured out what the oil chemistry best suited to minimizing carbon build up is. Or maybe they have but don't what us to know! In other words, the issue may not be so much syn vs dino but what it leaves behind when and how it burns.

So, could you please explain why Mazda does not Recommend Synthetic oil to ALL of their lineups ? because all of them have apex seals ?

explain.

my answer would be, because its *better be safe than sorry* and theres no way for Mazda to say *which oil is good which oil is not good*. and its ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS easier to just say does not recommend. and does any of you anti-synthetic people read? does not recommend is NOT THE SAME AS AGAINST.

Hi guyz. I just read the owners manual and now I am an expert, so please feel free to ask me any questions.

I would definately listen to the people that race rotaries for a living before I would listen to Mazda at least until we can kill all the lawyers.