Hello all,

It's been a long time since I came here for help (a sign the car has been pretty good to me), but now I think I'm in a bit of a pickle. My car is an 04 base, had it since new, and it now has 72,000 miles. A while back, I kept getting check engine lights. The dealer would find mild misfiring and/or some emissions slightly out of spec. Reflashing, changed spark plugs, O2 sensors, etc. seemed to make it go away each time. But it did keep coming back, the last time putting it into limp mode. That time, they discovered my wiring harness was starting to rot at the battery terminal, but they managed to fix it without replacing it (they say it is fine now). All along, I've had a pretty rough idle, but no problems starting it.

Then a few days ago, I flooded it for the first time--classic case of turning it on and seconds later turning it off. The dealer cleared it out and replaced the spark plugs and then did a compression test. They got 6.7, 6.7, 6.7 for the front rotor at 278 rpm, and 6.6, 6.4, 6.7 for the rear at 288 rpm. THey said this warrants a new engine. It runs okay, but they say it might flood or not start, or simply die. They also said the ignition coils and wires need replacing--probably causing the misfiring and rough idle. I also need new motor mounts and a bunch of other things.

I'm still in graduate school (2-3 years to go), so I don't want to buy a new car (though I could). I don't commute with it, so I don't need a 100% dependable car right now. I fully expected I'd run it into the ground. I don't know how saleable it'd be when 12-13 years old, and it's starting to rust, so why not keep it, even as a 2nd car. But I didn't think the ground was approaching so fast, so to speak. So now I'm considering some options:

1. Dealer insists I need to replace the engine. I'm a little skeptical, the flooding was clearly my stupidity, and they say the compression numbers are not horrible. It started fine before and it still starts fine after they cleaned it out. But part of me thinks I should do this. Put in $6-7000 and have it for another 4-5 years if lucky.

2. If the compression's really not that bad (this is something I could use some judgment on), I figure I could replace the wires and coils to fix the misfiring, and have it continue on for some time, but certainly not 4-5 years. This is, of course, the cheapest option. But it might not work for long. Another question is whether my cat will now likely be bad, and what that'd run me.

3. junk it for parts, and get something more boring, but more reliable. This is tempting because, while I don't use it everyday, I don't like sitting on a ticking timebomb. And I must admit it might be fun to have something different, especially something with an auto that my new wife could drive (I've tried, but she can barely use a manual).

4. Other options I'm not thinking of?

Any thoughts would really be appreciated!

 

Given that situation, personally I would replace coils and wires (which should have been done when the problems started in the first place), and do a proper Seafoam/decard procedure. This is something you can do yourself in a couple of hours for fairly cheap (especially on the scale of an engine replacement). That will stop things from getting worse and solve the immediate problem.
These are also items you'll need to pay to replace with the engine anyway.

At that point you're only $250 or so down with a running car and can choose your next move without time pressure. The cat is a bit of a wildcard, it could be bad, it could be ok, but only you can judge that. After you get the engine fixed up, see if it glows after a drive or if there's a noticeable loss of power.

 

https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-discuss...t-here-202454/

You are obviously not a new or potential owner, however you should check out post #3 about "ignition health"

I think Loki is on to something. Have the coils ever been replaced?

 

Thanks for the replies. I'm on my 3rd set of coils. But they said they need replacing. Unless the car goes to a junkyard, they'll be replaced again. The engine itself is the real question.

 

Ignore ppl like Slidin8. It's your money, your life plan, and from my POV, you're being entirely reasonable. 04's are dying off like flies for exactly this reason, the cost of engine replacement (from the dealer) exceeds the value of the car. Good, Fast, Cheap, pick two. If you had the time to mess with it, plus a garage to mess with it in, you could get a rebuild done much cheaper. But unless you're getting a PhD in Basketweaving, you don't have time for sure. Try some cheaper things, but consider getting rid of it. When you have a real job, you can buy a rust-free one and mess with it all you wish. Or, perhaps, if you can find a barn somewhere, stick in storage until you're in a better position to fix it up.

 

Brandon,

Loki's advice is the most reasonable that you can expect right now. You can take heart though that the engine replacement won't be $6-7k. You can get a quality rebuilt engine from Mazmart for half of that, and if you aren't willing to do the labor yourself (with or without help), you could find labor for as cheap as maybe $500 to do the swap. Personally, I would be confident that a Mazmart engine would last for 80k+, assuming it isn't over heated, run out of oil, or carbon choked to death.

I assume that you are past the factory 8yr 100,000 mile engine warranty due to time?



In the end though, if you aren't willing to do an engine replacement on it (in some fashion), then your cheapest option is to just do the items Loki recommended and sell/trade it when the timing is more appropriate. Resolving to keep the car WILL mean engine replacement at some point relatively soon (in mileage, if you park it or barely drive it for a while).

An RX-8 is decent chassis condition with a failed engine is worth about $3,500-$4,000, to give you an idea of that direction.

 

So the compression numbers are not awful yet? I didn't find many comparable numbers here after searching, and the dealer gave mixed messages. First saying it needed replacement now, and later saying they weren't "horrible."

The $6-7000 is the engine plus a lot of other stuff it needs or could use if were to keep it another 4-5 years (clutch, motor mounts, other bushings, etc.). I'm in no position to do the swap myself, so I'm stuck with the dealer I think.

For what it's worth, I said I'd likely run it into the ground because I don't want a new car for 2-3 years (suggesting I do like the car a lot, I've already had it 9 years). By then, assuming I didn't need a new engine, I figured it will not be very saleable except to a place that parts out cars. If I do get a new one, then I obviously could keep it longer and justify putting much more money into it (maybe).

Thanks a bunch for the advice already!

 

The compression numbers are indeed failing, but barely. I think the 6.4 on the rear rotor would be the only one to dip below the 6.0 mark if normalized for 250rpm. At a guess, you might have 10,000 or so miles left before nothing you can do will mask the problem.

 

i would go trade it in at a dealer, get as much as you can and buy a new or used vehicle.

Or, upgrade your ignition system, do coils, plugs and wires for about 350$. The car will probably run fine until the engine is toast for real.

 

I question Mazda's remans. Personally, after dealing with someone else's problem (bought my '06 in mid '08, w/ 27k on the clock), I have gone through 2 remans already. OE engine replaced @ 33 or 36k, first reman replaced @ 60k (dumping 1/qt per day into the front rotor....), and the last one is getting replaced now. Honestly thinking about trading mine in, as I got my second on the way, and as much as I love my 8, I will not have the funds for random engine replacements when I am out of warranty (currently @ 87k). I think I'll just give it a few more years, and rock an econo-shitbox till I can buy me a nice little project car